"Joelle" wrote in message
...
I think there's a power thing going on, women still want to be "in charge"
of
the housework and want to set the standards. But if it really is a shared
responsiblity, then you have to agree on the standards as well.

Joelle

Yeah, interesting that you should say so. When I was living with my wife and
I was working full time she had a part time job two evenings a week, I
suggested getting someone to help with managing the housework as it was a
big load and my sister knew someone who did that for a living. My wife 'did
not want someone else in her house' but admitted it was hard to manage. I
thought I helped as much as possible when I was home (now I am alone I know
the difference between the 'showy' help and the real help but thats a topic
for another day!). I guess it gets very territorial. Sometimes my attempts
to help out with something would be met with a 'you don't know how to do
that properly'. That's not to say that I am denying the 'men are inherently
lazy argument' as I think many humans (can we count ourselves here?) will
avoid tedious work if they think they can and men in a 'normal' (note the
quotes) marriage have every opportunity to do this. Douglas Adams SEP field
applies (Someone Else's Problem). Hate to get contentious but some people
can also project a real 'o woe is me, I work so hard, I am such a troubled
person, life is just so tough, o woe' and don't seem to want to get out of
it or be relieved of it. (Not my wife by the way who did lots, was great and
I just wish it had worked out). Also standards alone and standards with a
kid in the house, the stuff they do and the time you have to spend on them
rather than cleaning have got to be different in the real world.

Like someone recently posted there is a problem with 'traditional' roles and
current real life. Anyone who is a fan of science fiction should have a read
of the books of Sherri Tepper, feminist writer with some very interesting
ideas about the way we ought to structure society with the genders behaviour
as it is. If any of you do read her books I would be interested in your
views on the differing social structures she posits as better or at least
alternatives.

Andrew

PS Joelle, don't say things like 'he was older, 35'. It hurts. 35 is not
older, it is prime rib from there till at least 45. (Dennis, help me out
here?? 35-55, your sexiest years???) :-)

PPS As an aside there are some things I am obsessive about in the standards
front, such as how clean cutlery and crockery should be. Although once
having a kid some things do change, five years ago I would never have
imagined being in a position of sticking my poor, naked hand into a toilet
bowls water for any reason whatsoever!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! All we need now is me
in the kitchen with pots and pans, Kat dealing with the floors and a
volunteer for the laundry and bedmaking and we're set as a pretty groovy
commune. I also peel potatoes like a demon, its a primary skill of mine.