Grandson was taken away & given to other grandma...

On Aug 16, 10:47 am, Dragon's Girl wrote:
(top posting for clarity)

Greg, I didn't see this whole post, and who knows where it might be
located?
But the part that I did read, what is below...there is nothing
mentioned about DFS in there.
It sounds to me as if the one grandmother took temp guardianship to
family court and won. No DFS involvement.
If that is the case, nothing that you said in your long, drawn out
reply will help this woman.

Failed drug test.

On Aug 16, 1:38 am, Greegor wrote:



My daughter and her boyfriend had a baby. His mother filed an order and the
judge signed off on it for her to get temp. guardianship of my grandson. We
proved 99% of the things were lies she was even drug tested which came back
clean but the father came back pos.! How can she get away with this. My
daughter and her boyfriend are back together and the other grandma tried to
get her to sign her rights over to her. My daughter and her boyfriend both
have a mental illness but were doing really good with the baby their illness
until this happened. He was tricked by his mother and didn't fully know what
she was doing. They both want me and my husband to have guardianship. This
has been going on since the middle of May and the baby is going to her for a
week then to me and my husband for a week. It is CRAZY...any advice out
there? Lawyers and the judge don't seem to be doing much except drag this out.
The judge even said my daughter needed to be able to drive and have her GED...
do you know how many people out there are parents and don't drive or have a
GED or have graduated from high school?!

Did Child Protection have any legit reason for removing the child?
Why did the couple ever submit to drug testing?
Was there any probable cause or any merit to a Child Protection case?
Child Protective Services agencies are corrupt.
They use the title "Social Worker" without any SW license and
usually without the education as well.
Caseworkers LIE constantly!
It wouldn't surprise me they would take advantage
of this young couple.

Click on these links!

CPSwrkrs trained to bluff:10 helpful family tips when CPS knockshttp://groups.google.com/group/alt.support.child-protective-services/...

CPSWatch - Parents Guide to the Systemhttp://www.familyrightsassociation.com/cpswatch/parents_guide/

Find a "tricks of the trade" for CPS workers online.
There are several versions of this document which
describe many of the standard dirty tricks that
caseworkers use.

One that has evolved after many of those documents
were written is that caseworkers are SUPPOSED
to be trained how to respect the US Constitution.
In reality they train on how to CON people out of their
Constitutional rights (like getting in the door!) and
work AROUND the US Constitution.

Here's a good one from Massachusetts.
Most of the tricks apply in EVERY state.

http://massoutrage.com/dssdirtytricks.htm

DSS Dirty Tricks

This material is an introduction to the seamy underbelly of the
Massachusetts Department of Social Service's (DSS) operating
procedure. This is the "Dirty Tricks" section that isn't in the
policy
manual, but ought to be, on how to take and keep children. All DSS
agents know them, use them, and pass them on as oral tradition. Their
goal: Take as many children as possible. Their method: Dirty tricks.

Forget the law and regulations. They do! They use illegal police
state
tactics, and have all the power. They fear the law no more than
Cornelius Vanderbilt, the great "robber baron" financier and railroad
builder of the last century did. DSS has everyone, even judges and
lawyers, scared of that power.

DSS doesn't seem to know the difference between actual abuse and
minor
harm, and takes thousands of children every year from families who
have not abused them. Spanking, arguing, accidents, even praying, are
now considered to be abuse or neglect. If you have intentionally
abused your children, that is a different story, and you should get a
lawyer to help you.

Most people simply do not believe that a government agency charged
with helping families would use these police-state tactics. Believe
it. Sometimes it takes months of being on the business end of their
dirty tricks before a person finally realizes that the DSS agent is
NOT their friend. This information will help you shorten that process
of disbelief, and allow you to start protecting yourself before more
damage is done to your family.

This material is not a substitute for good legal help. You need a
good, dedicated lawyer in order to win. To have a chance against
them,
you and your lawyer must fight like your children's future depends on
it. It does.

THIS MATERIAL IS NOT SPECIFIC LEGAL ADVICE FOR
YOUR CASE. THEY ARE GENERAL PRINCIPLES, WHICH
MAY NOT APPLY IN EVERY CASE. REVIEW IT WITH
YOUR LAWYER BEFORE DECIDING HOW TO DEAL
WITH THE DSS. I WILL NOT BE LIABLE FOR PROBLEMS
YOU CAUSE BY NOT GETTING LEGAL ADVICE. YOU
WOULD NOT FLY AN AIRPLANE WITH NO TRAINING.
DON'T PRACTICE LAW, EITHER, WITHOUT TRAINING.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. One -
The DSS will pretend to help you, when they are really gathering
evidence to take your children. It's a new police state out there.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Two -
The DSS will try to get you to talk. SHUT UP!! Everything you say
will
be used against you in a court of law to take and keep your children.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Three -
DSS agents will abuse and traumatize your children themselves.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Four -
The DSS will try to get one parent to say incriminating things about
the other, especially about domestic abuse.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Five -
The DSS will try to get your child to make 'disclosures' about you,
using manipulation, coercion, and fear.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Six -
The DSS will try to make sure you get a lawyer who will work with
them, not against them.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Seven -
After DSS takes your children, the court must give you a hearing
within 72 hours. They rarely do. At the hearing, DSS will rarely meet
the legal standard for keeping custody of your children, but will do
so anyway.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Eight -
The DSS agent will try to get into your home to do an assessment, but
will use the evidence gathered there against you to take your
children.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Nine -
The DSS has a network of "mandated reporters" everywhere your child
is, to snitch on you. All helping professionals are required to
report
you to DSS if they suspect abuse; The people you think will help you
will now betray you.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Ten -
If DSS takes your children, they will keep them a year, and try to
adopt them out - They earn up to hundreds of thousands of dollars per
year per child taken, and keep a lot of cronies in work.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Eleven -
The DSS will try to get you to sign a "service plan" that will
incriminate you, and help them get information to make their case
against you.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Twelve -
The DSS will withhold key records that you need to make your case,
even though they are required by law to give them to you.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Thirteen -
The DSS allows you to challenge their findings of abuse - But their
own agents do the review, and call it a "Fair Hearing".
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Fourteen -
The DSS will rarely let you visit your children, and will not let you
show affection when you do.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Fifteen -
Although the law requires the DSS to place your children with
relatives, if available, they will try to stop it.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Sixteen -
The DSS will keep you from any legal challenge to their custody of
your children for a year or more.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Seventeen -
If the DSS can't get you for abuse or neglect, it will get you for
not
stopping abuse and neglect by your partner i.e., "Safety issues".
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Conclusion
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----

Dirty Trick No. One
The DSS will pretend to help you, when they are really gathering
evidence to take your children. It's a new police state out there.

They Want Your Kids
The first DSS dirty trick is making you think they would NEVER use
dirty tricks to take your children. Beneath the nice exterior of your
friendly DSS agent is a person whose

...

read more »- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

On Aug 16, 1:17 pm, Greegor wrote:
On Aug 16, 10:47 am, Dragon's Girl wrote:

(top posting for clarity)

Greg, I didn't see this whole post, and who knows where it might be
located?
But the part that I did read, what is below...there is nothing
mentioned about DFS in there.
It sounds to me as if the one grandmother took temp guardianship to
family court and won. No DFS involvement.
If that is the case, nothing that you said in your long, drawn out
reply will help this woman.

Failed drug test.

So?

They could have taken it on their own, without the request of DFS.
Maybe the judge asked for it.
Who knows?
A failed drug test doesn't mean DFS involvement.
Right?

On Aug 16, 1:38 am, Greegor wrote:

My daughter and her boyfriend had a baby. His mother filed an order and the
judge signed off on it for her to get temp. guardianship of my grandson. We
proved 99% of the things were lies she was even drug tested which came back
clean but the father came back pos.! How can she get away with this. My
daughter and her boyfriend are back together and the other grandma tried to
get her to sign her rights over to her. My daughter and her boyfriend both
have a mental illness but were doing really good with the baby their illness
until this happened. He was tricked by his mother and didn't fully know what
she was doing. They both want me and my husband to have guardianship. This
has been going on since the middle of May and the baby is going to her for a
week then to me and my husband for a week. It is CRAZY...any advice out
there? Lawyers and the judge don't seem to be doing much except drag this out.
The judge even said my daughter needed to be able to drive and have her GED...
do you know how many people out there are parents and don't drive or have a
GED or have graduated from high school?!

Did Child Protection have any legit reason for removing the child?
Why did the couple ever submit to drug testing?
Was there any probable cause or any merit to a Child Protection case?
Child Protective Services agencies are corrupt.
They use the title "Social Worker" without any SW license and
usually without the education as well.
Caseworkers LIE constantly!
It wouldn't surprise me they would take advantage
of this young couple.

Click on these links!

CPSwrkrs trained to bluff:10 helpful family tips when CPS knockshttp://groups.google.com/group/alt.support.child-protective-services/...

CPSWatch - Parents Guide to the Systemhttp://www.familyrightsassociation.com/cpswatch/parents_guide/

Find a "tricks of the trade" for CPS workers online.
There are several versions of this document which
describe many of the standard dirty tricks that
caseworkers use.

One that has evolved after many of those documents
were written is that caseworkers are SUPPOSED
to be trained how to respect the US Constitution.
In reality they train on how to CON people out of their
Constitutional rights (like getting in the door!) and
work AROUND the US Constitution.

Here's a good one from Massachusetts.
Most of the tricks apply in EVERY state.

http://massoutrage.com/dssdirtytricks.htm

DSS Dirty Tricks

This material is an introduction to the seamy underbelly of the
Massachusetts Department of Social Service's (DSS) operating
procedure. This is the "Dirty Tricks" section that isn't in the
policy
manual, but ought to be, on how to take and keep children. All DSS
agents know them, use them, and pass them on as oral tradition. Their
goal: Take as many children as possible. Their method: Dirty tricks.

Forget the law and regulations. They do! They use illegal police
state
tactics, and have all the power. They fear the law no more than
Cornelius Vanderbilt, the great "robber baron" financier and railroad
builder of the last century did. DSS has everyone, even judges and
lawyers, scared of that power.

DSS doesn't seem to know the difference between actual abuse and
minor
harm, and takes thousands of children every year from families who
have not abused them. Spanking, arguing, accidents, even praying, are
now considered to be abuse or neglect. If you have intentionally
abused your children, that is a different story, and you should get a
lawyer to help you.

Most people simply do not believe that a government agency charged
with helping families would use these police-state tactics. Believe
it. Sometimes it takes months of being on the business end of their
dirty tricks before a person finally realizes that the DSS agent is
NOT their friend. This information will help you shorten that process
of disbelief, and allow you to start protecting yourself before more
damage is done to your family.

This material is not a substitute for good legal help. You need a
good, dedicated lawyer in order to win. To have a chance against
them,
you and your lawyer must fight like your children's future depends on
it. It does.

THIS MATERIAL IS NOT SPECIFIC LEGAL ADVICE FOR
YOUR CASE. THEY ARE GENERAL PRINCIPLES, WHICH
MAY NOT APPLY IN EVERY CASE. REVIEW IT WITH
YOUR LAWYER BEFORE DECIDING HOW TO DEAL
WITH THE DSS. I WILL NOT BE LIABLE FOR PROBLEMS
YOU CAUSE BY NOT GETTING LEGAL ADVICE. YOU
WOULD NOT FLY AN AIRPLANE WITH NO TRAINING.
DON'T PRACTICE LAW, EITHER, WITHOUT TRAINING.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. One -
The DSS will pretend to help you, when they are really gathering
evidence to take your children. It's a new police state out there.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Two -
The DSS will try to get you to talk. SHUT UP!! Everything you say
will
be used against you in a court of law to take and keep your children.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Three -
DSS agents will abuse and traumatize your children themselves.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Four -
The DSS will try to get one parent to say incriminating things about
the other, especially about domestic abuse.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Five -
The DSS will try to get your child to make 'disclosures' about you,
using manipulation, coercion, and fear.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Six -
The DSS will try to make sure you get a lawyer who will work with
them, not against them.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Seven -
After DSS takes your children, the court must give you a hearing
within 72 hours. They rarely do. At the hearing, DSS will rarely meet
the legal standard for keeping custody of your children, but will do
so anyway.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Eight -
The DSS agent will try to get into your home to do an assessment, but
will use the evidence gathered there against you to take your
children.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Nine -
The DSS has a network of "mandated reporters" everywhere your child
is, to snitch on you. All helping professionals are required to
report
you to DSS if they suspect abuse; The people you think will help you
will now betray you.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Ten -
If DSS takes your children, they will keep them a year, and try to
adopt them out - They earn up to hundreds of thousands of dollars per
year per child taken, and keep a lot of cronies in work.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Eleven -
The DSS will try to get you to sign a "service plan" that will
incriminate you, and help them get information to make their case
against you.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Twelve -
The DSS will withhold key records that you need to make your case,
even though they are required by law to give them to you.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Thirteen -
The DSS allows you to challenge their findings of abuse - But their
own agents do the review, and call it a "Fair Hearing".
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Fourteen -
The DSS will rarely let you visit your children, and will not let you
show affection when you do.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Fifteen -
Although the law requires the DSS to place your children with
relatives, if available, they will try to stop it.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Sixteen -
The DSS will keep you from any legal challenge to their custody of
your children for a year or more.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Dirty Trick No. Seventeen -
If the DSS can't get you for abuse or neglect, it will get you for
not
stopping abuse and neglect by your partner i.e., "Safety issues".
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----
Conclusion
---------------------------------------------------------------------------**-----

Dirty Trick No. One
The DSS will pretend to help you, when they are really gathering
evidence to take your children. It's a new police state out there.

They Want Your Kids
The first DSS dirty trick is making you think they would NEVER use
dirty tricks to take your children. Beneath the nice exterior of your
friendly DSS agent is a person whose

...

read more »- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

"Dragon's Girl" wrote in message
oups.com...
(top posting for clarity)

Greg, I didn't see this whole post, and who knows where it might be
located?
But the part that I did read, what is below...there is nothing
mentioned about DFS in there.
It sounds to me as if the one grandmother took temp guardianship to
family court and won. No DFS involvement.
If that is the case, nothing that you said in your long, drawn out
reply will help this woman.

Sure, it will.

It'll help to confuse her and take her mind off of what really
matters.

When has Greg ever looked out for anything lese?

"Bright side to a TPR?"

"Present evidence of a crime in family court?"

Which form of sodomy of your child will make you happy?"