A Parenting & kids forum. ParentingBanter.com

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » ParentingBanter.com forum » misc.kids » General
Site Map Home Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

128 students suspended at Ind. school



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old August 28th 06, 01:59 PM posted to misc.kids
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 215
Default 128 students suspended at Ind. school


nimue wrote:

Teenagers want to be able to express themselves through their clothing. I
have no problem with that. I don't want to squash their individuality. I
don't want to control every aspect of their lives. I just want them IN
CLASS. Let them have their high school fun; the real world will come along
soon enough.


School IS the real world. It is the job of 14-18 year olds.
And of course they can express their individuality through clothing.
THere are score of options that they can wear that meet the dress code.
Now, if their 'individuality' requires that they go to school 3/4's
naked, or dressed in gang-wear, perhaps their career goals lean towards
exotic dancer or drug dealer ... and neither of those requires a high
school diploma.

Naomi

  #13  
Old August 28th 06, 03:12 PM posted to misc.kids
Banty
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,278
Default 128 students suspended at Ind. school

In article .com,
says...


Jen wrote:
"nimue" wrote in message
...
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060827/..._st/dress_code

128 students suspended at Ind. school
Classrooms were a little less crowded at Morton High School on the first
day
of classes: 128 students were sent home for wearing the wrong clothes.



Why not a proper uniform, with a range of things to cover lots of tastes and
individuality, but not turning it into a fashion show.

Because with a uniform that parents have to go out and buy their kids
an entire new wardrobe just for school? (And if the 'range' is broad
enough to cover a wide enough range, it's no longer a uniform, but a
dress code.)


You've always made that assertion about uniforms - that it costs families more,
and I never bought it. It's less wear for other clothes, so fewer other clothes
are needed, and there are opportunities for bulk buying coordinated by the
school or privately, hand-me-downs within famlies, and a used uniform market as
well.

Didn't we discuss this before, and it eventually came down to how you choose to
dress and launder in your particular family? Insisting on much variety in all
categories of wardrobe and laundering after each wearing (or was it laundrering
very infrequently, necessitating the large wardrobes?), or something like that.

Banty


--

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5222154.stm
  #14  
Old August 28th 06, 04:11 PM posted to misc.kids
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 215
Default 128 students suspended at Ind. school


Banty wrote:
In article .com,
says...


Jen wrote:
"nimue" wrote in message
...
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060827/..._st/dress_code

128 students suspended at Ind. school
Classrooms were a little less crowded at Morton High School on the first
day
of classes: 128 students were sent home for wearing the wrong clothes.


Why not a proper uniform, with a range of things to cover lots of tastes and
individuality, but not turning it into a fashion show.

Because with a uniform that parents have to go out and buy their kids
an entire new wardrobe just for school? (And if the 'range' is broad
enough to cover a wide enough range, it's no longer a uniform, but a
dress code.)


You've always made that assertion about uniforms - that it costs families more,
and I never bought it. It's less wear for other clothes, so fewer other clothes
are needed, and there are opportunities for bulk buying coordinated by the
school or privately, hand-me-downs within famlies, and a used uniform market as
well.


My kid's clothes STILL rarely wear out before they are outgrown. (And
if her school was to suddenly switch to uniforms (or semi--uniforms --
as in, 'blue dress slacks and white shirts'), I WOULD have to go out
and buy her at least 5 new outfits for school. (By contrast, I bought
her 3 new pairs of slacks and a couple of shirts for school this year.
She could still wear most of her clothes from last year.) She sure
can't wear her clothes (at least not her shirts -- teens tend to sweat
.... ) more than once without laundering, and it's really inefficient of
water to have to do 'mini loads' every couple of days -- necessary if
she was to try and get by with only a couple of uniforms.

Didn't we discuss this before, and it eventually came down to how you choose to
dress and launder in your particular family? Insisting on much variety in all
categories of wardrobe and laundering after each wearing (or was it laundrering
very infrequently, necessitating the large wardrobes?), or something like that.

Interestingly, after I have always come out against uniforms in public
schools, Shaina wrote a English paper last year (in which she had to
support her argument) in FAVOR of school uniforms. She told me she
really believed it ... that she thought uniforms would be a great idea.
(She got an A on the paper too.)

*shrug* I still think a reasonable, and well enforced dress code is
quite adequate.

Naomi


Banty


--

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5222154.stm


  #15  
Old August 28th 06, 04:53 PM posted to misc.kids
Banty
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,278
Default 128 students suspended at Ind. school

In article .com,
says...


Banty wrote:
In article .com,
says...


Jen wrote:
"nimue" wrote in message
...
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060827/..._st/dress_code

128 students suspended at Ind. school
Classrooms were a little less crowded at Morton High School on the first
day
of classes: 128 students were sent home for wearing the wrong clothes.


Why not a proper uniform, with a range of things to cover lots of tastes and
individuality, but not turning it into a fashion show.

Because with a uniform that parents have to go out and buy their kids
an entire new wardrobe just for school? (And if the 'range' is broad
enough to cover a wide enough range, it's no longer a uniform, but a
dress code.)


You've always made that assertion about uniforms - that it costs families more,
and I never bought it. It's less wear for other clothes, so fewer other clothes
are needed, and there are opportunities for bulk buying coordinated by the
school or privately, hand-me-downs within famlies, and a used uniform market as
well.


My kid's clothes STILL rarely wear out before they are outgrown. (And
if her school was to suddenly switch to uniforms (or semi--uniforms --
as in, 'blue dress slacks and white shirts'), I WOULD have to go out
and buy her at least 5 new outfits for school. (By contrast, I bought
her 3 new pairs of slacks and a couple of shirts for school this year.
She could still wear most of her clothes from last year.) She sure
can't wear her clothes (at least not her shirts -- teens tend to sweat
... ) more than once without laundering, and it's really inefficient of
water to have to do 'mini loads' every couple of days -- necessary if
she was to try and get by with only a couple of uniforms.


Naw - it's that you STILL outfit way too much.

Look - ANY policy wouldnt' work perfectly well for alllll families. This family
has siblings to hand down to, that one does not; this teen isn't squicked by
used clothing; that teen is; this set of parents is releived not to buy the
latest fashion demands fortheir kids; that set of parents don't care.

I think just about any policy can be *made* to be burdensome if you really try.
So, if you INSIST that skirts and vests (rather than just shirts and socks)
HAAAAVE to be washed after every wearing, and INSIST that your child immediately
changes when she gets home to clothes that are of comparable quality and variety
to what she would wear to school everyday, and INSIST that everything gets
washed after even an evening's wear, and REFUSE to do smaller washes to save
water because you live in the desert climes of - Indiana, and REFUSE to look
into second hand clothing, then I guess you've pretty much engineered a problem
for yourself if there were a school uniform policy in your district.


Didn't we discuss this before, and it eventually came down to how you choose to
dress and launder in your particular family? Insisting on much variety in all
categories of wardrobe and laundering after each wearing (or was it laundrering
very infrequently, necessitating the large wardrobes?), or something like that.

Interestingly, after I have always come out against uniforms in public
schools, Shaina wrote a English paper last year (in which she had to
support her argument) in FAVOR of school uniforms. She told me she
really believed it ... that she thought uniforms would be a great idea.
(She got an A on the paper too.)


One doesn't have to believe in the premise to make a good argument - ask any
high school debater


*shrug* I still think a reasonable, and well enforced dress code is
quite adequate.


Oh, I agree with that. But I have yet to hear a good argument that uniforms are
actually harmful or unreasonable, even if I'm likewise convinced they're not
necessary.

Banty


--

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5222154.stm
  #16  
Old August 28th 06, 06:03 PM posted to misc.kids
Rosalie B.
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 984
Default 128 students suspended at Ind. school

wrote:
Banty wrote:
In article .com,
says...

Jen wrote:
"nimue" wrote in message
...
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060827/..._st/dress_code

128 students suspended at Ind. school
Classrooms were a little less crowded at Morton High School on the first
day of classes: 128 students were sent home for wearing the wrong clothes.

Why not a proper uniform, with a range of things to cover lots of tastes and
individuality, but not turning it into a fashion show.

Because with a uniform that parents have to go out and buy their kids
an entire new wardrobe just for school? (And if the 'range' is broad
enough to cover a wide enough range, it's no longer a uniform, but a
dress code.)

You've always made that assertion about uniforms - that it costs families more,
and I never bought it. It's less wear for other clothes, so fewer other clothes
are needed, and there are opportunities for bulk buying coordinated by the
school or privately, hand-me-downs within famlies, and a used uniform market as
well.


My kid's clothes STILL rarely wear out before they are outgrown. (And
if her school was to suddenly switch to uniforms (or semi--uniforms --
as in, 'blue dress slacks and white shirts'), I WOULD have to go out
and buy her at least 5 new outfits for school. (By contrast, I bought
her 3 new pairs of slacks and a couple of shirts for school this year.
She could still wear most of her clothes from last year.)


I don't think there's a significant financial hardship that would be
entailed by buying two more pairs of slacks and a couple more shirts
than you normally buy if the school had uniforms all along.

My kids did wear out their clothes, and I couldn't hand things down
even when they didn't because dd#1 was thinner (slim v.s. regular)
than dd#2, plus there were several years where they wore the same
size. By the time dd#3 (5 years younger) came along, the clothes
that I saved from dd#1 and dd#2 were out of fashion. So it would have
saved me money if the kids had a uniform.

She sure
can't wear her clothes (at least not her shirts -- teens tend to sweat
... ) more than once without laundering, and it's really inefficient of
water to have to do 'mini loads' every couple of days -- necessary if
she was to try and get by with only a couple of uniforms.


This doesn't compute, even if I don't quite understand why she can't
wear antiperspirant. If you have 3 pairs of uniform slacks from last
year and you buy two more for this year, and you get several shirts
for this year (counting on her wearing some of last years), there's no
reason why you would have to do 'mini' loads.

DD#1 and dd#2's children wear uniforms to school, and I don't notice
them doing any mini loads. DD#1's daughter wore white blouse, pleated
plaid skirt, knee socks and dark blue sweater. (It was a catholic
school.) DD#2's children wear a collared shirt and khaki shorts (they
are in Miami in a private school), or in the case of her dd a skirt.

Didn't we discuss this before, and it eventually came down to how you choose to
dress and launder in your particular family? Insisting on much variety in all
categories of wardrobe and laundering after each wearing (or was it laundrering
very infrequently, necessitating the large wardrobes?), or something like that.

Interestingly, after I have always come out against uniforms in public
schools, Shaina wrote a English paper last year (in which she had to
support her argument) in FAVOR of school uniforms. She told me she
really believed it ... that she thought uniforms would be a great idea.
(She got an A on the paper too.)

*shrug* I still think a reasonable, and well enforced dress code is
quite adequate.

Naomi



  #17  
Old August 28th 06, 07:41 PM posted to misc.kids
Jeff
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 780
Default 128 students suspended at Ind. school


"Banty" wrote in message
...
In article .com,
says...


nimue wrote:

Teenagers want to be able to express themselves through their clothing.
I
have no problem with that. I don't want to squash their individuality.
I
don't want to control every aspect of their lives. I just want them IN
CLASS. Let them have their high school fun; the real world will come
along
soon enough.


School IS the real world. It is the job of 14-18 year olds.
And of course they can express their individuality through clothing.
THere are score of options that they can wear that meet the dress code.
Now, if their 'individuality' requires that they go to school 3/4's
naked, or dressed in gang-wear, perhaps their career goals lean towards
exotic dancer or drug dealer ... and neither of those requires a high
school diploma.


Few teens actually dress to express their individuality. Quite the
opposite.
They dress for peer group identification.


That is their identity.

Not that that's necessarily all bad, but it's not this vaunted project in
self-actualization that an enlightened institution needs to respect,
either. It
can darn well happen during non-school hours, or in more subtle ways
within a
dress code.


Depends on the dress code. But even if they code requires black shoes, they
can choose the brand and style, to suit their needs. Same things with ties
and shirts. And not all dress codes are strick. Apparently, the dress code
that the OP referenced just required that certain areas of the body be
covered and nothing offensive be on the clothing. And, that teens keep their
cell phones off (that's not part of the dress, however - but there were
problems with this, as well).

Jeff

Banty


--

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5222154.stm


  #18  
Old August 28th 06, 08:38 PM posted to misc.kids
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 215
Default 128 students suspended at Ind. school


Jeff wrote:
"Banty" wrote in message

Depends on the dress code. But even if they code requires black shoes, they
can choose the brand and style, to suit their needs. Same things with ties
and shirts. And not all dress codes are strick. Apparently, the dress code
that the OP referenced just required that certain areas of the body be
covered and nothing offensive be on the clothing. And, that teens keep their
cell phones off (that's not part of the dress, however - but there were
problems with this, as well).


Right. The dress code sounds very similar to the one at our local
schools. Which includes: no offensive/drug related slogans on shirts;
skirts and shorts have to be longer than the tips of the fingers held
at the sides; girls can wear sleeveless shirts if the straps are (IIRC)
at least two fingers wide and the shirt is cut high enough under the
arms to cover the bra; boys have to have sleeves. (Not sure why the
discrepancy.). No bare midriffs or backs (shirts have to be long enough
to tuck in), and pants have to be high enough to cover the underwear.
Nothing transparent or very low cut. No hats or bandanas or heavy
coats. (Religious headcoverings are exempt.) No pajamas. And nothing
likely to damage school property. (Cleats on shoes or hard metal
trimmings on clothing.) The code concludes with something like "If in
doubt, don't wear it."

Still plenty of room there for 'individual expression.' Oh, and cell
phones have to be off during school hours.

Jeff

Banty


--

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5222154.stm


  #19  
Old August 28th 06, 10:20 PM posted to misc.kids
Jeff
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 780
Default 128 students suspended at Ind. school


"Banty" wrote in message
...
In article , nimue
says...

Tori M wrote:
I found it to be distracting to be in classes with kids wearing CoEd
Naked shirts (until the school figured them out lol) This was also
the "start" of the baggy jeans to your ankles pants.. kids yanking
them up all the time. I dont want to see anyones undies. I dont see
what the big deal is of wearing Jeans that fit and then going home
and changing and expressing themselves on their own time. Some
people might be suprised at how nice it is to walk without your pants
falling off all the time.


I think it is absolutely ridiculous to suspend kids who violate the dress
code. Hello? The kids need to go to class to learn. We should not
punish
kids by taking away their opportunity and responsibility to learn. That
is
utterly counter-productive. Give the kids detention if you must, just
don't take them out of class for violating a dress code. They need to
know
that going to class and getting an education takes priority over nearly
everything.


OK - so you object to the punishment and not the rule?

I agree that suspension is a pretty unimaginative way to deal with it.


to me: unimaginative = clear-cut. If you don't were the right dress, you
don't come to school.

So, how
about in-house detention, and in black slacks and white shirts as required
wear.
IF the parents can't support that (and run out and get the clothes), then
their
true value on education would be apparent. It would make the point, and
the
clothes would add the embarassment factor that would make the point to the
kids
in question.

Would you go along with that?

Banty


The kids were essentially sent home on the first day of school because they
either were not wearing appropriate attire or were using cell phones. The
student dress code is available on the internet and presumable, students and
parents were able to get a copy of it if they didn't have it from the
previous year. Clothing stores in the area sell the apporpiate clothing that
is consistant with the dress code (no logos except school logos) in the
appropriate color. I am sure not only did the high school students get the
message that only appropriate clothing is to be worn, but the kids at the
other two high schools in the district and the lower grades got the message,
too.

If the policy is uniformly enforced, then it becomes a non-issue.

The kids have plenty of ways to express themselves with wearing jewlry and
othe ways. Hats and other colors are often allowed in schools to decrease
the visibility of gang symbols.

IMHO, the school did a good job.

http://hammond.k12.in.us/StudentParentGuide.pdf

Jeff


--

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5222154.stm



  #20  
Old August 28th 06, 11:41 PM posted to misc.kids
Jen
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 165
Default 128 students suspended at Ind. school


wrote in message
oups.com...

Jen wrote:
"nimue" wrote in message
...
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060827/..._st/dress_code

128 students suspended at Ind. school
Classrooms were a little less crowded at Morton High School on the
first
day
of classes: 128 students were sent home for wearing the wrong clothes.



Why not a proper uniform, with a range of things to cover lots of tastes
and
individuality, but not turning it into a fashion show.

Because with a uniform that parents have to go out and buy their kids
an entire new wardrobe just for school? (And if the 'range' is broad
enough to cover a wide enough range, it's no longer a uniform, but a
dress code.)


As far as I know ALL highschools have uniforms here, and most primary
schools are now starting, my daughter is in primary, and I like the idea of
a uniform. As I mentioned, there is some variety, But the basic colours are
navy blue and white, and the only thing that is more expensive is the
jumpers or jackets that need the logo on them. All the kids look like
they're from the same school - it's definitely a uniform, and not just a
dress code.

Jen


 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
A School Paddling Correlation Study [email protected] Foster Parents 2 November 9th 05 02:48 PM
Trying to understand - some personal issues based on experience Stuart Magpie Spanking 4 August 4th 04 11:15 AM
How Children REALLY React To Control Chris Solutions 437 July 11th 04 02:38 AM
IQ-160s Vote (with their *feet*) [email protected] Solutions 119 June 3rd 04 06:29 AM
Virtual school seeks Iowa funding [email protected] General 4 June 29th 03 12:55 AM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 12:53 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 ParentingBanter.com.
The comments are property of their posters.