kindergarten concerns

On Feb 3, 8:26 am, "Donna Metler" wrote:
Check both kinder options carefully. Here, full-day kindergarten is usually
in place in schools where many of the children struggle, and as a result,
full-day kids tend to get really heavy academics, frequent testing, and
little time to play. Nap time just plain doesn't exist-or, at best, it's a
short time watching an educational video or having a book read aloud after
lunch.

Wow -- we just started to offer a tution-based full-day K, which is
the half-day program spread out over a full-day. So full-day is a
slower half-day, with more breaks and more play.

Interesting how areas differ, isn't it?

Half-day programs tend to be more developmental (and are mostly through
private schools) and may well offer more time for socialization.

What is pretty common here is to put your summer birthday child into a 1/2
day program at age 5, then to look seriously and decide if they should enter
Kinder or 1st full-day the following year. A lot of parents take the "one
year at private kindergarten, 1/2 day, and one year at public kindergarten,
full-day" option, unless the child is obviously ready for 1st.

Here, if you have a boy with a summer birthday, you seemingly start K
at 6. Everyone else starts at 5, either full-day or half-day. (yes,
there's rant there, but I'll skip it for now

Caledonia

On Sun, 3 Feb 2008 19:47:17 -0800 (PST), Caledonia wrote:

Here, if you have a boy with a summer birthday, you seemingly start K
at 6. Everyone else starts at 5, either full-day or half-day. (yes,
there's rant there, but I'll skip it for now

I could so rant on that one. There's a boy in DS's class with a
mid-December birthday. Were his birthday just a couple of weeks earlier,
he'd be eligible to start a whole year earlier. Instead, he was redshirted
because he's a boy, no other reason except all the other boys in his
preschool were being redshirted with him. So, the kid's bright, reading at
4th grade level in kindergarten, nearly two years older than the youngest
child in class, definitely the oldest child in class. This year, his mom
made the comment she was afraid he was bored. Really? I wonder why.

Anne Rogers wrote:

Our son will be 5 in May, which means in this state (WA), he starts
kindergarten in September and as they use an August 31st cut off, he's
one of the younger children in the year.
[snip]

All the information we've seen about kindergarten readiness would
indicate he's ready across all the different aspects, however, our local
school is BIG, 600 students. He would be able to ride the bus, we're
just about the last stop on one of the routes, so it's very convenient,
however my anxieties about him riding the bus are too long to list.
Having driven past the school at drop off and pick up time, I don't
really see not riding the bus as an option.

Just for comparison with the UK, my two oldest went to a primary
school with about 600 children. They were all full-time by the time
they were five as well.

HTH

--
Penny Gaines
UK mum to three

On Feb 2, 3:53�pm, Anne Rogers wrote:
Our son will be 5 in May, which means in this state (WA), he starts
kindergarten in September and as they use an August 31st cut off, he's
one of the younger children in the year.

He'd be older than a quarter of the kids -- I wouldn't call that
really young in grade. My kids were late summer babies and did fine,
though my son tended to fall asleep in the car on the way home about
one day in three.

I have heard of parents easing their kids into kindergarten: having
them attend half-day at first and gradually go longer. You could ask
if that's an option. I would also definitely ask about rest periods.

If the bus ride is pretty short (should be, if you're almost the last
stop before the school) I'd go ahead and do it for the mornings. I
always liked picking my kids up in the afternoons -- if you plan ahead
and park a little way from school, it's not bad. I met a lot of other
parents while the kids played after school at the playground. Of
course that's not the norm at all schools -- but when the weather gets
a little better you could go and see if people do that at yours. Oh,
and some schools always have messed-up bus service the first week or
two, but then it all irons out, while others tend to have pretty good
service from the start. Ask around about what the beginning of the
year tends to look like.

The other thing is that it's over half a year until all this happens.
Kids change very fast at this age -- you may be surprised how much
more he can handle in the fall.

How big are the classes? I'm not sure the size of the whole school
matters as much as the size of his own class.

--Helen

I'm answering Helen's, it breaks the questions that remain to be
answered into paragraphs, so it's easier to respond too!

He'd be older than a quarter of the kids -- I wouldn't call that
really young in grade. My kids were late summer babies and did fine,
though my son tended to fall asleep in the car on the way home about
one day in three.

Quite possibly, though there does seem to be a not insignificant number
of children with birthdays in the last quarter of the year who's parents
hold them back a further year.

I have heard of parents easing their kids into kindergarten: having
them attend half-day at first and gradually go longer. You could ask
if that's an option. I would also definitely ask about rest periods.

The school urged us not to do this, if we want them full day, we should
send them full day from the start, though they admit this year about
half the half day children have switched to full day in January. There
is a quiet period after lunch.

If the bus ride is pretty short (should be, if you're almost the last
stop before the school) I'd go ahead and do it for the mornings. I
always liked picking my kids up in the afternoons -- if you plan ahead
and park a little way from school, it's not bad. I met a lot of other
parents while the kids played after school at the playground. Of
course that's not the norm at all schools -- but when the weather gets
a little better you could go and see if people do that at yours. Oh,
and some schools always have messed-up bus service the first week or
two, but then it all irons out, while others tend to have pretty good
service from the start. Ask around about what the beginning of the
year tends to look like.

Parking a little way from school and walking isn't really an option,
there isn't any parking in the area, it's all either main roads or fire
lanes. Most of the housing close by is condos/apartments with residents
only parking. One problem I didn't mention is that I can't reliably pick
up in the afternoon, I have narcolepsy and I really need to take drugs
for it, but for other reasons I can't right now, I can't commit to
having to drive in the afternoons, so it's the bus or nothing. I know
one way to get to know teachers and the school is to volunteer, but with
a younger child that's not likely to be possible.

The other thing is that it's over half a year until all this happens.
Kids change very fast at this age -- you may be surprised how much
more he can handle in the fall.

That's part of the problem! So far I've not been that great at
guesstimating what he's going to be like and be able to deal with 6
months in advance, so far I've tended to overestimate rather than be
over cautious!

How big are the classes? I'm not sure the size of the whole school
matters as much as the size of his own class.

low 20s, with an assistant some of the time, plus volunteers.

Cheers
Anne

On Feb 4, 2:01�pm, Anne Rogers wrote:


Parking a little way from school and walking isn't really an option,
there isn't any parking in the area, it's all either main roads or fire
lanes. Most of the housing close by is condos/apartments with residents
only parking.

Oh, that's too bad. I know the kind of neighborhood you mean, it's a
pain.

One problem I didn't mention is that I can't reliably pick
up in the afternoon, I have narcolepsy and I really need to take drugs
for it, but for other reasons I can't right now, I can't commit to
having to drive in the afternoons, so it's the bus or nothing. I know
one way to get to know teachers and the school is to volunteer, but with
a younger child that's not likely to be possible.

Okay, given that, I would grab whatever opportunity makes things
easier FOR YOU, which sounds to me like having him in school longer (I
could be wrong, depends on your situation). I think it's okay to
weight your *known* needs pretty high, and assume he is likely to be
able to handle what lots of other kids do. Your being able to function
better is very important to him too.

Helen

Okay, given that, I would grab whatever opportunity makes things
easier FOR YOU, which sounds to me like having him in school longer (I
could be wrong, depends on your situation). I think it's okay to
weight your *known* needs pretty high, and assume he is likely to be
able to handle what lots of other kids do. Your being able to function
better is very important to him too.

It may sound counter intuitive, but in some ways having him in school
less might actually work better, I can generally predict my dozy times
and right now the are fairly much at school bus drop off time, which
means I'd have to summon the energy to get a younger child outside, walk
up the drive, frequently in the pouring rain to meet him, then give him
attention once at home. Conversely, we're used to the 11.30 pick up and
2-4pm being look after yourself time.

The narcolepsy factors into the 8am start time too, I've been trying for
the last month to switch my body clock so I can be up and theoretically
have a child ready for a 7.40 bus pick up, perhaps not actually having
to do it has been the cause of failure, but it's been nowhere near
successful, I tend to wake early, but then hit a dozy spot just as it
would be time to get the kids up and function. The program we're
considering at his current preschool starts at 9, it's on the way to
work for DH, he'd take him some days and me others.

Of course all these problems are going to come round again the following
year, but there are so many possibilities as to what could happen,
choosing what works for one year may be a better option. It seems we can
apply to use a different school district and we're quite close to the
boundary and the adjacent district is surprisingly different, school
starts at 9, half day kindergarten is the norm.

I chatted with the kindergarten teacher at the preschool today, although
the sign up is supposed to be this week, she says the class won't be
full, so we have longer. Similarly, the school district would prefer us
to register by May, so no desperate rush either.

One thing I hadn't mentioned in my original post was that a lot of my
concern has risen from DH having had a very troubled time at school
(including expulsion) at it's been hard to get to the bottom of the
causes and whether or not any of the same factors are present for DS.
When you see the high achieving adult DH has turned out to be, it's hard
to believe, he definitely has a mischievous streak and I've been able to
spot some possible parenting issues.

Anne

On Mon, 04 Feb 2008 16:04:17 -0800, Anne Rogers wrote:

Of course all these problems are going to come round again the following
year, but there are so many possibilities as to what could happen,
choosing what works for one year may be a better option. It seems we can
apply to use a different school district and we're quite close to the
boundary and the adjacent district is surprisingly different, school
starts at 9, half day kindergarten is the norm.

One thing to consider about that is the issue of neighborhood friends.
Depending on how social your child is, this could present a problem.

When I was a kid, we played with our friends in the neighborhood who went
to our school When we hit junior high, the boundaries split up the block
right down the middle so that my brother and I ended up in a different
school from our friends. This affected our relationships with them and
although we did play together in elementary school, we no longer associated
with them in junior high. It did not help that the schools were rivals.

DS does not attend the neighborhood school. All his playdates have to be
arranged, the kids have to be driven, etc. He doesn't know the kids in the
neighborhood, not that we have many his age here anyway.

One thing to consider about that is the issue of neighborhood friends.
Depending on how social your child is, this could present a problem.

When I was a kid, we played with our friends in the neighborhood who went
to our school When we hit junior high, the boundaries split up the block
right down the middle so that my brother and I ended up in a different
school from our friends. This affected our relationships with them and
although we did play together in elementary school, we no longer associated
with them in junior high. It did not help that the schools were rivals.

DS does not attend the neighborhood school. All his playdates have to be
arranged, the kids have to be driven, etc. He doesn't know the kids in the
neighborhood, not that we have many his age here anyway.

We live in a 40 unit condo complex, there isn't anyone quite his age,
he's played with the boy next door who is about a year younger. Going
outside of the complex without an adult is a no no (inside it's against
the rules!), as we're unfortunately on the access route to a major
building site, it would be too dangerous. Given most don't have english
as a first language, communicating with other parents is an issue. I can
see this is a concern for the future, but not something I'm worried
about for next year.

Cheers
Anne

On Feb 3, 8:58�am, "Sue" wrote:
I go with the flow and deal with problems if there are any to deal with.
Personally, I think a full day for kindergarteners is a bit much. They are
extremely tired at a half day and I could easily see how a full day would
really wear them out. As far as how many kids go to the school, it's not
that big of a number to me. Our elementary has around 400 kids, but the
lower elementary kids are in another part of the building than the older
kids. My oldest rode the bus when she was in preschool and kindergarten and
I was very fearful of it, but she didn't have any problems what so ever.
They took the little ones off the bus and escorted them to class. It's not
like they just let the little ones figure it out. If your son is fragile,
then he will probably get a lot of illnesses in the beginning, but soon he
will build up his immunities and he will be stronger for it. He probably
needs to toughen up a little bit and school will be the spot for it. First
time moms and sending their little ones to school is hard, but it is harder
for the moms than it is for the kids. Just don't put your anxieties off on
him.
--
Sue (mom to three girls)

"Anne Rogers" wrote in message

. ..





Our son will be 5 in May, which means in this state (WA), he starts
kindergarten in September and as they use an August 31st cut off, he's one
of the younger children in the year.

State provision is for part time kindergarten, but the local school
district strongly pushes full time kindergarten, unlike neighbouring ones
where there is a lottery for full time places. There is a charge, but it's
very little more than we're paying for preschool anyway, so it's nothing
more than a minor consideration when it comes to decision making.

All the information we've seen about kindergarten readiness would indicate
he's ready across all the different aspects, however, our local school is
BIG, 600 students. He would be able to ride the bus, we're just about the
last stop on one of the routes, so it's very convenient, however my
anxieties about him riding the bus are too long to list. Having driven
past the school at drop off and pick up time, I don't really see not
riding the bus as an option.

The start time is 8am, which means half day kindergarten finishes at
10.40, which would be very tieing, I would have to stop going to women's
bible study and it would make scheduling other things tricky too. Plus,
he's turned out to be a slow starter in the mornings, he's the kind of
child that takes an hour or so after waking up to be ready for breakfast..
Hence, half day kindergarten at public school isn't looking a great
option.

The school can't say for sure what the classes will be, they say they
started the year with 3 classes full day and all the half day children in
one class, but now have 2 or 3 half day children in each class, so all the
core stuff is squeezed into the morning.

My other concern is his general constitution and energy levels, he's not a
sickly child, who gets ill all the time, but he does seem more fragile
than most and fatigues fairly easily.

Our other option is to have him continue into the kindergarten class at
preschool, it's a 9-11.30 program and it's a small class with one teacher,
I have no doubt at all that it would be fantastic for the academics, but
I'm a little concerned that transitioning to first grade would be tricky,
though I chatted to the teacher on Friday and she says that she's never
had a child find this a problem - I rather suspect the additional year in
age helps. He can stay for lunch up to 3 days a week, which would give him
practice at the longer day.

A big part of me is saying suck it up, stick him in full day kindergarten,
put him on the bus and stop being an over anxious parent. But an equally
big part of me is saying, I'm the one that knows him best and I have
genuine concerns, the kindergarten class at preschool will be fine (if not
better) academically and we have a good relationship with the teacher, we
know if there are any problems they'll be communicated to us.

I think that, unfortunately, some of the concerns I have may well still
apply in first grade, I'm not sure why the school has grown so big, other
schools in the school district aren't that size even without the gifted
program, and it's the host school for that, making it even bigger, it's
bigger than the smallest high school in the district! It's a very
transient population, there will be kids coming and going all the time. On
the other hand overall, it appears to be a good school district, all the
high schools appeared in the national top 100 list last year in whichever
magazine it was that did it.

So what does everyone else do? Go with the flow and deal with problems if
they appear, or head them off and make alternative arrangements?

Cheers
Anne- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Alot of schools adopt a policy that kindergartners ride the bus in
front in an attempt to keep them away from the older, cocky, mouthy
children who prefer the back. If a bus is able to drive straight
through in front of your home, meaning it won't be required to turn
around or undertake some challenging maneuvers therein, many also
adopt the policy that kindergartners must board the bus and be
released in front of where they live.

I also don't believe full-day kindergarten is a good thing for the
majority of 5-year-olds. There are exceptions of course. He may
surprise you. My second child, whom we thought would never speak in a
classroom....well, put it this way.....as I sat in the parking lot
secretly filming her on her first kindergarten recess (she had a half-
day), I could hear her from where I was and she had no problems
whatsoever in yelling at the little boy who dared jump on the
balancing beam with chains before her turn was over. She definitely
came out of her shell very quickly and now has a hard time clamming
up.

You may also find that your school welcomes parent volunteers like
ours does where you can be there frequently to help with
administrative tasks the teachers want help with, reading/projects
with children, etc. Each time one of my older two boarded that bus for
their first day, they were smiling like crazy like they couldn't wait
to be rid of me. I smiled my arse off right back, waving frantically,
and then balled like a baby and raced to the school to get there
before them so I could secretly film them getting off the bus and
entering for their first day. I got busted by my first during both
covert operations too. lol. I was hiding by the gymnasium doors and he
got off the bus, started walking and looked straight at me. During his
recess filming, his baby sister, then 3, screamed out the window -
Jaaaaaaakeeeeeeee! so she gave us away. lol.