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#1
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Obsessive behavior in 4 year old
Hi All,
We've got a problem that has been escalating for a while now. First, a bit of history: for the last, oh, two years or so, James and Daddy have a Saturday ritual that involves going to the toy store where James picks out a toy. These have often been things that exist in a collection like Thomas trains, Power Ranger figures, Bionicles, Ninja Turtles, etc. So, James typically looks forward to finishing off the series as the weeks go by. There have often been issues of James wanting more than one toy on these trips, or asking to get one during the week, but that has all seemed very "normal" and he is easily convinced that this is a Saturday thing with Daddy and he gets one only, or has to wait. Not a big deal. Lately, this has been turning into a big deal. James has been absolutely obsessed with finishing off a collection, all at once, and *immediately*. At times, he literally can not think or talk of anything else, other than the figures that he needs. Dad was out of town last week and left 2 bionicles as surprises for James, and literally the FIRST thing James said was "Now I need the white one, the blue one and the green one!" Not any thanks, not any "WOW!" but an immediate calculation of what he needs next. And he could NOT let it go. After I calmly tried to tell him about the usual "routine" and said that he should try to just forget about the other ones, and play with the ones he already has, he really did try. A few minutes later he threw his arms around my neck and was crying that he tried, but he just could NOT get Bionicles out of his head. "Bionicles, bionicles, bionicles - that's all I can think about Mommy!" It was heartbreaking. I finally got him calmed down, but it was very disturbing that he really tried, but could not let this go (and he was clearly upset that he couldn't let it go). A few minutes later he was fine, but this lasted for a good 15 minutes or so. Now, he's determined to get some new GI Joe stuff. He got into a screaming fight yesterday with his playdate buddy about how HE was going to get the GI Joe, NOT his friend - over and over again. He just can't let this stuff go - we hear about this constantly, all week long. So, what to do? My instinct is to ditch the Saturday ritual. I have felt that it was a BAD idea from the start (I think it's teaching a bad lesson - you get toys *weekly*, James has no real concept of gifts being a special thing since he essentially gets them all the time, and we have more toys in our house than ToysRUs, etc.), and now that it is clearly causing James emotional pain, I think that it should be eliminated. Daddy, however, thinks this is a bigger issue, and rather than eliminate the Saturday ritual (which he is VERY against), thinks we should talk to someone (a professional) on how to teach James to deal with his obsessions, etc. He thinks that treating the Saturday is simply treating a symptom, and not the problem. While I think that's overkill, I am happy to go along with it. But I still think it's silly (and somewhat cruel to James) to keep the Saturday ritual, since it is clearly a problem, symptom or not. So, am I overreacting about the Saturday ritual? Is it a cute, fun, Daddy-son thing, and I'm being overly stubborn about it? Does this obsessiveness about the collections, and of "living for Saturday" (literally, right after he gets the Saturday toy, he starts talking about what he's going to get NEXT Saturday, and we hear about it ALL week long, over and over again) seem normal and fine? Or is this potentially a bigger issue that we should see someone about? We are going to talk to his pediatrician about this - I'd just like to get some "real-life" experience from the board as well. Thanks, m. James, 4 yrs. Lauren, 1 yr. |
#2
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Obsessive behavior in 4 year old
Michelle Spina wrote:
So, am I overreacting about the Saturday ritual? Is it a cute, fun, Daddy-son thing, and I'm being overly stubborn about it? Does this obsessiveness about the collections, and of "living for Saturday" (literally, right after he gets the Saturday toy, he starts talking about what he's going to get NEXT Saturday, and we hear about it ALL week long, over and over again) seem normal and fine? Or is this potentially a bigger issue that we should see someone about? I'm with you. I would cut out the Saturday thing. I would also remove most toys--not in a punitive way! I would just explain that there are too many toys around to deal with and we're going to put some in the garage/attic/ whatever for later and we'll rotate toys around. Leave him with only a few toys. Then, keep the Saturday date with Daddy, but make it about events, not toys. At first, go only to noncommercial establishments so that there's not a fit at the museum gift shop. Have a really fun day--make it very attractive, just no gifts. I think that many people vastly underestimate how damaging it is to have too many toys. We're as guilty as the next person of toy overkill, but it really is damaging. I think your whole issue could easily be attributable to the weekly toy trip. Having a special ritual with Daddy is a HUGELY powerful thing. The time spent with Daddy alone makes it of tremendous importance, and you're tying that huge importance with toy buying. I think it would totally be overkill to start counseling or something over this when there's a huge, obvious thing you could try changing before that. After a while, when things settle down, you can reintroduce the toy buying, but NOT as the special thing Daddy does with him. Reintroduce it with *HIM* buying his own toys with his allowance money (with appropriate money management). Meanwhile, encourage others to give him time gifts (experiences, trips, etc.) rather than toys so that he's not always associating getting toys with people's expression of affection. Best wishes, Ericka |
#3
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Obsessive behavior in 4 year old
Michelle Spina wrote: So, am I overreacting about the Saturday ritual? Is it a cute, fun, Daddy-son thing, and I'm being overly stubborn about it? Does this obsessiveness about the collections, and of "living for Saturday" (literally, right after he gets the Saturday toy, he starts talking about what he's going to get NEXT Saturday, and we hear about it ALL week long, over and over again) seem normal and fine? Or is this potentially a bigger issue that we should see someone about? I don't think you're overreacting. Just on a practical level, what are you going to do when Lauren starts bringing home *her* Saturday ritual gits too? (No, no, take your head out of the gas oven.) I think it's great for children to have a special weekly time with each parent, but I also think tying it to buying something *every time* is a bad idea. Personally, I don't know that there's anything abnormal about James' behavior - IMO the abnormal thing was that he got a gift every Saturday. Clisby |
#4
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Obsessive behavior in 4 year old
"Michelle Spina" wrote in message om... Hi All, We've got a problem that has been escalating for a while now. First, a bit of history: for the last, oh, two years or so, James and Daddy have a Saturday ritual that involves going to the toy store where James picks out a toy. These have often been things that exist in a collection like Thomas trains, Power Ranger figures, Bionicles, Ninja Turtles, etc. So, James typically looks forward to finishing off the series as the weeks go by. There have often been issues of James wanting more than one toy on these trips, or asking to get one during the week, but that has all seemed very "normal" and he is easily convinced that this is a Saturday thing with Daddy and he gets one only, or has to wait. Not a big deal. Lately, this has been turning into a big deal. James has been absolutely obsessed with finishing off a collection, all at once, and *immediately*. At times, he literally can not think or talk of anything else, other than the figures that he needs. Dad was out of town last week and left 2 bionicles as surprises for James, and literally the FIRST thing James said was "Now I need the white one, the blue one and the green one!" Not any thanks, not any "WOW!" but an immediate calculation of what he needs next. And he could NOT let it go. After I calmly tried to tell him about the usual "routine" and said that he should try to just forget about the other ones, and play with the ones he already has, he really did try. A few minutes later he threw his arms around my neck and was crying that he tried, but he just could NOT get Bionicles out of his head. "Bionicles, bionicles, bionicles - that's all I can think about Mommy!" It was heartbreaking. I finally got him calmed down, but it was very disturbing that he really tried, but could not let this go (and he was clearly upset that he couldn't let it go). A few minutes later he was fine, but this lasted for a good 15 minutes or so. Now, he's determined to get some new GI Joe stuff. He got into a screaming fight yesterday with his playdate buddy about how HE was going to get the GI Joe, NOT his friend - over and over again. He just can't let this stuff go - we hear about this constantly, all week long. So, what to do? My instinct is to ditch the Saturday ritual. I have felt that it was a BAD idea from the start (I think it's teaching a bad lesson - you get toys *weekly*, James has no real concept of gifts being a special thing since he essentially gets them all the time, and we have more toys in our house than ToysRUs, etc.), and now that it is clearly causing James emotional pain, I think that it should be eliminated. Daddy, however, thinks this is a bigger issue, and rather than eliminate the Saturday ritual (which he is VERY against), thinks we should talk to someone (a professional) on how to teach James to deal with his obsessions, etc. He thinks that treating the Saturday is simply treating a symptom, and not the problem. While I think that's overkill, I am happy to go along with it. But I still think it's silly (and somewhat cruel to James) to keep the Saturday ritual, since it is clearly a problem, symptom or not. So, am I overreacting about the Saturday ritual? Is it a cute, fun, Daddy-son thing, and I'm being overly stubborn about it? Does this obsessiveness about the collections, and of "living for Saturday" (literally, right after he gets the Saturday toy, he starts talking about what he's going to get NEXT Saturday, and we hear about it ALL week long, over and over again) seem normal and fine? Or is this potentially a bigger issue that we should see someone about? We are going to talk to his pediatrician about this - I'd just like to get some "real-life" experience from the board as well. Thanks, m. James, 4 yrs. Lauren, 1 yr. In my opinion, you are right on. There are a host of reasons, including the ones you mention, that this particular ritual is not a good one. 4yo kids are perfectly happy with time, they do not need new toys all the time. Play grounds, walks and such would provide much more useful rituals. On the obsessive thing... I think it is simply a matter of being given something that he cannot handle not that he is particularly obsessive. S |
#5
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Obsessive behavior in 4 year old
Michelle Spina wrote:
I'm winging it here...no real life experience so take it for what it is worth...only something to add to the discussion ;-) So, what to do? My instinct is to ditch the Saturday ritual. I have felt that it was a BAD idea from the start (I think it's teaching a bad lesson - you get toys *weekly*, James has no real concept of gifts being a special thing since he essentially gets them all the time I'm with you. Even more then the growing number of toys is that the act of *getting* a toy is such an essential part of an important ritual and it is done frequently and consistently. Every week without fail. The consistent ritual with dad is wonderful but the essential part should be dad and not the toy. I now that is/was the parental intent but they are entwined for James so I'd try to change that. Daddy, however, thinks this is a bigger issue, and rather than eliminate the Saturday ritual (which he is VERY against), thinks we should talk to someone (a professional) on how to teach James to deal with his obsessions, etc. You only mentioned the obsessive behavior with regards to getting toys. Is obsessive over *everything* or is it just limited to toys. If toys only...that speaks volumes. So, am I overreacting about the Saturday ritual? Is it a cute, fun, Daddy-son thing, and I'm being overly stubborn about it? Might have been, but not anymore :-( Does this obsessiveness about the collections, and of "living for Saturday"...........seem normal and fine? Not to me. Or is this potentially a bigger issue that we should see someone about? You might get some pointers as to how to turn it all around. Maybe dh would get some pointers too...I'm guessing the professional would come in on the side of changing the Sat. ritual but maybe not?!!! Good luck! -- Nikki Mama to Hunter (4) and Luke (2) |
#6
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Obsessive behavior in 4 year old
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#7
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Obsessive behavior in 4 year old
In article ,
Clisby wrote: Michelle Spina wrote: So, am I overreacting about the Saturday ritual? Is it a cute, fun, Daddy-son thing, and I'm being overly stubborn about it? Does this obsessiveness about the collections, and of "living for Saturday" (literally, right after he gets the Saturday toy, he starts talking about what he's going to get NEXT Saturday, and we hear about it ALL week long, over and over again) seem normal and fine? Or is this potentially a bigger issue that we should see someone about? I don't think you're overreacting. Just on a practical level, what are you going to do when Lauren starts bringing home *her* Saturday ritual gits too? (No, no, take your head out of the gas oven.) I think it's great for children to have a special weekly time with each parent, but I also think tying it to buying something *every time* is a bad idea. Personally, I don't know that there's anything abnormal about James' behavior - IMO the abnormal thing was that he got a gift every Saturday. Clisby oh absolutely the child has been very effectively taught the importance of being a constant consumer -- that getting stuff is the most important thing and this has been done by making it the centerpiece of his relationship with Dad -- what could be more reinforcing that linking 'gimmee' values with the wonderful value of time with Dad. definitely bag this 'ritual' but thiing carefully about what can be substituted -- e.g. Dad and son learning a new sport e.g. they start going fishing, or racing bikes, or building stuff, or planning and going on a camping trip - in other words introduce a new tradition that has the potential for the same emotional power as buying stuff |
#8
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Obsessive behavior in 4 year old
In ,
Ericka Kammerer wrote: * I'm with you. I would cut out the Saturday thing. *I would also remove most toys--not in a punitive way! I I agree. That being said, two things leap to mind. First of all, don't take away special daddy weekend time. I would continue to have a special daddy weekend ritual - just one that doesn't involve buying toys! Maybe he could take special trips to go see the train station, or go to the library, or whatever. My three year old currently likes to go to Starbucks with daddy . The other thing that leaps to mind is to definitely follow through with consulting with the pediatrician. For your son to be so obsessed that it interferes with his ability to do other things is possibly not normal. At least, I know that when dogs literally can't stop doing one activity to the point where it interferes with other normal behaviors, we call that a pathologic compulsion, and treat it accordingly. -- hillary israeli vmd http://www.hillary.net "uber vaccae in quattuor partes divisum est." not-so-newly minted veterinarian-at-large |
#9
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Obsessive behavior in 4 year old
In article ,
"Nikki" wrote: Daddy, however, thinks this is a bigger issue, and rather than eliminate the Saturday ritual (which he is VERY against), thinks we should talk to someone (a professional) on how to teach James to deal with his obsessions, etc. Dad needs to see that he has painted himself into the role as 'person who buys me stuff' -- that the son values Dad for what he is bought every week is this REALLY what Dad wants in his relationship with his son? |
#10
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Obsessive behavior in 4 year old
If he's doing anything similar in any other part of his life, I'd talk
to the family doc. My middle kid has a very high functioning form of autism - he falls into the non-verbal learning disability category. Some kids with this (such as those with Aspergers Syndrome) are very intelligent, and may not look at all like what you would think of as autistic but develop real rituals and obsessions to the point of what looks like nuttiness. Our son was doing some really odd ritualized stuff and we thought he might have the beginnings of obsessive compulsive disorder - for example, he was obsessing about certain toys, how they had to be arranged, how many times he rinsed and spit when brushed his teeth, and if he couldn't follow his rituals he freaked. The doctor thought it might be OCD (which kids CAN get) but when we were sent to a specialist for proper assessment, it turned out to be it NLD. Listen to your instincts. Mary G. |
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