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#61
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help me keep my son from perpetuating the cycle of abuse (very long)
Tiffany wrote:
Why is one need to be worse then the other? YOU are the one who just said that what I was doing was worse. Why does there have to be fault? Again, YOU blamed ME, as usual. I didn't say you abuse Paul, but again, you are only reading what you want. Yes you did. You said I name called by pointing out that he is a woman abuser, and you equated that to him calling me a bitch, which I of course think is not the same thing. Why not answer my question on why you let this become abuse? It's not within my control to let it become anything, it is HIS responsibility and HIS intention to make it so. It is HIS campaign of hatred targeted at me and his fixation on me which is clear by his specific name calling of me "Looney Lorain" and how he has dug up peterd's old name calling of me "maroon" to continue that legacy of hate and how he uses my women's studies education against me and my feminist ideals against me, anything pertaining to anything womanly about me in particular not to the other women on this newsgroup but only on me. That is abuse. Why do you read posts or take it to heart when you don't even know these people? Would you say that about the positive posts on here? No? Then why would you say it about the negative ones? |
#62
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help me keep my son from perpetuating the cycle of abuse (very long)
Betsy wrote:
In regards to your health status, you can designate a Health Care Surrogate, or Power of Attorney for Health Care. It does not have to be a relative, but does have to be notarized. Usually that precludes the 'next of kin' call. Instead they call your HCS. Your HCS can be a friend you trust, your spouse, or a family member, or an adult child. Just remember whomever you designate must be someone you trust, and must know your wishes in an emergency. Hope this helped. Betsy thank you, now I have to find someone who I can really trust. isn't that sad? sheesh. I can't say enough how much this information helps. thank you again. |
#63
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help me keep my son from perpetuating the cycle of abuse (very long)
On Sat, 19 Jul 2003 11:01:25 +0100, "Dennis Here"
youreply wrote: CME wrote in message ... And you know what? That's the risk you take, but what you need to do is make him realize that if he's to live in your house, he needs to respect your rules and really the choice is his. If he leaves or you kick him out, Snip other good advice I have to disagree here Christine as my POV is a lot different to yours. I do not live in "my" house with my son, I live in our house. House rules are two way, I don't set them, we agree to them. Obviously at Freddie's age some basics are more my domain than his but at the age of Lorian's son, and I have two grown sons go through this stage, there has to be a big element of give and take based on mutual respect. It seems that going through an angst stage where he has little respect for her or anyone else for that matter. He is testing his limits and is finding that they are almost limitless at the moment. He will not stop until he realises that treating people with contempt if not the best way in life. He will be thinking, and not without reason, that everyone around him is treating him with contempt too. He thinks that he knows better than his mother and is ready and confident enough to find out for himself. To us it is a dreadfull stage in the development of an adolescent boy, to him it is merely testing the water and establishing himself as an adult capable of finding his own way in life. I left home a 16. I was fed up with the restrictions and expectations of my father. We fought all the time. I disagreed with everything he said and stood for. I was going to change the world. I would play Bob Dylan records at full volume just to **** him off! To an outsider I was an arrogant arsehole with a big attitude. To myself and my piers I was a self confident ground breaker who new where he was going for myself. I think I understand where you're coming from, Dennis, and I know that a lot of what you say is often true. My ex husband, for example, describes an extremely similar stage in his own development, at the same age. His epiphany was interfered with as he broke his neck on the second day of grade eleven, and spent the next eight months in hospital dealing with having become a quadriplegic. But the times, the feelings, the attitudes and behaviours he describes from that pre-injury time seem very much to be what you're talking about. He ended up spending that summer that he was sixteen putting up massive bales of hay as a residential farm worker, and he reckons that time away from home did him a great deal of good. All that said, I'll just point out from my own experience, that teenage acting out and traumatised, damaged teenage wigging out look very, very different. I have daughters, not sons, as you know, but the difference between the adolescent rebellion my eldest went through and the wounded, completely out of control rage that my youngest experienced, is very great. And it's quite often that parents who've experienced normal range adolesence with all its rebellion and downright obnoxiousness are unable to identify with parents dealing with the other kind, at least IME. Lorian's son doesn't sound like a normally rebellious teen to me. Maybe he is, but he sounds over the top. I could be wrong, you could be wrong. We're not there, and one of Lorian's many jobs is to work out what exactly she's dealing with. I'm hearing her say that he's not normal range, and that she's got a number of thoughts on why that might be. What she does really does need to take into account what she's dealing with. I suppose the biggest breakthrough was made by my mother as I still remember it clearly. After a full blast rendition of a Bob Dylan track entitled "My back Pages" from the Anotherside of LP, she quietly said that she really liked that one. I was thoroughly ****ed off that I had had the opposite affect to that intended and went to listen to it again quietly. I had only heard what I wanted to hear and completely overlooked the chorus. Here are the words from http://www.bobdylan.com/songs/backpages.html Crimson flames tied through my ears Rollin' high and mighty traps Pounced with fire on flaming roads Using ideas as my maps "We'll meet on edges, soon," said I Proud 'neath heated brow. Ah, but I was so much older then, I'm younger than that now. Half-wracked prejudice leaped forth "Rip down all hate," I screamed Lies that life is black and white Spoke from my skull. I dreamed Romantic facts of musketeers Foundationed deep, somehow. Ah, but I was so much older then, I'm younger than that now. Girls' faces formed the forward path From phony jealousy To memorizing politics Of ancient history Flung down by corpse evangelists Unthought of, though, somehow. Ah, but I was so much older then, I'm younger than that now. A self-ordained professor's tongue Too serious to fool Spouted out that liberty Is just equality in school "Equality," I spoke the word As if a wedding vow. Ah, but I was so much older then, I'm younger than that now. In a soldier's stance, I aimed my hand At the mongrel dogs who teach Fearing not that I'd become my enemy In the instant that I preach My pathway led by confusion boats Mutiny from stern to bow. Ah, but I was so much older then, I'm younger than that now. Yes, my guard stood hard when abstract threats Too noble to neglect Deceived me into thinking I had something to protect Good and bad, I define these terms Quite clear, no doubt, somehow. Ah, but I was so much older then, I'm younger than that now. My teenage hero had already seen the light! and my mother had seen it before I had! Lets hope that Lorian's son also has some kind of defining moment that he will see for himself, however that may happen. Yes, absolutely, let's hope so. I love that Dylan song myself, and so, BTW, does my ex, referred to above. I suspect you and he might have some other things in common. :-) He's a good guy; that's a compliment, not an insult, just so you know. Meanwhile, on the one hand, I agree that 'freeing' her son to go might be the making of him. Many a youth has left a home out of control, and found out a lot about themselves and life by going to the street for awhile, and come back the wiser and stronger for it. On the other hand, I totally identify with Lorian's fear of seeing him follow that path. Your own reference to your friends who died tells us that the street is not a place that all escape unscathed, and a sixteen year old who has become badly confused and enraged might well have experiences that do him great damage. It's as likely as his having experiences that strengthen him. The solution seems to be to 'let him go' but to seek a healthy place to go to. Lorian appears to be doing that, within the limits of her resources. I suspect that before a whole lot longer he'll decide the matter himself, because gone seventeen, it's pretty hard to keep them if they don't want to stay. And I hope earnestly for both of their sakes that the choices he makes turn out in the end to help rather than hurt his growth. Cele |
#64
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help me keep my son from perpetuating the cycle of abuse (very long)
Told you tiffany. Don't bother replying to her, you'll only become an abuser yourself. More then that, she snips out anythign relevant in her replies to disguise her BS a bit better. wrote in message . net... Tiffany wrote: Why is one need to be worse then the other? YOU are the one who just said that what I was doing was worse. Why does there have to be fault? Again, YOU blamed ME, as usual. I didn't say you abuse Paul, but again, you are only reading what you want. Yes you did. You said I name called by pointing out that he is a woman abuser, and you equated that to him calling me a bitch, which I of course think is not the same thing. Why not answer my question on why you let this become abuse? It's not within my control to let it become anything, it is HIS responsibility and HIS intention to make it so. It is HIS campaign of hatred targeted at me and his fixation on me which is clear by his specific name calling of me "Looney Lorain" and how he has dug up peterd's old name calling of me "maroon" to continue that legacy of hate and how he uses my women's studies education against me and my feminist ideals against me, anything pertaining to anything womanly about me in particular not to the other women on this newsgroup but only on me. That is abuse. Why do you read posts or take it to heart when you don't even know these people? Would you say that about the positive posts on here? No? Then why would you say it about the negative ones? |
#65
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help me keep my son from perpetuating the cycle of abuse (very long)
On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 17:53:10 GMT, wrote:
Tiffany wrote: Why is one need to be worse then the other? YOU are the one who just said that what I was doing was worse. Why does there have to be fault? Again, YOU blamed ME, as usual. I didn't say you abuse Paul, but again, you are only reading what you want. Yes you did. You said I name called by pointing out that he is a woman abuser, and you equated that to him calling me a bitch, which I of course think is not the same thing. Why not answer my question on why you let this become abuse? It's not within my control to let it become anything, it is HIS responsibility and HIS intention to make it so. I could be wrong, and I'm sure Tiffany will correct me if I am, but I think she may be making a point about giving the comments power rather than, exactly, letting them become abuse. I've made myself extremely clear on this issue in the past, so I won't bore everyone with a repeat. My position is expressed here, if anyone cares: http://groups.google.ca/groups?q=Pau...x.co m&rnum=1 However much Paul et.al. have complete control of and responsibility for their behaviour, Lorian, you have control of how much power you assign them. Are their remarks worth giving them any power at all? Not allowing them power means not allowing them the privilege of hurting you. If you see what I mean. :-/ Take care. Cele Would you say that about the positive posts on here? No? Then why would you say it about the negative ones? The positive posts come from another place, and are worthy of consideration. As are some that also come from the spirit of support or assistance, but that are hard to hear. But the bullying isn't worth giving power to. Not just with you, in this situation. In general, with everyone. Bullying is low and foul. Why afford it any power or dignity at all? Cele |
#66
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help me keep my son from perpetuating the cycle of abuse (very long)
On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 09:50:16 -0500, 'Kate
wrote: On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 09:35:00 -0400, "Rolly The Pervert" wasted bandwidth once again by posting: wrote in message news:GHISa.96500$GL4.27021@rwcrnsc53... Rolly The Pervert wrote: wrote in message news:KDDSa.107753$N7.14512@sccrnsc03... Lisa aka Surfer wrote: Well done, Tom. You have a bigger heart than I, it was clear from the very first reply from Betsy that she wasn't going to get the point. Yet you still took the time. Man oh man you're doing well these days!!!! Lisa Actually, Lisa, you and Tom are as emotionally abusiveslap And what you gonna do about it? **** off bitch So, calling me a bitch is ok with the group? It's my fault for failing to ignore him? Tell me why it isn't his fault. You are a bitch, and a lying netk00k kunt. More then that, your a lonney maroon. Go take your meds looney lorain. Worse than a vulture pickin' on carrion. Glad to see you back, Kate. I hope you are doing as well as possible. I think of you. And oh, btw, this was beautifully expressed. :-) Cele |
#67
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help me keep my son from perpetuating the cycle of abuse (very long)
On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 02:56:44 GMT, wrote:
Tiffany wrote: wrote in message news:KDDSa.107753$N7.14512@sccrnsc03... Lisa aka Surfer wrote: Well done, Tom. You have a bigger heart than I, it was clear from the very first reply from Betsy that she wasn't going to get the point. Yet you still took the time. Man oh man you're doing well these days!!!! Lisa Actually, Lisa, you and Tom are as emotionally abusive to me on here as always and I won't put up with it from you either. And I was able to resolve things with Betsy as I apologized for my sarcasm and she did get through to me in email. Because she did truly care for me and my son's best interests. You never have. You have always been catty and superior and very hurtful to me and I will not allow you to continue to do that to me here. L, you need to let go of this 'being abused online' stuff. No one can hurt you unless you let them, online. Don't read their posts for god sake. Hey, don't take the responsibility off of Lisa and put it on me Tiffany. Lisa has a very long history of being cruel to me in her posts to me. She doesn't need to waste bandwidth targeting me when I am at my most vulnerable with hurtful remarks but she does it all the time. There is no difference between if she said it to me online or in the mail or on the telephone or to my face, words hurt. Get in her face, not mine. Tiffany really seems to be trying to help. It's not your job to cure them of abusive behaviour. That's *their* job. I think Tiffany's point might be along the lines of letting go of it for *your* sake. Who cares whether they deal with their issues? You don't have to fix them. And abusive behaviour is *their* issue. It's *them* that has responsibility for that. Forget 'em. It's not about deciding fault. Any idiot can see they're abusive. It's about deciding how much power to give their behaviour. Cele |
#68
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help me keep my son from perpetuating the cycle of abuse (very long)
Cele wrote in message ... On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 17:53:10 GMT, wrote: Tiffany wrote: Why is one need to be worse then the other? YOU are the one who just said that what I was doing was worse. Why does there have to be fault? Again, YOU blamed ME, as usual. I didn't say you abuse Paul, but again, you are only reading what you want. Yes you did. You said I name called by pointing out that he is a woman abuser, and you equated that to him calling me a bitch, which I of course think is not the same thing. Why not answer my question on why you let this become abuse? It's not within my control to let it become anything, it is HIS responsibility and HIS intention to make it so. I could be wrong, and I'm sure Tiffany will correct me if I am, but I think she may be making a point about giving the comments power rather than, exactly, letting them become abuse. I've made myself extremely clear on this issue in the past, so I won't bore everyone with a repeat. My position is expressed here, if anyone cares: http://groups.google.ca/groups?q=Pau...t.support. si ngle-parents&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=uc8a6v4g11csnb09ea6iiv4lkqbaoh1an9%404a x.com&rnum=1 However much Paul et.al. have complete control of and responsibility for their behaviour, Lorian, you have control of how much power you assign them. Are their remarks worth giving them any power at all? Not allowing them power means not allowing them the privilege of hurting you. If you see what I mean. :-/ Take care. Cele Would you say that about the positive posts on here? No? Then why would you say it about the negative ones? The positive posts come from another place, and are worthy of consideration. As are some that also come from the spirit of support or assistance, but that are hard to hear. But the bullying isn't worth giving power to. Not just with you, in this situation. In general, with everyone. Bullying is low and foul. Why afford it any power or dignity at all? Cele Thats about right. Thank you Cele, as I am tired of trying to explain this. |
#69
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help me keep my son from perpetuating the cycle of abuse (very long)
Cele wrote in message ... On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 02:56:44 GMT, wrote: Tiffany wrote: wrote in message news:KDDSa.107753$N7.14512@sccrnsc03... Lisa aka Surfer wrote: Well done, Tom. You have a bigger heart than I, it was clear from the very first reply from Betsy that she wasn't going to get the point. Yet you still took the time. Man oh man you're doing well these days!!!! Lisa Actually, Lisa, you and Tom are as emotionally abusive to me on here as always and I won't put up with it from you either. And I was able to resolve things with Betsy as I apologized for my sarcasm and she did get through to me in email. Because she did truly care for me and my son's best interests. You never have. You have always been catty and superior and very hurtful to me and I will not allow you to continue to do that to me here. L, you need to let go of this 'being abused online' stuff. No one can hurt you unless you let them, online. Don't read their posts for god sake. Hey, don't take the responsibility off of Lisa and put it on me Tiffany. Lisa has a very long history of being cruel to me in her posts to me. She doesn't need to waste bandwidth targeting me when I am at my most vulnerable with hurtful remarks but she does it all the time. There is no difference between if she said it to me online or in the mail or on the telephone or to my face, words hurt. Get in her face, not mine. Tiffany really seems to be trying to help. It's not your job to cure them of abusive behaviour. That's *their* job. I think Tiffany's point might be along the lines of letting go of it for *your* sake. Who cares whether they deal with their issues? You don't have to fix them. And abusive behaviour is *their* issue. It's *them* that has responsibility for that. Forget 'em. It's not about deciding fault. Any idiot can see they're abusive. It's about deciding how much power to give their behaviour. Cele Again, yes. |
#70
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help me keep my son from perpetuating the cycle of abuse (very long)
"Tiffany" wrote in message ...
Err... here we go again. To me, no name calling is ok but I can't control what Roy types or what Paul types nor would I want to. There is no one to be at fault here. You have name called also though, maybe not using b---- but you called Paul a women abuser which is pretty harsh. More so then being a bitch as most women confess to being a bitch. You are dealing with alot right now.... why make it worse by dealing with negative posts? Negative *anything* avoid like the plague now, Lorian. Goodness gracious, you want to pop a vein or something? Think, feel, live positive. Surround yourself with positivity. Some stuff you can't avoid, I know. Karen |
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