CHICKEN POX VACCINE ASSOCIATED WITH SHINGLES EPIDEMIC Gary S. Goldman, Ph.D.

john wrote:
PRESS RELEASE

Contact: Gary S. Goldman, Ph.D.
Phone: 661-944-5661
Fax: 661-944-4483
For Immediate Rrelease

CHICKEN POX VACCINE ASSOCIATED WITH SHINGLES EPIDEMIC

But John, vaccines don't work and chicken pox isn't caused by a virus
anyway, right? Right, John? It's caused by persistent wrong feeding
of children leading to a natural healing crisis, I thought. Or maybe
it's caused by elimination of toxic fat or fatty acids through the hair
fat gland. Or if it is caused by a virus, it's not as though the
vaccine works - the vaccine is ineffective and certainly can't
eradicate the chicken pox virus. Right? So this guy is just full of
it.

Or what? Does the damn vaccine work or not? You can't simultaneously
claim it doesn't work and blame it for working too well. Unless you're
an idiot.

Beth

On 1 Sep 2005 14:06:07 -0700, "
wrote:

Unless you're an idiot.

I think you've just solved the riddle.

PF

wrote:
john wrote:

PRESS RELEASE

Contact: Gary S. Goldman, Ph.D.
Phone: 661-944-5661
Fax: 661-944-4483
For Immediate Rrelease

CHICKEN POX VACCINE ASSOCIATED WITH SHINGLES EPIDEMIC


But John, vaccines don't work and chicken pox isn't caused by a virus
anyway, right? Right, John? It's caused by persistent wrong feeding
of children leading to a natural healing crisis, I thought. Or maybe
it's caused by elimination of toxic fat or fatty acids through the hair
fat gland. Or if it is caused by a virus, it's not as though the
vaccine works - the vaccine is ineffective and certainly can't
eradicate the chicken pox virus. Right? So this guy is just full of
it.

Or what? Does the damn vaccine work or not? You can't simultaneously
claim it doesn't work and blame it for working too well. Unless you're
an idiot.

Beth, correct me if I am wrong...I thought that shingles was something
that was caused by dormant chicken pox virus after a person got chicken
pox/ Now, if the vaccine actually prevents one from getting chicken pox.
and the vaccine in not a live virus, then, that person is also protected
against getting shingles.

Am I wrong, or is someone missing something?

Mark Probert wrote:
wrote:
john wrote:

PRESS RELEASE

Contact: Gary S. Goldman, Ph.D.
Phone: 661-944-5661
Fax: 661-944-4483
For Immediate Rrelease

CHICKEN POX VACCINE ASSOCIATED WITH SHINGLES EPIDEMIC


But John, vaccines don't work and chicken pox isn't caused by a virus
anyway, right? Right, John? It's caused by persistent wrong feeding
of children leading to a natural healing crisis, I thought. Or maybe
it's caused by elimination of toxic fat or fatty acids through the hair
fat gland. Or if it is caused by a virus, it's not as though the
vaccine works - the vaccine is ineffective and certainly can't
eradicate the chicken pox virus. Right? So this guy is just full of
it.

Or what? Does the damn vaccine work or not? You can't simultaneously
claim it doesn't work and blame it for working too well. Unless you're
an idiot.

Beth, correct me if I am wrong...I thought that shingles was something
that was caused by dormant chicken pox virus after a person got chicken
pox/ Now, if the vaccine actually prevents one from getting chicken pox.
and the vaccine in not a live virus, then, that person is also protected
against getting shingles.

Am I wrong, or is someone missing something?

I *think* you're right. The abstract does actually say

"As vaccinated children replace those with a prior history of wild-type
varicella in the 10 age group, increasing HZ incidence among this
cohort will be of less concern in the near future. "

However, the concern seems to be that people who *have* had chicken pox
won't get the immunological boost that apparently occurs from being
exposed to wild-type varicella-zoster virus, because kids aren't
getting the disease anymore.

In other words, you are more likely to develop shingles if you are not
further exposed to chicken pox.

I think.

Cathy

excatholic wrote:
Mark Probert wrote:
wrote:
john wrote:

PRESS RELEASE

Contact: Gary S. Goldman, Ph.D.
Phone: 661-944-5661
Fax: 661-944-4483
For Immediate Rrelease

CHICKEN POX VACCINE ASSOCIATED WITH SHINGLES EPIDEMIC


But John, vaccines don't work and chicken pox isn't caused by a virus
anyway, right? Right, John? It's caused by persistent wrong feeding
of children leading to a natural healing crisis, I thought. Or maybe
it's caused by elimination of toxic fat or fatty acids through the hair
fat gland. Or if it is caused by a virus, it's not as though the
vaccine works - the vaccine is ineffective and certainly can't
eradicate the chicken pox virus. Right? So this guy is just full of
it.

Or what? Does the damn vaccine work or not? You can't simultaneously
claim it doesn't work and blame it for working too well. Unless you're
an idiot.

Beth, correct me if I am wrong...I thought that shingles was something
that was caused by dormant chicken pox virus after a person got chicken
pox/ Now, if the vaccine actually prevents one from getting chicken pox.
and the vaccine in not a live virus, then, that person is also protected
against getting shingles.

Am I wrong, or is someone missing something?

I *think* you're right. The abstract does actually say

"As vaccinated children replace those with a prior history of wild-type
varicella in the 10 age group, increasing HZ incidence among this
cohort will be of less concern in the near future. "

However, the concern seems to be that people who *have* had chicken pox
won't get the immunological boost that apparently occurs from being
exposed to wild-type varicella-zoster virus, because kids aren't
getting the disease anymore.

In other words, you are more likely to develop shingles if you are not
further exposed to chicken pox.

I think.

Cathy

Got the damn name wrong again.

excatholic wrote:
Mark Probert wrote:
wrote:
john wrote:

PRESS RELEASE

Contact: Gary S. Goldman, Ph.D.
Phone: 661-944-5661
Fax: 661-944-4483
For Immediate Rrelease

CHICKEN POX VACCINE ASSOCIATED WITH SHINGLES EPIDEMIC


But John, vaccines don't work and chicken pox isn't caused by a virus
anyway, right? Right, John? It's caused by persistent wrong feeding
of children leading to a natural healing crisis, I thought. Or maybe
it's caused by elimination of toxic fat or fatty acids through the hair
fat gland. Or if it is caused by a virus, it's not as though the
vaccine works - the vaccine is ineffective and certainly can't
eradicate the chicken pox virus. Right? So this guy is just full of
it.

Or what? Does the damn vaccine work or not? You can't simultaneously
claim it doesn't work and blame it for working too well. Unless you're
an idiot.

Beth, correct me if I am wrong...I thought that shingles was something
that was caused by dormant chicken pox virus after a person got chicken
pox/ Now, if the vaccine actually prevents one from getting chicken pox.
and the vaccine in not a live virus, then, that person is also protected
against getting shingles.

Am I wrong, or is someone missing something?

I *think* you're right. The abstract does actually say

"As vaccinated children replace those with a prior history of wild-type
varicella in the 10 age group, increasing HZ incidence among this
cohort will be of less concern in the near future. "

However, the concern seems to be that people who *have* had chicken pox
won't get the immunological boost that apparently occurs from being
exposed to wild-type varicella-zoster virus, because kids aren't
getting the disease anymore.

In other words, you are more likely to develop shingles if you are not
further exposed to chicken pox.

Yes, what excatholic said. People who never get the chicken pox
because they have been protected by the vaccine won't develop shingles.
However, right now most of the adult population of the US has had
chicken pox and thus we're all carrying zoster around with us. We're
the ones at risk for shingles if our immune systems aren't occasionally
goosed by exposure to the wild virus. Presumably the problem would
shake itself out eventually, but with potential negative public health
effects in the near term.

As the article says, there is a shingles vaccine in the works, but then
compliance will be an issue.

The chicken pox vaccine may well in retrospect have had unintended
consequences that offset the intended consequences. However, it's
important (for John) to note that this is only happening because THE
VACCINE WORKS.

Beth

PF Riley wrote:
On 1 Sep 2005 14:06:07 -0700, "
wrote:

Unless you're an idiot.

I think you've just solved the riddle.

PF

I know, and usually I don't respond to John. For some reason this
chicken pox thing is what gets my goat; it makes it so blatantly
obvious that all he has to know is that a particular piece of
information is 'anti-vaccine' in some way, even if it's hopelessly
inconsistent with his other 'information'.

Arg.

Beth

"excatholic" wrote in message
ups.com...

Mark Probert wrote:
wrote:
john wrote:

PRESS RELEASE

Contact: Gary S. Goldman, Ph.D.
Phone: 661-944-5661
Fax: 661-944-4483
For Immediate Rrelease

CHICKEN POX VACCINE ASSOCIATED WITH SHINGLES EPIDEMIC


But John, vaccines don't work and chicken pox isn't caused by a virus
anyway, right? Right, John? It's caused by persistent wrong feeding
of children leading to a natural healing crisis, I thought. Or maybe
it's caused by elimination of toxic fat or fatty acids through the hair
fat gland. Or if it is caused by a virus, it's not as though the
vaccine works - the vaccine is ineffective and certainly can't
eradicate the chicken pox virus. Right? So this guy is just full of
it.

Or what? Does the damn vaccine work or not? You can't simultaneously
claim it doesn't work and blame it for working too well. Unless you're
an idiot.

Beth, correct me if I am wrong...I thought that shingles was something
that was caused by dormant chicken pox virus after a person got chicken
pox/ Now, if the vaccine actually prevents one from getting chicken pox.
and the vaccine in not a live virus, then, that person is also protected
against getting shingles.

Am I wrong, or is someone missing something?

I *think* you're right. The abstract does actually say

"As vaccinated children replace those with a prior history of wild-type
varicella in the 10 age group, increasing HZ incidence among this
cohort will be of less concern in the near future. "

However, the concern seems to be that people who *have* had chicken pox
won't get the immunological boost that apparently occurs from being
exposed to wild-type varicella-zoster virus, because kids aren't
getting the disease anymore.

In other words, you are more likely to develop shingles if you are not
further exposed to chicken pox.

Fortunately, there is a way to give an immunological boost against chicken
pox: immunization.

I believe studies show that older adults who get the chicken pox vaccine
suffer from fewer episodes of shingles.

There are fewer episodes of younger people who get shingles who have been
vaccinated vs. those who have not been.

Jeff


I think.

Cathy

Jeff wrote:

Fortunately, there is a way to give an immunological boost against chicken
pox: immunization.

I believe studies show that older adults who get the chicken pox vaccine
suffer from fewer episodes of shingles.

There are fewer episodes of younger people who get shingles who have been
vaccinated vs. those who have not been.

Again, though, the problem with depending on a system which requires
adults to get regularly vaccinated is that compliance can be a problem.
From a medical perspective it's a perfect solution, from a public
health perspective it's a bit of a headache.

Beth

Vaccination of a child with the varicella (chickenpox) vaccine actually
introduces into the body a live, attenuated (weakened) varicella-zoster
virus which can reactivate at a later time--producing shingles (or
herpes zoster).
However, the vaccine-strain virus is comprised of the Oka-strain which
was derived from a Japanese child. When a vaccinated child in the U.S.
encounters one of the U.S. wild-type strains, the vaccinated child may
experience a subclincal reaction (with no observable rash) or a
breakthrough rash (often less than 50 lesions) due to the encounter
with a child with the natural or wild-type virus. It is believed that
this occurs due to the dissimilarity between the Oka-strain and
wild-type U.S. strain (i.e., the strains are heterologous). The natural
virus then becomes the dominant virus in the body that is more likely to
reactivate. As an example, I just received an e-mail from a parent whose
child was vaccinated at age 1. The child had a breakthrough chickenpox
rash at age 3, and now has shingles at age 10.


--
GarySGoldman