BU$TED?

"Raving Loonie" wrote in message
oups.com...
Jason Johnson wrote:
In article , "Rich"
wrote:
[snip]

Rich,
Thanks, I was not aware that Hep-B is usually caused because the
mother
was infected.
Since thimerosal will no longer be used in any vaccines in the near
future, do you believe that it is (or is not) ethical to conduct a
study
that involves injecting premature and LBW infants with
thimersal-containing vaccines.

Nobody is "injecting premature and LBW infants with
thimerosal-containing
vaccines" for the purpose of conducting a study.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Rich,
You successfully avoided answering my question. In order for the study to
be performed, medical staff will have to make use of a Hep-B vaccine that
contains thimerosal instead of a Hep-B vaccine that does NOT contain
thimerosal. Is it ethical for medical staff (that are not actually
involved with the study) to do such a thing.

Another question came up while I was visiting this website:

http://www.whale.to/vaccines/autism_genetics.html

It was mentioned that the Hep-B vaccine that does NOT contain thimerosal
contains Aluminum? I should note that Aluminum is a known poison. Is that
true? If it is true, I don't know why drug companies place known
poisons in medications, vaccines and other products. For example,
aluminum
hydroxide is used in many over-the-counter antacids and under-arm
deodorants\
Quoting from Health Canada

Aluminum and Human Health

" ... The intake of aluminum from food for an adult amounts to about 8
milligrams per day, although higher daily intakes have also been
estimated. In general, approximately 95% of the normal daily intake of
aluminum for an adult comes from food. For infants, daily intakes of
aluminum are usually less than 1 milligram per day.

Pharmaceuticals

The daily intake of aluminum can be greatly increased for individuals
consuming maximum recommended doses of aluminum-based over-the-counter
drugs such as antacids and buffered acetylsalicylic acid (ASA). The
World Health Organization has estimated that individuals who regularly
ingest these aluminum-containing pharmaceuticals may have intakes as
high as 5 grams per day. ..."

http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/ewh-semt/wate...uminium_e.html

BTW, IIRC calcium carbonate derived from marine deposits has a high
concentration of Hg ( ??? )

Now, you have more to worry about. Enjoy.

Cordially,

RL

Ohh looky what I found!

A repost:

http://groups.google.com/group/misc....nce+of+opinion

2001 Sep;124(Pt 9):1821-31

Macrophagic myofasciitis lesions assess long-term persistence of
vaccine-derived aluminium hydroxide in muscle.

Gherardi RK, Coquet M, Cherin P, Belec L, Moretto P, Dreyfus PA, Pellissier
JF, Chariot P, Authier FJ.

Equipe mixte INSERM E 0011/Universite Paris XII, France.


Macrophagic myofasciitis (MMF) is an emerging condition of unknown cause,
detected in patients with diffuse arthromyalgias and fatigue, and
characterized by muscle infiltration by granular periodic acid-Schiff's
reagent-positive macrophages and lymphocytes. Intracytoplasmic inclusions
have been observed in macrophages of some patients. To assess their
significance, electron microscopy was performed in 40 consecutive cases and
chemical analysis was done by microanalysis and atomic absorption
spectrometry. Inclusions were constantly detected and corresponded to
aluminium hydroxide, an immunostimulatory compound frequently used as a
vaccine adjuvant. A lymphocytic component was constantly observed in MMF
lesions. Serological tests were compatible with exposure to aluminium
hydroxide-containing vaccines. History analysis revealed that 50 out of 50
patients had received vaccines against hepatitis B virus (86%), hepatitis A
virus (19%) or tetanus toxoid (58%), 3-96 months (median 36 months) before
biopsy. Diffuse myalgias were more frequent in patients with than without an
MMF lesion at deltoid muscle biopsy (P 0.0001). Myalgia onset was
subsequent to the vaccination (median 11 months) in 94% of patients. MMF
lesion was experimentally reproduced in rats. We conclude that the MMF
lesion is secondary to intramuscular injection of aluminium
hydroxide-containing vaccines, shows both long-term persistence of aluminium
hydroxide and an ongoing local immune reaction, and is detected in patients
with systemic symptoms which appeared subsequently to vaccination.

PMID: 11522584 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...eve&db=PubMed&...
uids=12184366&dopt=Abstract

Vaccine 2002 May 31;20 Suppl 3:S5-6 Related Articles, Links

Macrophagic myofasciitis: a summary of Dr. Gherardi's presentations.

Brenner A.

Rhevmatological Services, Inc., Framington, MA 01702, USA.

Dr. R.K. Gherardi presented two papers at the symposium, detailing his
researches into a proposed new clinical entity which he has entitled
Macrophagic Myofasciitis (MMF). In his first paper he described the
histopathologic and immunologic characteristics of the condition, and in the
second, the clinical and serologic features. Dr. Gherardi believes that MMF,
a
syndrome of ascending myalgias, fatigue and diffuse musculoskeletal pain,
may
be related to a chronic immune response to aluminum granulomas persisting at
the sites of prior immunization with aluminum adjuvated vaccines.

PMID: 12184366 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...eve&db=PubMed&...
uids=11910509&dopt=Abstract

Pediatr Dev Pathol 2002 Mar-Apr;5(2):151-8 Related Articles, Links

Aluminum phagocytosis in quadriceps muscle following vaccination in
children:
relationship to macrophagic myofasciitis.

Lacson AG, D'Cruz CA, Gilbert-Barness E, Sharer L, Jacinto S, Cuenca R.

Departments of Pediatrics and Pathology, University of South Florida at All
Children's Hospital, 801 Sixth Street South 7020, St. Petersburg, FL 33731,
USA.

Macrophagic myofasciitis (MMF) is a rare, seemingly emerging entity among
adult
patients in France. We encountered two children with the first two cases of
MMF
in North America. A 5-year-old male with chronic intestinal
pseudo-obstruction
required nighttime parenteral nutrition. Abnormal pupillary reflexes and
urinary retention suggested a diffuse dysautonomia, which prompted a
neurological diagnostic work-up. A 3-year-old child had developmental delay
and
hypotonia. Both children received age-appropriate immunizations. Quadriceps
muscle biopsy from each child showed the typical patchy, cohesive
centripetal
infiltration of alpha-1-antitrypsin+, alpha-1-antichymotrypsin+, CD68+,
PAS+,
CD1a-, S-100-, factor XIII- granular macrophages with adjacent myofiber
atrophy, dilated blood vessels, and mild endomysial and perimysial fibrosis.
No
myonecrosis was observed and no discrete granulomas were seen. A single
aluminum peak was demonstrated on energy dispersive X-ray microanalysis. The
etiology of the clinical symptoms in these cases and in cases reported as
MMF
remains intriguing. Despite numerous stains to demonstrate organisms, most
infectious causes leading to macrophage activation were ruled out. These
cases
are being reported to increase awareness of this condition and to encourage
a
systematic epidemiologic and clinicopathologic study in North America.

PMID: 11910509 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...eve&db=PubMed&...
uids=11335699&dopt=Abstract

Brain 2001 May;124(Pt 5):974-83 Related Articles, Links

Central nervous system disease in patients with macrophagic myofasciitis.

Authier FJ, Cherin P, Creange A, Bonnotte B, Ferrer X, Abdelmoumni A, Ranoux
D,
Pelletier J, Figarella-Branger D, Granel B, Maisonobe T, Coquet M, Degos JD,
Gherardi RK.

Groupe d'Etudes et de Recherches sur le Muscle et le Nerf (GERMEN, EA
Universite Paris XII-Val de Marne), Faculte de Medecine de Creteil,
Departement
de Pathologie, Hopital Henri Mondor, AP-HP, Creteil, France.


Macrophagic myofasciitis (MMF), a condition newly recognized in France, is
manifested by diffuse myalgias and characterized by highly specific
myopathological alterations which have recently been shown to represent an
unusually persistent local reaction to intramuscular injections of
aluminium-containing vaccines. Among 92 MMF patients recognized so far,
eight
of them, which included the seven patients reported here, had a symptomatic
demyelinating CNS disorder. CNS manifestations included hemisensory or
sensorimotor symptoms (four out of seven), bilateral pyramidal signs (six
out
of seven), cerebellar signs (four out of seven), visual loss (two out of
seven), cognitive and behavioural disorders (one out of seven) and bladder
dysfunction (one out of seven). Brain T(2)-weighted MRI showed single (two
out
of seven) or multiple (four out of seven) supratentorial white matter
hyperintense signals and corpus callosum atrophy (one out of seven). Evoked
potentials were abnormal in four out of six patients and CSF in four out of
seven. According to Poser's criteria for multiple sclerosis, the diagnosis
was
clinically definite (five out of seven) or clinically probable multiple
sclerosis (two out of seven). Six out of seven patients had diffuse
myalgias.
Deltoid muscle biopsy showed stereotypical accumulations of PAS (periodic
acid-Schiff)-positive macrophages, sparse CD8+ T cells and minimal myofibre
damage. Aluminium-containing vaccines had been administered 3-78 months
(median
= 33 months) before muscle biopsy (hepatitis B virus: four out of seven,
tetanus toxoid: one out of seven, both hepatitis B virus and tetanus toxoid:
two out of seven). The association between MMF and multiple sclerosis-like
disorders may give new insights into the controversial issues surrounding
vaccinations and demyelinating CNS disorders. Deltoid muscle biopsy
searching
for myopathological alterations of MMF should be performed in multiple
sclerosis patients with diffuse myalgias.

PMID: 11335699 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...eve&db=PubMed&...
uids=10847840&dopt=Abstract

Science 2000 May 26;288(5470):1323-4 Related Articles, Links

Public health. Aluminum is put on trial as a vaccine booster.

Malakoff D.

Publication Types:
News

PMID: 10847840 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...eve&db=PubMed&...
uids=9302736&dopt=Abstract

Vaccine 1997 Aug-Sep;15(12-13):1314-8 Related Articles, Links

In vivo absorption of aluminium-containing vaccine adjuvants using 26Al.

Flarend RE, Hem SL, White JL, Elmore D, Suckow MA, Rudy AC, Dandashli EA.

Department of Physics, Purdue University, West Lafayette, IN 47907, USA.

Aluminium hydroxide (AH) and aluminium phosphate (AP) adjuvants, labelled
with
26Al, were injected intramuscularly (i.m.) in New Zealand White rabbits.
Blood
and urine samples were collected for 28 days and analysed for 26Al using
accelerator mass spectrometry to determine the absorption and elimination of
AH
and AP adjuvants. 26Al was present in the first blood sample (1 h) for both
adjuvants. The area under the blood level curve for 28 days indicates that
three times more aluminium was absorbed from AP adjuvant than AH adjuvant.
The
distribution profile of aluminium to tissues was the same for both adjuvants
(kidney spleen liver heart lymph node brain). This study has
demonstrated that in vivo mechanisms are available to eliminate
aluminium-containing adjuvants after i.m. administration. In addition, the
pharmacokinetic profiles of AH and AP adjuvants are different.

PMID: 9302736 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

http://brain.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/...act/124/9/1821

"Rich" wrote in message
...

"Jan Drew" wrote in message
.com...



1. There is no reason not to. There is no evidence that Thimerosal
causes any problems.

Blatant lie.



You keep saying it is your belief. You have a right to believe that.
However, there is no factual basis for it.

Blatant lie # 2.



No, Jan, those are not "Blatant lies."

Yes, they are.

Furthermore, YOU are BLATANTLY lying...AGAIN.




A blatant lie is, "I posted it with
the permission of the author."

Yep.

Jim wrote *I have permission from the author.*


One would think that an experienced, proven
liar like yourself would understand what a lie really is, but you do not.

http://groups.google.com/group/misc....0e6d5d8?hl=en&

Hmmm.

Fact: There are at least four James Drews in Bloomington, IN.

Fact: Probert is a common Jewish name.

Fact: There are more Jews in New York than there are in Israel.

http://groups.google.com/group/misc....fe34e8b?hl=en&

Sat, Dec 17 2005 4:26 pm

Look in the phone book.

These are NOT errors. They ARE lies.



--Rich

"Jan Drew" wrote in message
. com...

"Rich" wrote in message
...

"Jan Drew" wrote in message
.com...



1. There is no reason not to. There is no evidence that Thimerosal
causes any problems.

Blatant lie.



You keep saying it is your belief. You have a right to believe that.
However, there is no factual basis for it.

Blatant lie # 2.



No, Jan, those are not "Blatant lies."

Yes, they are.

Furthermore, YOU are BLATANTLY lying...AGAIN.




A blatant lie is, "I posted it with
the permission of the author."

Yep.

Jim wrote *I have permission from the author.*


One would think that an experienced, proven
liar like yourself would understand what a lie really is, but you do not.

http://groups.google.com/group/misc....0e6d5d8?hl=en&

Hmmm.

Fact: There are at least four James Drews in Bloomington, IN.

Fact: Probert is a common Jewish name.

Fact: There are more Jews in New York than there are in Israel.

http://groups.google.com/group/misc....fe34e8b?hl=en&

Sat, Dec 17 2005 4:26 pm

Look in the phone book.

These are NOT errors. They ARE lies.


No, they are errors. A lie is "I posted it with the permission of the
author." YOU are the proven liar in this newsgroup. Now stop falsely
accusing others of your sins.
--


--Rich

Recommended websites:

http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
http://www.acahf.org.au
http://www.quackwatch.org/
http://www.skeptic.com/
http://www.csicop.org/

In article , "Jan Drew"
wrote:

"David Wright" wrote in message
y.net...
In article ,
Jason Johnson wrote:
In article , "Rich"
wrote:

"Jason Johnson" wrote in message
...

My problem is with the
medical establishment that continues to give children vaccines that
contain mercury--knowing full well that in the near future that none of
the vaccines will contain mercury. It would do no harm to wait until
the
vaccines that do not contain mercury become available.

Oh, but there is harm in waiting. Hep-B is devastating to an infant. It
is
the right thing to protect newborns from this disease as early as
possible,
especially since the risks from giving babies vaccines containing
Thimerosal
are neglegible compared to the risks of hepatitis.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Rich,
Good point. Does at least one company make a Hep-B vaccine that does NOT
contain thimerosal?

All hep B vaccines on the market are now thimerosal-free.

( http://www.vaccinesafety.edu/thi-table.htm )

Hep A-B
Twinrix
GlaxoSmithKline
*
*



1

PRESCRIBING INFORMATION

TWINRIX®

[Hepatitis A Inactivated & Hepatitis B (Recombinant) Vaccine]

DESCRIPTION

TWINRIX® [Hepatitis A Inactivated & Hepatitis B (Recombinant) Vaccine] is a
sterile

bivalent vaccine containing the antigenic components used in producing
HAVRIX® (Hepatitis A

Vaccine, Inactivated) and ENGERIX-B® [Hepatitis B Vaccine (Recombinant)].
TWINRIX is a

sterile suspension of inactivated hepatitis A virus (strain HM175)
propagated in MRC5 cells, and

combined with purified surface antigen of the hepatitis B virus. The
purified hepatitis B surface

antigen (HBsAg) is obtained by culturing genetically engineered
Saccharomyces cerevisiae cells,

which carry the surface antigen gene of the hepatitis B virus, in synthetic
media containing

inorganic salts, amino acids, dextrose, and vitamins. Bulk preparations of
each antigen are

adsorbed separately onto aluminum salts and then pooled during formulation.

A 1.0-mL dose of vaccine contains not less than 720 ELISA Units of
inactivated hepatitis A






virus and 20 mcg of recombinant HBsAg protein. One dose of vaccine also
contains 0.45 mg of
aluminum in the form of aluminum phosphate and aluminum hydroxide as
adjuvants,

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Jan, the key words from your post a

One dose of vaccine also contains 0.45 mg of aluminum in the form of
aluminum phosphate and aluminum hydroxide as adjuvants,

Conclusion:
The vaccine no longer contains MERCURY but instead contains ALUMNINUM--a
known poison.

Will the drug companies ever figure out how to make vaccines without
including known poisons? I hope so.

Jason

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Jan Drew wrote:
"Rich" wrote in message
...

"Jan Drew" wrote in message
.com...



1. There is no reason not to. There is no evidence that Thimerosal
causes any problems.

Blatant lie.



You keep saying it is your belief. You have a right to believe that.
However, there is no factual basis for it.

Blatant lie # 2.



No, Jan, those are not "Blatant lies."

Yes, they are.

Furthermore, YOU are BLATANTLY lying...AGAIN.




A blatant lie is, "I posted it with
the permission of the author."

Yep.

Jim wrote *I have permission from the author.*

Actually, Jim wrote "I just put it on the web with the permission of
the
author. The original author was an AOL user named "DOwens6683" who
posted it to the alt.paranormal newsgroup in 1998."

http://groups.google.com.au/group/mi...4?dmode=source

The author later chimed in to confirm this with:

http://groups.google.com.au/group/mi...c?dmode=source

"Jim Lippard did in fact contact me for permission to post the article
on his own website. Although he has probably been unaware of it until
this moment, he also ran across me in the pages of Filthy Pierre's "The

Connection," an amateur magazine where he and I exchanged some general
comments on religion back in the '80s.


As the author of "Stupid Skeptic Tricks," I can state unequivocally
that Jan Drew never requested or received permission to reprint or
repost the article from me. I was doing a bit of ego-surfing, and her
dishonesty ****ed me off. "

You, Jan, are a liar and a thief.




One would think that an experienced, proven
liar like yourself would understand what a lie really is, but you do not.


snip Jan pretending not to understand the difference between an error
and a lie, despite her acknowledged expertise as a practised liar

Thanks a lot--more things for all of us to worry about. I only recently
found out that the over-the-counter antacid that I have been making use of
for several years contains aluminum. I went to the drug store in other to
find an antacid that did NOT contain aluminum and discovered that almost
everyone of them had alumnium. Even if every word in your post is 100%
true, do you believe that aluminum should be placed in vaccines that are
injected into children?

I have what may sound like a dense question (or a
brilliant one, depending on whether you are a no-nonsense "take it as I
see it" person, or a "question everything" person who is perhaps WAY
too literal - like *me*).

What is the difference between being pleased that your
breakfast cereal has "super/extra-fortified/for today's hectic
lifestyle" levels of iron, potassium, zinc, magnesium,
manganese....etc. - and recoiling in disgust or horror or fear that
your vaccine or baby formula or toothpaste or whatever may have
aluminum or whatever?

I guess my question is because I don't have a "gut"
impression about aluminum. I feel good about zinc, iron, potassium,
etc. - but do not wish to encounter lead, cyanide, uranium,
silica/silicone, etc in my daily life.

Yet - these are all elements on the periodic table. I
know (or I think I know) that we are carbon-based animals - but I don't
really understand why or what it means. I know (or I think I know)
that most of nature (except rocks and magma/larva - and anything
derived therefrom) is some combo of hydrogen oxygen, and carbon. I
know that Nitrogen is very prominent too - but somehow it seems more -
I don't know - unstable, or maybe it's because I've seen reference to
nitrates or nitrites or whatever in so-called "unnatural" chemicals.

As you can see, my hold on this stuff is rather skimpy -
but basicically what part of the periodic table is "human friendly" -
metabolized or, er, eliminated, without incident. And what part/which
elements should one avoid unless they have specific expertise?

Sorry for rambling - but I've been thinking about this
for years. I work with a boy who is autistic, and one theory is that
he was exposed to Hg (mercury) as a baby during/because of vaccination.
When I don't believe it, I'm perplexed - and I can enjoy and accept
him and the frustrations that come from working with him with a "we're
all God's creatures and I'm gonna do right by this kid. He's a package
deal" attitude. When I do believe it, I'm angry. The idea that his
difficulties were essentially injected into him - well - I've been near
tears a few times. The idea that some folks get paid to try to force
him to be a "regular" kid - and essentially reject him - let's just say
I've once or twice thought of quitting in dramatic, verbose, and LOUD,
ANIMATED fashion.

But then I say - why should *I* also abandon him? Okay
- that was such a tangent! Obviously - the human body does not like
mercury. What else, then?

-stan

"Raving Loonie" wrote in message
ups.com...
Jan Drew wrote:
"stan" wrote in message
oups.com...

Raving Loonie wrote:
stan wrote:
Indigo Crow wrote:
stan wrote:
Raving Loonie wrote:
stan wrote:
Is this fun for you? Did daddy cut up your
credit cards
or something? Why are you here?


-stan

To expose YOU.

Friend of Mark Probert.....


By golly, I think that's the first nice thing
you've
said to or about me, Jan! Thanks!


-stan
This is Usenet, stan.

It is not RL.

You are talking bull****. **** off.

It doesn't *sound* like RL, either. So then who the
hell
are you and what is this post of yours about?
I am the "Raving Loonie". Check the IP on the headers.

In real life psychiatric patients don't exist either, asshole.

Okay - there are two explanations to this weird tangent.
One is that you are a troll who has gotten hold of someone's
computer
and cannot handle the freedom, or two - that you are Raving
Loonie/RL
and the instability you have been documenting, complaining about,
and
demonstrating on ASAD lately is raging and your just lashing out -
without answering my question "what are you posting about" ie. why
are
you using such hostile language towards me?
Am I annoyed with you, Stan?

Nah. I am just being passionate with my emotions and enjoying it

Lot's of people are passionate here about all sorts of things ...

They don't go around calling themselves, the "Raving Loonie" or
"Indigo
Crow". (Thank Google Groups for the *necessary* change in email Addy,
BTW ) Many hide their emotion behind a dispassionate delivery, too.

As for "Twittering One" (Virginia) ?

Now that she is alone and locked up in the loony bin; people would
prefer not to know or to forget. Nobody; either from Usenet or real
life ( except for one other, once ... AFAIK ) has had the sense to
call
and say "hi".

THAT annoys me intensely. It is inexcusable and thoughtless.

I have to claim passive-observer status. I don't believe I
know T1 yet, and I don't feel I have the right to assume familiarity
with someone and make a helpful gesture just so I can pat myself on the
back and say "what a good friend I am!". On the other hand, I agree
with you. If there are folks on this board who have "earned" the
status of friendship with T1, then it is up to them to reach out, or to
seriously reflect on why they genuinely shouldn't at this time. But
she must be feeling very lonely and perhaps scared right now. So
friends and family would be pretty important to her right now, I would
think.

I don't know her either. Just KNOW she is having a rough time.
That's ALL I need to know!!
It would easy to surmise that I am laying a 'guilt trip' upon people.

O.K. The thought does cross my mind and puts a huge grin on my face
...

))))))))))))))

Notwithstanding such, I perceive more in all this. I shall explain:

Honestly, GUILT or lack of guilt HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH IT. Frankly,
it doesn't matter a jot what a person has "said" or "hasn't said" to T1
in the past. Nor, does it matter a jot what T1 has or hasn't said on
her own behalf. Nor does it matter that T1 is perfectly sane or nuttier
than a fruitcake. Nor does it matter that the poster chooses to spend
their time posting on Usenet because they cherish the anonymity and or
absence of direct, verbal contact, or all the more so of such things.

Conversing with another disembodied voice who happens to be locked up
and attached to a payphone on a psychiatric ward is NOT intimidating.
It is not embarrassing. It is apt to be far less awkward than the
caller might imagine.

As far as the recipient of the call on the other end of the line is
concerned?

They are probably going to be delighted to have the opportunity to
converse with someone that they, at the very least indirectly know, at
the level of an ordinary person-to-person human being, who accepts
their ' detained ' status and all that it implies; as part of the
'status quo'. In short; there isn't exactly a hell of a lot that needs
explaining, here. Simply calling and talking acknowledges and dispenses
with all that unpleasantness AUTOMATICALLY.

Most of all, the poster might discover that he or she has had a
delightful conversation with another poster; which if 'circumstances'
had been otherwise might never have taken place at all.

What I am trying to say is ...

This is an opportunity to talk to someone with who you would not
normally verbally converse. It is *in reality*, less intimidating and
stressful, than calling a person via the telephone out of the blue, in
the privacy of their own home.

Take advantage of the moment. It will pass ... When it does; you might
never know what you have missed. IMO, that is a great pity.

Cordially,

RL

Very well said.

I called her. She was very pleasant. In a good mood.
I have NEVER spoke with her before. She was glad to hear
from me and pleased I called. As mentioned we had exchanged
e-mails when I sent her money.

She guessed YOU have given me the phone number. She KNOWS and
APPRECIATES your concern. Your efforts to help.

She gave me permission to pass along, she thinks she will be released
next week. She also stated the hospital and staff were all very nice.

I asked her if..she was still being forced [not sure if I used that word] to
take the
meds she objected to taking. She said.. yes. But..her doctor was reducing
some ADHD meds.
She was pleased with that. Mentioned lesser of two evils.

I asked what she was planning to do. She told me to zip her a e-mail. She
would tell
me more. All in all it was a pleasant conversation. She thanked me
repeatedly. Since
I only know her from a few of her posts. She expressed her appreciation.

I told her she certainly did not sound like she was mentally ill.

She told me to *take care*.

I said, you do the same..sweet lady. God Bless.

Thanks again Raving for caring.

God Bless you.

Sincerely,

Jan






You, OTOH are looking for excuses.

At least you see the several ironies in what I have posted. My point,
EXACTLY.

huge grin

Cordially,

RL

Whew! I thought I had either offended, that some jerk
had taken advantage of you for getting up from your computer (or worse
- hacked in), or that I was morally obligated to find a way to help you
if you were in crisis. Glad you seem okay. Are you?


-stan

"stan" wrote in message
oups.com...


THAT annoys me intensely. It is inexcusable and thoughtless.

I have to claim passive-observer status. I don't believe I
know T1 yet, and I don't feel I have the right to assume familiarity
with someone and make a helpful gesture just so I can pat myself on the
back and say "what a good friend I am!". On the other hand, I agree
with you. If there are folks on this board who have "earned" the
status of friendship with T1, then it is up to them to reach out, or to
seriously reflect on why they genuinely shouldn't at this time. But
she must be feeling very lonely and perhaps scared right now. So
friends and family would be pretty important to her right now, I would
think.

I don't know her either. Just KNOW she is having a rough time.
That's ALL I need to know!!

You, OTOH are looking for excuses.

Jan, this just shows that you have no respect for
a person's privacy. Who the hell am I to say - "Gee, Twittering One
(not even knowing her real name)

It was mentioned right here.

Any more excuses?!?!


- I don't know you, but since we both
read/post to the same usenet forum (!!!!) - that makes us buddies

NOT!

and
gives me a bond with you that entitles me to butt into your real life

What nonsense.

even though it's painful and confusing right now......"

I'm looking for excuses? No - I am showing
respect. YOU on the other hand are looking for a fight.

NO.


You're
nothing but a saucy little school(girl?) with duplicitous morality and
unearned pseudo-righteousness. Go stand in a corner. And since a brat
like you would likely not have been befriended by T1, leave her the
hell alone. She doesn't need you. No one in this forum does.

Absolutely wrong. This IS a support group.

Listen, Lady Lollipop - the jig is up, okay? Just
because we live on opposite coasts doesn't mean that you are impervious
to karma. Perhaps you'd better enjoy spending your time in the
dentist's chair, or handling and inspecting your own feces, or kissing
up to Hulda. I know *I'd* rather you be doing so.

More complete nonsense and LIES.

It's over, 415*****72.

More nonsense.


Capiche?


-stan

"Rich" wrote in message
...

"Jan Drew" wrote in message
. com...

"Rich" wrote in message
...

"Jan Drew" wrote in message
.com...



1. There is no reason not to. There is no evidence that Thimerosal
causes any problems.

Blatant lie.



You keep saying it is your belief. You have a right to believe that.
However, there is no factual basis for it.

Blatant lie # 2.



No, Jan, those are not "Blatant lies."

Yes, they are.

Furthermore, YOU are BLATANTLY lying...AGAIN.




A blatant lie is, "I posted it with
the permission of the author."

Yep.

Jim wrote *I have permission from the author.*


One would think that an experienced, proven
liar like yourself would understand what a lie really is, but you do
not.

http://groups.google.com/group/misc....0e6d5d8?hl=en&

Hmmm.

Fact: There are at least four James Drews in Bloomington, IN.

Fact: Probert is a common Jewish name.

Fact: There are more Jews in New York than there are in Israel.

http://groups.google.com/group/misc....fe34e8b?hl=en&

Sat, Dec 17 2005 4:26 pm

Look in the phone book.

These are NOT errors. They ARE lies.


No, they are errors.

No, when you state. Fact.

That IS a lie. NOT an error.

Look in the phone book...IS a lie.

A lie is "I posted it with the permission of the
author."

Yep. Jim wrote *I have permission from the author.*


YOU are the proven liar in this newsgroup.

Yes, you are.

So is Mark Probert.

Who...YOU repeatedly LIE when you say he did not lie.


Now stop falsely
accusing others of your sins.

That IS you, Rich Shewmaker.

YOU lie every time..you shill for a proven liar.


--


--Rich

"cathyb" wrote in message
ps.com...

Jan Drew wrote:
"Rich" wrote in message
...

"Jan Drew" wrote in message
.com...



1. There is no reason not to. There is no evidence that Thimerosal
causes any problems.

Blatant lie.



You keep saying it is your belief. You have a right to believe that.
However, there is no factual basis for it.

Blatant lie # 2.



No, Jan, those are not "Blatant lies."

Yes, they are.

Furthermore, YOU are BLATANTLY lying...AGAIN.




A blatant lie is, "I posted it with
the permission of the author."

Yep.

Jim wrote *I have permission from the author.*

Actually, Jim wrote "I just put it on the web with the permission of
the
author. The original author was an AOL user named "DOwens6683" who
posted it to the alt.paranormal newsgroup in 1998."

http://groups.google.com.au/group/mi...4?dmode=source

The author later chimed in to confirm this with:

http://groups.google.com.au/group/mi...c?dmode=source

Thanks for showing that lie. Being completely honest...YOU did not post his
lie.

Concerning proof of authorship, I can only say the
publishers of "The Skeptic" were willing to accept me as the author of
this piece when they contacted me for permission to reprint it in the
August 2003 issue of their magazine.


"Jim Lippard did in fact contact me for permission to post the article
on his own website. Although he has probably been unaware of it until
this moment, he also ran across me in the pages of Filthy Pierre's "The

Connection," an amateur magazine where he and I exchanged some general
comments on religion back in the '80s.


As the author of "Stupid Skeptic Tricks,

There IS the lie.


" I can state unequivocally
that Jan Drew never requested or received permission to reprint or
repost the article from me. I was doing a bit of ego-surfing, and her
dishonesty ****ed me off. "

Gullywampus.

NOT DOwens6683.


You have made this particular accusation many times, and provided not
one shred of evidence



You, Jan, are a liar and a thief.






One would think that an experienced, proven
liar like yourself would understand what a lie really is, but you do
not.


snip Jan pretending not to understand the difference between an error
and a lie, despite her acknowledged expertise as a practised liar

Snip what you cannot handle.

Proof..Rich Shewmaker is a blatnat liar.

Just like you....


http://groups.google.com/group/misc....e85fb13868d12b

For which you are clearly to blame

http://groups.google.com/group/misc....ad28c24baffa15

Doo-Lally-Pop of accusing
me of being at least three other people of late.

http://groups.google.com/group/misc....1e489e7b96ed4d

Fri, Jun 9 2006 10:55 pm

[posted links that didn't work].


http://groups.google.com/group/misc....6c9484fe669fc2

Sat, Jun 10 2006 2:57 am

Those were my links, and I have no idea why they didn't work. I
certainly can't be bothered trying to find them again, when everyone
has read the pertinent stuff anyway.

http://groups.google.com/group/misc....2a3c5aa974d5f1

Sun, Jun 11 2006 1:43 am

[posted correct links that worked].


Blatant liar, aka/cathyb wrote:

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.s...57add11?hl=en&

Sorry about the name; my son gave it to me as a joke many months ago,
and sometimes it just shows up.

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.s...8791e5a?hl=en&

Well, yes. It usually occurs when I post to a group other than mha; I
never remember to check which name is up there. Since in this case the
post was to a breast implant group I've never visited before, it
happened here.

Why; what possible problem can you have with this? Do you hav e any
conception of how stupid you appear?


Jan Drew wrote:
"cathyb" wrote in message
ups.com...

excatholic wrote:


I will show how DECEITFUL aka/cathy is:


"excatholic" wrote in message
oups.com...


She didn't want the readers to see that.

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.s...0388100?hl=en&


Sure, Jan. That's why I posted it: so no-one would read it.

==

Well, NO she did NOT.

Blatant liar exposed.


http://groups.google.com/group/misc....66c4f8206aa32d

[more blatant lies, and said *That's a blatant lie, Jan].

http://groups.google.com/group/misc....3d99d4f09f87da

[blatant liar exposed].

http://groups.google.com/group/misc....6b14e49234d02e

[blatant liar exposed...AGAIN].

http://groups.google.com/group/misc....806d9a4cd29e7b

Well, thank you for showing that I was telling the truth, Jan