Clarification teaching good sleep habits (xpost)

Hi everybody,

Thanks for the replies. I'm not really concerned about the schedule yet, I
think hubby would like it because he keeps trying to get to bed by 10 and
the boys keep keeping us up until 11:30 or 12.

More important is the learning-to-go-to-sleep-on-their-own thing. Take last
night for example: boys weren't asleep (therefore not in bed) until
12:30am. 3am Chris wakes up, wanting to be fed: hubby has to get up with
him because I have to express breastmilk (can't leave it or I leak all over
everywhere, wasting precious BM). 3:30am, Alex wakes up. I'm finished
expressing, Chris is finished feeding *but* he's not asleep again yet. So
hubby has to stay up feeding Alex while I try and get Chris to sleep. By
4:00am both had finished feeding, neither was asleep, so both hubby and I
had to still be up. It was about 5:30 before all of us were in bed again,
and poor hubby is supposed to be out to work by 7:30am. We were up for 2.5
hours, and only about 50 minutes of that was actually feeding.

Days like today (as hubby and I stumble around bleary eyed) I feel like we
*need* to teach the boys to go to sleep on their own. But I understand from
a lot of your posts that they are still simply too young. SIGH At least I
had a mother's helper in this morning so I grabbed an extra hour sleep, but
hubby doesn't have that option :-(

Marie

"Marie" wrote in message
e.rogers.com...
My twin boys are 3.5 mos old, about 6 wks corrected. They are beginning
to
sleep 5 hrs at night *once* we get them to sleep, but getting them to
sleep
is a challenge. They both want to be held while falling asleep, until
they
are *completely* asleep. If they are even just dozing when we put them
down
in their crib, they wake up howling and screaming and we have to begin the
entire settling down/falling asleep process all over again. This is a
pain
as one of them, who tends towards colic, can sometimes take upwards of two
hours to fall asleep :-( The other one averages about 30-40 mins for the
process.

I know they are too young for Ferber, but I would *really* like to teach
them how to fall asleep in their cribs--it seems like an important
lifeskill. Besides, they knew how to do it once, I think: they spent the
first 5.5 wks of their life in the hospital and the nurses certainly
didn't
hold them all the time. Even when I was there during the day they would
be
out of their cots for feeding and then placed back in, even if they were
awake.

BTW, it's not just at night--during the day they insist on being held as
well.

When/how can I start teaching them to relax themselves to sleep on their
own?

When/how do I start trying to introduce a "scheduled" nap-time into their
lives?

TIA

Marie
Chris & Alex--born 04/23/03 (31 wks gestational)

I haven't been totally following this line because I was out of town all
week but I feel for you! Mine went through weekly stages....either they both
woke up at the same time or they tag teamed....the only time where it was
really difficult was when I just started feeding one and the other woke up
shortly there after....thats when I had to wake up dh, otherwise it was all
on me to change/feed them at night. I didn't BF, so mine were
bottle-fed....while they were very young, I did manage to hold both and feed
both at the same time but propping them on pillows, side by side and then
holding the bottles also worked well (also made it *kind of* easier to stay
awake)....the routine was kinda basic....when they woke, I got the bottles
warmed (either by the bottle warmer or just via tap), changed them then fed
em, then back to bed.....I can't remember when I started them on their
schedule....I know they started sleeping longer at 2.5mos so it must've been
sometime after that .... but now come 7pm they know its bed time!! All I
have to say/announce is "Its bed time!" and there they go....two cute butts
walking down the hallway right to their room! Boy, when they are ready for
it, scheduling is definatly the way to go!!
Oh, I got sidetracked.....as someone else stated, I would wake the other one
up to change/feed at the same time.....getting tagteamed is the
worse!....actually you don't have to "wake them up"...you just get them out
of bed and then change and feed (if they take it, they take it, if they
don't, they don't)
oh, and I don't know how light you sleep, but I know with all three of mine,
I could sleep while they were awake, cradled in my arms....if they moved,
then I instantly woke...but outside of being on a boob, there's nothing a
babe likes more than being nuzzled on moms/dads chest, listening to their
heartbeats...knocks em right out!
hth

--
Gwen, Designer Wraps
SAHM to James (9-98) Austin and Amber (5-02)


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I remember those awful nights...really I do...do try the tandem nursing, a
BFing pillow or just a whole bunch of pillows around you, football holds and
see if that works. No sleep makes one nuts..I remember that too. Most
babies don't mind sharing mom at that age so the double feeding might work.
I did try to wake one up when I fed the other and it worked for a while
until the other one went on strike when I would wake them up. But for a
while it helps mom and dad get a few more winks. Good luck, hang in there,
it seems like a long time but really it will be over and you will be
surprised.

Shirley
Chris and Kathleen 1/95

"Sue" wrote in message
...
My friend had twins and if one woke up to feed during the night, she woke
the other one too to feed at the same time. I don't know if that is an
option for you and your husband, but at least they got the feedings done
at
the same time. She only did this in the middle of the night.
--
Sue
mom to three girls

Marie wrote in message
le.rogers.com...
Hi everybody,

Thanks for the replies. I'm not really concerned about the schedule
yet,
I
think hubby would like it because he keeps trying to get to bed by 10
and
the boys keep keeping us up until 11:30 or 12.

More important is the learning-to-go-to-sleep-on-their-own thing. Take
last
night for example: boys weren't asleep (therefore not in bed) until
12:30am. 3am Chris wakes up, wanting to be fed: hubby has to get up
with
him because I have to express breastmilk (can't leave it or I leak all
over
everywhere, wasting precious BM). 3:30am, Alex wakes up. I'm finished
expressing, Chris is finished feeding *but* he's not asleep again yet.
So
hubby has to stay up feeding Alex while I try and get Chris to sleep.
By
4:00am both had finished feeding, neither was asleep, so both hubby and
I
had to still be up. It was about 5:30 before all of us were in bed
again,
and poor hubby is supposed to be out to work by 7:30am. We were up for
2.5
hours, and only about 50 minutes of that was actually feeding.

Days like today (as hubby and I stumble around bleary eyed) I feel like
we
*need* to teach the boys to go to sleep on their own. But I understand
from
a lot of your posts that they are still simply too young. SIGH At
least
I
had a mother's helper in this morning so I grabbed an extra hour sleep,
but
hubby doesn't have that option :-(

Marie

"Marie" wrote in message
e.rogers.com...
My twin boys are 3.5 mos old, about 6 wks corrected. They are
beginning
to
sleep 5 hrs at night *once* we get them to sleep, but getting them to
sleep
is a challenge. They both want to be held while falling asleep, until
they
are *completely* asleep. If they are even just dozing when we put
them
down
in their crib, they wake up howling and screaming and we have to begin
the
entire settling down/falling asleep process all over again. This is a
pain
as one of them, who tends towards colic, can sometimes take upwards of
two
hours to fall asleep :-( The other one averages about 30-40 mins for
the
process.

I know they are too young for Ferber, but I would *really* like to
teach
them how to fall asleep in their cribs--it seems like an important
lifeskill. Besides, they knew how to do it once, I think: they spent
the
first 5.5 wks of their life in the hospital and the nurses certainly
didn't
hold them all the time. Even when I was there during the day they
would
be
out of their cots for feeding and then placed back in, even if they
were
awake.

BTW, it's not just at night--during the day they insist on being held
as
well.

When/how can I start teaching them to relax themselves to sleep on
their
own?

When/how do I start trying to introduce a "scheduled" nap-time into
their
lives?

TIA

Marie
Chris & Alex--born 04/23/03 (31 wks gestational)

My friend had twins and if one woke up to feed during the night, she woke
the other one too to feed at the same time. I don't know if that is an
option for you and your husband, but at least they got the feedings done at
the same time. She only did this in the middle of the night.
--
Sue
mom to three girls

Marie wrote in message
le.rogers.com...
Hi everybody,

Thanks for the replies. I'm not really concerned about the schedule yet,
I
think hubby would like it because he keeps trying to get to bed by 10 and
the boys keep keeping us up until 11:30 or 12.

More important is the learning-to-go-to-sleep-on-their-own thing. Take
last
night for example: boys weren't asleep (therefore not in bed) until
12:30am. 3am Chris wakes up, wanting to be fed: hubby has to get up with
him because I have to express breastmilk (can't leave it or I leak all
over
everywhere, wasting precious BM). 3:30am, Alex wakes up. I'm finished
expressing, Chris is finished feeding *but* he's not asleep again yet. So
hubby has to stay up feeding Alex while I try and get Chris to sleep. By
4:00am both had finished feeding, neither was asleep, so both hubby and I
had to still be up. It was about 5:30 before all of us were in bed again,
and poor hubby is supposed to be out to work by 7:30am. We were up for
2.5
hours, and only about 50 minutes of that was actually feeding.

Days like today (as hubby and I stumble around bleary eyed) I feel like we
*need* to teach the boys to go to sleep on their own. But I understand
from
a lot of your posts that they are still simply too young. SIGH At least
I
had a mother's helper in this morning so I grabbed an extra hour sleep,
but
hubby doesn't have that option :-(

Marie

"Marie" wrote in message
e.rogers.com...
My twin boys are 3.5 mos old, about 6 wks corrected. They are beginning
to
sleep 5 hrs at night *once* we get them to sleep, but getting them to
sleep
is a challenge. They both want to be held while falling asleep, until
they
are *completely* asleep. If they are even just dozing when we put them
down
in their crib, they wake up howling and screaming and we have to begin
the
entire settling down/falling asleep process all over again. This is a
pain
as one of them, who tends towards colic, can sometimes take upwards of
two
hours to fall asleep :-( The other one averages about 30-40 mins for
the
process.

I know they are too young for Ferber, but I would *really* like to teach
them how to fall asleep in their cribs--it seems like an important
lifeskill. Besides, they knew how to do it once, I think: they spent
the
first 5.5 wks of their life in the hospital and the nurses certainly
didn't
hold them all the time. Even when I was there during the day they would
be
out of their cots for feeding and then placed back in, even if they were
awake.

BTW, it's not just at night--during the day they insist on being held as
well.

When/how can I start teaching them to relax themselves to sleep on their
own?

When/how do I start trying to introduce a "scheduled" nap-time into
their
lives?

TIA

Marie
Chris & Alex--born 04/23/03 (31 wks gestational)

Marie,

I had (what sounds like) the same sleep goals for my kids that you have. My
belief for our family is that kids should go to bed and stay there until they
get up in the morning. Bad dreams, thunderstorms, illness, etc. do not count,
btw!

You have already heard that it is too early to worry about this, although I
sympaythize with you. I think a key thing we did was start putting them in
their cribs at about a month of age after that early evening feeding, around 8
pm or so?? Door closed, room dark, so they know it is now nighttime. The
nighttime feedings were done, then back to the cribs. In the daytime it took a
little longer for them to start napping in the cribs. I kept a log of feeding
and sleeping, and one day when they were about 5 mos. old I realized that they
had napped at right around the same times for a few days straight. Alas, our
two-nap schedule was born!

Another suggestion if you are not already doing it...when one wakes up to eat,
either wake the other at the same time or right after so they get on the same
feeding schedule. My boys have eaten, napped, and gone to bed at the same time
since they've been on a schedule. They didn't have a choice Otherwise you
will get no sleep and get nothing done.

Don't fret too much right now about having to let them cry it out, etc. I am a
firm believer in children going to sleep on their own and staying asleep, but I
am not some tyrant who let them cry for hours. They really never needed much
"coaching". All 3 now go to bed and sleep 11-12 hrs. Yours may be the same
way, or you may need to "teach" them. You may find that you'll do anything to
get some sleep and have them both in with you if need be! Take it one step at
a time and things will fall into place.

You have probably already realized that people have very strong opinions about
the sleep topic. I'm sure some are reading this thinking I am a heartless
wench because I don't sleep with my kids or let them sleep with me. Just do
what works for you. Good luck and hang in there!


Ellen
--------
Erin 6/26/95
Bradley & Alex 10/5/00

Ellen Kmetz writes:
I had (what sounds like) the same sleep goals for my kids that you
have. My belief for our family is that kids should go to bed and stay
there until they get up in the morning. Bad dreams, thunderstorms,
illness, etc. do not count, btw!

OK, I really can't tell. Do you mean that being sick isn't a valid
excuse for not sleeping according to your standards? Or do you mean the
opposite: that you're willing to waive your mandate in case of sickness?

David desJardins

I think she meant she believes they should stay in bed until morning. However,
she makes an exception when there is a bad dream or illness...
That is how I read it.



~Kimberly
Mommy to Alexis Iliana 07/17/99 and
Emma Elidia & Aislyn Gabriela 10/01/02
come see us...
http://www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aislynemma/

I think she meant she believes they should stay in bed until morning.
However,
she makes an exception when there is a bad dream or illness...
That is how I read it.


That is exactly what I meant, Kim!


Ellen
--------
Erin 6/26/95
Bradley & Alex 10/5/00

I think I remember mine pulling that one too....thinking that 3 am was
morning! ahhhh well, at least around here they repeat the previous nights
local news at that time.....plus it a good time to run another load of
laundry!

--
Gwen, Designer Wraps
SAHM to James (9-98) Austin and Amber (5-02)


tired of eBay? Try these great alternatives!
www.tobuytwo.com ....auction house for families of multiples (but singletons
can use it too!)
www.familyauction.com
www.wahmall.com
www.wahmauctions.com

"Bert Szala" wrote in message
...
My girls just turned 7 months monday (6 weeks premature) and I have to
echo the sentiments that I've heard. If one wakes up they both get fed
(only at night). Mind you that I have to feed them formula (they can't
eat my breast milk - but that's another story!). We keep lights and
noise to an absolute minimum, just enought to measure the meds and mix
the formula (and not stumble). Usually we are able to get them both
back to sleep with singing and carrying.

If they wake up after 3am for the "midnight" feeding we seem to be out
of luck. At that point they seem to think that they've had enough sleep
and it's time to play.

Bert

PS I keep telling myself that it gets easier but DH and I have yet to
get a full night's sleep (or enough sleep for that matter) since they
were born.

Sue wrote:

My friend had twins and if one woke up to feed during the night, she woke
the other one too to feed at the same time. I don't know if that is an
option for you and your husband, but at least they got the feedings done
at
the same time. She only did this in the middle of the night.
--
Sue
mom to three girls

Marie wrote in message
ble.rogers.com...


Hi everybody,

Thanks for the replies. I'm not really concerned about the schedule
yet,


I


think hubby would like it because he keeps trying to get to bed by 10
and
the boys keep keeping us up until 11:30 or 12.

More important is the learning-to-go-to-sleep-on-their-own thing. Take


last


night for example: boys weren't asleep (therefore not in bed) until
12:30am. 3am Chris wakes up, wanting to be fed: hubby has to get up
with
him because I have to express breastmilk (can't leave it or I leak all


over


everywhere, wasting precious BM). 3:30am, Alex wakes up. I'm finished
expressing, Chris is finished feeding *but* he's not asleep again yet.
So
hubby has to stay up feeding Alex while I try and get Chris to sleep.
By
4:00am both had finished feeding, neither was asleep, so both hubby and
I
had to still be up. It was about 5:30 before all of us were in bed
again,
and poor hubby is supposed to be out to work by 7:30am. We were up for


2.5


hours, and only about 50 minutes of that was actually feeding.

Days like today (as hubby and I stumble around bleary eyed) I feel like
we
*need* to teach the boys to go to sleep on their own. But I understand


from


a lot of your posts that they are still simply too young. SIGH At
least


I


had a mother's helper in this morning so I grabbed an extra hour sleep,


but


hubby doesn't have that option :-(

Marie

"Marie" wrote in message
ble.rogers.com...


My twin boys are 3.5 mos old, about 6 wks corrected. They are
beginning


to


sleep 5 hrs at night *once* we get them to sleep, but getting them to


sleep


is a challenge. They both want to be held while falling asleep, until


they


are *completely* asleep. If they are even just dozing when we put them


down


in their crib, they wake up howling and screaming and we have to begin


the


entire settling down/falling asleep process all over again. This is a


pain


as one of them, who tends towards colic, can sometimes take upwards of


two


hours to fall asleep :-( The other one averages about 30-40 mins for


the


process.

I know they are too young for Ferber, but I would *really* like to
teach
them how to fall asleep in their cribs--it seems like an important
lifeskill. Besides, they knew how to do it once, I think: they spent


the


first 5.5 wks of their life in the hospital and the nurses certainly


didn't


hold them all the time. Even when I was there during the day they
would


be


out of their cots for feeding and then placed back in, even if they
were
awake.

BTW, it's not just at night--during the day they insist on being held
as
well.

When/how can I start teaching them to relax themselves to sleep on
their
own?

When/how do I start trying to introduce a "scheduled" nap-time into


their


lives?

TIA

Marie
Chris & Alex--born 04/23/03 (31 wks gestational)

On Wed, 06 Aug 2003 12:24:42 GMT, Bert Szala
wrote:

PS I keep telling myself that it gets easier but DH and I have yet to
get a full night's sleep (or enough sleep for that matter) since they
were born.

Again, I don't multiples. At night, I did all the feeding and waking
during the week, which included pumping with my DD (for the first few
weeks). My DH had to be at work at 7am. I went to bed early usually
by 8pm. So he did the evening shift with DD, and I did the night
shift. On one weekend night a week, DH did the night shift for me so
I could sleep through.

If you are breastfeeding, this might not work. It is what helped me
save my sanity and get enough sleep.

--
Daye
Momma to Jayan
EDD 11 Jan 2004