MAINTENANCE OF CHILD SUPPORT RECORDS

Dear Layne & all who have contributed....
Thank you for your responses! I have done a lot of research so far and
talked to quite a few attorney's. Fueled by these discussions that have been
very educational, it is now my opinion that: Absolutely, the burden of
proof is on her, and not me (that's why the phone call with no paper work
and or follow-up letter), and yes there most certainly is a problem with
laches (it goes both ways). Here's the ultimate conclusion with respect to
these matters:
"Modification Of Custody and Support" states "support and maintenance is
vacated, nunc pro tunc." That's back to the date of the divorce order!" That
is all that I'm going to provide here on this public board and I'm certain
that you understand. The issue's remaining is their behavior's hereinafter!
I honestly forgave a long time ago. The collection agency, well, they called
me up and ultimately harrassed me. I had to be transferred to a supervisor
because the first collections agent was a woman who obviously was gender
bias! Based on threats that they made, they victimized me and demanded
documents that they failed to obtain from their client!
With the threat of judgement and "going forward" they feel clever to
make me provide proof or else! They refused to provide me with any
documentation with respect to these matters. No letter as they said they
sent (lie). I HATE liar's and have a deep rooted problem with them! Never
ask me a question that you don't wnt to know the answer to I tell my
friends. I hope that they "collectively" really go for it, I sincerely do.
They illegally accessed my credit report based on theory and not fact! No
justification whatsoever!

What do you think now?

Thank you,

George

Layne Barlow" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 28 Jul 2003 04:10:11 GMT, "Live Wire Cycles NY/LI"
wrote:

MAINTENANCE OF CHILD SUPPORT RECORDS

My New York Divorce was effective Oct 4, 1984 and my ex had custody for
approximately 34 months thereafter. The support order was vacated on Aug.
1,
1987 after I took custody (handicapped child). I never asked for support
nor
received any. My ex has seen the child about 8 times in all these years.
My
ex NOW (almost 20 years later) is claiming that she has never been paid
support and has filed clam with a collections agency located in Texas!
The
child and I have always resided in New York. The mother resides in PA now
as
she has recently moved there from New Jersey.

Question: How long do you have to maintain records of child support?

Thank you in advance for any assistance you can provide.....

George



This is an easy one.

First, the burden of proof is on her to prove she received no support.

Second, as soon as they make any kind of formal claim against you,
counterclaim for all the support *she* didn't pay for all those years.
Parents' duty to support their children exists independent of any
statute or judgment. That's even in Blackstone. Dig deep enough and
you should be able to find caselaw supporting this in every state.

Third, jurisdiction should remain with the original court ... or in
the state where the child now resides. Since the child is now an
adult, some creative legal research could probably prove mom has no
standing now to sue for support for the child.

Absent a defined statute of limitations, she's also going to find a
trouble with laches (sat on her rights too long and it's now therefore
as stale claim).

Good luck.

Layne

In response to the possible affidavit that allegedly she signed, I have one
that she signed and is filed! Wow, two affidavit's, one says one thing and
the other says another? I'm not very smart when it comes to these things.
Should this topic be expanded into another legal forum now?

George


"Live Wire Cycles NY/LI" wrote in message
news
Dear Layne & all who have contributed....
Thank you for your responses! I have done a lot of research so far and
talked to quite a few attorney's. Fueled by these discussions that have
been
very educational, it is now my opinion that: Absolutely, the burden of
proof is on her, and not me (that's why the phone call with no paper work
and or follow-up letter), and yes there most certainly is a problem with
laches (it goes both ways). Here's the ultimate conclusion with respect to
these matters:
"Modification Of Custody and Support" states "support and maintenance is
vacated, nunc pro tunc." That's back to the date of the divorce order!"
That
is all that I'm going to provide here on this public board and I'm certain
that you understand. The issue's remaining is their behavior's
hereinafter!
I honestly forgave a long time ago. The collection agency, well, they
called
me up and ultimately harrassed me. I had to be transferred to a supervisor
because the first collections agent was a woman who obviously was gender
bias! Based on threats that they made, they victimized me and demanded
documents that they failed to obtain from their client!
With the threat of judgement and "going forward" they feel clever to
make me provide proof or else! They refused to provide me with any
documentation with respect to these matters. No letter as they said they
sent (lie). I HATE liar's and have a deep rooted problem with them! Never
ask me a question that you don't wnt to know the answer to I tell my
friends. I hope that they "collectively" really go for it, I sincerely do.
They illegally accessed my credit report based on theory and not fact! No
justification whatsoever!

What do you think now?

Thank you,

George

Layne Barlow" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 28 Jul 2003 04:10:11 GMT, "Live Wire Cycles NY/LI"
wrote:

MAINTENANCE OF CHILD SUPPORT RECORDS

My New York Divorce was effective Oct 4, 1984 and my ex had custody for
approximately 34 months thereafter. The support order was vacated on
Aug.
1,
1987 after I took custody (handicapped child). I never asked for
support
nor
received any. My ex has seen the child about 8 times in all these
years.
My
ex NOW (almost 20 years later) is claiming that she has never been paid
support and has filed clam with a collections agency located in Texas!
The
child and I have always resided in New York. The mother resides in PA
now
as
she has recently moved there from New Jersey.

Question: How long do you have to maintain records of child support?

Thank you in advance for any assistance you can provide.....

George



This is an easy one.

First, the burden of proof is on her to prove she received no support.

Second, as soon as they make any kind of formal claim against you,
counterclaim for all the support *she* didn't pay for all those years.
Parents' duty to support their children exists independent of any
statute or judgment. That's even in Blackstone. Dig deep enough and
you should be able to find caselaw supporting this in every state.

Third, jurisdiction should remain with the original court ... or in
the state where the child now resides. Since the child is now an
adult, some creative legal research could probably prove mom has no
standing now to sue for support for the child.

Absent a defined statute of limitations, she's also going to find a
trouble with laches (sat on her rights too long and it's now therefore
as stale claim).

Good luck.

Layne

"Live Wire Cycles NY/LI" wrote in message
...
In response to the possible affidavit that allegedly she signed, I have
one
that she signed and is filed! Wow, two affidavit's, one says one thing and
the other says another? I'm not very smart when it comes to these things.
Should this topic be expanded into another legal forum now?

George
==
No need. Your case doesn't hinge on her affidavit--it hinges on your court
order so it
matters not what she told the agency or what she signed for them. Your court
order trumps her
recent affidavit.
==
==

On Tue, 29 Jul 2003 17:17:18 GMT, "Live Wire Cycles NY/LI"
wrote:

In response to the possible affidavit that allegedly she signed, I have one
that she signed and is filed! Wow, two affidavit's, one says one thing and
the other says another? I'm not very smart when it comes to these things.
Should this topic be expanded into another legal forum now?

George


"Live Wire Cycles NY/LI" wrote in message
news
Dear Layne & all who have contributed....
Thank you for your responses! I have done a lot of research so far and
talked to quite a few attorney's. Fueled by these discussions that have
been
very educational, it is now my opinion that: Absolutely, the burden of
proof is on her, and not me (that's why the phone call with no paper work
and or follow-up letter), and yes there most certainly is a problem with
laches (it goes both ways). Here's the ultimate conclusion with respect to
these matters:
"Modification Of Custody and Support" states "support and maintenance is
vacated, nunc pro tunc." That's back to the date of the divorce order!"
That
is all that I'm going to provide here on this public board and I'm certain
that you understand. The issue's remaining is their behavior's
hereinafter!
I honestly forgave a long time ago. The collection agency, well, they
called
me up and ultimately harrassed me. I had to be transferred to a supervisor
because the first collections agent was a woman who obviously was gender
bias! Based on threats that they made, they victimized me and demanded
documents that they failed to obtain from their client!
With the threat of judgement and "going forward" they feel clever to
make me provide proof or else! They refused to provide me with any
documentation with respect to these matters. No letter as they said they
sent (lie). I HATE liar's and have a deep rooted problem with them! Never
ask me a question that you don't wnt to know the answer to I tell my
friends. I hope that they "collectively" really go for it, I sincerely do.
They illegally accessed my credit report based on theory and not fact! No
justification whatsoever!

What do you think now?



I think you need to nail this collection agency under the Fair Credit
Reporting Act (FRCPA). Under that federal Act it's illegal for them
to:

* call you before 8 a.m. or after 9 p.m.

* talk to ANY 3rd party about your debt, including family and friends.
They CAN call them to get your location information, but they
cannot tell them that they are trying to collect on a debt from you.

* add collection fees to your debt. The ONLY fees that any agency
can add to your debt is interest and that is only if your original
contract included interest.

* continue to report your alleged debt to the Credit Reporing
Agencies if they have failed to validate at your request.

* harass you by calling numerous times, hanging up on you, leaving
numerous messages on your machine, etc.

* use vulgar or profane language, call you names or threaten you
physically.

* threaten legal action against you if they do not intend to take
legal action against you (NO Collection Agency CAN SUE YOU, ONLY AN
ATTORNEY REPRESENTING THE ORIGINAL CREDITOR CAN SUE YOU!)

* charge Attorney's Fees if they have not filed suit. This is for
those special agencies that are Attorney/Collectors.

* continue collection activity if you have requested validation and
they have NOT provided it.

All of the above actions are illegal. Any violation of the above can
result in you filing suit against the company and receiving up to
$1000.00 per violation.

This bit and other great info can be found at
http://www.faircreditmovement.com/filecomplaints.htm


Thank you,

George

What she said.

:-) (Thanks, Gini)

"frazil" wrote in message
...

gini52 wrote in message
...

"Layne Barlow" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 28 Jul 2003 04:10:11 GMT, "Live Wire Cycles NY/LI"
wrote:

MAINTENANCE OF CHILD SUPPORT RECORDS

My New York Divorce was effective Oct 4, 1984 and my ex had custody
for
approximately 34 months thereafter. The support order was vacated on
Aug.
1,
1987 after I took custody (handicapped child). I never asked for
support
nor
received any. My ex has seen the child about 8 times in all these
years.
My
ex NOW (almost 20 years later) is claiming that she has never been
paid
support and has filed clam with a collections agency located in
Texas!
The
child and I have always resided in New York. The mother resides in PA
now
as
she has recently moved there from New Jersey.

Question: How long do you have to maintain records of child support?

Thank you in advance for any assistance you can provide.....

George



This is an easy one.

First, the burden of proof is on her to prove she received no support.
==
Untrue. All she needs to do is sign an affidavit of no support. The
burdon
is then on the
other parent to prove support was paid. Layne's post has many more
inaccuracies but
Moonshyne has addressed them well so I won't duplicate her response.
==
==

Her affidavit is worthless, in the absence of an order establishing
support
in the first instance.
===
Precisely, and I told the OP this in a subsequent post. My comment to Layne
was
meant in a general sense. In George's case, the affidavit is worthless. In
"our" case,
the affidavit the ex signed was not worthless. She told the court we didn't
pay. The court did not tell her to prove we didn't pay. The court told us to
prove we did pay. We showed the court the receipts. The court said: "Ha!
That's not child support--that's $7,000. in gifts! You now owe her
$XXXXXX.XX." (Well, you get the pictu-)
===
===

"Live Wire Cycles NY/LI" wrote in message
...
This question is a very good one! *KEY* if you will.......
I want to have respect for all you good people out there by answering,
but please respect my decision not to! (read between the lines) .. I
didn't
make a false statement by any means!

===
I don't know where all this came from but I do know this thread has
definately
outlived its usefulness. This is really a simple matter. 1. She has no case.
2. They can't
make him pay. 3. He might be able to make her pay if he
checks NY statutes (if he wishes to). That's it. Done. (Hopefully)
===
===

gini52 wrote in message
...

"Layne Barlow" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 28 Jul 2003 04:10:11 GMT, "Live Wire Cycles NY/LI"
wrote:

MAINTENANCE OF CHILD SUPPORT RECORDS

My New York Divorce was effective Oct 4, 1984 and my ex had custody for
approximately 34 months thereafter. The support order was vacated on
Aug.
1,
1987 after I took custody (handicapped child). I never asked for
support
nor
received any. My ex has seen the child about 8 times in all these
years.
My
ex NOW (almost 20 years later) is claiming that she has never been paid
support and has filed clam with a collections agency located in Texas!
The
child and I have always resided in New York. The mother resides in PA
now
as
she has recently moved there from New Jersey.

Question: How long do you have to maintain records of child support?

Thank you in advance for any assistance you can provide.....

George



This is an easy one.

First, the burden of proof is on her to prove she received no support.
==
Untrue. All she needs to do is sign an affidavit of no support. The burdon
is then on the
other parent to prove support was paid. Layne's post has many more
inaccuracies but
Moonshyne has addressed them well so I won't duplicate her response.
==
==

Her affidavit is worthless, in the absence of an order establishing support
in the first instance.

gini52 wrote in message
...

"Layne Barlow" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 28 Jul 2003 04:10:11 GMT, "Live Wire Cycles NY/LI"
wrote:

MAINTENANCE OF CHILD SUPPORT RECORDS

My New York Divorce was effective Oct 4, 1984 and my ex had custody for
approximately 34 months thereafter. The support order was vacated on
Aug.
1,
1987 after I took custody (handicapped child). I never asked for
support
nor
received any. My ex has seen the child about 8 times in all these
years.
My
ex NOW (almost 20 years later) is claiming that she has never been paid
support and has filed clam with a collections agency located in Texas!
The
child and I have always resided in New York. The mother resides in PA
now
as
she has recently moved there from New Jersey.

Question: How long do you have to maintain records of child support?

Thank you in advance for any assistance you can provide.....

George



This is an easy one.

First, the burden of proof is on her to prove she received no support.
==
Untrue. All she needs to do is sign an affidavit of no support. The burdon
is then on the
other parent to prove support was paid. Layne's post has many more
inaccuracies but
Moonshyne has addressed them well so I won't duplicate her response.
==
==

Her affidavit is worthless in the absence of an order establishing support,
in the first instance. And her affidavite must have resulted in judgement
of arrearages. So far whatever agency is after him has produced neither.

gini52 wrote in message
...

"Live Wire Cycles NY/LI" wrote in message
...
In response to the possible affidavit that allegedly she signed, I have
one
that she signed and is filed! Wow, two affidavit's, one says one thing
and
the other says another? I'm not very smart when it comes to these
things.
Should this topic be expanded into another legal forum now?

George
==
No need. Your case doesn't hinge on her affidavit--it hinges on your court
order so it
matters not what she told the agency or what she signed for them. Your
court
order trumps her
recent affidavit.
==
==

Correct, she signed an affidavit, that she is rightfully owed something, and
she should have also provided the order establishing the obligation she
claims was not fulfilled (i.e. the order that established CS support payable
by you to her). Now, you must show that the order she provided was, at some
point, superceded by a subsequent order that vacated her order. Further,
you may also have to provide documentation that you did fulfill the
obligation established by the order she provided, during the time the order
had effect. Then you file a counterclaim and an affidavit claiming she
never paid the support owed by her to you, which was established by the
subsequent order. If there is no order establishing her CS obligation, then
you must argue that under the law it is permissable for you to now sue for
back support. Part of that argument is that according to the laws in you
state (i.e state with jurisdiction to hear the matter), you are within the
statute of limitations for collect CS.