Nursing at other peoples' houses?

cjra wrote:
Caledonia wrote:
I think, though, that she *can* feed her daughter, they just don't want
her to nurse in front of them. Isn't that the case?

I have two siblings I love dearly, and I'm always pleased to see them.
They smoke, and I ask that they smoke outside. Even when its in the
single digits, with a blizzard moving in...

Um, no way on earth can a sane person equate smoking with feeding one's

child! They're not even in the same realm. Nursing doesn't leave a
stink on everything in the room, it doesn't make the non-nursers gag
when they breathe, it doesn't make them go home smelling like an
ashtray, it doesn't permeate every fiber of the house. Smoking is not
healthy, and addiction aside, is not a requirement for life.

And last I checked, nursing doesn't *cause* a deadly illness to the
person doing it or those around them.

(And yeah, you can argue that while feeding is vital, 'nursing' is
not, but to that I say BS. Nursing is not just a choice like smoking
is, or choosing to eat out at a restaurant, it's THE primary way to
feed one's child, any other way is secondary.)

My closest friend has a preschooler who still wears diapers, and I
request that she not change him on my kitchen table, even though we're
typically hanging out in the kitchen. So yes, I want her to schlepp him
somewhere else to change the poopy diapers, even though it's not
convenient and she changes him on her kitchen table at her house...


Not even close. Feces potentially carry dangerous organisms; breastmilk

- except in the case of HIV - does not. The risk of infection to anyone

else eating at the same table a child is nursing is nil. The risk to
any one eating on the table where a diaper was changed is high. A
diaper change takes a few minutes. Nursing can take anywhere from
15-30mins. Removing oneself for 2-3 mins is not inconvenient. Removing
oneself for 15-30 mins every 2 hours - why bother going over?

btw - as an epidemiologist who frequently has to educate parents of
diapered kids when the whole family comes down with salmonella or
shigella because of non-hygienic diaper changing, your friend is
placing her entire family at risk - and anyone else who eats there - by
using her kitchen table as a changing table.

Look, I'm not equating 'witnessing for the Lord,' smoking, or diaper
hygiene to nursing. Setting rules for guest behaviors that the
homeowners find reasonable/acceptable is the issue.

I really do have an issue with 'Nursing Trumps All' when it comes to
visiting someone else's house, with the implicit idea that if it makes
the homeowner uncomfortable, they should just get over it. Yes, I'm an
avowed supporter of nursing and extended nursing, hence these threads
where someone in a private home is asked to nurse in a private location
= 'they must not want to really see you' strikes me as silly and unduly
petulant.

Yes, it's awkward to remove oneself for 15-30 minutes every 2 hours,
and a visit of 6 hours with a 2 week old could start to seem
ridiculously isolating. The OP was offered the spare bedroom, she felt
it wasn't optimal, and chose to nurse in the laundry area. I can't see
how this makes the homeowners unwelcoming, unless you're saying that a
homeowner imposing restrictions on *any behaviors that aren't health
risks* is unwelcoming, even if such behaviors make the homeowner
uncomfortable.

Caledonia

Caledonia wrote:
cjra wrote:
Caledonia wrote:
I think, though, that she *can* feed her daughter, they just don't want
her to nurse in front of them. Isn't that the case?

I have two siblings I love dearly, and I'm always pleased to see them.
They smoke, and I ask that they smoke outside. Even when its in the
single digits, with a blizzard moving in...

Um, no way on earth can a sane person equate smoking with feeding one's

child! They're not even in the same realm. Nursing doesn't leave a
stink on everything in the room, it doesn't make the non-nursers gag
when they breathe, it doesn't make them go home smelling like an
ashtray, it doesn't permeate every fiber of the house. Smoking is not
healthy, and addiction aside, is not a requirement for life.

And last I checked, nursing doesn't *cause* a deadly illness to the
person doing it or those around them.

(And yeah, you can argue that while feeding is vital, 'nursing' is
not, but to that I say BS. Nursing is not just a choice like smoking
is, or choosing to eat out at a restaurant, it's THE primary way to
feed one's child, any other way is secondary.)

My closest friend has a preschooler who still wears diapers, and I
request that she not change him on my kitchen table, even though we're
typically hanging out in the kitchen. So yes, I want her to schlepp him
somewhere else to change the poopy diapers, even though it's not
convenient and she changes him on her kitchen table at her house...


Not even close. Feces potentially carry dangerous organisms; breastmilk

- except in the case of HIV - does not. The risk of infection to anyone

else eating at the same table a child is nursing is nil. The risk to
any one eating on the table where a diaper was changed is high. A
diaper change takes a few minutes. Nursing can take anywhere from
15-30mins. Removing oneself for 2-3 mins is not inconvenient. Removing
oneself for 15-30 mins every 2 hours - why bother going over?

btw - as an epidemiologist who frequently has to educate parents of
diapered kids when the whole family comes down with salmonella or
shigella because of non-hygienic diaper changing, your friend is
placing her entire family at risk - and anyone else who eats there - by
using her kitchen table as a changing table.

Look, I'm not equating 'witnessing for the Lord,' smoking, or diaper
hygiene to nursing. Setting rules for guest behaviors that the
homeowners find reasonable/acceptable is the issue.

I'm all about respecting others' wishes in their houses. But I *don't*
see the examples you described as similar in any way to nursing, except
perhaps the 'witnessing for the Lord" because those are health *risks.*

So maybe it was just a poor choice of examples - comparing apples to
say um, cake.

I really do have an issue with 'Nursing Trumps All' when it comes to
visiting someone else's house, with the implicit idea that if it makes
the homeowner uncomfortable, they should just get over it. Yes, I'm an
avowed supporter of nursing and extended nursing, hence these threads
where someone in a private home is asked to nurse in a private location
= 'they must not want to really see you' strikes me as silly and unduly
petulant.

Yes, it's awkward to remove oneself for 15-30 minutes every 2 hours,
and a visit of 6 hours with a 2 week old could start to seem
ridiculously isolating. The OP was offered the spare bedroom, she felt
it wasn't optimal, and chose to nurse in the laundry area. I can't see
how this makes the homeowners unwelcoming, unless you're saying that a
homeowner imposing restrictions on *any behaviors that aren't health
risks* is unwelcoming, even if such behaviors make the homeowner
uncomfortable.

I do think it's totally reasonable of a homeowner to say "not in my
house". Similarly, it's totally reasonable of the guest to say "then I
can't come over." That's not silly and petulant, that's simply
reality. If compromise can be reached - such as using a blanket, or
providing a comfortable room, or it's the case that the homeowners are
in such a state that one *must* see them (elderly, ill), then great.
But requiring your guest to sequester themselves in another location
for a significant chunk of time to *feed* their baby while they are
visiting is to me, the epitomy of poor hosting. To smoke? Sure. That's
a choice. To eat? No. Why bother inviting someone over if you're
sending them away frequently?

I don't think the homeowners need to be forced into accepting it. If
they're uncomfortable,that's their right. But it is also the right of
the OP to say she is not comfortable with that option and decline the
invitation.

cjra wrote:
I don't think the homeowners need to be forced into accepting it. If
they're uncomfortable,that's their right. But it is also the right of
the OP to say she is not comfortable with that option and decline the
invitation.

Let me clarify that if she IS comfortable going off to another room to
nurse, or it's worth the hassle to visit these people, then that's a
sacrifice one chooses to make for their sake. And that's great. If
however, it's too much to ask and a visit to these relatives is not
high on the priority list, she should decline the invitation. Being
able to feed your child in a comfortable setting is anything but
petulant.

FWIW I'm not an in-your-face nurser. I am discreet when I nurse in
public. I often move myself off to the side a bit so I'm not flashing
everyone in the room. But I also *refuse* to give a bottle to my child
just because someone is uncomfortable with nursing (I know the OP
didn't mention that, but I *have* heard that before, elsewhere).

cjra wrote:
Caledonia wrote:
cjra wrote:
Caledonia wrote:
I think, though, that she *can* feed her daughter, they just don't want
her to nurse in front of them. Isn't that the case?

I have two siblings I love dearly, and I'm always pleased to see them.
They smoke, and I ask that they smoke outside. Even when its in the
single digits, with a blizzard moving in...

Um, no way on earth can a sane person equate smoking with feeding one's

child! They're not even in the same realm. Nursing doesn't leave a
stink on everything in the room, it doesn't make the non-nursers gag
when they breathe, it doesn't make them go home smelling like an
ashtray, it doesn't permeate every fiber of the house. Smoking is not
healthy, and addiction aside, is not a requirement for life.

And last I checked, nursing doesn't *cause* a deadly illness to the
person doing it or those around them.

(And yeah, you can argue that while feeding is vital, 'nursing' is
not, but to that I say BS. Nursing is not just a choice like smoking
is, or choosing to eat out at a restaurant, it's THE primary way to
feed one's child, any other way is secondary.)

My closest friend has a preschooler who still wears diapers, and I
request that she not change him on my kitchen table, even though we're
typically hanging out in the kitchen. So yes, I want her to schlepp him
somewhere else to change the poopy diapers, even though it's not
convenient and she changes him on her kitchen table at her house...


Not even close. Feces potentially carry dangerous organisms; breastmilk

- except in the case of HIV - does not. The risk of infection to anyone

else eating at the same table a child is nursing is nil. The risk to
any one eating on the table where a diaper was changed is high. A
diaper change takes a few minutes. Nursing can take anywhere from
15-30mins. Removing oneself for 2-3 mins is not inconvenient. Removing
oneself for 15-30 mins every 2 hours - why bother going over?

btw - as an epidemiologist who frequently has to educate parents of
diapered kids when the whole family comes down with salmonella or
shigella because of non-hygienic diaper changing, your friend is
placing her entire family at risk - and anyone else who eats there - by
using her kitchen table as a changing table.

Look, I'm not equating 'witnessing for the Lord,' smoking, or diaper
hygiene to nursing. Setting rules for guest behaviors that the
homeowners find reasonable/acceptable is the issue.

I'm all about respecting others' wishes in their houses. But I *don't*
see the examples you described as similar in any way to nursing, except
perhaps the 'witnessing for the Lord" because those are health *risks.*

So maybe it was just a poor choice of examples - comparing apples to
say um, cake.

I really do have an issue with 'Nursing Trumps All' when it comes to
visiting someone else's house, with the implicit idea that if it makes
the homeowner uncomfortable, they should just get over it. Yes, I'm an
avowed supporter of nursing and extended nursing, hence these threads
where someone in a private home is asked to nurse in a private location
= 'they must not want to really see you' strikes me as silly and unduly
petulant.

Yes, it's awkward to remove oneself for 15-30 minutes every 2 hours,
and a visit of 6 hours with a 2 week old could start to seem
ridiculously isolating. The OP was offered the spare bedroom, she felt
it wasn't optimal, and chose to nurse in the laundry area. I can't see
how this makes the homeowners unwelcoming, unless you're saying that a
homeowner imposing restrictions on *any behaviors that aren't health
risks* is unwelcoming, even if such behaviors make the homeowner
uncomfortable.

I do think it's totally reasonable of a homeowner to say "not in my
house". Similarly, it's totally reasonable of the guest to say "then I
can't come over." That's not silly and petulant, that's simply
reality. If compromise can be reached - such as using a blanket, or
providing a comfortable room, or it's the case that the homeowners are
in such a state that one *must* see them (elderly, ill), then great.
But requiring your guest to sequester themselves in another location
for a significant chunk of time to *feed* their baby while they are
visiting is to me, the epitomy of poor hosting. To smoke? Sure. That's
a choice. To eat? No. Why bother inviting someone over if you're
sending them away frequently?

I guess I'm seeing the offering of the spare bedroom as the homeowner's
attempt at reasonable accomodation. [I have to admit, there's also a
part of me that would find it difficult to spend 4 hours at anyone's
house 2 weeks post-partum, so perhaps that's coloring my impression
that the visits wouldn't be all-day. ]

I don't think the homeowners need to be forced into accepting it. If
they're uncomfortable,that's their right. But it is also the right of
the OP to say she is not comfortable with that option and decline the
invitation.

Agreed -- I just feel that the mere concept that the homeowner could be
uncomfortable with NIP doesn't mean 'they must not want you to visit,'
especially if the homeowner is making what they feel is a reasonable
accomodation.

Caledonia

Caledonia wrote:

I guess I'm seeing the offering of the spare bedroom as the homeowner's
attempt at reasonable accomodation. [I have to admit, there's also a
part of me that would find it difficult to spend 4 hours at anyone's
house 2 weeks post-partum, so perhaps that's coloring my impression
that the visits wouldn't be all-day. ]

I had ot go to NICU, but if DD was home? I wouldn't be going anywhere
2wks pp. They can come to me! Although once she was BF, DD was eating
every 2 hrs so 4 hrs would mean 2 feedings.


I don't think the homeowners need to be forced into accepting it. If
they're uncomfortable,that's their right. But it is also the right of
the OP to say she is not comfortable with that option and decline the
invitation.

Agreed -- I just feel that the mere concept that the homeowner could be
uncomfortable with NIP doesn't mean 'they must not want you to visit,'
especially if the homeowner is making what they feel is a reasonable
accomodation.

I think it just means they're clueless about nursing - about what's
involved and the commitment it takes. That's not a bad thing, they just
don't know. So you can educate them, deal with it, or choose not to go.

I really don't know... Anyone have any suggestions or ideas?



It probably is fair enough for them to want to be comfortable in their own
home. Before you visit could you maybe say something like "I realise uncle
is not comfortable and would like to respect him, so would you please be
able to set up a comfy chair in another room (be it the laundry or wherever)
so I can feed her when it's neccesary without causing problems"
Maybe this way you could be showing you are trying to accomodate his wishes
and they might be more understanding in general.

"xkatx" wrote in message
news:%PN3h.56073$P7.52020@edtnps90...
I'm sure someone might have come across a similar problem...

When in someone else's home I go to another room if that is what they want.
It really doesn't bother me.

In my own home I do what ever I want. I did 'ease' my in-laws into my
nursing in front of them and went in another room even in my own house a few
times. That did not bother me and seemed more reasonable then making my
company and in-laws uncomfortable. I nurse in front of them all
now.....unless I want a little break. Then I go lay down. ;-)

I don't have any desire to take a stand, make a point, assert my rights. I
just want to live in peace and harmony. If that means I have to sit in a
laundry room once a week to nurse, I could live with that. Actually I bet
your aunt would find you a more comfortable place if you asked her. Your
uncle probably didn't think the whole thing through when he asked you to go
the spare room and I doubt either one really wants you sitting on their
laundry room floor.


--
Nikki, mama to
Hunter 4/99
Luke 4/01
Brock 4/06
Ben 4/06

Caledonia wrote:


I really do have an issue with 'Nursing Trumps All' when it comes to
visiting someone else's house, with the implicit idea that if it makes
the homeowner uncomfortable, they should just get over it. Yes, I'm an
avowed supporter of nursing and extended nursing, hence these threads
where someone in a private home is asked to nurse in a private location
= 'they must not want to really see you' strikes me as silly and unduly
petulant.

Yes, it's awkward to remove oneself for 15-30 minutes every 2 hours,
and a visit of 6 hours with a 2 week old could start to seem
ridiculously isolating.

It depends on your child's nursing patterns. With my son, at two weeks
he was latched on roughly 75% of his waking hours, seems to me. There
was no such THING as a specific "feeding" that I could remove myself
from the room for.

--Helen

Yes, it's awkward to remove oneself for 15-30 minutes every 2 hours,
and a visit of 6 hours with a 2 week old could start to seem
ridiculously isolating.

It depends on your child's nursing patterns. With my son, at two weeks
he was latched on roughly 75% of his waking hours, seems to me. There
was no such THING as a specific "feeding" that I could remove myself
from the room for.

my first was the same for around the first 3 months, it's ridiculous how
often an unintended bit of boob got caught on camera!

This whole conversation seems to be occuring in the wrong generation, it's
the kind of thing I'd have expected my mum to have a problem with, not me
and in my family that has worked out to be true, my mum says her FIL thought
she should go to another room, but got over it pretty speedily, as it
happens, he is the only one of my grandparents who died before I had
children, so I've bf in front of all the rest as well as my husbands
grandparents, with no problems (though I do wonder if DH's grandfather
actually noticed!).

Cheers

Anne

Anne Rogers wrote:

This whole conversation seems to be occuring in the wrong generation, it's
the kind of thing I'd have expected my mum to have a problem with, not me
and in my family that has worked out to be true, my mum says her FIL thought
she should go to another room, but got over it pretty speedily, as it
happens, he is the only one of my grandparents who died before I had
children, so I've bf in front of all the rest as well as my husbands
grandparents, with no problems (though I do wonder if DH's grandfather
actually noticed!).

Um. I'm in my 40's, my mom was born in '22, her mom was born in '88. My
mom would have had no issues with nursing in front of *her* parents (in
fact, my Mom wished she had breastfed -- but an after-effect of
'twilight sleep' was that she was too woozy for days, or so the family
lore goes, hence it was Karo and canned milk for us), but did have
'issues' (or general uncomfortableness) with the idea that her
daughters would NIP. Then again, she was shocked that her daughters
would be leaving the hospital within a day of giving birth...even
though she was born at home, as were her siblings.

Caledonia