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  #11  
Old April 26th 05, 11:25 PM
Kevin Karplus
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On 2005-04-26, Rosalie B. wrote:
I also agree that an IEP isn't really the way to go. What you have to
deal with is not Henry so much as this particular teacher and that
could be the possibility with anyone. It happened a couple of times
to mine. It sounds like he's coping fine without an ISP in general,
and I agree with the principal on this - it will be another strike
against him, and it IS a major PITA.


I'm a little confused by the claims on this newsgroup that
1) having an IEP is a stigma
2) getting an IEP is a major problem

I don't see how having an IEP for ADD would be any more of a stigma
than the ADD diagnosis itself.

My own experience with this is limited---my son has an IEP for speech
therapy, and it was no problem at all to get. He had a referral to
the speech therapist from the classroom teacher when he was in
kindergarten, who agreed that he could benefit from speech therapy.
He gets pulled out of class once or twice a week for the therapy, as
do a few other kids. We have to meet with the speech therapist a
couple of times a year to get a progress report, learn suggested
exercises to do at home, and sign some paperwork. There does not seem
to be any stigma at his school associated with speech therapy (perhaps
because about 1/3 of the school has English as second language).

Is the IEP for speech therapy bureaucratically a different thing from
an IEP for ADD? Or is it that the actions required of the
teacher are different (releasing student for pullout versus changing
some cherished pedagogical style)?

Could someone with more experience explain things to me?


------------------------------------------------------------
Kevin Karplus http://www.soe.ucsc.edu/~karplus
Professor of Biomolecular Engineering, University of California, Santa Cruz
Undergraduate and Graduate Director, Bioinformatics
(Senior member, IEEE) (Board of Directors, ISCB)
life member (LAB, Adventure Cycling, American Youth Hostels)
Effective Cycling Instructor #218-ck (lapsed)
Affiliations for identification only.

  #12  
Old April 27th 05, 01:31 PM
illecebra
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Robyn Kozierok wrote:
In article ,
illecebra wrote:

Unless the teachers write all their own materials, putting
worksheets and such up on a web site is probably begging for textbook
companies to sue the school. Sad but true.



That's a good point. I was assuming they were generated by the
teachers, but that's probably not a fair assumption, at least not
all of the time. If the worksheets are coming from a text/wookbook,
though, perhaps Dawn can purchase a copy to have at home for her son.


--Robyn
.



That's a very good idea.

Susan

  #13  
Old April 27th 05, 01:33 PM
animzmirot
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"Kevin Karplus" wrote in message
...
On 2005-04-26, Rosalie B. wrote:
I also agree that an IEP isn't really the way to go. What you have to
deal with is not Henry so much as this particular teacher and that
could be the possibility with anyone. It happened a couple of times
to mine. It sounds like he's coping fine without an ISP in general,
and I agree with the principal on this - it will be another strike
against him, and it IS a major PITA.


I'm a little confused by the claims on this newsgroup that
1) having an IEP is a stigma
2) getting an IEP is a major problem


I have to agree with Kevin. I have two children on IEPs and have never had
any of the experiences that Robyn claims to have experienced. If you know
your rights (http://www.wrightslaw.com) and do your homework ahead of time,
the IEP process is pretty simple. Getting teachers to FOLLOW the IEP might
be an issue, especially with the science teacher Dawn describes, but then
again, the threat of non-compliance sends your school into a tizzy. They DO
NOT want to be sued.

As for having an IEP, I can't see the stigma attached to it at all. One of
my kids is two grade levels ahead of his age, and has an IEP for his ADHD
and organizational issues, similar to Henry's. It has nothing to do with his
intelligence or ability to do work, it does have to do with his inability to
get his homework done 100% of the time, or to get writing assignments
completed without dictation and typing help from me. Like Henry, these
accomodations are a requirement for success in school. Without them, my
child fails his classes, with them he is a straight A student. There is no
stigma from the kids, because probably 1/3 of them have IEPs for one thing
or another. There is no stigma from the teachers, but there is an occasional
uncooperative teacher who refuses to follow an IEP until his/her superiors
have intervened. The one thing we have experienced is the teacher who feels
put-upon having to do any extra work, but I've learned how to deal with
those types as well. When a child in middle school has an IEP, there is a
specialist in the school whose sole job it is is to ensure that IEPs are
followed. These are usually NOT guidance counselors, they're sped
specialists. If you get these folks on your side, your child is going to
benefit from an IEP and there won't be any stigma involved at all.

I don't see how having an IEP for ADD would be any more of a stigma
than the ADD diagnosis itself.

My own experience with this is limited---my son has an IEP for speech
therapy, and it was no problem at all to get. He had a referral to
the speech therapist from the classroom teacher when he was in
kindergarten, who agreed that he could benefit from speech therapy.
He gets pulled out of class once or twice a week for the therapy, as
do a few other kids. We have to meet with the speech therapist a
couple of times a year to get a progress report, learn suggested
exercises to do at home, and sign some paperwork. There does not seem
to be any stigma at his school associated with speech therapy (perhaps
because about 1/3 of the school has English as second language).

Is the IEP for speech therapy bureaucratically a different thing from
an IEP for ADD? Or is it that the actions required of the
teacher are different (releasing student for pullout versus changing
some cherished pedagogical style)?

No, there is NO difference between an IEP for speech, for language
processing, for ADHD, for dysgraphia, for emotional problems, or for
physical differences. The IEP is, as its title says, an Individualized
Educational Plan, a plan that is created for the specific needs of each
particular student. My two kids have very different IEPs for very different
issues, and yet they are handled exactly the same way by the schools, the
administration, and the teachers.

Marjorie

Could someone with more experience explain things to me?


------------------------------------------------------------
Kevin Karplus http://www.soe.ucsc.edu/~karplus
Professor of Biomolecular Engineering, University of California, Santa

Cruz
Undergraduate and Graduate Director, Bioinformatics
(Senior member, IEEE) (Board of Directors, ISCB)
life member (LAB, Adventure Cycling, American Youth Hostels)
Effective Cycling Instructor #218-ck (lapsed)
Affiliations for identification only.



  #14  
Old April 27th 05, 01:33 PM
Cathy Kearns
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"Dawn" wrote in message
oups.com...
Thanks to everyone so far for the excellent suggestions. Just to
clarify, we already have taken each of the steps suggested. He did try
to get the study guide from another student, but we weren't able to
locate anyone -- it's complicated, but this particular class is not in
his regular "group" and he doesn't know many kids from the class -- and
wasn't able to contact the few he did know.


At my daughter's high school at the beginning of the year each child and
parent signs a contract for each class. On the contract is a space to fill
in the names of two fellow classmates who are also in that class, that will
be their contacts in case they miss homework assignments. The contract is
not accepted without those two names. Might be something to add to your
list of steps at the beginning of each year.

I check his planner every
day, period. That's the kind of thing you absolutely have to do with
an ADD kids. I was told at orientation that every class's homework
would be on the website -- that has only been true for one of his four
teachers consistently. When the assignments are online, the actual
worksheets are not. So in this case I knew the study guide was due but
couldn't access the study guide. Lastly, we met with all the teachers
at the beginning of the year and twice since then. This one has also
refused to let him to go the nurse to get needed medication for
migraine headaches. It's my personal opinion that she has just decided
not to like him for who-knows-what reason.


This is just sad.

She's been rude to me in person and in e-mail. I'm not willing to
schedule another conference, it's time to take this to her superior in
my view. Hence, the IEP question. For his good, I need some assurance
that we're not just going to rely on the kindness of teachers (as
wonderful as that is when it happens).


I hope a discussion with the vice principal will at least get this teacher
to be civil, allow him to get medication, post study guides, and basically
be treated like she would treat another adult.

-Dawn


  #15  
Old April 27th 05, 04:04 PM
Louise
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On Tue, 26 Apr 2005 18:25:56 EDT, Kevin Karplus
wrote:

I'm a little confused by the claims on this newsgroup that
1) having an IEP is a stigma
2) getting an IEP is a major problem

I don't see how having an IEP for ADD would be any more of a stigma
than the ADD diagnosis itself.


I don't know how similar our IEP laws and customs are here in Canada.
But it's been my impression that getting the IEP is straightforward
and that having IEPs for learning disabilities and/or for giftedness
has offered extra opportunities while not creating restrictions or
stigmas.

I wondered whether the original advice Dawn got from the assistant
principal about not proceeding officially was about the stigmatized
perceptions of boys with ADD, among the teachers in his school or
among high school teachers. Why he didn't go on to say "such as Ms
S, but here is how you/we might approach her" is a good question.

Without an IEP, maybe he thought he was giving Henry a chance to
"pass" without teachers labelling him as ADD before meeting him,
either in junior high or in high school.

Louise

  #16  
Old April 27th 05, 06:19 PM
Rosalie B.
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illecebra wrote:

Robyn Kozierok wrote:
In article ,
illecebra wrote:

Unless the teachers write all their own materials, putting
worksheets and such up on a web site is probably begging for textbook
companies to sue the school. Sad but true.



That's a good point. I was assuming they were generated by the
teachers, but that's probably not a fair assumption, at least not
all of the time. If the worksheets are coming from a text/wookbook,
though, perhaps Dawn can purchase a copy to have at home for her son.


My mom would often buy duplicate copies of textbooks for us to have at
home so we wouldn't have to carry them to and from school (or forget
to bring them home). One of my grandsons has no lockers though, so he
has to haul all his books plus one or two musical instruments from
class to class and home on the bus.

When I was teaching, we didn't have textbooks available for most of
the curriculum that we taught (we did a combined science class - a
unit of botany, a unit of earth science, a unit of physical science
and so on instead of a year of earth science, a year of biology etc
and there were no textbooks that had all of what we did in them, plus
I had to have different reading levels for 4 different classes) so I
basically didn't give books out at all.

And I did usually write and run off my own worksheets, but that was
mostly to assign long term projects and for study aids for A/V
materials. But I don't think most teachers do this.



grandma Rosalie

 




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