Ability grouping

This is at the elementary level-at high school, ability grouping is alive
and well, with multiple levels of the same class in anything required by the
state.

Oops, I forgot to say that in my answer about Seattle schools I was talking
about elementary school only. I think there are different math tracks in middle
school, but it's whole classes, not ability groups. And of course in high
school there is the chance to take AP courses or go to the IB school, but
again, no individual ability grouping, all at class-level.

--Helen

"Nevermind" wrote in message
om...
I know this will be a very unscientific survey, but I'm curious about
how common Erika's school's grouping system (see below) is these days.
Our school doesn't officially do ability grouping -- there is *no*
expectation that the work the kids're doing in reading or math will be
pegged to their individual ability at all, only to their age. It's
one-size-fits-all unless the teacher wants to differentiate on her
own.

How about your kids' elementary schools?

I had understood that ability grouping had become rare in U.S.
elementary schools, but if I'm wrong about that, then our school
district's system is much more vulnerable to criticism and parental
agitation for change.

At our elementary schools there was grouping in math and
reading in first grade, not so much in second or third (more
individualized work). At the end of third they take math tests
to determine if they learned all of third grade math. If they ace
(100%) that they take the end of fourth grade math test, if they
pass that they take a few work pages home for the summer, and in
fourth grade start attending fifth grade math. This progresses, and
in sixth grade they have a special teacher come in and teach 7th
grade math. In junior high all math is tracked, and those who were
advanced in elementary (as well as a few that caught up since then)
take Algebra in 8th grade, and end up in honors Geometry freshman
year in high school. I know of one child who skipped two math
levels, and would ride her bike between junior high and high school
to take Geometry her 8th grade year.

Junior high math levels also determined if you took Biology
(which counts as a science toward graduation requirements)
or Life Sciences (which doesn't, I'm not sure why) as a
Freshman in high school. Honors courses in English don't
start 'til sophomore year. Those who took two years of a
language (Spanish or French) in junior high start in the
second year in high school. (French II for instance)

Reading and other subjects tend to be pulled back together
come third grade. They are then all reading the same book,
and tested on comprehension, so it is a given by third grade
you could read third grade books. (I believe one book was
"Little House on the Prairie". This year in fourth grade they
are reading "Island of the Blue Dolphin".) I have had
experience that when one of my kids was acing the
preliminary spelling tests (the one having never seen the
words before) she was excused from spelling for the
rest of the week, and sent to write a play with another
student who also wasn't needing spelling practice. So
it's possible that in other subjects if the child is advanced
for the class they are excused to do other interesting
work.

The GATE program for this district is administered as
classes after school, all consolidated at one elementary
school. My kids do (and did) have the GATE eligibility box
checked on their report cards, but since it cuts into their
other after school activities, and is another place to drive
to, I didn't look into it. I've heard parents who love the
GATE classes and those who aren't impressed. I haven't
heard any kid willing to give up soccer for it.

In article ,
says...

We aren't allowed to ability group anymore within a school.

A friend of our's, living in Connecticut, has a child who has quite a
talent for math (he's been doing Algebra at home with his mother) and
he's bored with his classroom math. His parents requested from the
teacher and the principal to accelerate his math program. They were
flatly refused, being told that it's mandated by the state that every
child receive an identical education until grade six, unless they are
specifically categorized as learning disabled.

The upshot was, they asked me for some homeschooling math resources,
then pulled him out of the public school and put him in private
school. To their surprise, they found several of the boy's friends
who had disappeared from the school that year.

Michelle
Flutist

--
In my heart. By my side.
Never apart. AP with Pride!
Katrina Marie (10/19/96)
Xander Ryan (09/22/98 - 02/23/99)
Gareth Xander (07/17/00) Zachary Mitchell
Theona Alexis (06/03/03) (01/12/94, fostered 09/05/01 - 07/23/03)

(Nevermind) wrote in message . com...
I know this will be a very unscientific survey, but I'm curious about
how common Erika's school's grouping system (see below) is these days.
Our school doesn't officially do ability grouping -- there is *no*
expectation that the work the kids're doing in reading or math will be
pegged to their individual ability at all, only to their age. It's
one-size-fits-all unless the teacher wants to differentiate on her
own.

How about your kids' elementary schools?


My children attended elementary school in two different states: MA and
CA. In both states, ability grouping was not allowed by the state. In
MA, they're rabid on the subject. But once children hit 7th grade,
they do ability group in Math, Languages, and I think other stuff, but
they don't really admit it!

Marjorie

I had understood that ability grouping had become rare in U.S.
elementary schools, but if I'm wrong about that, then our school
district's system is much more vulnerable to criticism and parental
agitation for change.

Nevermind wrote:

Wow -- is ability grouping common in the UK? If I understand
correctly, it has been all but wiped out of public schools in the
U.S.
It sounds like wonderful common sense to me.

It sure isn't wiped out in the public schools
here. In my sons' school they ability group for math
and reading in every grade past kindergarten (except
it seems that they don't in the center based GT program,
which I suppose makes sense). They have as many groups
as they have teachers for that grade. So, this year
there are something like six first grade teachers, so
they have seven reading groups (each teacher has one,
plus there's a reading specialist) and six math groups.
The groups are relatively fluid, so children who need
to move up or down accordingly. Seems to work like a
charm.

Best wishes,
Ericka

In article ,
(chiam margalit) wrote:

(Nevermind) wrote in message
. com...
I know this will be a very unscientific survey, but I'm curious about
how common Erika's school's grouping system (see below) is these days.
Our school doesn't officially do ability grouping -- there is *no*
expectation that the work the kids're doing in reading or math will be
pegged to their individual ability at all, only to their age. It's
one-size-fits-all unless the teacher wants to differentiate on her
own.

How about your kids' elementary schools?


My children attended elementary school in two different states: MA and
CA. In both states, ability grouping was not allowed by the state. In
MA, they're rabid on the subject. But once children hit 7th grade,
they do ability group in Math, Languages, and I think other stuff, but
they don't really admit it!

Marjorie


How long ago was that? My kids started elementary school in Mass (in 87
and 91) and they had reading groups by ability at that time.

meh
--
Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care

In article , Nevermind says...

I know this will be a very unscientific survey, but I'm curious about
how common Erika's school's grouping system (see below) is these days.
Our school doesn't officially do ability grouping -- there is *no*
expectation that the work the kids're doing in reading or math will be
pegged to their individual ability at all, only to their age. It's
one-size-fits-all unless the teacher wants to differentiate on her
own.

How about your kids' elementary schools?

I had understood that ability grouping had become rare in U.S.
elementary schools, but if I'm wrong about that, then our school
district's system is much more vulnerable to criticism and parental
agitation for change.

My son's elementary schools in New York state had ability grouping in reading
for most grades. Math ability grouping starts in 6th grade.

There is no tracking - efforts are made to have a distribution of abilities in
each classroom.

Banty

"Cathy Kearns" wrote in message om...
"Nevermind" wrote in message
om...
I know this will be a very unscientific survey, but I'm curious about
how common Erika's school's grouping system (see below) is these days.
Our school doesn't officially do ability grouping -- there is *no*
expectation that the work the kids're doing in reading or math will be
pegged to their individual ability at all, only to their age. It's
one-size-fits-all unless the teacher wants to differentiate on her
own.

How about your kids' elementary schools?

I had understood that ability grouping had become rare in U.S.
elementary schools, but if I'm wrong about that, then our school
district's system is much more vulnerable to criticism and parental
agitation for change.

At our elementary schools there was grouping in math and
reading in first grade, not so much in second or third (more
individualized work). At the end of third they take math tests
to determine if they learned all of third grade math. If they ace
(100%) that they take the end of fourth grade math test, if they
pass that they take a few work pages home for the summer, and in
fourth grade start attending fifth grade math. This progresses, and
in sixth grade they have a special teacher come in and teach 7th
grade math. In junior high all math is tracked, and those who were
advanced in elementary (as well as a few that caught up since then)
take Algebra in 8th grade, and end up in honors Geometry freshman
year in high school. I know of one child who skipped two math
levels, and would ride her bike between junior high and high school
to take Geometry her 8th grade year.

This sounds similar to my own elementary school (started kindergarden
in '74). But we had two groups in kindergarden - one was expected to
learn to read (or already did), and the other wasn't. But, I don't
remember math being tracked nearly that much until 7th and 8th grade,
where they taught some kids algebra and not others.


Junior high math levels also determined if you took Biology
(which counts as a science toward graduation requirements)
or Life Sciences (which doesn't, I'm not sure why) as a
Freshman in high school. Honors courses in English don't
start 'til sophomore year. Those who took two years of a
language (Spanish or French) in junior high start in the
second year in high school. (French II for instance)

This corresponds with my own experience, though we had Accelerated
English starting in freshman year.

Reading and other subjects tend to be pulled back together
come third grade. They are then all reading the same book,
and tested on comprehension, so it is a given by third grade
you could read third grade books. (I believe one book was
"Little House on the Prairie". This year in fourth grade they
are reading "Island of the Blue Dolphin".)

Again, this sounds similar, though I don't exactly remember.

We didn't have any separate gifted programs, except for a math program
outside of school. I only know one kid who was in it, one of my
sister's friends, and he was waay ahead of everyone else. His friends
would ask him for help with homework, and he wouldn't remember how to
do it in the current method, only in the more advanced methods!

(I know the poll is about current stuff, but my ds is only 2...I did
think that it was interesting that this was so similar to my own
experience, however.)

Irene

That's interesting, since my nephew in Fairfield, CT public schools is
profoundly gifted, and the district is paying for a teacher to come
and work with him on advanced math. It's a pull out program. They
still haven't quite solved the English/Language Arts piece, since it
involves driving him over to the high school.
He's had a great experience, and they have accomodated him in ways I
would not have expected.

Here in our urban district in Oakland there is no official ability
grouping but in Middle school there is a fairly obvious one... Kids
can take Algebra in 7th grade, but only if they are given permission
and there appear to be two tracks for "Core" social science/language
arts

In the k-5 schools, there are certainly lit circles where the teachers
pick the students and the book. It's hard for strong boy readers like
my kid, since he ends up in circles with mostly girls.



We aren't allowed to ability group anymore within a school.

A friend of our's, living in Connecticut, has a child who has quite a
talent for math (he's been doing Algebra at home with his mother) and
he's bored with his classroom math. His parents requested from the
teacher and the principal to accelerate his math program. They were
flatly refused, being told that it's mandated by the state that every
child receive an identical education until grade six, unless they are
specifically categorized as learning disabled.

The upshot was, they asked me for some homeschooling math resources,
then pulled him out of the public school and put him in private
school. To their surprise, they found several of the boy's friends
who had disappeared from the school that year.

Michelle
Flutist

I haven't seen ability grouping in public schools recently. Years ago, when
I was a student in Pocatello, Idaho, the school system began "tracking" or
ability grouping in 7th grade, and continued through high school. In my
opinion, it worked very well.

For my kids, we "ability group" just fine, because we homeschool. So my 7
year old that reads at a 6th grade level doesn't get bored, and my 5 year
old that does math at 2nd grade level isn't bored, and my 14 year old takes
half 10th grade subjects, half 9th grade, while my 17 year old is finishing
her high school requirements at the local community college by taking
freshman college courses. Where we see deficiencies, we work on those
individually. The only hard part is when people ask my kids what grade they
are in -- it's hard for them to characterize
"Donna Metler" wrote in message
.. .

"Nevermind" wrote in message
om...
I know this will be a very unscientific survey, but I'm curious about
how common Erika's school's grouping system (see below) is these days.
Our school doesn't officially do ability grouping -- there is *no*
expectation that the work the kids're doing in reading or math will be
pegged to their individual ability at all, only to their age. It's
one-size-fits-all unless the teacher wants to differentiate on her
own.

How about your kids' elementary schools?

I had understood that ability grouping had become rare in U.S.
elementary schools, but if I'm wrong about that, then our school
district's system is much more vulnerable to criticism and parental
agitation for change.

We aren't allowed to ability group anymore within a school. However,
within
the district there are several optional schools which only take the high
performing students, and one (the one I teach at), which takes only the
lowest performing students, so I guess you could say that the district
ability groups by school, if the parents choose to take advantage of it.

This is at the elementary level-at high school, ability grouping is alive
and well, with multiple levels of the same class in anything required by
the
state. A class which might be one semester or one year for high ability
students will be cut into two parts for lower ability students, and go at
a
much slower pace, but with the same content.


Nevermind wrote:

Wow -- is ability grouping common in the UK? If I understand
correctly, it has been all but wiped out of public schools in the
U.S.
It sounds like wonderful common sense to me.

It sure isn't wiped out in the public schools
here. In my sons' school they ability group for math
and reading in every grade past kindergarten (except
it seems that they don't in the center based GT program,
which I suppose makes sense). They have as many groups
as they have teachers for that grade. So, this year
there are something like six first grade teachers, so
they have seven reading groups (each teacher has one,
plus there's a reading specialist) and six math groups.
The groups are relatively fluid, so children who need
to move up or down accordingly. Seems to work like a
charm.

Best wishes,
Ericka

In article ,
Nevermind wrote:
I know this will be a very unscientific survey, but I'm curious about
how common Erika's school's grouping system (see below) is these days.
Our school doesn't officially do ability grouping -- there is *no*
expectation that the work the kids're doing in reading or math will be
pegged to their individual ability at all, only to their age. It's
one-size-fits-all unless the teacher wants to differentiate on her
own.

How about your kids' elementary schools?

My kids' (ex) public elementary did quite a bit of ability grouping for
reading (pulled in all sorts of extra people to take groups, a reading
specialist and some others) and a little but not so much for math.
(In Vermont, fwiw)

--Robyn