RSVP (and pinatas)

In article ,
Ericka Kammerer wrote:

boggle How on earth is the issuing of party invitations the business of
the school? And the school is going to tell me who I am inviting to my own
child's party? Do they have rules about the colour of the kids' underwear
as well??

I'm not sure what you're boggling at? A school rule that
says that one doesn't publicly hand out invitations in front of
folks who aren't invited is simply reinforcing the polite behavior
you describe.

No, a school rule that says that if my child hands out invitations, they have
to be for all the kids in his class. That isn't enforcing discretion; rather
the opposite, I would suggest. It's also enforcing huge parties, which a
parent may not have the room or money to accommodate, and I assume the school
is not helping with that either.

I suppose if you stood just outside the school gate, you could hand out the
invitations without violating the rule (except that my school has multiple
gates). I suppose the Aussie ;-) option would be to just hand out the
invitations anyway. What sort of punishment could a school impose without
looking completely ridiculous?

--
Chookie -- Sydney, Australia
(Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply)

http://chookiesbackyard.blogspot.com/

In article , Banty
wrote:

The polite way to hand out invitations is discreetly, of course,
particularly
if you aren't silly enough to invite all your child's classmates. I had DS1
hand out his invitations as everyone left school, but still on the premises.


Well, that's the thinking - since preschoolers and early graders are not
going to be very good at the nuance of being discreet, they want to eliminate
that cause of upset (and sometimes rank exclusion - as in purposely inviting
everyone *but* one kid) from the classroom.

Um, do preschoolers and early graders usually do that sort of thing -- and
with the connivance of their parents?

--
Chookie -- Sydney, Australia
(Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply)

http://chookiesbackyard.blogspot.com/

In article ehrebeniuk-ECCD8B.10105431052008@news, Chookie says...

In article , Banty
wrote:

The polite way to hand out invitations is discreetly, of course,
particularly
if you aren't silly enough to invite all your child's classmates. I had DS1
hand out his invitations as everyone left school, but still on the premises.


Well, that's the thinking - since preschoolers and early graders are not
going to be very good at the nuance of being discreet, they want to eliminate
that cause of upset (and sometimes rank exclusion - as in purposely inviting
everyone *but* one kid) from the classroom.

Um, do preschoolers and early graders usually do that sort of thing -- and
with the connivance of their parents?


Yeah, in the early grades the odd kid would be odd kid out.

Banty

In article ehrebeniuk-536AF9.09492931052008@news, Chookie says...

In article ,
"Donna Metler" wrote:

It's fairly common to have a policy that *invitations* cant' be passed
out unless all are invited. This note would not be an invitation.

boggle How on earth is the issuing of party invitations the business of
the school? And the school is going to tell me who I am inviting to my own
child's party? Do they have rules about the colour of the kids' underwear
as well??

This is VERY common in US schools. If something is done at school, including
on the premises, all children must be invited (or, sometimes, all the girls
or all the boys, especially in the older primary grades). The reason is that
the school is trying to avoid building cliques and excluding children early
on. And for the little ones, there really won't be any time that they're not
with the group as others are being picked up. It will be obvious if a child
gives something to Anna, Becki, and Gabrielle, but not Stacy, Kevin, or
Melissa.

It's just how things are done here.

But younger primary children don't *have* cliques. Their concept of
friendship doesn't run that way: for them, a friend is someone they play
with. The whole idea of a friend as the person you have secrets with is a
pubescent development (on average; most people here at mk and their children
are of above-average intelligence and will develop these concepts earlier).
Either there is some research about friendships of which I am unaware, or this
school rule is based on false premises.

It sounds to me like parents are offered the "choice" of having their personal
details circulated to complete strangers OR of running whole-class-size
parties -- and all at the say-so of the school. And people don't see this as
interfering in their personal lives?


Are you talking about our Montessori school, which had long elaborate
costume-demanding International Day celebrations each October 31, in hopes that
that would overwhelm the "evil, occult" Halloween? The one that banned my child
from eating Fritos?

Naw - they don't do this to interfere in our personal family life - what you
kiddin'?

Banty

Chookie wrote:

It sounds to me like parents are offered the "choice" of having their personal
details circulated to complete strangers OR of running whole-class-size
parties -- and all at the say-so of the school. And people don't see this as
interfering in their personal lives?

While some might have it so, it really doesn't boil down
that way in my experience. It's true that if one isn't going to
invite the whole class, one should not use public means of
distributing invitations (like handing them out in class or
putting them in cubbies where it's obvious who gets one and who
doesn't). That ought to be true regardless of school policy.
It's simply not polite to make a show of who's invited and who's
not.
So, if one *doesn't* want to invite the whole class,
one then confronts the issue of how to successfully invite
the desired kids. Some believe that this is nigh
impossible without a school or class directory. Personally,
I think there's usually a way around this for a parent who
chooses to make the effort. It may be more difficult in some
settings, but I rather think that there are few situations
in which it's truly impossible to make a connection. If nothing
else, one could likely contact the teacher and ask him or her
to help facilitate some kind of contact which could result in
an exchange of contact information which could then allow for
an invitation to be sent privately. And if there are schools
in which no contact is allowed between parents, and faculty
are unwilling to facilitate any contact, and no directory is
permitted, well, I would certainly hope they're few and far
between as they're not doing what any decent preschool ought
to be doing in terms of facilitating community connections.

Best wishes,
Ericka

Chookie wrote:
In article , Banty
wrote:

The polite way to hand out invitations is discreetly, of course,
particularly
if you aren't silly enough to invite all your child's classmates. I had DS1
hand out his invitations as everyone left school, but still on the premises.

Well, that's the thinking - since preschoolers and early graders are not
going to be very good at the nuance of being discreet, they want to eliminate
that cause of upset (and sometimes rank exclusion - as in purposely inviting
everyone *but* one kid) from the classroom.

Um, do preschoolers and early graders usually do that sort of thing -- and
with the connivance of their parents?

They don't have to do it with malice aforethought, intending
to exclude just a single child. Young kids can feel left out even if
they're not the only one excluded. All they know is that others are
getting to do something fun that they're not.

Best wishes,
Ericka

Chookie wrote:
In article ,
Ericka Kammerer wrote:

boggle How on earth is the issuing of party invitations the business of
the school? And the school is going to tell me who I am inviting to my own
child's party? Do they have rules about the colour of the kids' underwear
as well??

I'm not sure what you're boggling at? A school rule that
says that one doesn't publicly hand out invitations in front of
folks who aren't invited is simply reinforcing the polite behavior
you describe.

No, a school rule that says that if my child hands out invitations, they have
to be for all the kids in his class. That isn't enforcing discretion; rather
the opposite, I would suggest. It's also enforcing huge parties, which a
parent may not have the room or money to accommodate, and I assume the school
is not helping with that either.

No, no--they're not requiring that you invite all the
kids. They're just saying that if you're not, you shouldn't
be using a public method of distributing the invitations (i.e.,
cubbies/backpacks/hand out in class/etc.). This is no more than
legislating decent manners in my book. If you're not inviting
everyone, then *of course* you shouldn't be distributing
invitations publicly. It isn't *that* hard to find a way to
distribute invitations privately if one is minded to do so.
After all, if one is limiting the guest list, presumably the
list is comprised mostly of kids one has already had some
contact with anyway, not to mention it's not going to be a
zillion people you'll have to track down.

Best wishes,
Ericka

Chookie wrote:
[snip]
No, a school rule that says that if my child hands out invitations, they have
to be for all the kids in his class. That isn't enforcing discretion; rather
the opposite, I would suggest. It's also enforcing huge parties, which a
parent may not have the room or money to accommodate, and I assume the school
is not helping with that either.
[snip]

I wonder if it depends on class size as well? Enforcing a rule that
includes 10 kids is quite different to a rule that makes you have
parties for 30.

The other factor about pre-school invites is that the US seems to run
pre-school differently to over here. Typically, in the UK, there might
be 50 children in a pre-school, but a different set of 20 comes each
day. Some days Mary and Jane are at pre-school, other days it's Mary
and Emily, and some days its Emily and Annabel.

--
Penny Gaines
UK mum to three

In article , Penny Gaines says...

Chookie wrote:
[snip]
No, a school rule that says that if my child hands out invitations, they have
to be for all the kids in his class. That isn't enforcing discretion; rather
the opposite, I would suggest. It's also enforcing huge parties, which a
parent may not have the room or money to accommodate, and I assume the school
is not helping with that either.
[snip]

I wonder if it depends on class size as well? Enforcing a rule that
includes 10 kids is quite different to a rule that makes you have
parties for 30.

Neither would "make" anyone have a party for whatever number. One invites the
people one knows and likes.


The other factor about pre-school invites is that the US seems to run
pre-school differently to over here. Typically, in the UK, there might
be 50 children in a pre-school, but a different set of 20 comes each
day. Some days Mary and Jane are at pre-school, other days it's Mary
and Emily, and some days its Emily and Annabel.


For pre-school, same here, actually. It overlaps with daycare a lot.

Banty

Penny Gaines wrote:
Chookie wrote:
[snip]
No, a school rule that says that if my child hands out invitations,
they have to be for all the kids in his class. That isn't enforcing
discretion; rather the opposite, I would suggest. It's also enforcing
huge parties, which a parent may not have the room or money to
accommodate, and I assume the school is not helping with that either.
[snip]

I wonder if it depends on class size as well? Enforcing a rule that
includes 10 kids is quite different to a rule that makes you have
parties for 30.

Again, I think this is totally missing the point.
These rules are not there to attempt to force parents into
inviting the entire class. They're there to enforce common
sense and manners (which some are sadly lacking). It just
isn't polite to publicly distribute invitations when only
some are invited. It wouldn't be proper for adults to
do that when inviting other adults!

The other factor about pre-school invites is that the US seems to run
pre-school differently to over here. Typically, in the UK, there might
be 50 children in a pre-school, but a different set of 20 comes each
day. Some days Mary and Jane are at pre-school, other days it's Mary
and Emily, and some days its Emily and Annabel.

That's true--while I know some preschools that
do things this way (our two-year old "parents' day out"
program used to run that way years ago), it seems increasingly
rare. And frankly, I can see why. It was always a challenge
for the teachers to deal with the ever-changing mix of
students. Social interactions at that age are challenging
enough without the inconsistency! ;-) So most programs I've
seen now have set days for set classes. Daycare, especially
drop-in daycare, is a different situation, of course, but
the preschool programs typically have set classes.

Best wishes,
Ericka