Rant: Over indulgent parents strike again

Paul wrote:

http://archive.thebrunswicknews.com/...ws%0A%09%09%09

Hopefully the link above works, I found this while cruising the web. Not two
weeks after christmas and two children in this sleepy little town have
already been hit by cars while riding scooters that their best friends
(parents) indulged them with this holiday season.

IMO, these parents should be held civilly and criminally liable for the
damage to the vehicles that these children of theirs caused.

I have witnessed these children on numerous occasions lately breaking nearly
every traffic law imaginable except for speeding on these things - which I
assume these scooters are not capable of. Among the violations and/or
dangerous acts I have seen my self include disregard for traffic signals,
disregard for stop signs, riding on sidewalks, riding on the wrong side of
the road and darting in and out of traffic and otherwise acting in an
unpredictable manner. Also, (atleast in GA), these kids are violating the
law simply by taking these scooters on public rights of way since they must
be at least 15 years of age to operate one off private property and they
must also have a DL or Learner's Permit.

It would be nice if the police would start to crack down on these idiot
kids - hitting their parents in the pocketbook would be a good start.

rant off

--
Paul

First of all -- the kids of this generation are spoiled
and "do no wrong" in the eyes of their parents. They are
right and you are wrong .... especially when a 13 year old
wanted $40 to shovel the snow from my sidewalk recently. I
told the kid I'll give him $10 and he walked away. Good. I'll
wait until it melts before I pay that much.

About 7-8 teens (12-15) received these motor cycles/scooters
this Christmas and they ride (speed) up and down the street
and don't even use helmets! The law here requires helmets
for bicycles so you'd think the parents would demand they
wear them .... but they (kids) always get "their way" but
this will change when one of them is seriously hurt! They even
ride through this neighborhood at night with no lights attached
to their motor cycles. Where are the parents?

Jon

Jon Walters wrote in message ...

First of all -- the kids of this generation are spoiled
and "do no wrong" in the eyes of their parents. They are
right and you are wrong .... especially when a 13 year old
wanted $40 to shovel the snow from my sidewalk recently. I
told the kid I'll give him $10 and he walked away. Good. I'll
wait until it melts before I pay that much.

Ah, so you think just because he's 13, he ought to do it for less than
an amount that he considers worth his time? He doesn't owe you
service. The only thing I can think of is that he might not have been
polite, and that's the only thing that he might have done wrong. But,
I've seen people like you grump over the polite ones, too.

Shoveling snow is hard work, and it's no fun. And if you contract
with an agency that does stuff like that, they charge $75. So you
should either pay up or shut up and do it yourself.

I've heard this so many time before...old codgers who think the
neighbor kids owe them labor for cheap. And for whatever reason, it's
always over shoveling snow.

Cathy Weeks
Mommy to Kivi Alexis 12/01

My grandmother's neighbor used to shovel her snow for her every winter,
a pretty big job where she lived! She commented one year that she could
tell he was growing up, because he still shoveled her snow but no longer
charged her for it. I think he started shoveling for her when he was
about 10 or 11, and stopped charging when he was about 16 or so.

Kids do need a way to earn money when they're too young to take a
regular job. ANd I've always thought hard physical labor was worth
paying for, if done well.

If your 13 year old neighbor seems to be charging too much, look at how
much walkway you have to get cleared. Consider how long it ought to
take him to do a good job, and in your own head work out a fair hourly
rate. Then negotiate, and include both how much you think the job is
worth, and what the job specifically entails. Do you want just a narrow
path, or the full walkway uncovered? Does it include the full sidewalk
in front of your property as well as the walkway? A walkway to the back
or garage? The driveway? Does he put out salt or dirt as well? For
labor of this demanding nature, we figure on a wage equivalent to $7 or
$8 per hour with a $10 minimum.

So given all that, was $40 really out of line? If only by a little,
perhaps you could work on teaching the child how to negotiate, and throw
in some hot apple cider on completion.

Just my thoughts,
--Beth Kevles

http://web.mit.edu/kevles/www/nomilk.html -- a page for the milk-allergic
Disclaimer: Nothing in this message should be construed as medical
advice. Please consult with your own medical practicioner.

NOTE: No email is read at my MIT address. Use the AOL one if you would
like me to reply.

(Beth Kevles) wrote in message ...

For
labor of this demanding nature, we figure on a wage equivalent to $7 or
$8 per hour with a $10 minimum.

That seems low to me. I'm thinking back to that "mother of all
snowstorms" that hit the east coast about a year ago. Here in NJ we
got two feet of snow. We dug out only one of our cars and the bare
minimum of driveway and a path to the door (only about 5 feet of
path). This is actually a very small area (our front door is RIGHT by
our driveway, and our house is VERY close to the road). The job took
hours (4 or so). If I could have paid someone $25 per hour I would
have HAPPILY paid the $100 (or perhaps more). I was stiff and sore
for days after that job.

But it is still the case that everyone values their time differently,
and as long as the teen wasn't rude, the man shouldn't be insulted
about "today's kids" because the kid wouldn't do it for less than $40.

By the way, *I* might shovel someone's snow for free (if they were
friends, and were unable to do it) but I wouldn't take on a shoveling
*job* for $10 (unless it were quick and easy).

Cathy Weeks
Mommy to Kivi Alexis 12/01

In article , Cathy Weeks wrote:

minimum of driveway and a path to the door (only about 5 feet of
path). This is actually a very small area (our front door is RIGHT by
our driveway, and our house is VERY close to the road). The job took
hours (4 or so). If I could have paid someone $25 per hour I would
have HAPPILY paid the $100 (or perhaps more). I was stiff and sore
for days after that job.

As I have learned in chicago blizzards is to go out in the snow as
it's falling and shovel low depths often. The last one we had in 99 (I
think) I went out and shoveled every couple-three hours. Annoying yes,
but I didn't have my cars burried like the neighbors did. It's just
easier to take care of it in small bites.

Brent P wrote:

As I have learned in chicago blizzards is to go out in the snow as
it's falling and shovel low depths often. The last one we had in 99 (I
think) I went out and shoveled every couple-three hours. Annoying yes,
but I didn't have my cars burried like the neighbors did. It's just
easier to take care of it in small bites.


I just moved to California! :-) Problem solved.



John

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(Cathy Weeks) wrote:

$10/hr
That seems low to me. I'm thinking back to that "mother of all
snowstorms" that hit the east coast about a year ago. Here in NJ we
got two feet of snow. We dug out only one of our cars and the bare
minimum of driveway and a path to the door (only about 5 feet of
path). This is actually a very small area (our front door is RIGHT by
our driveway, and our house is VERY close to the road). The job took
hours (4 or so). If I could have paid someone $25 per hour I would
have HAPPILY paid the $100 (or perhaps more). I was stiff and sore
for days after that job.

We got about 3 feet of snow in Baltimore over one long weekend in
about 1998. (Also ice storms, but that's another storm).

No one was doing anything or going anywhere, and dh voluntarily
shoveled our sidewalk (short - about 8 feet), and also shoveled the
lady across the street's passageways (she's in a wheelchair so she has
ramps) for free of course, and then shoveled the entire street (both
lanes) (our frontage was about 50 feet- hers was about 100 feet).

We don't often get snowplows, and people park on the side (no curbs)
so there's sometimes only one lane through which is why there aren't
many plows. The other men on the street (younger) were kind of
guilted into doing the same. It made it very nice along our section
of street. No icy ruts and snowplowed in driveways. We also had a
pile of snow along inside the fence until mid June.

My mom will pay to have her walk shoveled, but the neighbors will
often come and clean off her car and dig her out. This is partly
guilt because the lady next door to her of about the same age
apparently came out of her house last winter, slipped and fell and hit
her head and froze to death. She wasn't discovered until the next
morning by one of the neighbors who was out jogging.

But it is still the case that everyone values their time differently,
and as long as the teen wasn't rude, the man shouldn't be insulted
about "today's kids" because the kid wouldn't do it for less than $40.

By the way, *I* might shovel someone's snow for free (if they were
friends, and were unable to do it) but I wouldn't take on a shoveling
*job* for $10 (unless it were quick and easy).

The guy next door felt that dh was taking money from teens who might
have shoveled the ramps of our neighbor across the street, and so he
didn't do that for subsequent storms.
grandma Rosalie

On 8 Jan 2004 11:34:11 -0800, (Cathy Weeks)

(Beth Kevles) wrote in message ...

For
labor of this demanding nature, we figure on a wage equivalent to $7 or
$8 per hour with a $10 minimum.

That seems low to me. I'm thinking back to that "mother of all
snowstorms" that hit the east coast about a year ago.

Think of a typical snowfall instead. Obviously you'd charge more to
shovel 2 feet of snow than to shovel 4 inches. When it snows where I'm
from, nobody shovels anything - we don't have snow shovels and the city
doesn't have plows. Of course, it all melts in about an hour, so it's
no big deal.

During the '80s, I got $20 to mow the yard, which of course includes
edging, sweeping the pavement, and it was a big yard. I can't imagine
shoveling 4 inches of snow off of someone's front walk would be even
half as large of a job. Half the job, half the price and I'd generously
double the money to make up for increases in the cost of living.

Here in NJ we
got two feet of snow. We dug out only one of our cars and the bare
minimum of driveway and a path to the door (only about 5 feet of
path). This is actually a very small area (our front door is RIGHT by
our driveway, and our house is VERY close to the road). The job took
hours (4 or so). If I could have paid someone $25 per hour I would
have HAPPILY paid the $100 (or perhaps more). I was stiff and sore
for days after that job.

But it is still the case that everyone values their time differently,
and as long as the teen wasn't rude, the man shouldn't be insulted
about "today's kids" because the kid wouldn't do it for less than $40.

By the way, *I* might shovel someone's snow for free (if they were
friends, and were unable to do it) but I wouldn't take on a shoveling
*job* for $10 (unless it were quick and easy).


Yeah, but you're probably not a teenager without a regular job either,
are you?

Cathy Weeks
Mommy to Kivi Alexis 12/01

In article , Mike Helm says...

On 8 Jan 2004 11:34:11 -0800, (Cathy Weeks)


By the way, *I* might shovel someone's snow for free (if they were
friends, and were unable to do it) but I wouldn't take on a shoveling
*job* for $10 (unless it were quick and easy).


Yeah, but you're probably not a teenager without a regular job either,
are you?

She's not an aerospace engineer laid off after a contract is lost either, but
what's the point?

Banty

Mike Helm wrote in
:

During the '80s, I got $20 to mow the yard, which of course includes
edging, sweeping the pavement, and it was a big yard.


During the mid-80's I kept food in my belly by shoveling snow in the
winter and doing yard work in the summer and fall for $5 an hour. Spring
was a very lean time for me. Even though I got paid by the hour I
usually did 2 hour's worth of work in that 60 minutes...

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