*At risk* of abuse and CPS interventions

Subject: South stands alone...
From: "Doug"
Date: 10/7/2003 2:13 AM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id: t

LaVonne Carlson writes:

Children who were corporally punished are significantly more likely to
experience problems of substance abuse,

Hi, LaVonne!

You are incorrect. The study that draws this conclusion has been challenged
on many fronts, among them the failure to control for other variables.
Researchers have been unable to duplicate the results. If you would cite
your source, we can look at the research and its social science detractors.

depression, suicide,

I am not sure which study you are relying upon, but citing it would help us
see where you base your claim.

and are significanly more likely to abuse their own children than are
children who were parenting
without corporal punishment.

Given the nature of CPS founded "abuse," which is often discussed in this
newsgroup, it would be helpful to learn how child abuse was established to
have occurred in the study you rely upon here for your claim.

For example, former foster children are claimed to be significantly more
likely to abuse their own children than parents raised in the general
population. Is this because former foster children are more abusive or
because CPS targets former foster children in their risk assessment
instruments as being at risk of abusing their own children. As a
consequence, a higher percentage of former foster children are
substantiated, while parents themselves, for "abuse." Most CPS cases are
substantiated on the basis of risk rather than actual abuse.

Again, citing the authority for your claim will allow us to look at what the
researcher looked at.




Robert T McQuaid
Orangeville Ontario Canada
Love does not come out of the barrel of a gun

Nor, Robert, does love come out of a hand hitting and hurting a child.

Fern5827 wrote:

Subject: South stands alone...
From: "Doug"
Date: 10/7/2003 2:13 AM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id: t

LaVonne Carlson writes:

Children who were corporally punished are significantly more likely to
experience problems of substance abuse,

Hi, LaVonne!

You are incorrect. The study that draws this conclusion has been challenged
on many fronts, among them the failure to control for other variables.
Researchers have been unable to duplicate the results. If you would cite
your source, we can look at the research and its social science detractors.

I didn't say "study" Fern. I said "studies." Studies banning nearly three
decades. I have posted references and you have responded. If you are the same
Fern that was active in this ng in the latter part of the 90's you know these
studies. You also know studies that have been posted since then that clearly
negate your erroneous statement. If you are the same Fern that has been
posting since the later part of the 90's, please post references.

depression, suicide,

I am not sure which study you are relying upon, but citing it would help us
see where you base your claim.

Citing would help, but since you are Fern, and you have responded to this study
numerous times, I suggest you provide the citation. You are Fern, aren't you?

and are significanly more likely to abuse their own children than are
children who were parenting
without corporal punishment.

Given the nature of CPS founded "abuse," which is often discussed in this
newsgroup, it would be helpful to learn how child abuse was established to
have occurred in the study you rely upon here for your claim.

I'm not talking about a study, Fern. I'm talking about three decades of
studies. Remember when you actually seemed to read something other than
internet and National Enquirer? Who are you now, Fern?

How was child abuse established, you ask. This is a very good question. In
some states parents can hit their children with instruments, leaving bruises
and welts, and this is not considered abuse. In other states if a parent
leaves a mark on a child, or hits above the waist, the spanking is considered
abuse. In the US, states are free to define child abuse. How bizarre is that,
Fern? You want the state to define what level of physically assault is
considered abusive if you are the victim?

LaVonne

LaVonne Carlson wrote in message ...
Fern5827 wrote:

Subject: South stands alone...
From: "Doug"
Date: 10/7/2003 2:13 AM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id: t

LaVonne Carlson writes:

Children who were corporally punished are significantly more likely to
experience problems of substance abuse,

Hi, LaVonne!

You are incorrect. The study that draws this conclusion has been challenged
on many fronts, among them the failure to control for other variables.
Researchers have been unable to duplicate the results. If you would cite
your source, we can look at the research and its social science detractors.

I didn't say "study" Fern. I said "studies." Studies banning nearly three
decades. I have posted references and you have responded. If you are the same
Fern that was active in this ng in the latter part of the 90's you know these
studies. You also know studies that have been posted since then that clearly
negate your erroneous statement. If you are the same Fern that has been
posting since the later part of the 90's, please post references.

depression, suicide,

I am not sure which study you are relying upon, but citing it would help us
see where you base your claim.

Citing would help, but since you are Fern, and you have responded to this study
numerous times, I suggest you provide the citation. You are Fern, aren't you?

and are significanly more likely to abuse their own children than are
children who were parenting
without corporal punishment.

Given the nature of CPS founded "abuse," which is often discussed in this
newsgroup, it would be helpful to learn how child abuse was established to
have occurred in the study you rely upon here for your claim.

I'm not talking about a study, Fern. I'm talking about three decades of
studies. Remember when you actually seemed to read something other than
internet and National Enquirer? Who are you now, Fern?

How was child abuse established, you ask. This is a very good question. In
some states parents can hit their children with instruments, leaving bruises
and welts, and this is not considered abuse. In other states if a parent
leaves a mark on a child, or hits above the waist, the spanking is considered
abuse. In the US, states are free to define child abuse. How bizarre is that,
Fern? You want the state to define what level of physically assault is
considered abusive if you are the victim?

Actually parents should be charged with child abuse if they look at
'their' child in a mean way!!!!!!!!!!!

LaVonne


LaVonne