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#161
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Ritalin Helps Beat Cancer Fatigue
jake wrote in message . ..
RSD, CFS, MCS, etc. And, NONE of those have clearly objective tests. sure... I would say its status is exactly that of Chronic Fatigue Syndrome. Fine. How about RSD, migraine, and schizophrenia? You keep dodging those questions. -- CBI, MD |
#162
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Ritalin Helps Beat Cancer Fatigue
"Joe Parsons" wrote in message ... On Mon, 22 Dec 2003 17:25:15 +0000, jake wrote: [snip] Some people seem to want one set of rules for them, and another for others... there are no medical tests for ADHD. It is not a medical condition. Now *this* is funny. There isn't a darn thing funny about the functional response children make to sharing territory with odious persons creating an environment so hostile to such children that the childrens adapt in a manner includes permanent alterations to their brain chemistry, originally named Minimal Brain Dysfunction and only recently renamed ADHD to appease parents of unfortunate children. |
#163
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Ritalin Helps Beat Cancer Fatigue
"jake" wrote in message ... On Mon, 22 Dec 2003 13:25:53 -0600, "SumBuny" wrote: hmmm... so he is saying kids(Dxed with ADHD)on speed drive more safely? Why do you insist on using such an inflammatory word? Is it intentional, or ignorant? *That* is the problem that those of us who choose to use medication run into, the attitude that ADHD meds=speed=illicit drug abuse... WRONG But some do not *want* to hear that or understand that... thats food for thought I must admit.. lots of food for thought there in fact..thank you for posting it.. If you are *truly* thinking about it, that treated ADHD is better/safer that untreated...though your inflammatory and prejudicial comment above leaves me believing that you are only being condescending here. Do note this...like diabetes, ADHD does not always need medication to be treated....some diabetics do fine with diet and excercise (behavior modifications), some need the addition of medication to the behavior modifications. I.e., insulin alone will not treat the diabetes, but changes in behavior (diet, exercise) are also needed. The same goes for ADHD. Some do fine with behavior modification and coping mechanisms (such as those found http://www.add.org/content/school/list.htm ) But there are those who need medication *in addition to* those behavior changes...medication alone will not treat ADHD any more than it will treat diabetes, when it is used. *That* is another similarity between the two...meds alone will not work, and meds are not necessary in all cases. Unfortunately, there are those who are vehemently anti-meds for ADHD, that they overlook this last statement from ADHDers like me--that meds alone are not the answer, and that meds are not always necessary... well that sounds like refreshingly fair comment.. I try to be...because I know that extremism--on any side--leads to people not listening, but only yelling...and it *is* what I believe, not just because I think someone else wants to hear it... Buny |
#164
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Ritalin Helps Beat Cancer Fatigue
"SumBuny" wrote
there are no medical tests for ADHD. It is not a medical condition. What are the "medical tests" for near-sightedness? Far-sightedness? Pain? ... students who do not have "medical conditions" because the tests for them are not truly objective...and whil you are at it, insist that everyone remove their prescription lenses, because that too is subjective, not objectively tested... Tests for nearsightedness and for eyeglass prescriptions *are* objective. Perhaps you think that eyecharts are not objective, but most optometrists do all their diagnosis and testing with objective tests that look directly at the lens in the eye. The eyechart is just a way of double-checking the results. |
#165
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Ritalin Helps Beat Cancer Fatigue
"jake" wrote in message ... On Mon, 22 Dec 2003 13:32:52 -0600, "SumBuny" wrote: "jake" wrote in message .. . On Mon, 22 Dec 2003 11:02:00 -0600, "SumBuny" wrote: "jake" wrote in message .. . On Mon, 22 Dec 2003 11:24:00 GMT, "Marciosos8 Probertiosos8" wrote: "jake" wrote in message .. . I dont know about my double standards but your obsessions are sure showing.. As I said ..anything to avoid facing the fact that ADHD is nothing remotely like diabetes.. However, it is like chronic pain, Have you ever had chronic pain? you might change your mind rapidly.... there is no question of "forgetting" to take painkillers.. Hmmm...sounds like an "addiction" to me....if a person never forgets to take their drug, they must be addicted...right? If you are in chronic pain you do not forget to take painkillers. It is no secret that opiates and painkillers like Oxycontin are highly addictive. True...but what about those who are using NSAIDs for chronic conditions? well..I am not too sure they are being very smart.. there are worse things than being addicted In terms of this discussion I guess you would have to say they are dependent but not addicted.. What is the difference, in your opinion? And a person who does forget must not be addicted, right? I suspect that they remember fast enough when the withdrawal symptoms kick in.. Did ya know that you can get rebound headaches from overuse of NSAIDs? http://www.healthyroads.com/MyLibrar...eboundHeadache. asp overuse is sure not a good idea.. this should be publicized more often IMHO.. Agreed...overuse/abuse of *any* medication is not good--including ADHD meds...however, all too many extremists do not seem to "hear" that...they believe that anyone using ADHD meds is abusing them... Considering that both chronic pain and ADHD are diagnosed subjectively...and the former patients never forget their meds while the latter often do...then why is the ADHDer called addicted to drugs for a "made up condition" and the pain sufferer is not? the addictive qualities are a function of the drug.. Both opiates and amphetamines are highly addictive. Explain the rebound headaches for overuse/abuse of NSAIDs (not opiates) lol...a bit of a burden when the experts dont know.. but "a history of taking prescription or nonprescription pain relievers daily or almost every day, contrary to directions on the package label" sounds fair enough to me.. it brings to mind a similar discussion we had on OTC inhalers where you were perfectly correct.. nodding Key words are "contrary to directions"...when a doctor directs you to take medication daily or over an extended period of time, that is not considered overuse, right? As long as you are working with your doctor, following his/her directions as far as dose and frequency, it is not abuse or overuse, right? Same for all medications...including those for mental health issues... Just trying to understand the POV of those who make this "distinction"... yes you can be quite rational..but as soon as the spectre of scientology is summoned up you became a eccentric and hysterical as the rest.. a curious phenomenum I have never been impressed with the extremism of that group...anyone who decides what is right for *everyone else* no matter what, strikes me as eccentric and hysterical. and how about the extremism of those who troll around as self-styled "anti-scientologists" routinely pack attacking poor devils who have never even heard of the damn group? raving about clams and god knows what other madness..???? Just because I do not participate in those does not mean I agree/support them...otherwise, I could be accused of doing the same on many anti-ADHD med threads as well, no? g I have never insisted that all people take medication, that it is right for everyone. I believe that this is something to be decided by the patient and the doctor...however, when someone who has never met me insists that I should not be allowed to do this, that they can "practice medicine" for my docotr, *that* is where I get defensive. Wouldn't you get upset if a stranger insists that you and your doctor not be the ones to decide your health care? Indeed.. in other forums I am considered a pain for constantly criticizing mentally ill usenet doKtors.. who diagnose and prescribe for unmet strangers from behind their keyboards.. nodding The frightening thing that I have seen is that it is not only mental health issues, but just about any medical condition can be abused online...there is definately something to be said about personal interaction with one's doc....many conditions mimic others...my grandfather had been diagnosed as arthritic for years...only to be found with pancreatic cancer by a specialist who happened to be in the office during one of his follow-ups...another friend was misdiagnosed with Chron's (sp?) disease--he actually had leukemia...I do agree that ADHD is often misdiagnosed--but misdiagnosis goes *both ways*. I.e., some who are diagnosed as ADHD do not have it, but that also means that some people who are not diagnosed ADHD *do* have it. odd that they almost invariably diagnose people as having the same problem as them and encourage others to take the same drugs as they do I do admit that I see much through the eyes of "ADHD, aspergers/autism, gifted, sensory integrations disorder". Why? Because that is what my family is dealing with, and "If the only tool one has is a hammer, everything begins to look like a nail." I may see ADHD or autism, or SID where it might not be, but I do not insist that medication is what everyone should have. If I am asked what *I* (or my family) is doing/using, I do not lie. But I *do* insist that they go to their doctor to get it checked/ruled out. If it wasn't for some folks doing that, my son's autism would probably have gone undiagnosed for a few more years (he was not diagnosed aspergers until he was 8)...someone suggested I research that, and when I saw the description, I went to his doc and asked that he be screened for it. The same with ADHD... YMMV, and we are all human and make mistakes...docs included g Buny |
#166
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Ritalin Helps Beat Cancer Fatigue
"L" wrote in message s.com... There isn't a darn thing funny about the functional response children make to sharing territory with odious persons creating an environment so hostile to such children that the childrens adapt in a manner includes permanent alterations to their brain chemistry, originally named Minimal Brain Dysfunction and only recently renamed ADHD to appease parents of unfortunate children. I do not see my children nor I as "unfortunate." There are many good things about ADHD... http://www.netacc.net/~gradda/sp0150or.html 50 (or so) Great Things About ADD by Bob Seay Entertain your friends with witty one-liners and sharp come backs. · Insomnia makes for more time to stay up and surf the net! · The drive of Hyper-focus · Two words: Chat Addiction · Hyperactivity+Creativity+ a Compulsive Libido= One Popular Guy on Dates · Resilience · Can meet someone, fall deeply in love, marry, fight, hate and divorce all in about 35 minutes or less · Sparkling personality · Drop names like Edison, Einstein, Walt Disney and Beethoven in conversations · Can fixate on one object while the rest of the world goes right down the toilet · Can see all of your wordly possessions at one time.. because they are all over the floor · Tends to be very generous with money, time and resources. · flexible · ENTHUSIASTIC · innovative · A strong sense of what is FAIR · Willing to take a Risk · Alert · Eager · creative · provides original ideas · or isn't afraid to steal them. · Make far reaching analogies that no one else understands. Write them off as "Deep Thoughts" · Theoretical · Abstract Thinkers · Spontaneous · Always Hopeful · Keeps business meetings lively · The Mind of a Pentium - with only 2Mgs of RAM · Aesthetically oriented · Pleasantly and constantly surprised by finding clothing you had forgotten about. · Able to tie seemingly unrelated ideas together · Funny · Able to see The Big Picture while others stumble around in the dark. · Independent · Demands to know WHY? · Last of the ROMANTICS · Has a wide variety of interests · Good conversationalist · Qualify for bulk rate mail on tax returns because you have at least 24 W-2's attached. · At IQs of 160 and above, virtually all people have ADD symptoms · An innately better understanding of intuitive technologies such as computers · In class popularity contests, always voted "Most Entertaining" · "Most Energetic" and "Most likely to Self Immolate" · Great Improvisors · Able to leap tall buildings in a single bound (did you actually read that?) · Honestly believes that anything is possible · Great at Extemporaneous Speaking · Quickly assimilates new information · Usually a little smarter than the average bear · Willing to "step out in faith" · Rarely satisfied with the status quo · Empathetic · Can easily replace missing childhood photos with panels from "Calvin & Hobbes" · Pleasantly and constantly surprised by finding money you had forgotten about. · Blows up, but then usually recovers quickly · An unstoppable dynamo of human energy · Doesn't know when to quit · Intuitive · Compassionate · Persistant · Spunky · Hidden TALENT · Closely attuned to the moods of those around them · Pleasantly and constantly surprised by finding spouses you had forgotten about. · ADD is especially common among artists, musicians, and other creative people · Can always be depended upon to provide a different perspective · Visionary · An Individualist · Many successful entrepreneurs exhibit ADD behaviors · A greater tolerance for Chaos · Provides job security for writers of Spell Check programs · Will fight for what they believe in · Excellent motivators of others · Highly organized, punctual and generally responsible (OK, so I lied) · got your attention? Not exactly "unfortunate" Buny |
#167
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Ritalin Helps Beat Cancer Fatigue
"jake" wrote in message ... On Mon, 22 Dec 2003 11:24:00 GMT, "Marciosos8 Probertiosos8" wrote: "jake" wrote in message .. . On Mon, 22 Dec 2003 10:21:56 GMT, "Marciosos7 Probertiosos8" wrote: "jake" wrote in message .. . On Sun, 21 Dec 2003 16:09:27 GMT, "Marciosos7 Probertiosos8" wrote: "Roger Schlafly" wrote in message et... "Marciosos7 Probertiosos8" wrote Dr. Mary Ann Block BTW, in some recent readsing, I came accross this little gem.... http://www.fumento.com/adhdblock.html Imagine if anyone who is pro med used an expert that was this tainted..... They do. (Do you mean Block or Fumento?) Block, of course, as that was the context which you snipped and did not mention. I usually enjoy Fumento's column, but he is a little off-base here. Disagree. I would say "Grand slam." (pun intended) He tries to smear Block with a scientology charge, when the connection is very tenuous at best. Bull****. I looked at all of it, ans she is a fellow traveller, and in lock step. "fellow traveller"??? thats a useful expresion.. IOW you are totally aware that the lady is NOT in fact a scientologist and its just another pathetic attempt to smear using "guilt by association" From all my reading, she is freely travelling with them. For whatever purpose, she has made a considered to affiliate with this Kriminal Kult. now here come the capital letters and conspiracy theories.. I dont know about my double standards but your obsessions are sure showing.. As I said ..anything to avoid facing the fact that ADHD is nothing remotely like diabetes.. However, it is like chronic pain, Have you ever had chronic pain? On three occasions in my life I had sufficient pain to want prescription medication, and was given it by doctors. One was addictive, but, I did not get addicted, as I did not abuse it. you might change your mind rapidly.... there is no question of "forgetting" to take painkillers.. Irrelevant, since we are discussing the diagnosis. Pain, especially the degree of pain, is subjective, and the doctor occasionally renders treatment based upon a patient's description of their subjective symptomatology. Since this is clearly analogous to the issue of diagnosing ADHD, for you to be consistent, you would have to oppose the use of any medicition for these patients. Now, you may ask is this pain real? The answer is, absent some element of secondary gain, yes. My firm often looks at claims of people who are alleging such a disability. We look to see how their lives have been affected. And, this is one of the elements of the diagnostic protocol for AH/HD. the comparisons are striking. RSD, CFS, MCS, etc. And, NONE of those have clearly objective tests. sure... I would say its status is exactly that of Chronic Fatigue Syndrome. I have seen people incapacitated from CFS. |
#168
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Ritalin Helps Beat Cancer Fatigue
"jake" wrote in message ... On Mon, 22 Dec 2003 13:36:28 -0600, "SumBuny" wrote: "jake" wrote in message news there are no medical tests for ADHD. It is not a medical condition. What are the "medical tests" for near-sightedness? Far-sightedness? Pain? Autism? Sensory integration disorder? If you cannot state any, does that mean that these are not medical conditions? That they should/can not be treated? That they are not real? Try to spend some time volunteering in special education classes with students who do not have "medical conditions" because the tests for them are not truly objective...and whil you are at it, insist that everyone remove their prescription lenses, because that too is subjective, not objectively tested... Until then, do not tell me that my family is not dealing with disabling conditions, such as ADHD, autism, sid, pain.... I am not aware that pointing out that diabetes is nothing like ADHD is telling you and family anything..or that I have ever suggested such a thing.. It was not your pointing out diabetes is "nothing like ADHD" that I was commenting on, but the comment of "there are no medical tests for ADHD. It is not a medical condition" that I was...and you conveniently snipped both that and my explanatory comments...your comment was "telling my family" that our ADHD, autism, sid, pain issues are not "medical conditions"... Buny |
#169
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Ritalin Helps Beat Cancer Fatigue
"CBI" wrote in message m... jake wrote in message . .. RSD, CFS, MCS, etc. And, NONE of those have clearly objective tests. sure... I would say its status is exactly that of Chronic Fatigue Syndrome. Fine. How about RSD, migraine, and schizophrenia? You keep dodging those questions. Although late stage RSD can have some objective findings. |
#170
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Ritalin Helps Beat Cancer Fatigue
"SumBuny" wrote in message news:rnFFb.9118$Fg.2730@lakeread01... "Marciosos7 Probertiosos8" wrote in message .net... "jake" wrote in message ... On Sun, 21 Dec 2003 16:09:27 GMT, "Marciosos7 Probertiosos8" wrote: "fellow traveller"??? thats a useful expresion.. IOW you are totally aware that the lady is NOT in fact a scientologist and its just another pathetic attempt to smear using "guilt by association" From all my reading, she is freely travelling with them. For whatever purpose, she has made a considered to affiliate with this Kriminal Kult. Not to mention that exact same "argument" is used to deny the accuracy of medical tests that are run by labs that are "guilty by association" with pharmaceutical companies.... Some people seem to want one set of rules for them, and another for others... Of course. it is the only way that they can win. |
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