Inconsiderate drivers and kids who walk to school

On 2005-09-19, Nikki wrote:
I love the greeter idea. I plan to join the PTA, maybe I'll mention it in a
year or two ;-) Apparently my neighbor tried to get a parent volunteer
crossing guard when her kid was there (she was PTA president) but the school
nixed the idea due to liability reasons or something. I imagine there would
be great resistance to not being able to park along that street and I'm not
sure there is anything that can actually be done about it since it is a
public street.

Petition the city (or whoever has jurisdiction over the street) to put
in a 200-foot no-parking zone directly in front of the school.
Explain the reasons to them and they'll probably do it.


------------------------------------------------------------
Kevin Karplus http://www.soe.ucsc.edu/~karplus
Professor of Biomolecular Engineering, University of California, Santa Cruz
Undergraduate and Graduate Director, Bioinformatics
(Senior member, IEEE) (Board of Directors, ISCB)
life member (LAB, Adventure Cycling, American Youth Hostels)
Effective Cycling Instructor #218-ck (lapsed)
Affiliations for identification only.

On 2005-09-19, Circe wrote:
In our case, we can't even GET a public bus. Public bus service in
California in general is spotty and minimal at best, unfortunately.
Generally speaking, you have to be a minimum distance away from the school
(usually a mile or more) even to qualify for the privilege of *paying* for
bus service. The only exceptions to that are if you have a child who goes to
a school that isn't your neighborhood school for either "program
improvement" under NCLB or due to "special needs".

In our case, we live only about a half a mile from the school, which means
we don't have the option of paying for the bus. It's really not safe,
however, for the children to walk to school because our neighborhood has no
sidewalks and the street the school is located on (and where our kids would
do all but about 300 feet of their walking) is the major thoroughfare
through the neighborhood with a speed limit of 35 mph (and, of course, no
one pays the slightest attention it; cars doing 45-50 mph is more common
than one doing 35). There have been several pedestrians killed while walking
on the shoulder of this particular street over the past decade or so, which
means our fears are not exactly groundless.

So, guess what? We chauffer the kids to and from school, as do the vast
majority of other parents in the neighborhood. Which, of course, is
responsible for a significant amount of the traffic on the road into/out of
school that makes walking unsafe. Vicious circle, really.

California districts vary enormously in what transit is available. In
the Santa Cruz City school district there are no school buses (except
one little one for special ed, and one that buses the students from
Beach Hill to Delaveaga school, if that hasn't been cancelled this
year). Students generally are within 2 miles of their school, though
the boundries between schools are a bit strange (the edge of the
Bayview School area is right at the school---if you live across
Mission from the school you are now in the Westlake school).

We do have a decent public transit system (thanks to local sales taxes
and to UCSC and Cabrillo students, who tax themselves for bus passes).
I believe that high school students use the public buses somewhat, but
they are not scheduled or routed well for the elementary or middle
schools. Bus rides do cost $1.50 each, so are rather expensive.

We've just moved from a public school to a private one, increasing our
walk or bike ride from a half mile to 3/4 of a mile each way. There
is one very busy street to cross, so we still accompany our
9-year-old, though he is probably responsible enough now to do it by
himself. The private school seems to have less of a problem with
irresponsible drivers than the public one, despite having a larger
fraction of the students coming by car. Perhaps it is because their
parking lot is proportionately larger. Other explanations are also
possible.


------------------------------------------------------------
Kevin Karplus http://www.soe.ucsc.edu/~karplus
Professor of Biomolecular Engineering, University of California, Santa Cruz
Undergraduate and Graduate Director, Bioinformatics
(Senior member, IEEE) (Board of Directors, ISCB)
life member (LAB, Adventure Cycling, American Youth Hostels)
Effective Cycling Instructor #218-ck (lapsed)
Affiliations for identification only.

On 2005-09-18, Hillary Israeli wrote:

We're
required to make a left into the lot and a right out of the lot - this
means that we have to actually go around the school because the way we
approach, we'd have to make a right into the lot which is forbidden. So,
ultimately what happens is a huge line of cars forms waiting to get into
the lot... and the cars which are just driving down the road NOT wanting
to get into the school... what do they do? They reasonably enough do not
want to sit in traffic 2 city blocks worth for "no reason," so they
decide to just drive in the lane reserved for opposing traffic! This is a
two-lane road. It's also curvy. So when people start EXITING the lot, they
are confronted with the cars going the WRONG WAY. It's a huge problem,
IMO.

This sounds like a disaster waiting to happen. Someone gave no
thought at all to safety when making up the rules. What you should do
is petition the school to allow only RIGHT turns into or out of the
lot, so that no traffic needs to be crossed entering or exiting the
lot, and so that wrong-way traffic is not encouraged.


------------------------------------------------------------
Kevin Karplus http://www.soe.ucsc.edu/~karplus
Professor of Biomolecular Engineering, University of California, Santa Cruz
Undergraduate and Graduate Director, Bioinformatics
(Senior member, IEEE) (Board of Directors, ISCB)
life member (LAB, Adventure Cycling, American Youth Hostels)
Effective Cycling Instructor #218-ck (lapsed)
Affiliations for identification only.

Kevin Karplus wrote:

Petition the city (or whoever has jurisdiction over the street) to put
in a 200-foot no-parking zone directly in front of the school.
Explain the reasons to them and they'll probably do it.

Hmm, that is an interesting idea, very good! They already have that at the
front of the school. The side of the street next to the school receives the
school buses and two city transit vans and the opposite side has no parking
between the hours of 7am-4am, which I don't even understand. Maybe that was
to prevent parents from dropping off kids by the buses?All the parents have
to drop their kids off at the back of the school by the play ground. Good
idea though - if just a small section there kept moving it would make a
world of difference. We are the biggest grade school in town but still a
small school in the scheme of things.

--
Nikki
Hunter 4/99
Luke 4/01
EDD 4/06

Kevin Karplus wrote:

On 2005-09-19, Nikki wrote:
I love the greeter idea. I plan to join the PTA, maybe I'll mention it in a
year or two ;-) Apparently my neighbor tried to get a parent volunteer
crossing guard when her kid was there (she was PTA president) but the school
nixed the idea due to liability reasons or something. I imagine there would
be great resistance to not being able to park along that street and I'm not
sure there is anything that can actually be done about it since it is a
public street.

Petition the city (or whoever has jurisdiction over the street) to put
in a 200-foot no-parking zone directly in front of the school.
Explain the reasons to them and they'll probably do it.

I know from experience what will happen here though - people will sit
in their cars with the engines running and thus not "parked".

We have streets that there is no parking during 'rush hour' and you
can't legally park on the streets going downtown until after 9 am. So
people pull into the parking places and just sit there until 9. There
aren't enough police to actually ticket all these people.

grandma Rosalie

"Rosalie B." wrote in message
...
Kevin Karplus wrote:
On 2005-09-19, Nikki wrote:
I love the greeter idea. I plan to join the PTA, maybe I'll mention it
in a
year or two ;-) Apparently my neighbor tried to get a parent volunteer
crossing guard when her kid was there (she was PTA president) but the
school
nixed the idea due to liability reasons or something. I imagine there
would
be great resistance to not being able to park along that street and I'm
not
sure there is anything that can actually be done about it since it is a
public street.

Petition the city (or whoever has jurisdiction over the street) to put
in a 200-foot no-parking zone directly in front of the school.
Explain the reasons to them and they'll probably do it.

I know from experience what will happen here though - people will sit
in their cars with the engines running and thus not "parked".

We have streets that there is no parking during 'rush hour' and you
can't legally park on the streets going downtown until after 9 am. So
people pull into the parking places and just sit there until 9. There
aren't enough police to actually ticket all these people.

Moreover, these rules make it extraordinarily difficult for people who do
pick up their children. Our school has a drive-through circle for picking up
the kids, but there's always a line of cars going into it backed well up
onto the street. I prefer to park and walk in to pick them up, so as not
waste time (not to mention gasoline!) sitting in the long line of cars. But
that leads to problems because my school *has* managed to get a "no parking"
zone specified in front of the school, but in which it's perfectly legal to
sit in your car and wait for your kids. But you can only do that if your
kids are in 2nd grade or higher; they won't release my first grader to her
older third grade brother--an adult must pick her up. This means I have to
park across the street or up the hill, which means that I must then cross
the busy street with three children to get back to it. All of which means
I'm caught between the devil and the deep blue sea!
--
Be well, Barbara

"Kevin Karplus" wrote in message
...
On 2005-09-19, Nikki wrote:
I love the greeter idea. I plan to join the PTA, maybe I'll mention it
in a
year or two ;-) Apparently my neighbor tried to get a parent volunteer
crossing guard when her kid was there (she was PTA president) but the
school
nixed the idea due to liability reasons or something. I imagine there
would
be great resistance to not being able to park along that street and I'm
not
sure there is anything that can actually be done about it since it is a
public street.

Petition the city (or whoever has jurisdiction over the street) to put
in a 200-foot no-parking zone directly in front of the school.
Explain the reasons to them and they'll probably do it.

One of the schools in our district did just that, and the city changed the
street in front of the school to a drop-off zone, loading and unloading
only. This actually was better than a school parking lot, in that the
police could ticket the parents that didn't do the drop-off fast enough.
Those folks got very efficient at dropping kids.

Ericka Kammerer wrote:

Cathy Kearns wrote:

Here is where I think the problem is lack of experience. The schools
themselves don't want responsibility for the drop-off area, the teachers in
our district don't feel they are paid enough to work the drop-off, so it is
left to the PTA or parent volunteers.

I don't think it ever crossed our principal's mind that
it wasn't his responsibility to ensure the safety of the children
during drop off and pick up. It's hard for me to imagine that
a school would be willing to have that sort of liability exposure,
regardless of whether less mercenary arguments would have
swayed them ;-) As far as the teachers not wanting to do it,
I don't have a lot of sympathy for that. At least here, the
teachers are required to be at school by that time anyway,
and it's no different from recess or lunch duty, which they
also cycle through.

I've only worked at a middle school or HS so there weren't really
little children. But in our middle school one of the assistant
principals ran the bus area and took care of discipline. All the kids
that got there before homeroom was to start went to the cafeteria
where someone (I think the gym teacher who didn't have a homeroom)
took care of them and also the free breakfast kids.

We had to be at school by 7:30, and ready for students at 7:50, and
that's not a lot of time to prepare for a day of teaching IMHO.

Also we did not cycle through lunch duty. We got 20 minutes on our
own to eat between taking the kids to the cafeteria and picking them
up at the cafeteria. I would certainly have objected to giving up my
lunch.

And we didn't have any recess unless the teachers on the team decided
to have one. In that case, one person stayed with the kids who were
finishing assignments or who were restricted from recess, and the
other teachers were all out with the kids. We didn't 'cycle' through
it. We all did it.

School got out at 2:30, and we stayed with the kids until about 2:50
(IIRC) at which time all the late bus kids went to the cafeteria. We
could leave at 3:15. There was no time in the school day that we were
not responsible for students and could prepare for the next day,
contact parents, grade papers, etc. other than the 20 minutes before
school, 20 minutes lunch and 25 minutes after school, and one 50
minute planning period.. So some of us got there earlier or stayed
later and worked at home. I would definitely NOT wanted to have bus
duty whether you had sympathy for me or not.


The model I
found worked the best, and implemented at our school was greeters. Greeters
in orange vests (and umbrellas if the weather was bad) would wave cars onto
the curb, open car doors, and grab instruments/backpack/projects while the
kids climbed out. Then the kids could scramble out fast, the driver didn't
need to leave the vehicle to get bulky items from the trunk or free kids
riding in the "way back". If a kid needed two trips to get everything to a
classroom the volunteers would either help carry, or watch the items until
the kid came back for a second trip, so there weren't cars abandoned in the
drop-off while parents ran cupcakes in. Not only were we never run over, we
got nothing but compliments. A smile and an offer to help go a long way in
the early morning drop-off stress.

That's essentially what they do at our school. There are
a few teachers stationed around (entrance/exit to the kiss'n'ride
area, where the cars are stopping, etc.) and the safety patrols
(kids) are the ones that open/close doors and help the kids with
their stuff, if need be. The line moves fast and is very efficient.
If you want to haul a bunch of stuff in, you'd normally park on
the street and walk it in, though if our kiss'n'ride had to
snake along the street, a couple extra safety patrols who could
help run stuff would solve the problem.

Best wishes,
Ericka

grandma Rosalie

Caledonia wrote:

Out of curiousity, are public school busses 'free' (included in the
cost of the school versus paid for like an activity) there?

In Britain, it depends on the child's age and the distance from the
nearest school. If they are under 8yo, you get transport provided
if you live more then 2 miles from the school, but if they are over
8yo, you have to live more then 3 miles from the school before they
get transport.

At my younger kids' school, several children from outlying farms come
by taxi. DS gets to his school on the school bus: although there is
one kid who catches it at his bus stop who has a taxi from her farm.

--
Penny Gaines
UK mum to three

In misc.kids Claire Petersky wrote:
The only time you got a ride from school was when you were sick or
something.

It seems you're not hip unless you're driving your kid 20 miles
to school.

We live in a highly rated school system in San Diego. We're fine
letting our son attend school where he is. Cultural diversity
is fueled by a large research university nearby. It attracts all
types of parents - doctors, researchers, grad students - with an
acute interest in their kid's education.

Plenty of parents ship their kids into this district and incur the
transportation costs of doing that. Some parents even ship their
kids out of the district. Reasons vary from school ratings to
institutional feel to feeling like a number.

I walk my son by the way. It's crazy. People get frustrated and
just do stupid things. Some woman forced her way through a line
of people legally crossing through a crosswalk waving a handicap
placard. I chalk it up to the first few weeks. Things will
settle down.