Intro, and a question, might be long.

Hello, I am Vicki, and I just was searching around for a group with
single parents, and I have a few questions that only another single
parent can answer..;-)...or a lawyer.... but fisrt off,
I hope I won't offend anyone, espeically all of you wonderful Dads who
may be raising your children on your own..;-)

Okay, here is my questions, My STBX, filed for divorce back in Feb (My
state is PA) it was a complete train wreck type of divorce for me, I
mean we had our up and downs, but imo, mostly ups, but he up and file,
and I am home with my Mother in her home, I have a two year old
daughter, who has never been away from me, NEVER..;-) and atually one
of our huge problems was that he never bothered with her, and I was
just so heartbroken, because I was so proud of her (first child) and
waited a long time to have her,..;-) but he has a 16 y/o and a 10 y/o,
and everytime I would ask him ''why don't you ever pick the baby up''?
yada yada yada...he would say, ''oh I have been through the ''baby''
stage 2 times, and it's just no big deal, in other words, seen one,
baby seen them all..well, to my suprise after we split up, he filed for
50/50 shared custody....and my lawyer was so sure that he would NOT
ever get it, he told me that he would get,Wed.nights and everyother
weekends..now in the beginning,she had a really rough time being away
from me even one day,but was always kinda ok with it, but now since
Sept, it has gone into the second faze...meaning that he gets her, wed
night, thur night, friday night, sat night, and sunday till 6pm..now,
come Jan,he will have sunday ''all night'' added on to this...he will
get this everyother week. i'm sure you all heard of it, it's called
the 5-2 schedule...anyways back to my *fisrt and fired* lawyer, he
*promised me* that he would only get what he was getting at the time,
EOWE and Weds.....when it was time for a concielation,my lawyer totally
turned on me,and scared me to death, tell me things like..'' once this
gets to a judge you never know what might happen'' umm, this judge is
new, young, liberal, and she will NEVER rule in your favor....he told
me'' it is the law'' and fatheres have all the rights now a days'' he
had me in tears and I thought I was passing out, he was yelling at me
to ''just sign'' ''nothing is etched in stone'' so I looked up at his
large intimadating body over my shoulders, and I said..'' you mean I
can change this if it does not work, and he said ''yes you can''
so i signed it.

Well. I am trying to make a very long story as short as possible so I
don't lose anyone in my Drama..;lol....but it is NOT working out....as
i said before, she was ''okay'' and atually likes the weekends, but
these 5 day stays are really hard on her,...then Jan one more night
will be added on...*they eased me and my daughter into this* over the
summer and winter...

When he picked her up tonight, she was *screaming* mamamamama, and big
huge tears running down her face, she was begging me to get her out of
his truck, ( he made me put her in) but she knows that she has to go
for that long! she was using every word that is in her little
vocabulary to express herself to me, she was saying...*home home, and
point back at my house, she was screaming mama, and car car, (my car)
she was saying, and pointing,'' inside inside'' my house) she was
desparate...but I could not do one thing...before I put her in the
truck, he (my stbx) grabbed her very cold, and said, ''COME ON THATS
ENOUGH'' and then made me put her in the seat, she cryed the whole way
up the hill for her mommy,

I am fearful that she will remember me walking away from her when she
needed me the most, my EX feels that I should just place her in the
seat and turn and leave....

Well, she is not in daycare or anything, she is in gymnastics, and she
goes to sunday school, so she does not have a separation problem...but
it is too many days from Mom...HE wants to be the mom, he is like that
with all his kids..( 3 different moms too, I might add)

So back in Aug. I hired a new Lawyer and she is a custody Lawyer, and
she felt very strong that she is too small to be away from me *that
long* and she did a motions court, or something...and I guess the judge
said ''nope'' she (the judge) would not sign a special relief, she said
I signed it, live with it...

So my Lawyer said that iho..she would modify, and keep going and
fighting this till she is older, etc. now does anyone know if there is
ever a good outcome? I truely believe my 2 year old is suffering form
this...now that she knows it is for a long time, she no longer wants
to go there...she wont even bring up his name, (and we *stbx* were
having a good relationship) it is civil, so there is NO Dad bashing
behind her back OR infront of her...

I will try to get her to call him on the phone, and she does not want
anything to do with talking...she does that part to me too
though...LOL...

Now, when I go pick her up, she is so happy that she is squeeling, and
it is so loud, she is hugging me so tight, and says...'' home, peese,
home peese''

I wanted him ...no, I begged him to just give me, thur, NIGHTS back and
to stop the Sunday nights from happening, meaning he could still have
her all day on thur, I told him I would pick her up at midnight, just
so it would break up the long stay, and she could sleep in bed with me
that night, and same thing about sunday nights, I told him I will pick
her up as late as he wants, just let her come home...he says NO WAY! no
way EVER!

I don't know why he can't see that she is suffering, even if it is only
a short time, she is very disturbed when she goes....and I have no idea
how she is right now, because he will not call me, answer the phone or
answer my emails...

What can I do?
Anything?

Video tape it? (I could get the whole thing on tape the next
time...??????

get ANOTHER Lawer?

I have no funds left...I work once a week and 3 times a week when she
is with him, I do not work when she is here with me..;-)
but I ''could'' maybe scrape some cash...

what about a free lawyer? are they good? do they fight for you? or
are they just *there*????? how do you obtain them?

Should it cost money to fight for my daughters well being?

Where do I turn?

Is it too late to try to modify the custody order?

I know I won't sleep tonight, thinking about my princess, leaving as
she was screaming for the one person that she knows would never turn
her back on her, and I had to turn it tonight, and the last few weeks
as well...;(

Does anyone have any advice for me....

I have offered him so many different things, IE on the week that he
does get her the long weekend, then let me have her thur night. then on
the week that he does not get her the long weekend, then she stays,
both Wed and Thur, one night really makes a huge difference on how she
reacts to going with him....I was asking for ''hours'' back with her,
not even days, but he is just so dead set..he says NO, and his word
counts!

He has money.....should that matter?
(although he hides it well) according to the IRS he makes 9.00 an
hour..LOL...another post.lol...

does the one with the most money win?
is there *anyway* I could lose her to him?

One thing, I am proud to say is that he has NOTHING on me, nudda, I
don't smoke, drink, no drugs,bars, and never did.... I dont even ever
recall a speeding ticket in my life, I devoted my life to my baby, and
she really appreciates it and he is taking it from her...

I know she needs to be with her Dad too, (that would be worse) i think)
if she didnt have a dad, but this 5 day stretch is doing a number on
her emotionally...

there is so much more, but I will start with this...

Thank you so much for reading this,,,if you made it this far...LOL..

please, any advice will be much appreciated...feel free to contact me
via email as well..;-)
Also, I know this post probably sounds scatter brained, please excuse
me because I have having those horrible visions of my baby begging and
begging me to bring her back in my home..;(

TY,
Vicki....

Vicki,
Hi my name is Bev I hang around here for a few reasons, the people here
are real and quite effective and helpful in giving truthful advice hit
ya between the eys or not it helps you to figure things out!

I am for the most part "a single" parent...... especially when it comes
to not being "together" with the person I live with about my now
"adult" child that has mental health issues and an almost three year
old and another child due in Feb. that lives in the same household.
Long story that really don't belong here.

I have found good advice and I have learned some things about myself
being involved here.

My granddaughter has the 50/50 schedule between my daughter, myself
,my partner, her dad, his mom and his dad. The kids were young 16-17
when the baby was born and their relationship lasted up to the baby was
7 months old. At that time all hell broke lose with my daughter , her
mental health issues came back fullt active and with alarming behaviors
towards "him and his parents"

There was a custody fight to beat all! Not between the kids really , it
was surely between the grandparents.The kids were uh 17 years old! We
live in Pa. as well. We had a legal aide lawyer and she was superb!
They were going for full custody of our granddaughter and used my
daughters mental health the whole way to try and take her child from
her. This made me very angry and I fought for my daughters rights and
we managed to hold on to a 50/50 decision with my daughter being
supervised during the babies stay with us, until her pschologist feels
she is ready for this restriction to be lifted.

I just wanted to give you a brief background before getting into how
this change effected my granddaughter in the beginning. J had lived
with us full time the whole time prior. The dads parents took the baby
every other weekend prior to the 50/50. The dad and mom were more
worried about themselves then the baby for a while and so we all as
grandparents stood up and made sure the baby got what she needed
emotionally .

Our 50/50 schedule was originally presented to us by the judge as a Sun
5 p.m. to Sun 5 p.m. deal, they did not prove their case for taking
full custody to the judge! My daughter burst out crying that it was too
long for her to be away . I suggested an overnight in the middle of the
week, wed at noon until thurs at 9 p.m. and the judge and they agreed
to it, so that is what we have. So you see from Sun at 5 p.m. to wed at
noon and then thurs night at 9 p.m. til Sunday at 5 p.m. So Sun to wed
is a three night twoish day period and then Thur nite at 9 p.m. to Sun
night at 5p.m. is a three night threeish day period. This is done
opposite each week so everyother week the wed to thurs is theirs etc. I
can not reccomend a better schedule considering the ability to make it
less periods of time for seperation between the baby and both parents!
Maybe you can be happy with this and I know there was still an
adjustment period for my granddaughter but with constant explaining of
how daddy and pop and mimi love you too and they want to see you and
have fun with you too finally has settled in for J. Although she still
at times verbalizes not wanting to go , but to ask them she does the
same thing to them ! LOL! It was a hard adjustment for all of us ...I
must admit though now I enjoy the me time !

Ummm we cant really safely divulge more info about each others area
well actually I am in Northampton county and I highly recommend the
legal aide department which is located in Bethlehem Pa. If you are not
in this county then look up the legal aide office in the county you are
in and schedule an appt.Tell them the issues you have with the custody
arrangement and if you think our schedule could work for you suggest it
to be looked at by the Judge or maybe even your EX will be able to
think of the baby more than himself and see how much better this
schedule is for her emotionally, and avoid all the bullcrap and just
have it written up and changed through the lawyers. My granddaughters
life was changed this way at the same age as your daughter 2 years old
! She will be three in Dec and she made it through rather well . Dont
give up on what you strongly believe is better for her emotional
health. I especially feel this way because you said "he" did not pay
her any attention prior to the split so he is a stranger to her.
Another thing, did you know he is responsible for paying you child
support even in a 50/50 in this state? They take both incomes and
average out an amount that the parent that makes less gets ,so that the
childs both homes are considered equal opportunity for the child !
Isn't that wonderful :-) yeah!

I am wondering ...what is he doing with the child while he works? and
maybe this is a direction you can go to have her with you some more
time....such as rather than daycare or some one else other than he or
you spending this time with your child it be you ! Makes sense to
me.......since I guess at this point you have the time if you are not
working full time and you are being helped by your parents you have
options and offers to make him . Apparently he likes the power he has.
Too bad this so often happens in breakups and the children suffer the
most truly. If all parents put what is best for the children first the
world would be a much better place I think.

Well I am gonna end this reply for now I need my coffee!
Bev

Vivki, I would start by trying to get a child psychologist to give you
some information about what this kind of trauma is like for a baby. My
son is 3.5 and a child psychologist said he was absolutely not to go to
Paris to be with his father for Christmas this year, that what he
needed most of all right now is stability with a primary parent, and
unlimited visits with the father, an occasional overnight, but NOT
long-term separation from his mama.

I respectfully disagree with the poster who says your child will not
remember this. If you've ever watched your kid memorize the words to
her favorite song after hearing it five times, you'll know that a
child's capacity for memory is enormous. And emotional trauma takes its
toll. Your two year old is too young to be separate from you for more
than a night, perhaps two if she's ok with it.

No parent should ever force a child to do something like this. Your ex
is shooting himself in the foot on this one. She will not attach to
him, learn to trust him, or enjoy him. Her emotional bond with him will
be one of pain.

You can set your child up for some sense of security while she is with
you. Talk to her a few hours before she leaves for her father's about
how you imagine it must feel for her. 'Hey, boo, is it scary to leave
mama's even though you get to go to your papa's house for a little bit?
I bet you must be worried that you won't see mama again when you leave
my house. But I'm always here, and I'll be right here waiting for you
to get back. You can ask papa to call me so you can see for yourself
that mama's at home waiting for you.' Reassure her that you love her,
and that you will be there for her when she comes home. Ask your ex
what activities he has planned for her while she is with him, so you
can talk to her about specific, fun things she'll get to do. If she has
a favorite stuffed animal, sleep with it or wear it under your shirt
for a while before she goes. She will smell your scent on her lovey and
hopefully be comforted.

Find another lawyer, and tell that lawyer that you felt you were
pressured into signing, that the documents you signed you signed under
duress. Do some research on the old lawyer who intimidated him. Talk to
the Bar Association in your county/state and see if there is anything
you can do with regards to your treatment. See if there are any other
compaints against him. Talk to your state welfare/women and children
program and see if they can steer you to affordable legal care.

If you have proof of the income your ex is hiding, bring this to your
attorney. You should have alimony as well as child support. You can
discuss with the lawyer how to get funds from your ex to pay for legal
expenses. Any lawyer you talk to should give you a preliminary
consultation of at least a half hour for free, and you can ask
questions like these and get a feel for the lawyer herself or himself.

Good luck!



Vicki wrote:
Hello, I am Vicki, and I just was searching around for a group with
single parents, and I have a few questions that only another single
parent can answer..;-)...or a lawyer.... but fisrt off,
I hope I won't offend anyone, espeically all of you wonderful Dads who
may be raising your children on your own..;-)

Okay, here is my questions, My STBX, filed for divorce back in Feb (My
state is PA) it was a complete train wreck type of divorce for me, I
mean we had our up and downs, but imo, mostly ups, but he up and file,
and I am home with my Mother in her home, I have a two year old
daughter, who has never been away from me, NEVER..;-) and atually one
of our huge problems was that he never bothered with her, and I was
just so heartbroken, because I was so proud of her (first child) and
waited a long time to have her,..;-) but he has a 16 y/o and a 10 y/o,
and everytime I would ask him ''why don't you ever pick the baby up''?
yada yada yada...he would say, ''oh I have been through the ''baby''
stage 2 times, and it's just no big deal, in other words, seen one,
baby seen them all..well, to my suprise after we split up, he filed for
50/50 shared custody....and my lawyer was so sure that he would NOT
ever get it, he told me that he would get,Wed.nights and everyother
weekends..now in the beginning,she had a really rough time being away
from me even one day,but was always kinda ok with it, but now since
Sept, it has gone into the second faze...meaning that he gets her, wed
night, thur night, friday night, sat night, and sunday till 6pm..now,
come Jan,he will have sunday ''all night'' added on to this...he will
get this everyother week. i'm sure you all heard of it, it's called
the 5-2 schedule...anyways back to my *fisrt and fired* lawyer, he
*promised me* that he would only get what he was getting at the time,
EOWE and Weds.....when it was time for a concielation,my lawyer totally
turned on me,and scared me to death, tell me things like..'' once this
gets to a judge you never know what might happen'' umm, this judge is
new, young, liberal, and she will NEVER rule in your favor....he told
me'' it is the law'' and fatheres have all the rights now a days'' he
had me in tears and I thought I was passing out, he was yelling at me
to ''just sign'' ''nothing is etched in stone'' so I looked up at his
large intimadating body over my shoulders, and I said..'' you mean I
can change this if it does not work, and he said ''yes you can''
so i signed it.

Well. I am trying to make a very long story as short as possible so I
don't lose anyone in my Drama..;lol....but it is NOT working out....as
i said before, she was ''okay'' and atually likes the weekends, but
these 5 day stays are really hard on her,...then Jan one more night
will be added on...*they eased me and my daughter into this* over the
summer and winter...

When he picked her up tonight, she was *screaming* mamamamama, and big
huge tears running down her face, she was begging me to get her out of
his truck, ( he made me put her in) but she knows that she has to go
for that long! she was using every word that is in her little
vocabulary to express herself to me, she was saying...*home home, and
point back at my house, she was screaming mama, and car car, (my car)
she was saying, and pointing,'' inside inside'' my house) she was
desparate...but I could not do one thing...before I put her in the
truck, he (my stbx) grabbed her very cold, and said, ''COME ON THATS
ENOUGH'' and then made me put her in the seat, she cryed the whole way
up the hill for her mommy,

I am fearful that she will remember me walking away from her when she
needed me the most, my EX feels that I should just place her in the
seat and turn and leave....

Well, she is not in daycare or anything, she is in gymnastics, and she
goes to sunday school, so she does not have a separation problem...but
it is too many days from Mom...HE wants to be the mom, he is like that
with all his kids..( 3 different moms too, I might add)

So back in Aug. I hired a new Lawyer and she is a custody Lawyer, and
she felt very strong that she is too small to be away from me *that
long* and she did a motions court, or something...and I guess the judge
said ''nope'' she (the judge) would not sign a special relief, she said
I signed it, live with it...

So my Lawyer said that iho..she would modify, and keep going and
fighting this till she is older, etc. now does anyone know if there is
ever a good outcome? I truely believe my 2 year old is suffering form
this...now that she knows it is for a long time, she no longer wants
to go there...she wont even bring up his name, (and we *stbx* were
having a good relationship) it is civil, so there is NO Dad bashing
behind her back OR infront of her...

I will try to get her to call him on the phone, and she does not want
anything to do with talking...she does that part to me too
though...LOL...

Now, when I go pick her up, she is so happy that she is squeeling, and
it is so loud, she is hugging me so tight, and says...'' home, peese,
home peese''

I wanted him ...no, I begged him to just give me, thur, NIGHTS back and
to stop the Sunday nights from happening, meaning he could still have
her all day on thur, I told him I would pick her up at midnight, just
so it would break up the long stay, and she could sleep in bed with me
that night, and same thing about sunday nights, I told him I will pick
her up as late as he wants, just let her come home...he says NO WAY! no
way EVER!

I don't know why he can't see that she is suffering, even if it is only
a short time, she is very disturbed when she goes....and I have no idea
how she is right now, because he will not call me, answer the phone or
answer my emails...

What can I do?
Anything?

Video tape it? (I could get the whole thing on tape the next
time...??????

get ANOTHER Lawer?

I have no funds left...I work once a week and 3 times a week when she
is with him, I do not work when she is here with me..;-)
but I ''could'' maybe scrape some cash...

what about a free lawyer? are they good? do they fight for you? or
are they just *there*????? how do you obtain them?

Should it cost money to fight for my daughters well being?

Where do I turn?

Is it too late to try to modify the custody order?

I know I won't sleep tonight, thinking about my princess, leaving as
she was screaming for the one person that she knows would never turn
her back on her, and I had to turn it tonight, and the last few weeks
as well...;(

Does anyone have any advice for me....

I have offered him so many different things, IE on the week that he
does get her the long weekend, then let me have her thur night. then on
the week that he does not get her the long weekend, then she stays,
both Wed and Thur, one night really makes a huge difference on how she
reacts to going with him....I was asking for ''hours'' back with her,
not even days, but he is just so dead set..he says NO, and his word
counts!

He has money.....should that matter?
(although he hides it well) according to the IRS he makes 9.00 an
hour..LOL...another post.lol...

does the one with the most money win?
is there *anyway* I could lose her to him?

One thing, I am proud to say is that he has NOTHING on me, nudda, I
don't smoke, drink, no drugs,bars, and never did.... I dont even ever
recall a speeding ticket in my life, I devoted my life to my baby, and
she really appreciates it and he is taking it from her...

I know she needs to be with her Dad too, (that would be worse) i think)
if she didnt have a dad, but this 5 day stretch is doing a number on
her emotionally...

there is so much more, but I will start with this...

Thank you so much for reading this,,,if you made it this far...LOL..

please, any advice will be much appreciated...feel free to contact me
via email as well..;-)
Also, I know this post probably sounds scatter brained, please excuse
me because I have having those horrible visions of my baby begging and
begging me to bring her back in my home..;(

TY,
Vicki....

DCMama wrote:
Vivki, I would start by trying to get a child psychologist to give you
some information about what this kind of trauma is like for a baby. My
son is 3.5 and a child psychologist said he was absolutely not to go to
Paris to be with his father for Christmas this year, that what he
needed most of all right now is stability with a primary parent, and
unlimited visits with the father, an occasional overnight, but NOT
long-term separation from his mama.

Hello ...I am not Vicki and I hope you dont mind my two cents on what
you are writing here.

I am shocked that any child psychologist would ever say such a thing to
anyone.
Spending time with ones parents both mother and father does not sound
to me to be a "Trauma" I think it is more of a "Trauma" for *you* that
your 3 1/2 year old be in Paris for Christmas!

In todays world the" traditional family" is far and few. What young
children NEED is both parents showing a united front . Together sharing
in what is best for the children no matter where each one resides. What
is this "primary parent" you speak of? Are you refering to one parent
being more important than the other? I hope not!

Times are changing and have been for quite some time now, Mama is not
always the childs strongest attachment. It may be Dad or Gramma or
Grampa .

There is no way I can believe a professional to claim these things to
be what is best for ALL children.

I respectfully disagree with the poster who says your child will not
remember this. If you've ever watched your kid memorize the words to
her favorite song after hearing it five times, you'll know that a
child's capacity for memory is enormous. And emotional trauma takes its
toll. Your two year old is too young to be separate from you for more
than a night, perhaps two if she's ok with it.

Puleeze , may I ask you to list all your memories of when you were
2,3,4 ?
Memorising is a total different concept than memory or remembering!

No parent should ever force a child to do something like this. Your ex
is shooting himself in the foot on this one. She will not attach to
him, learn to trust him, or enjoy him. Her emotional bond with him will
be one of pain.

The child needs to have both her mother and father equally involved in
her life, all kids do!
The drama and trauma is fed to a child through us. If we take the time
to discuss the concept of what is happening to a child even as young as
2 and 3 years of age they will understand . A part of teaching our
children needs to be that we all accept that sometimes we have to do
things that may not be exactly what we think we want to do at that
particular time but it is a part of our lives and a responsibility to
do these things. If we make this arrangement a fun activity the child
will learn to enjoy rather than dread it.......




You can set your child up for some sense of security while she is with
you. Talk to her a few hours before she leaves for her father's about
how you imagine it must feel for her. 'Hey, boo, is it scary to leave
mama's even though you get to go to your papa's house for a little bit?
I bet you must be worried that you won't see mama again when you leave
my house. But I'm always here, and I'll be right here waiting for you
to get back. You can ask papa to call me so you can see for yourself
that mama's at home waiting for you.' Reassure her that you love her,
and that you will be there for her when she comes home. Ask your ex
what activities he has planned for her while she is with him, so you
can talk to her about specific, fun things she'll get to do. If she has
a favorite stuffed animal, sleep with it or wear it under your shirt
for a while before she goes. She will smell your scent on her lovey and
hopefully be comforted.

I dont agree........I think with a child as young as 2 and 3 all that
really needs to be supported is that the child is loved by the other
parent and that the other parent misses them and wants to spend a
little time with them as well. It will be fun and exciting to have two
homes and two bedrooms and two different sets of toys to look forward
to and getting to play with on each visit. Reasuring that it is only a
couple days and you will call in a day or so to talk about all the fun
things that are happening while the child is at dads or moms house.
Rather than call out the spooks with a child so young you have to bring
out the positives ............

Find another lawyer, and tell that lawyer that you felt you were
pressured into signing, that the documents you signed you signed under
duress. Do some research on the old lawyer who intimidated him. Talk to
the Bar Association in your county/state and see if there is anything
you can do with regards to your treatment. See if there are any other
compaints against him. Talk to your state welfare/women and children
program and see if they can steer you to affordable legal care.

If you have proof of the income your ex is hiding, bring this to your
attorney. You should have alimony as well as child support. You can
discuss with the lawyer how to get funds from your ex to pay for legal
expenses. Any lawyer you talk to should give you a preliminary
consultation of at least a half hour for free, and you can ask
questions like these and get a feel for the lawyer herself or himself.

Good luck!

Sounds like good, accurate legal advice. It is a shame though, that
more people dont slow the heck down and stop all the madness all the
money wasting in the court system having strangers make decisions about
what they are doing with thier children , letting others make final
decisions for them and giving them your money that you could be using
to raise your kids, or help them to attend college one day ! I can
remember the parenting class we all had to attend where the woman
giving the class said please all of you if there is any way you can all
sit down and come to an amicable agreement among yourselves and keep
the court system out of your personal lives with your children do so !
In the end you may spend $20,000.00 to not get what you wanted in the
first place ! What a waste !

So yea just my 2 cents.....kind of been here already! living it on a
daily basis............
Bev


Vicki wrote:
Hello, I am Vicki, and I just was searching around for a group with
single parents, and I have a few questions that only another single
parent can answer..;-)...or a lawyer.... but fisrt off,
I hope I won't offend anyone, espeically all of you wonderful Dads who
may be raising your children on your own..;-)

Okay, here is my questions, My STBX, filed for divorce back in Feb (My
state is PA) it was a complete train wreck type of divorce for me, I
mean we had our up and downs, but imo, mostly ups, but he up and file,
and I am home with my Mother in her home, I have a two year old
daughter, who has never been away from me, NEVER..;-) and atually one
of our huge problems was that he never bothered with her, and I was
just so heartbroken, because I was so proud of her (first child) and
waited a long time to have her,..;-) but he has a 16 y/o and a 10 y/o,
and everytime I would ask him ''why don't you ever pick the baby up''?
yada yada yada...he would say, ''oh I have been through the ''baby''
stage 2 times, and it's just no big deal, in other words, seen one,
baby seen them all..well, to my suprise after we split up, he filed for
50/50 shared custody....and my lawyer was so sure that he would NOT
ever get it, he told me that he would get,Wed.nights and everyother
weekends..now in the beginning,she had a really rough time being away
from me even one day,but was always kinda ok with it, but now since
Sept, it has gone into the second faze...meaning that he gets her, wed
night, thur night, friday night, sat night, and sunday till 6pm..now,
come Jan,he will have sunday ''all night'' added on to this...he will
get this everyother week. i'm sure you all heard of it, it's called
the 5-2 schedule...anyways back to my *fisrt and fired* lawyer, he
*promised me* that he would only get what he was getting at the time,
EOWE and Weds.....when it was time for a concielation,my lawyer totally
turned on me,and scared me to death, tell me things like..'' once this
gets to a judge you never know what might happen'' umm, this judge is
new, young, liberal, and she will NEVER rule in your favor....he told
me'' it is the law'' and fatheres have all the rights now a days'' he
had me in tears and I thought I was passing out, he was yelling at me
to ''just sign'' ''nothing is etched in stone'' so I looked up at his
large intimadating body over my shoulders, and I said..'' you mean I
can change this if it does not work, and he said ''yes you can''
so i signed it.

Well. I am trying to make a very long story as short as possible so I
don't lose anyone in my Drama..;lol....but it is NOT working out....as
i said before, she was ''okay'' and atually likes the weekends, but
these 5 day stays are really hard on her,...then Jan one more night
will be added on...*they eased me and my daughter into this* over the
summer and winter...

When he picked her up tonight, she was *screaming* mamamamama, and big
huge tears running down her face, she was begging me to get her out of
his truck, ( he made me put her in) but she knows that she has to go
for that long! she was using every word that is in her little
vocabulary to express herself to me, she was saying...*home home, and
point back at my house, she was screaming mama, and car car, (my car)
she was saying, and pointing,'' inside inside'' my house) she was
desparate...but I could not do one thing...before I put her in the
truck, he (my stbx) grabbed her very cold, and said, ''COME ON THATS
ENOUGH'' and then made me put her in the seat, she cryed the whole way
up the hill for her mommy,

I am fearful that she will remember me walking away from her when she
needed me the most, my EX feels that I should just place her in the
seat and turn and leave....

Well, she is not in daycare or anything, she is in gymnastics, and she
goes to sunday school, so she does not have a separation problem...but
it is too many days from Mom...HE wants to be the mom, he is like that
with all his kids..( 3 different moms too, I might add)

So back in Aug. I hired a new Lawyer and she is a custody Lawyer, and
she felt very strong that she is too small to be away from me *that
long* and she did a motions court, or something...and I guess the judge
said ''nope'' she (the judge) would not sign a special relief, she said
I signed it, live with it...

So my Lawyer said that iho..she would modify, and keep going and
fighting this till she is older, etc. now does anyone know if there is
ever a good outcome? I truely believe my 2 year old is suffering form
this...now that she knows it is for a long time, she no longer wants
to go there...she wont even bring up his name, (and we *stbx* were
having a good relationship) it is civil, so there is NO Dad bashing
behind her back OR infront of her...

I will try to get her to call him on the phone, and she does not want
anything to do with talking...she does that part to me too
though...LOL...

Now, when I go pick her up, she is so happy that she is squeeling, and
it is so loud, she is hugging me so tight, and says...'' home, peese,
home peese''

I wanted him ...no, I begged him to just give me, thur, NIGHTS back and
to stop the Sunday nights from happening, meaning he could still have
her all day on thur, I told him I would pick her up at midnight, just
so it would break up the long stay, and she could sleep in bed with me
that night, and same thing about sunday nights, I told him I will pick
her up as late as he wants, just let her come home...he says NO WAY! no
way EVER!

I don't know why he can't see that she is suffering, even if it is only
a short time, she is very disturbed when she goes....and I have no idea
how she is right now, because he will not call me, answer the phone or
answer my emails...

What can I do?
Anything?

Video tape it? (I could get the whole thing on tape the next
time...??????

get ANOTHER Lawer?

I have no funds left...I work once a week and 3 times a week when she
is with him, I do not work when she is here with me..;-)
but I ''could'' maybe scrape some cash...

what about a free lawyer? are they good? do they fight for you? or
are they just *there*????? how do you obtain them?

Should it cost money to fight for my daughters well being?

Where do I turn?

Is it too late to try to modify the custody order?

I know I won't sleep tonight, thinking about my princess, leaving as
she was screaming for the one person that she knows would never turn
her back on her, and I had to turn it tonight, and the last few weeks
as well...;(

Does anyone have any advice for me....

I have offered him so many different things, IE on the week that he
does get her the long weekend, then let me have her thur night. then on
the week that he does not get her the long weekend, then she stays,
both Wed and Thur, one night really makes a huge difference on how she
reacts to going with him....I was asking for ''hours'' back with her,
not even days, but he is just so dead set..he says NO, and his word
counts!

He has money.....should that matter?
(although he hides it well) according to the IRS he makes 9.00 an
hour..LOL...another post.lol...

does the one with the most money win?
is there *anyway* I could lose her to him?

One thing, I am proud to say is that he has NOTHING on me, nudda, I
don't smoke, drink, no drugs,bars, and never did.... I dont even ever
recall a speeding ticket in my life, I devoted my life to my baby, and
she really appreciates it and he is taking it from her...

I know she needs to be with her Dad too, (that would be worse) i think)
if she didnt have a dad, but this 5 day stretch is doing a number on
her emotionally...

there is so much more, but I will start with this...

Thank you so much for reading this,,,if you made it this far...LOL..

please, any advice will be much appreciated...feel free to contact me
via email as well..;-)
Also, I know this post probably sounds scatter brained, please excuse
me because I have having those horrible visions of my baby begging and
begging me to bring her back in my home..;(

TY,
Vicki....

Hello, And thanks for getting back to me, any advice is much
appreciated..;-)

I want and *am* going to make an appointment asap with a child
psychologist, I am hoping they can help me...

I can't stress enough that I am not trying in anyway to keep her from
her dad, but I just want him to see that she needs just one night (back
with me, to break up that long stay) Honestly I would like the EOWE and
WED's till she is older but he will not budge one hour...

someone asked what he does for work, well, he is a self employeed CPA,
from his home..
so that is another merrit i thought he had for him...almost like a
SAHD....but NOW that I see how she is reacting when he picks her up, it
is just Horrible...I might add that he tell the goverment that he makes
9.00 per hour....lmao.

someone aslo said that when they are small, they react when they come
back home, OMG! i was able to catch it on video, she is used to be
horrible when she returned, and this was just last month, she would
hang on my, cry, and beg and beg me to just hold her, I could not put
her down to even step into the bathroom, she acted like she had been
through boot camp, then after about an hour she would be ok, she would
see me putting on my night clothes and hers too, so she knew she was
sleeping with me, ( we co-sleep) now she is ok when she returns just
EXTREMELY happy to be home, but now it is reversed, she is doing
horrible when he comes for her.

His other kids, one he has 50/50 ( because he told me that the Mother
is on drugs, and that is why she agreed to 50/50 (the mom) because she
is a druggie...and was afraid of him going for full custody..so she
signed it, 7 years ago, the 16 y/o is an EOWE child, and the EOWE child
is way more stable, she knows where to call home, she has her room,
school, friends, she is way more stable, IMHO.

My Daughter is very smart (like all of our kids) LOL...but she does
remember FAST! and that is what I fear, her remembering her mom turning
her back on her..;(

She remembers things that I didnt expect her to even hear...lol...

It breaks my heart, I am unable to get the thought of her little face,
all red with huge tears, screaming...... mamamamama..........., up the
hill... then I have to walk away from her, it's just not fair....(to
either of us)

he does have a good relationship with his kids,

but at this point, I just feel that she is just too little to be away
from me that long..;(
see, the 10y/o, has a mom on drugs and she drinks A LOT, bars and all,
so when her daughter goes with her dad it is PARTY TIME....she enjoys
her time away from her child....me on the other hand, suffer without
her, and her me..;(

I just need to know if anyone would know if there is a chance to modify
this aggreement, even just a few nights a month, as I said, just to
break it up some....

thanks so much for reading my problems..;(



DCMama wrote:
Vivki, I would start by trying to get a child psychologist to give you
some information about what this kind of trauma is like for a baby. My
son is 3.5 and a child psychologist said he was absolutely not to go to
Paris to be with his father for Christmas this year, that what he
needed most of all right now is stability with a primary parent, and
unlimited visits with the father, an occasional overnight, but NOT
long-term separation from his mama.

I respectfully disagree with the poster who says your child will not
remember this. If you've ever watched your kid memorize the words to
her favorite song after hearing it five times, you'll know that a
child's capacity for memory is enormous. And emotional trauma takes its
toll. Your two year old is too young to be separate from you for more
than a night, perhaps two if she's ok with it.

No parent should ever force a child to do something like this. Your ex
is shooting himself in the foot on this one. She will not attach to
him, learn to trust him, or enjoy him. Her emotional bond with him will
be one of pain.

You can set your child up for some sense of security while she is with
you. Talk to her a few hours before she leaves for her father's about
how you imagine it must feel for her. 'Hey, boo, is it scary to leave
mama's even though you get to go to your papa's house for a little bit?
I bet you must be worried that you won't see mama again when you leave
my house. But I'm always here, and I'll be right here waiting for you
to get back. You can ask papa to call me so you can see for yourself
that mama's at home waiting for you.' Reassure her that you love her,
and that you will be there for her when she comes home. Ask your ex
what activities he has planned for her while she is with him, so you
can talk to her about specific, fun things she'll get to do. If she has
a favorite stuffed animal, sleep with it or wear it under your shirt
for a while before she goes. She will smell your scent on her lovey and
hopefully be comforted.

Find another lawyer, and tell that lawyer that you felt you were
pressured into signing, that the documents you signed you signed under
duress. Do some research on the old lawyer who intimidated him. Talk to
the Bar Association in your county/state and see if there is anything
you can do with regards to your treatment. See if there are any other
compaints against him. Talk to your state welfare/women and children
program and see if they can steer you to affordable legal care.

If you have proof of the income your ex is hiding, bring this to your
attorney. You should have alimony as well as child support. You can
discuss with the lawyer how to get funds from your ex to pay for legal
expenses. Any lawyer you talk to should give you a preliminary
consultation of at least a half hour for free, and you can ask
questions like these and get a feel for the lawyer herself or himself.

Good luck!



Vicki wrote:
Hello, I am Vicki, and I just was searching around for a group with
single parents, and I have a few questions that only another single
parent can answer..;-)...or a lawyer.... but fisrt off,
I hope I won't offend anyone, espeically all of you wonderful Dads who
may be raising your children on your own..;-)

Okay, here is my questions, My STBX, filed for divorce back in Feb (My
state is PA) it was a complete train wreck type of divorce for me, I
mean we had our up and downs, but imo, mostly ups, but he up and file,
and I am home with my Mother in her home, I have a two year old
daughter, who has never been away from me, NEVER..;-) and atually one
of our huge problems was that he never bothered with her, and I was
just so heartbroken, because I was so proud of her (first child) and
waited a long time to have her,..;-) but he has a 16 y/o and a 10 y/o,
and everytime I would ask him ''why don't you ever pick the baby up''?
yada yada yada...he would say, ''oh I have been through the ''baby''
stage 2 times, and it's just no big deal, in other words, seen one,
baby seen them all..well, to my suprise after we split up, he filed for
50/50 shared custody....and my lawyer was so sure that he would NOT
ever get it, he told me that he would get,Wed.nights and everyother
weekends..now in the beginning,she had a really rough time being away
from me even one day,but was always kinda ok with it, but now since
Sept, it has gone into the second faze...meaning that he gets her, wed
night, thur night, friday night, sat night, and sunday till 6pm..now,
come Jan,he will have sunday ''all night'' added on to this...he will
get this everyother week. i'm sure you all heard of it, it's called
the 5-2 schedule...anyways back to my *fisrt and fired* lawyer, he
*promised me* that he would only get what he was getting at the time,
EOWE and Weds.....when it was time for a concielation,my lawyer totally
turned on me,and scared me to death, tell me things like..'' once this
gets to a judge you never know what might happen'' umm, this judge is
new, young, liberal, and she will NEVER rule in your favor....he told
me'' it is the law'' and fatheres have all the rights now a days'' he
had me in tears and I thought I was passing out, he was yelling at me
to ''just sign'' ''nothing is etched in stone'' so I looked up at his
large intimadating body over my shoulders, and I said..'' you mean I
can change this if it does not work, and he said ''yes you can''
so i signed it.

Well. I am trying to make a very long story as short as possible so I
don't lose anyone in my Drama..;lol....but it is NOT working out....as
i said before, she was ''okay'' and atually likes the weekends, but
these 5 day stays are really hard on her,...then Jan one more night
will be added on...*they eased me and my daughter into this* over the
summer and winter...

When he picked her up tonight, she was *screaming* mamamamama, and big
huge tears running down her face, she was begging me to get her out of
his truck, ( he made me put her in) but she knows that she has to go
for that long! she was using every word that is in her little
vocabulary to express herself to me, she was saying...*home home, and
point back at my house, she was screaming mama, and car car, (my car)
she was saying, and pointing,'' inside inside'' my house) she was
desparate...but I could not do one thing...before I put her in the
truck, he (my stbx) grabbed her very cold, and said, ''COME ON THATS
ENOUGH'' and then made me put her in the seat, she cryed the whole way
up the hill for her mommy,

I am fearful that she will remember me walking away from her when she
needed me the most, my EX feels that I should just place her in the
seat and turn and leave....

Well, she is not in daycare or anything, she is in gymnastics, and she
goes to sunday school, so she does not have a separation problem...but
it is too many days from Mom...HE wants to be the mom, he is like that
with all his kids..( 3 different moms too, I might add)

So back in Aug. I hired a new Lawyer and she is a custody Lawyer, and
she felt very strong that she is too small to be away from me *that
long* and she did a motions court, or something...and I guess the judge
said ''nope'' she (the judge) would not sign a special relief, she said
I signed it, live with it...

So my Lawyer said that iho..she would modify, and keep going and
fighting this till she is older, etc. now does anyone know if there is
ever a good outcome? I truely believe my 2 year old is suffering form
this...now that she knows it is for a long time, she no longer wants
to go there...she wont even bring up his name, (and we *stbx* were
having a good relationship) it is civil, so there is NO Dad bashing
behind her back OR infront of her...

I will try to get her to call him on the phone, and she does not want
anything to do with talking...she does that part to me too
though...LOL...

Now, when I go pick her up, she is so happy that she is squeeling, and
it is so loud, she is hugging me so tight, and says...'' home, peese,
home peese''

I wanted him ...no, I begged him to just give me, thur, NIGHTS back and
to stop the Sunday nights from happening, meaning he could still have
her all day on thur, I told him I would pick her up at midnight, just
so it would break up the long stay, and she could sleep in bed with me
that night, and same thing about sunday nights, I told him I will pick
her up as late as he wants, just let her come home...he says NO WAY! no
way EVER!

I don't know why he can't see that she is suffering, even if it is only
a short time, she is very disturbed when she goes....and I have no idea
how she is right now, because he will not call me, answer the phone or
answer my emails...

What can I do?
Anything?

Video tape it? (I could get the whole thing on tape the next
time...??????

get ANOTHER Lawer?

I have no funds left...I work once a week and 3 times a week when she
is with him, I do not work when she is here with me..;-)
but I ''could'' maybe scrape some cash...

what about a free lawyer? are they good? do they fight for you? or
are they just *there*????? how do you obtain them?

Should it cost money to fight for my daughters well being?

Where do I turn?

Is it too late to try to modify the custody order?

I know I won't sleep tonight, thinking about my princess, leaving as
she was screaming for the one person that she knows would never turn
her back on her, and I had to turn it tonight, and the last few weeks
as well...;(

Does anyone have any advice for me....

I have offered him so many different things, IE on the week that he
does get her the long weekend, then let me have her thur night. then on
the week that he does not get her the long weekend, then she stays,
both Wed and Thur, one night really makes a huge difference on how she
reacts to going with him....I was asking for ''hours'' back with her,
not even days, but he is just so dead set..he says NO, and his word
counts!

He has money.....should that matter?
(although he hides it well) according to the IRS he makes 9.00 an
hour..LOL...another post.lol...

does the one with the most money win?
is there *anyway* I could lose her to him?

One thing, I am proud to say is that he has NOTHING on me, nudda, I
don't smoke, drink, no drugs,bars, and never did.... I dont even ever
recall a speeding ticket in my life, I devoted my life to my baby, and
she really appreciates it and he is taking it from her...

I know she needs to be with her Dad too, (that would be worse) i think)
if she didnt have a dad, but this 5 day stretch is doing a number on
her emotionally...

there is so much more, but I will start with this...

Thank you so much for reading this,,,if you made it this far...LOL..

please, any advice will be much appreciated...feel free to contact me
via email as well..;-)
Also, I know this post probably sounds scatter brained, please excuse
me because I have having those horrible visions of my baby begging and
begging me to bring her back in my home..;(

TY,
Vicki....

"Vicki" wrote in message
ups.com...
snipped
My Daughter is very smart (like all of our kids) LOL...but she does
remember FAST! and that is what I fear, her remembering her mom turning
her back on her..;(

Or her mom forcing her dad to turn his back on her?
Or her mom encouraging anything but a relationship with her dad?

She remembers things that I didnt expect her to even hear...lol...

It breaks my heart, I am unable to get the thought of her little face,
all red with huge tears, screaming...... mamamamama..........., up the
hill... then I have to walk away from her, it's just not fair....(to
either of us)

he does have a good relationship with his kids,

but at this point, I just feel that she is just too little to be away
from me that long..;(
see, the 10y/o, has a mom on drugs and she drinks A LOT, bars and all,
so when her daughter goes with her dad it is PARTY TIME....she enjoys
her time away from her child....me on the other hand, suffer without
her, and her me..;(

I just need to know if anyone would know if there is a chance to modify
this aggreement, even just a few nights a month, as I said, just to
break it up some....

Maybe try something like alt.support.divorce or alt.child-support

thanks so much for reading my problems..;(

"DCMama" wrote in message
s.com...
Vivki, I would start by trying to get a child psychologist to give you
some information about what this kind of trauma is like for a baby. My
son is 3.5 and a child psychologist said he was absolutely not to go to
Paris to be with his father for Christmas this year, that what he
needed most of all right now is stability with a primary parent, and
unlimited visits with the father, an occasional overnight, but NOT
long-term separation from his mama.

Hm... Long term separation from his precious mama 'cause poor daddy isn't
important?

I respectfully disagree with the poster who says your child will not
remember this. If you've ever watched your kid memorize the words to
her favorite song after hearing it five times, you'll know that a
child's capacity for memory is enormous. And emotional trauma takes its
toll. Your two year old is too young to be separate from you for more
than a night, perhaps two if she's ok with it.

What on earth are you talking about?
B had a book, "Now We Can Go" memorized by the time he was about 2, maybe 2
and a half. I found that book hidden in the back of his book shelf maybe a
year or so ago (he'll be 6 in January) and he didn't remember a darn thing
of that book, yet the last time we picked up that book was probably a year
before. So, by the time he was 2ish, he had the book memorized from me
reading it over and over, we read it until about 2 years ago, until he was
about 4, 'lost it' for about a year and found it again when he was about 5
(as he is nearly 6)
At 2 years of age, why would she be way too young to be separated from Mom
for more than a night but can be separated from Dad for a week? (or whatever
the case may be)
I'm such a horrible person... When B was about 6 months old, I took a road
trip with 3 friends for the weekend - we left on a Friday afternoon and came
back very late on Sunday night. That was about 2 and a half days that I
left him with my parents to go and do my own thing. I also left him 2
summers ago with my aunt and uncle to go nearly a week to Vegas with my mom.
He was 3 and a half. My poor son must be sooo traumatized.

No parent should ever force a child to do something like this. Your ex
is shooting himself in the foot on this one. She will not attach to
him, learn to trust him, or enjoy him. Her emotional bond with him will
be one of pain.

That depends on how both sides (by that I mean both parents) act and react
to this. If going with Daddy is going to be a good thing - which it should
be - then that kind of mentality needs to be set in place. I think OP is
shooting herself in the foot on this one, moreso than the child's dad, and
yes I am also keeping in mind that there's always 2 sides to every story,
and there's just one side here (from the OP) and even this side probably has
a lot more to it than what was mentioned.

You can set your child up for some sense of security while she is with
you. Talk to her a few hours before she leaves for her father's about
how you imagine it must feel for her. 'Hey, boo, is it scary to leave
mama's even though you get to go to your papa's house for a little bit?
I bet you must be worried that you won't see mama again when you leave
my house. But I'm always here, and I'll be right here waiting for you
to get back. You can ask papa to call me so you can see for yourself
that mama's at home waiting for you.'

What, exactly, will talking to a 2 year old hours before she is leaving
going to accomplish? A 2 year old toddler has the attention span of a
horse, which is basically not much of an attention span, and very normal.
Asking a 2 year old if leaving Mom's house is scary to go to Dad's house is
just going to put that idea into her head and confirm to her that leaving
Mom is scary. Using words like 'worried that you won't see mama again when
you leave' is another thing that's going to stick in a 2 year old's mind for
as long as they can remember (again, not long, but if you continually use
those words, phrases and sentences, it will eventually become the norm)

Reassure her that you love her,
and that you will be there for her when she comes home. Ask your ex
what activities he has planned for her while she is with him, so you
can talk to her about specific, fun things she'll get to do. If she has
a favorite stuffed animal, sleep with it or wear it under your shirt
for a while before she goes. She will smell your scent on her lovey and
hopefully be comforted.

I see nothing wrong with constantly reassuring that you love your child -
you should do that regardless. I also think that the constant reassurance
that the other parent loves them is just as needed. Also, the idea of
asking Dad what his plans might be might be a good idea to get the kid
psyched about what she will be doing, so there are no surprises. If he's
planning on taking her to the park in the afternoon, get her interested in
that. If he has a movie in mind, then that gives her something she can look
forward to.

Find another lawyer, and tell that lawyer that you felt you were
pressured into signing, that the documents you signed you signed under
duress. Do some research on the old lawyer who intimidated him. Talk to
the Bar Association in your county/state and see if there is anything
you can do with regards to your treatment. See if there are any other
compaints against him. Talk to your state welfare/women and children
program and see if they can steer you to affordable legal care.

If you have proof of the income your ex is hiding, bring this to your
attorney. You should have alimony as well as child support. You can
discuss with the lawyer how to get funds from your ex to pay for legal
expenses. Any lawyer you talk to should give you a preliminary
consultation of at least a half hour for free, and you can ask
questions like these and get a feel for the lawyer herself or himself.

While you're at that, discuss with your lawyer about paying for HIS legal
expenses.
It just makes me sick when people have to dish out their money for lawyers
when those lawyer fees for custody, visitation, child support (and so on,
anything regarding a child or children) could be spent far more wisely -
like on clothing, food, diapers, basically the needs of the child.

Good luck!

"'Kate" wrote in message
...
On 5 Oct 2006 21:07:32 -0700, "Vicki" the
snip

Fathers play an
important role in their daughter's lives. We've seen that through
numerous studies of successful women... a strong, caring, and loving
father who takes an interest in the things that interest his daughter
and shares how things are in the "man world" is important.

snip

I thought I'd post this... Not to go off topic, but because it was
mentioned. I really don't know who has seen this or what, but I had a
friend email this to me, and when I first read it, I thought it was great,
and as I look, I do see it's true.
Sorry it's so long - I didn't write it - but I did take out the little
footnotes and such to try and keep it down.
I thought it was a good article.


How Fathers, As Male Parents, Matter for Healthy Child Development
May 28, 2003 by Glenn T. Stanton

Fathers parent differently from mothers and that difference matters greatly
for children.
Fatherhood is just as essential to healthy child development as motherhood.
In some measures, father-love is more important. The professional journal,
Review of General Psychology, finds "evidence suggests that the influence of
father love on offspring's development is as great as and occasionally
greater than the influence of mother love." Fathering expert Dr. Kyle
Pruett explains in 'Fatherneed: Why Father Care is as Essential as Mother
Care, for Your Child,' quote: "fathers do not mother." 'Psychology Today'
explains: "fatherhood turns out to be a complex and unique phenomenon, with
huge consequences for the emotional and intellectual growth of children."
Erik Erikson, a pioneer in the world of child psychology, explained that
father love and mother love are qualitatively different kinds of love.
Fathers "love more dangerously" because their love is more "expectant, more
instrumental" than a mother's love. A father, as a male biological parent,
brings unique contributions to the job of parenting a child, that no one
else can replicate.

Following, are some of the most compelling ways a fathers involvement makes
a positive difference in a child's life. Decidedly, the first benefit is the
'difference' itself.

*Fathers Parent Differently
This difference provides an important diversity of experiences for children.
Dr. Pruett explains that fathers have a distinct style of communication and
interaction with children. Around the eighth week, infants generally know
the difference between who is interacting with them - their mother or their
father. This diversity, in itself, provides children with an enriched
experience, offering a greater contrast in relational interactions - more so
than for children who are raised by only one parent. Whether they realize it
or not, children are learning (at an early age) by sheer experience, that
men and women are different. And, that they have different ways of dealing
with life, other adults and children. This understanding can be of critical
value for a child's development.

"A father, as a male biological parent, brings a unique contribution to the
effort of parenting a child, that no one else can replicate."

*Fathers Play Differently
Fathers tend to play with, and mothers tend to care for, children. While
both mothers and fathers are physical, fathers are physical in different
ways.
Fathers tickle more, they wrestle, and they throw their children in the air
(while mother says. "Not so high!"). Fathers chase their children, sometimes
as playful, scary "monsters." Fathers are louder at play, while mothers are
quieter. Mothers cuddle babies, and fathers bounce them. Fathers roughhouse,
while mothers are gentle. Fathers encourage competition; mothers encourage
equity. Often, a father's style encourages independence, while a mother's
style encourages security.
Fathering expert, John Snarey, explains that children who roughhouse with
their fathers learn that biting, kicking and other forms of physical
violence are not appropriate. They learn self-control by being told when
"enough is enough" and when to "settle down." Girls and boys, both learn a
healthy balance between timidity and aggression. Children need mom's
softness as well as dad's roughhousing. Both provide security and confidence
in their own ways, by communicating love and physical intimacy.

*Fathers Build Confidence
Go to any playground and listen to the parents there. Who is encouraging
kids to swing or climb just a little higher; ride their bike just a little
faster; throw just a little harder; etc? Who is encouraging kids to be
careful? Mothers protect, and dads encourage kids to push their limits.
Either of these parenting styles by themselves can be unhealthy. One tends
toward encouraging risk, without consideration of consequences; the other,
tends toward avoidance of risk - hindering a child's ability to build
independence, confidence and other developments. Both perspectives tend to
lead a child toward a healthy balance - generally helping children remain
safe - while expanding their experiences and confidence.

*Fathers Communicate Differently
One major study showed that when speaking to children, mothers and fathers
converse differently. Mothers will simplify their words and speak on the
child's level. Men generally, are not as inclined to modify their language
for the child.
While mother's way may facilitate immediate communication, father's way
often challenges the child to expand vocabulary and linguistic skills - an
important building block for academic success.
Father's communication style tends to be more brief, direct, and to the
point. It also makes greater use of subtle body language. Mother's method
tend to be more descriptive, personal and verbally encouraging. Thus,
children who don't learn how to understand and use both styles of
conversation, as they grow, will be at a disadvantage, considering they will
experience each out in the world.

*Fathers Discipline Differently
Educational psychologist Carol Gilligan, tells us that fathers stress
justice, fairness and duty (based on their rules), while mothers stress
empathy, care and help (based on relationships). Fathers tend to observe and
enforce rules systematically and sternly. Often, this models for children
objectivity, and the consequences of one's actions. Mothers lean toward
grace and empathy, in the midst of disobedience, which provides a sense of
hopefulness. Again, either of these by themselves reduces equilibrium, but
together, they create a healthy, proper balance.

*Fathers Prepare Children for the Real World
Dads tend to see their children in relation to the rest of the world. While
mothers tend to see the rest of the world in relation to their child.
Perhaps, the following will clarify this distinction.
What often motivates a mother (as a parent)? Her primary concerns are
motivated by things from the outside world, that she knows could hurt her
child (i.e., lightning, accidents, disease, strange people, dogs or cats,
etc.). Fathers, while not unconcerned with these things, tend to focus on
how their children will, or will not be prepared, for an incident they may
encounter out in the world.
Fathers seek to get children to see that particular attitudes and behaviors,
have consequences. For instance, fathers are more likely to tell their
children that if they are not nice to others, kids will not want to play
with them. Or, if they don't do well in school, they will not get into a
good college or land a desirable job. Fathers push children to prepare for
the harshness of the real world, and mothers seek to protect children
against it. Both are necessary as children grow into adulthood.

*Fathers provide a Look at the World of Men; Mothers, the World of Women
Men and women are different. They eat differently. They dress differently.
They smell different. They cope with life differently. A father does "man
things" and a mother "woman things."
Girls and boys who grow up with a father are more familiar and secure with
the curious world of men. Girls with involved, connected fathers, are more
likely to have healthier relationships with boys during adolescence, and men
in adulthood, because they have learned from their fathers how respectful
men act toward women. They learn a sense of which behaviors are
inappropriate. They also have a healthy familiarity with the world of men.
They don't wonder how a man's facial stubble feels or what it's like to be
hugged by strong arms. This knowledge builds emotional security and safety,
from the exploitation of predatory males. They also learn from mom, how to
live in a woman's world. This is paricularly important as they approach
adolescence, and all the changes that this life-stage brings.
Boys who grow up with dads are less likely to be violent. Generally, since
they have their masculinity affirmed due to their inaction with their
fathers, and often learn from their fathers, how to channel their
masculinity and strength, in positive ways. Fathers help children understand
proper male sexuality, hygiene and behaviours in age-appropriate ways.
Whereas a mother will help boys understand the female world and develop some
sensitivity toward women. They also help boys to know how to relate and
communicate with women.

"As noted sociologist David Popenoe explains, 'Fathers are far more than
just a "second adult" in the home. Involved fathers - especially biological
fathers - bring positive benefits to their children that no other person is
as likely to bring.'"

*Fathers and Mothers Teach Respect for the Opposite Sex
Research consistently shows committed fathers are substantially less likely
to abuse their partners or their children, than men in any other category.
This means that boys and girls with committed fathers in the home learn, by
observation, how men respectfully treat women.
Girls with involved fathers, therefore, are more likely to select for
themselves good suitors and husbands, because they have a suitable standards
by which to judge all candidates. Often, fathers themselves, also help weed
out bad candidates. Boys raised with a father, are more likely to be better
mates, because they can emulate their fathers' successes, and learn from
their failures.
The American Journal of Sociology finds that: "Societies with
'father-present patterns of child socialization' produce men who are less
inclined to exclude women from public activities, than their counterparts in
father-absent societies."
Girls and boys with committed mothers, learn from their mothers what a
healthy, respectful female relationship with men looks like. Girls who
observe their mothers confidently and lovingly interacting with their
fathers learn how to interact confidently with men.

*Fathers Connect Children with Job Markets
A crucial point in life is the transition from financial dependence to
independence. This is usually a slow process spanning the years from about
16 to 22 years of age. Fathers often help connect their children (especially
boys) to job markets, as they enter adulthood. This is because fathers, more
than mothers, are more likely to have those kinds of diverse community
connections, needed to help young adults get their first jobs. When a dad is
not around, boys are not as likely to have these types of connections,
helpful in landing a summer job.

Conclusion
As noted sociologist David Popenoe explains: "Fathers are far more than just
a 'second adult' in the home. Involved fathers - especially biological
fathers - bring positive benefits to their children that no other person is
as likely to bring." Fathers bring good, essential things to the lives of
children. Children are impoverished developmentally, when they are deprived
of their father's love.

The "Review of General Psychology" concludes:
"Many studies conclude that children with highly involved fathers, as
compared to children with less involved fathers, tend to be more cognitively
and socially competent, less inclined toward gender stereotyping, more
empathetic, and just overall better psychologically adjusted."

T. Stanton is Director of Social Research and Cultural Affairs, and Senior
Analyst for Marriage and Sexuality at Focus on the Family.

"Vicki" wrote in message
ups.com...
Hello, I am Vicki, and I just was searching around for a group with
single parents, and I have a few questions that only another single
parent can answer..;-)...or a lawyer.... but fisrt off,
I hope I won't offend anyone, espeically all of you wonderful Dads who
may be raising your children on your own..;-)



Hello Vicki,

Unfortunate that the lawyer made those false promises. No lawyer can predict
the future. You picked a bad one there but there are plenty of good
attorneys you could utilize.

You state that the stays with Dad are doing a number on her emotionally. You
stated that you have devoted your life to your baby. May you consider that
it is YOU who can't handle this emotionally and that is the energy you are
putting out there and your daughter is picking up on it?

You state you want just ONE night back, for your daughter. I can't see what
one night will do to begin with. Chances are once your daughter gets away
from you, she is fine. Of course she is happy to see you, you are her
mother. Have you spoke with your ex, asked him how she behaves when he has
the child?

I just read more of your postings and you said you SUFFER without her.

I have no doubt in my mind that you are transferring to your daughter.
While it might be ok to seek some help for your daughter, you need to seek
help too. You are not crazy, don't get me wrong. You just need help letting
go and being ok with it. It is so wonderful that your ex wants to spend that
much time with her and unless there are obvious signs of abuse or neglect, I
think it is great.

Last but not least, does any of this have to do with the amount of support
you get? Because if so, shame on you.

Tiffany

Thanks for all the great advice...;-)




xkatx wrote:
"DCMama" wrote in message
s.com...
Vivki, I would start by trying to get a child psychologist to give you
some information about what this kind of trauma is like for a baby. My
son is 3.5 and a child psychologist said he was absolutely not to go to
Paris to be with his father for Christmas this year, that what he
needed most of all right now is stability with a primary parent, and
unlimited visits with the father, an occasional overnight, but NOT
long-term separation from his mama.

Hm... Long term separation from his precious mama 'cause poor daddy isn't
important?

I respectfully disagree with the poster who says your child will not
remember this. If you've ever watched your kid memorize the words to
her favorite song after hearing it five times, you'll know that a
child's capacity for memory is enormous. And emotional trauma takes its
toll. Your two year old is too young to be separate from you for more
than a night, perhaps two if she's ok with it.

What on earth are you talking about?
B had a book, "Now We Can Go" memorized by the time he was about 2, maybe 2
and a half. I found that book hidden in the back of his book shelf maybe a
year or so ago (he'll be 6 in January) and he didn't remember a darn thing
of that book, yet the last time we picked up that book was probably a year
before. So, by the time he was 2ish, he had the book memorized from me
reading it over and over, we read it until about 2 years ago, until he was
about 4, 'lost it' for about a year and found it again when he was about 5
(as he is nearly 6)
At 2 years of age, why would she be way too young to be separated from Mom
for more than a night but can be separated from Dad for a week? (or whatever
the case may be)
I'm such a horrible person... When B was about 6 months old, I took a road
trip with 3 friends for the weekend - we left on a Friday afternoon and came
back very late on Sunday night. That was about 2 and a half days that I
left him with my parents to go and do my own thing. I also left him 2
summers ago with my aunt and uncle to go nearly a week to Vegas with my mom.
He was 3 and a half. My poor son must be sooo traumatized.

No parent should ever force a child to do something like this. Your ex
is shooting himself in the foot on this one. She will not attach to
him, learn to trust him, or enjoy him. Her emotional bond with him will
be one of pain.

That depends on how both sides (by that I mean both parents) act and react
to this. If going with Daddy is going to be a good thing - which it should
be - then that kind of mentality needs to be set in place. I think OP is
shooting herself in the foot on this one, moreso than the child's dad, and
yes I am also keeping in mind that there's always 2 sides to every story,
and there's just one side here (from the OP) and even this side probably has
a lot more to it than what was mentioned.

You can set your child up for some sense of security while she is with
you. Talk to her a few hours before she leaves for her father's about
how you imagine it must feel for her. 'Hey, boo, is it scary to leave
mama's even though you get to go to your papa's house for a little bit?
I bet you must be worried that you won't see mama again when you leave
my house. But I'm always here, and I'll be right here waiting for you
to get back. You can ask papa to call me so you can see for yourself
that mama's at home waiting for you.'

What, exactly, will talking to a 2 year old hours before she is leaving
going to accomplish? A 2 year old toddler has the attention span of a
horse, which is basically not much of an attention span, and very normal.
Asking a 2 year old if leaving Mom's house is scary to go to Dad's house is
just going to put that idea into her head and confirm to her that leaving
Mom is scary. Using words like 'worried that you won't see mama again when
you leave' is another thing that's going to stick in a 2 year old's mind for
as long as they can remember (again, not long, but if you continually use
those words, phrases and sentences, it will eventually become the norm)

Reassure her that you love her,
and that you will be there for her when she comes home. Ask your ex
what activities he has planned for her while she is with him, so you
can talk to her about specific, fun things she'll get to do. If she has
a favorite stuffed animal, sleep with it or wear it under your shirt
for a while before she goes. She will smell your scent on her lovey and
hopefully be comforted.

I see nothing wrong with constantly reassuring that you love your child -
you should do that regardless. I also think that the constant reassurance
that the other parent loves them is just as needed. Also, the idea of
asking Dad what his plans might be might be a good idea to get the kid
psyched about what she will be doing, so there are no surprises. If he's
planning on taking her to the park in the afternoon, get her interested in
that. If he has a movie in mind, then that gives her something she can look
forward to.

Find another lawyer, and tell that lawyer that you felt you were
pressured into signing, that the documents you signed you signed under
duress. Do some research on the old lawyer who intimidated him. Talk to
the Bar Association in your county/state and see if there is anything
you can do with regards to your treatment. See if there are any other
compaints against him. Talk to your state welfare/women and children
program and see if they can steer you to affordable legal care.

If you have proof of the income your ex is hiding, bring this to your
attorney. You should have alimony as well as child support. You can
discuss with the lawyer how to get funds from your ex to pay for legal
expenses. Any lawyer you talk to should give you a preliminary
consultation of at least a half hour for free, and you can ask
questions like these and get a feel for the lawyer herself or himself.

While you're at that, discuss with your lawyer about paying for HIS legal
expenses.
It just makes me sick when people have to dish out their money for lawyers
when those lawyer fees for custody, visitation, child support (and so on,
anything regarding a child or children) could be spent far more wisely -
like on clothing, food, diapers, basically the needs of the child.

Good luck!