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#2
August 24th 05, 04:25 AM
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Todd Gastaldo wrote: SPIRITUAL OR MORTAL See below. I AM ASTONISHED... Keeping in mind that most newborns are still breathing through their umbilical cords at birth... Retired obstetrician George Malcolm Morley, MB ChB FACOG indicates that EVERY CESAREAN BABY is having its umbilical cord immediately clamped. COMMENT: Since resuscitation is done at another site, and you can't move the baby out of the operating field till the cord is clamped and cut, it seems rather stupid to sit there and wait too long. You have to resuscitate sometime. How long to wait is a good question. Perhaps we can have some OB-GYN input? As for premature infants born vaginally, evidence does support 30 to 120 seconds of delay before cord clamping. Need for transfusion and (more importantly) interventricular brain hemmorhage seems to be decreased by doing this. Here's a full Cochrane review on the very subject. http://www.mrw.interscience.wiley.co...248/frame.html SBH 
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#3
August 24th 05, 06:38 AM
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OB/GYNs: I AGREE WITH STEVE B. HARRIS, MD
....on one key point. Attention: Heike Rabe, MD, PhD ( ) Steve cited you. Please see my question for you below. I wrote: SPIRITUAL OR MORTAL See below. I AM ASTONISHED... Keeping in mind that most newborns are still breathing through their umbilical cords at birth... Retired obstetrician George Malcolm Morley, MB ChB FACOG indicates that EVERY CESAREAN BABY is having its umbilical cord immediately clamped. Steve B. Harris, MD snipped substantially and wrote: COMMENT: Since resuscitation is done at another site, Steve, I think it best to REDESIGN "another site" so that mother can be wheeled there with baby still attached to the natural transfusion/oxygenation device rather than routinely asphyxiating babies and robbing blood from them. and you can't move the baby out of the operating field till the cord is clamped and cut, First consideration: Many babies are very likely only in an "operating field" in the first place because of OB/GYN lies - for example OB/GYNs are lying to cover-up the fact they are closing birth canals up to 30%. Second consideration: You are euphemizing. "Cord clamped and cut" is euphemism for "baby being amputated from mother and anti-scientifically denied benefit of natural transfusion/oxygenation device." Third consideration: The baby blood robbery crime isn't just happening in cesarean births. It is being PROMOTED - as OB/GYNs stupidly assist the promoters - and lie to cover-up the fact they are routinely closing birth canals up to 30%. Fourth consideration: OB/GYNs are committing LOTS of obvious crimes. When I noted that MDs are committing obvious crimes and that law enforcement isn't enforcing the law. You replied with typical MD arrogance: "Without enforcement, there is no law. Without law, there is no crime. These are elementary principles. Get an adult to explain them to you." http://groups-beta.google.com/group/ misc.kids.pregnancy/msg/28866f3384801ae9? See Libertarians: Crooked obstetrician Ron Paul, MD (also: Michael Badnarik for Congress) http://health.groups.yahoo.com /group/chiro-list/message/3789 it seems rather stupid to sit there and wait too long. Speaking of stupid Steve, please note your arrogance babies be damned. As long as law enforcement looks the other way, the grisly MD silence game will work. You have to resuscitate sometime. How long to wait is a good question. Perhaps we can have some OB-GYN input? I AGREE WITH STEVE B. HARRIS, MD... Yes - it is time for OB-GYNs to account for themselves. First, they need to account for the fact that the baby blood robbery crime isn't just happening in cesarean births. It is being PROMOTED - as OB/GYNs stupidly assist the promoters - and lie to cover-up the fact they are routinely closing birth canals up to 30%. Surely all OB-GYNs can agree that that bizarre TEMPORARY baby asphyxiation experiment being promoted by Dr. Morley should never be attempted... Here it is again....note the word "asphyxia"... "[T]he umbilical cord [is] immediately closed between finger and thumb...The [fetal heart rate/FHR] will decelerate quickly to about 60 bpm...the color will change from purple-pink (normal at birth) to pallid blue (vaso-constriction and asphyxia.)...Few midwives or obstetricians will be able to observe, without interference, a deep, prolonged FHR deceleration on a non-breathing newborn for a period of 60 seconds.* Common sense will soon release the finger and thumb." http://www.cordclamping.com/acog-cp.htm Steve, you do agree that OB/GYNs should not be experimenting with asphyxiating babies temporarily, right? As for premature infants born vaginally, evidence does support 30 to 120 seconds of delay before cord clamping. Evidence supports the fact that a massive baby asphyxiation/baby blood robbery crime is being commmitted by OB/GYNs and CNMwives. Evidence supports the fact that criminals will do everything possible to make it look like they haven't committed a crime. My view: OB/GYNs and CNMwives are cooperating to get 30 seconds defined as "delayed" clamping. See 'Scientifically' supporting mass child abuse by MDs... http://groups-beta.google.com/group/ misc.kids.pregnancy/msg/7e3e71a8f5a79fd0? Need for transfusion and (more importantly) interventricular brain hemmorhage seems to be decreased by doing this. Yes, Steve-o, when you let the baby transfuse more of his or her OWN blood to himself or herself - "need for transfusion" will very likely "seem...to be decreased by doing this." Here's a full Cochrane review on the very subject. http://www.mrw.interscience.wiley.co.../CD003248/fram e.html I've discussed this very paper... See again: 'Scientifically' supporting mass child abuse by MDs... http://groups-beta.google.com/group/ misc.kids.pregnancy/msg/7e3e71a8f5a79fd0? The authors, Heike Rabe, MD, PhD et al.^^^ write: "Early clamping allows for immediate resuscitation of the newborn..." ---BIZARRE ^^^Rabe H, Reynolds G, Diaz-Rossello J. Cochrane Database Syst Rev. 2004 Oct 18;(4):CD003248. PubMed abstract I copied Heike before - but she never got back to me... I'll copy her again: Heike Rabe, MD, PhD Consultant Neonatologist Brighton & Sussex University Hospitals Brighton BN2 5BE (UK) Tel. +44 1273 696955, Fax +44 1273 664795, Heike, you are a neonatologist - why haven't neonatal resuscitation stations been redesigned so that mother and baby can be wheeled under keeping the natural oxygenation/transfusion device attached? Is there some technical obstacle? Again, my view: OB/GYNs and CNMwives are cooperating to get 30 seconds defined as "delayed" clamping. They know they are committing crime - they know they are abusing babies - they know they are using cultural authority to cover-up. Sorry to be redundant, but I say again Steve: When I noted that MDs are committing obvious crimes and that law enforcement isn't enforcing the law. You replied: "Without enforcement, there is no law. Without law, there is no crime. These are elementary principles. Get an adult to explain them to you." http://groups-beta.google.com/group/ misc.kids.pregnancy/msg/28866f3384801ae9? I am in favor of pardons in advance for MDs. As medical students, MDs are TRAINED to perform felonies. See Libertarians: Crooked obstetrician Ron Paul, MD (also: Michael Badnarik for Congress) http://health.groups.yahoo.com /group/chiro-list/message/3789 Todd Dr. Gastaldo Hillsboro, Oregon USA This post will be archived for global access in the Google usenet archive. Search http://groups.google.com for "OB/GYNs: I agree with Steve B. Harris, MD"
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#4
August 29th 05, 12:00 AM
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Google this, Gastaldo:
**PLONK**
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#5
August 29th 05, 06:34 AM
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Steve B. Harris, MD wrote:
Google this, Gastaldo: **PLONK** I wrote: snip Keeping in mind that most newborns are still breathing through their umbilical cords at birth... Retired obstetrician George Malcolm Morley, MB ChB FACOG indicates that EVERY CESAREAN BABY is having its umbilical cord immediately clamped. Steve B. Harris, MD snipped substantially and wrote: COMMENT: Since resuscitation is done at another site, Steve, I think it best to REDESIGN "another site" so that mother can be wheeled there with baby still attached to the natural transfusion/oxygenation device rather than routinely asphyxiating babies and robbing blood from them. and you can't move the baby out of the operating field till the cord is clamped and cut, First consideration: Many babies are very likely only in an "operating field" in the first place because of OB/GYN lies - for example OB/GYNs are lying to cover-up the fact they are closing birth canals up to 30%. Second consideration: You are euphemizing. "Cord clamped and cut" is euphemism for "baby being amputated from mother and anti-scientifically denied benefit of natural transfusion/oxygenation device." Third consideration: The baby blood robbery crime isn't just happening in cesarean births. It is being PROMOTED [cord blood banking - TG] - as OB/GYNs stupidly assist the promoters - and lie to cover-up the fact they are routinely closing birth canals up to 30%. Fourth consideration: OB/GYNs are committing LOTS of obvious crimes. When I noted that MDs are committing obvious crimes and that law enforcement isn't enforcing the law. You replied with typical MD arrogance: "Without enforcement, there is no law. Without law, there is no crime. These are elementary principles. Get an adult to explain them to you." http://groups-beta.google.com/group/ misc.kids.pregnancy/msg/28866f3384801ae9? See Libertarians: Crooked obstetrician Ron Paul, MD (also: Michael Badnarik for Congress) http://health.groups.yahoo.com /group/chiro-list/message/3789 it seems rather stupid to sit there and wait too long. Speaking of stupid Steve, please note your arrogance babies be damned. As long as law enforcement looks the other way, the grisly MD silence game will work. You have to resuscitate sometime. How long to wait is a good question. Perhaps we can have some OB-GYN input? I AGREE WITH STEVE B. HARRIS, MD... Yes - it is time for OB-GYNs to account for themselves. First, they need to account for the fact that the baby blood robbery crime isn't just happening in cesarean births. It is being PROMOTED - as OB/GYNs stupidly assist the promoters - and lie to cover-up the fact they are routinely closing birth canals up to 30%. Surely all OB-GYNs can agree that that bizarre TEMPORARY baby asphyxiation experiment being promoted by Dr. Morley should never be attempted... Here it is again....note the word "asphyxia"... "[T]he umbilical cord [is] immediately closed between finger and thumb...The [fetal heart rate/FHR] will decelerate quickly to about 60 bpm...the color will change from purple-pink (normal at birth) to pallid blue (vaso-constriction and asphyxia.)...Few midwives or obstetricians will be able to observe, without interference, a deep, prolonged FHR deceleration on a non-breathing newborn for a period of 60 seconds.* Common sense will soon release the finger and thumb." http://www.cordclamping.com/acog-cp.htm Steve, you do agree that OB/GYNs should not be experimenting with asphyxiating babies temporarily, right? As for premature infants born vaginally, evidence does support 30 to 120 seconds of delay before cord clamping. Evidence supports the fact that a massive baby asphyxiation/baby blood robbery crime is being commmitted by OB/GYNs and CNMwives. Evidence supports the fact that criminals will do everything possible to make it look like they haven't committed a crime. My view: OB/GYNs and CNMwives are cooperating to get 30 seconds defined as "delayed" clamping. See 'Scientifically' supporting mass child abuse by MDs... http://groups-beta.google.com/group/ misc.kids.pregnancy/msg/7e3e71a8f5a79fd0? Need for transfusion and (more importantly) interventricular brain hemmorhage seems to be decreased by doing this. Yes, Steve-o, when you let the baby transfuse more of his or her OWN blood to himself or herself - "need for transfusion" will very likely "seem...to be decreased by doing this." Here's a full Cochrane review on the very subject. http://www.mrw.interscience.wiley.co.../CD003248/fram e.html I've discussed this very paper... See again: 'Scientifically' supporting mass child abuse by MDs... http://groups-beta.google.com/group/ misc.kids.pregnancy/msg/7e3e71a8f5a79fd0? The authors, Heike Rabe, MD, PhD et al.^^^ write: "Early clamping allows for immediate resuscitation of the newborn..." ---BIZARRE ^^^Rabe H, Reynolds G, Diaz-Rossello J. Cochrane Database Syst Rev. 2004 Oct 18;(4):CD003248. PubMed abstract I copied Heike before - but she never got back to me... I'll copy her again: Heike Rabe, MD, PhD Consultant Neonatologist Brighton & Sussex University Hospitals Brighton BN2 5BE (UK) Tel. +44 1273 696955, Fax +44 1273 664795, Heike, you are a neonatologist - why haven't neonatal resuscitation stations been redesigned so that mother and baby can be wheeled under keeping the natural oxygenation/transfusion device attached? Is there some technical obstacle? Again, my view: OB/GYNs and CNMwives are cooperating to get 30 seconds defined as "delayed" clamping. They know they are committing crime - they know they are abusing babies - they know they are using cultural authority to cover-up. Sorry to be redundant, but I say again Steve: When I noted that MDs are committing obvious crimes and that law enforcement isn't enforcing the law. You replied: "Without enforcement, there is no law. Without law, there is no crime. These are elementary principles. Get an adult to explain them to you." http://groups-beta.google.com/group/ misc.kids.pregnancy/msg/28866f3384801ae9? I am in favor of pardons in advance for MDs. As medical students, MDs are TRAINED to perform felonies. See Libertarians: Crooked obstetrician Ron Paul, MD (also: Michael Badnarik for Congress) http://health.groups.yahoo.com /group/chiro-list/message/3789 Todd Dr. Gastaldo Hillsboro, Oregon USA This post will be archived for global access in the Google usenet archive. Search http://groups.google.com for "OB/GYNs: I agree with Steve B. Harris, MD"
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#6
September 3rd 05, 08:18 PM
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In message , Todd Gastaldo
writes (referring to babies post-Caesarean.....) Since resuscitation is done at another site, Steve, I think it best to REDESIGN "another site" so that mother can be wheeled there with baby still attached to the natural transfusion/oxygenation device rather than routinely asphyxiating babies and robbing blood from them. The problem you'd have would be with making the resuscitaire a sterile field, since the woman's still open at that point. I think that if a baby needs resuscitation following a Caesarean, snipping the cord straight away may be the only option. Of course, it's worth noting that a lot of babies _don't_ need to be rushed over to the resuscitaire immediately following a Caesarean. Unfortunately, this is one of the many things we do in medicine because It's Always Been Done That Way. If a baby comes out pink and screaming, as most of them do, then there's no reason at all to take it to the resuscitaire immediately, and it would make perfect sense to wait a few minutes. (And, as you say, it would be even better to try and avoid some of those Caesareans in the first place by better management of labour.) All the best, Sarah -- http://www.goodenoughmummy.blogspot.com But how do we _know_ that nobody ever said on their deathbed that they wished theyâd spent more time at the office?
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#7
September 4th 05, 04:03 PM
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ASPHYXIATING BABIES TO RESUSCITATE THEM...
Steve B. Harris, MD wrote: (referring to babies post-Caesarean.....) Since resuscitation is done at another site, Todd D. Gastaldo, DC replied: Steve, I think it best to REDESIGN "another site" so that mother can be wheeled there with baby still attached to the natural transfusion/oxygenation device rather than routinely asphyxiating babies and robbing blood from them. British general practitioner Dr. Sarah Vaughan responded: The problem you'd have would be with making the resuscitaire a sterile field, since the woman's still open at that point. Don't forget - many VAGINALLY born babies are being asphyxiated, robbed of massive amounts of blood and rushed across the room for resuscitation. I think that if a baby needs resuscitation following a Caesarean, snipping the cord straight away may be the only option. We gotta do what we gotta do - but we should remember that "snipping the cord" in this situation is euphemism for "amputating mother from baby, amputating baby's natural oxygenation/transfusion device, robbing baby of up to 50% of his/her blood volume - to be able to rush across the room to resuscitate baby." Of course, it's worth noting that a lot of babies _don't_ need to be rushed over to the resuscitaire immediately following a Caesarean. It certainly is worth noting - which is why retired obstetrician George Malcolm Morley MB ChB FACOG notes it... Unfortunately, this is one of the many things we do in medicine because It's Always Been Done That Way. New readers... Unfortunately, medicine can't immediately stop the routine baby asphyxiation/baby blood robbery because it's a crime and immediately stopping the crime would be tantamount to admitting the crime. When I asked Steve B. Harris, MD about another obvious crime in medicine, he replied: "Without enforcement, there is no law. Without law, there is no crime. These are elementary principles. Get an adult to explain them to you." http://groups.google.com/group /misc.kids.pregnancy/msg/28866 f3384801ae9 Accordingly, I have called for enforcement. See Arresting obstetricians - Lt. Bill Hunt: 11165PC Suspected (Mass) Child Abuse Report http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group...t/message/3848 I am in favor of pardons in advance for MDs. As medical students, MDs are TRAINED to perform obvious felonies. See the very end of this post. If a baby comes out pink and screaming, as most of them do, then there's no reason at all to take it to the resuscitaire immediately, and it would make perfect sense to wait a few minutes. I think Dr. Morley's point is that "baby born NOT pink and screaming" is the reason NOT to amputate mother from baby - the reason NOT to amputate baby's natural oxygenation/transfusion device - the reason NOT to rob baby of up to 50% of his/her blood volume. I think Dr. Morley is saying leave the natural resuscitation equipment in place - if at all possible. Unfortunately, instead of reporting the obvious mass child abuse, Dr. Morley is recommending an obviously illegal temporary baby asphyxiation experiment so that his fellow obstetricians can demonstrate to themselves why they shouldn't rob babies of up to 50% of their blood volume. FOR ANY NEW READERS WHO MISSED IT... Here is Dr. Morley's obviously illegal temporary baby asphyxiation experiment... "[T]he umbilical cord [is] immediately closed between finger and thumb...The [fetal heart rate/FHR] will decelerate quickly to about 60 bpm...the color will change from purple-pink (normal at birth) to pallid blue (vaso-constriction and asphyxia.)...Few midwives or obstetricians will be able to observe...a deep, prolonged FHR deceleration on a non-breathing newborn for a period of 60 seconds.* Common sense will soon release the finger and thumb." http://www.cordclamping.com/ac og-cp.htm PREGNANT WOMEN: To make sure your baby gets the "extra" up to 50% of blood, tell the obstetrician not to clamp the cord until it stops pulsating and your baby is pink and breathing and not in need of resuscitation. (And, as you say, it would be even better to try and avoid some of those Caesareans in the first place by better management of labour.) New readers: Dr. Vaughan is euphemizing about the other obvious obstetrician felonies alluded to above. Obstetricians are senselessly asphyxiating some babies BEFORE they are born. Obstetricians are closing birth canals up to 30% and keeping birth canals closed the "extra" up to 30% when babies get stuck. Obstetricians are lying to cover-up. For the Four OB Lies (they are whoppers)... See Birth Danger: Cal Chiro Bd - SIMPLE QUESTION http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group...t/message/3526 Obstetricians are slicing vaginas and abdomens en masse (episiotomy and c-section) - surgically/fraudulently inferring they are doing/have done everything possible to open birth canals - even as they close birth canals the "extra" up to 30%. Also, with birth canals senselessly closed the "extra" up to 30% when babies get stuck, obstetricians are pulling with hands, forceps and vacuums - sometimes pulling so hard they rip spinal nerves out of tiny spinal cords. Some babies die - some get paralyzed - most "only" have their necks grusomely wrenched. ALL spinal manipulation is gruesome with the birth canal senselessly closed the "extra" up to 30%. NOTE: Compelling obstetricians to allow birth canals to open maximally is not going to prevent all episiotomies, c-sections and forceps deliveries - but obstetricians have no business closing birth canals the "extra" up to 30%. I thank Dr. Vaughan for responding. I encourage her to speak out in the medical community - to her employer - to stop SENSELESS routine baby asphyxiations. I agree with her that if the mother might be harmed following a c-section, that is an argument for harming the baby. But so many postpartum baby asphyxiations are totally senseless. And there are totally senseless intrapartum baby asphyxiations - obstetricians senselessly closing birth canals up to 30%.... Again, I encourage Dr. Vaughan to speak out. Sincerely, Dr. Gastaldo Hillsboro, Oregon USA
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