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Inconsiderate drivers and kids who walk to school



 
 
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  #21  
Old September 18th 05, 03:32 PM
Caledonia
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Sue wrote:
"dragonlady" wrote in message However, that
school opened in about 1990, and most schools here are
considerably older -- they weren't designed with the major amount of
parent driving that takes place now in mind.


Yeah, the kids' elementary school was built in 1929 with a total of 20
parking spots in the parking lot. I kid you not, I counted. Now we have over
300 kids going to this school and we are all crammed in there trying to drop
off and pick up. I let my kids walk home in the afternoon, but I do drive
them in the morning. We live on a busy road and the drivers are supposed to
follow the 30 mph speed limit, but do you think the adults follow that
speed???


Near our school, the police are out in force every morning and every
afternoon (okay, we have a police force of 5 total, so there are about
2-3 officers out) ticketing anyone who goes above the speed limit of 30
(on surrounding roads) or 20 in the school zone. They manage to nab
about 12-15 cars a day for speeding within an 8 'block' area -- tidy
revenue for the town.

Caledonia

  #22  
Old September 18th 05, 05:44 PM
dragonlady
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In article ,
"toypup" wrote:

"dragonlady" wrote in message
...
It is exactly this attitude that is creating the safety problem:
everyone drives their kids to school, because of what I think is
misplaced anxiety -- at least, in most areas it is misplaced.

I've been astounded at what some people think are "unsafe" areas for
children to walk in, with no evidence other than the general growing
paranoia.

Add to that that so many of the parents who drive do NOT pay attention
to the pedestrians . . .

And that the schools were not designed to have safe drop-off/pick up
areas . . .


With everyone driving their kids to school, shouldn't they be designed with
safe drop-off/pick up areas. Too late if you have an older school, but they
are building lots of them here. I'm not sure if they have safe zones,
though.


VERY few new schools being build around here -- but if I were somewhere
where a new school was being built, that's one of things I'd want to
insist on: a design that made for safe pick up and drop off.
--
Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care

  #23  
Old September 18th 05, 06:48 PM
Jeanne
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JennP wrote:
"Claire Petersky" wrote in message
...


Someone alerted me to this website: http://drivetoschoolhallofshame.com/
that has photographs from a different school, of all the chaos caused by
parents who are driving their kids to school. What is this craziness?


WIWAK,

the only time you got a ride from school was when you were sick or
something.



Our town has a *huge* problem with this. It's become a very serious safety
issue. Not only do they not walk if outside the bus radius, but the busses
are practically empty because so many parents drive their kids to school.

JennP.




Our neighborhood also has a big problem with this. Lots of buses are
half-filled. The other pet peeve of mine is that many of these parents
are working parents so they are often in a rush, hence the unsafe speeds
and rudeness. It's pretty much a madhouse.

I think, for some reason, people think it's unsafe for children to be
riding the bus or walking so they end up chauffeuring their children to
school. I'm not talking about working parents who drop off their
children at the school's before-care or students whose neighborhoods
lack sidewalks - these are cases where parents need to drive their children.

Our neighbor refuses to let their daughter stand at the bus stop for 5
minutes (usually two moms are there as well) because they think random
strangers will note the presence of the children and try something.
Instead they take their daughter to before-school care at a local
daycare for 5-10 minutes and let them take the girl to school. It's
certainly their choice and if it makes them feel better, it's a valid
solution but I wonder what makes them feel the neighborhood is so
unsafe? It's your typical middle/upper-middle class suburban
neighborhood with sidewalks, with a low crime rate, never a kidnapping, etc.

  #24  
Old September 18th 05, 06:52 PM
Rosalie B.
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wrote:

Kevin Karplus wrote:
On 2005-09-17, Sushi Fish wrote:
to be safe, you want to drive her to school. cars are not the only
threat. your child is still at elementary, too little to walk by
herself, shortcut tends to be in obscure area.


Wrong---the health hazard of being in a car far exceeds the risks of
being a pedestrian, except in the very worst neighborhoods.

For pedestrians and bicyclists, cars are not the *only* threat, but
they are the biggest threat to kids of death or serious injury by
orders of magnitude.

The attitude that everyone *ought to* drive their kids everywhere is
probably one of the largest contributors to the obesity epidemic in
the US.


When mine were little, I wouldn't have allowed them to walk. There were
no sidewalks in some areas. There were roads to cross. Most kids in the
area did not walk. I didn't like the idea of the children walking
alone. I would have no way of knowing they had reached school.

By the time my kids were old enough that I would have considered
letting them walk (about 10-11) we were no longer living close enough
to school for it to be feasible.

The schools did not provide buses except for children being bused in
from other neighborhoods as an affirmative action measure. It was
easier for me to drop them in their schools and then go to work,
knowing they were safe.


I've been thinking about this a bit.

I always walked to my school which was about 1/2 mile or less. Both
my parents worked but they had only one car. Taking me to school was
not an option.

I do not remember having any buses at our elementary school. All the
neighborhoods had sidewalks, and if it was too far to walk, kids took
the public trolley which ran down the main street in front of the
school. I don't know how the kids on the other side of the street got
across though - maybe there was a crossing guard or something. I
lived on the same side as the main street as the school.

My route to walk was to go down my street 3 houses to the alley, walk
through the alley to the street behind ours, walk up that street
another 3 or 4 houses. Go across a block of storefront stores (A&P
and a drugstore were two of them and I would sometimes stop on the way
home to buy a Turkish taffy), and then walk in front of a couple more
houses, go down the LONG (in my memory) driveway alongside of the
school to the back of the school where there was a playground. When
the bell rang, we lined up by class, and were marched in by the
teachers. I don't remember what we did in inclement weather. This
school had grades K-8.

When I was in 8th grade we moved and were less than a block from the
hs that I went to (which I just attended the 50th reunion for our
graduating class). The HS did have buses for outlying areas, but I
always walked (or ran if I was late). This was the first time I had
been at a school with buses. One of my classmates remembers refusing
to stay for after school detention because there would have been no
transportation and he would have had to walk 8 miles home.

When dd#1 was in kindergarten in California, she walked up to the top
of the hill (2 houses distance) and then had to cross a busy main
street without a crossing guard. After the first couple of days, I
let her do this by herself. But California DOES have a yield to
pedestrian law and they enforce it pretty strictly, or did in those
days anyhow. From there she had about a half mile walk through the
suburbs to school where there was one crossing guard.

We moved in the middle of her kindergarten, and she, and then later
dd#2 walked to a parochial school - two blocks down to the dead end
of the street and then two blocks over to the school. No major
streets to cross and a crossing guard at the school.

Then we moved to Philadelphia and they had a similar walk on streets
with sidewalks and no major streets to cross so they walked to school.

We were in Maryland next, and the school was both too far away to walk
to and would require crossing several very busy streets, so they rode
the bus. I don't remember driving them to school although sometimes I
picked them up to go to music lessons or something.

After that we lived in a very rural part of Rhode Island right on a
state highway which had no shoulders or sidewalks but did have a
traffic roundabout between them and the school where two state
highways crossed, so they rode the bus. I did sometimes pick them up
from school if they were in an after school activity either in school
or elsewhere.

From there we moved to where we are now in Maryland - by this time

dd#1 was in 7th grade, dd#2 was in 5th grade and dd#3 was in kinder.
We lived about a mile from the school, but again they would have had
to walk on the shoulder of a major state highway for most of that
distance. So they rode the bus.

DD#1's older children initially walked to school until the oldest got
to middle school at which point she switched them to a Catholic school
and had to drive and pick them up. She carpooled with other parents.

When she was in England it was the same - parents provided the
transportation to the Catholic school - I don't know the specifics,
but there were rules about how it was done. Now their youngest is
still in elementary school I think and they are in a suburb with
absolutely no sidewalks, so I think he rides the bus although the
school is not very far. (USA type Public school)

DD#2's children are in private school as I've said where the parents
must provide transportation. The route to drive to the school takes
them through several other school zones.

DD#3's children are in a suburb (bedroom community) of Dallas, and
they live about a half mile from the school. DD#3 walks her child to
school every day and walks to the school to pick him up. This aids in
her fitness, and also the fitness of her younger child and provides a
way to exercise the dog (a boxer).

DS's oldest child was being bullied on the bus so his parents mostly
drove him to school. Right now he is in a middle school with a magnet
music program and has three changes of bus to get there, plus there
are no lockers at the school and he has two musical instruments
(violin and trumpet) and all his books to carry, so his parents
sometimes pick him up. I've never heard that they did that for his
younger sister though - she seems to ride the bus without problems.


grandma Rosalie

  #25  
Old September 18th 05, 06:53 PM
Louise
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On Sat, 17 Sep 2005 15:52:09 EDT, "Sushi Fish"
wrote:

to be safe, you want to drive her to school. cars are not the only
threat. your child is still at elementary, too little to walk by
herself, shortcut tends to be in obscure area.


So much of that depends on where you live and where the school is.
Our children walked or cycled home from school by themselves or with
peers (about a kilometer on an pre-arranged route) starting in Grade
One. (They usually walked or cyled the same route with parents in the
morning.) A footpath or bicycle path such as Claire describes is not
necessarily in an "obscure area". Presumably it's a path that
Claire's been taking with her children for many years.

Your post sounds to me as if you are criticizing Claire's parenting
judgement, without enough information to do so fairly.

Louise

  #26  
Old September 18th 05, 06:53 PM
Melody
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"Claire Petersky" wrote in message
...
My daughter walks or rides her scooter or bike to her elementary school
every day. Because the route goes on a footpath, it's only a quarter mile;
the route by motor vehicle is four times longer. The biggest problem right
now the kids walking is all the other parents who drive. She only has one
street to cross, and of course there's crossing guards, but the parents
still do not seem to respect the pedestrians in the vicinity.



Can you walk with her?

Unfortunately I don't think people will ever pay attention to pedestrians
again... they're just an annoyance that makes for extra wear & tear on the
SUV's brakes these days...


  #27  
Old September 18th 05, 06:55 PM
Cathy Kearns
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"hedgehog42" wrote in message
ups.com...
Today, I don't think it's generally a case of Mom/Dad believing their
young prince/princess shouldn't have to muddy those expensive athletic
shoes, at least not around here. I think there are safety/practicality
issues that make driving the kids look like the better option. Our
neighborhood has fewer kids attending public school (some are
homeschooled, some attend private schools without local bus service)
and so there's less of a "safety in numbers" protection for everything
from child predators to classroom bullies to unleashed dogs. Plus,
there are fewer moms at home during those hours to keep an eye out than
there were WIWAK.


I think this is true, many parent think there are safety/practicality issues
that make driving the kids look like the better option. I was on a school
committee to encourage walking and biking to school. We wanted to see what
the impediments to walking or biking were, so we sent out surveys. It turns
out the reason people drive their kids to school are not rational things
that can be fixed. Some number were sure their children would be kidnapped
by strangers. Note, there has been no child abductions by strangers in this
area in the school district's 50 year history. Yet, there it is, you can't
convince people that is not a risk. There were some that were convinced
dropping off and picking up saved time, despite the fact that walking to
school from their houses would take 5 to 10 minutes round trip, yet sitting
in the parking lot trying to get out could take at least that. And of
course, if the children were big enough to ride or walk themselves to school
it would take them 0 minutes. There were those that felt walking along this
some what busy two lane street was dangerous, despite the wide sidewalk,
planted area, and bike lane between them and the cars on the street. Most
suggestion were how to make the parking lot more efficient for the drivers,
rather than safer for the pedestrians.

I live in a safe community where 90 percent of the children live within 1
mile of the school, and 90 percent of those have to cross no more than one
two lane street, both of which have crossing guards. There are few places
in our neighborhood, and no place on my daughter's route to school, where
she is more than two houses away from someone she knows. There are two back
entrances where no cars drop off, and when entering the school on foot from
the front you do not have to cross the cars entering or exiting the parking
lot. The school is estatic when 20 to 30 percent of the students walk or
bike to school.

The survey showed me that parent prefer to drive their kids to school, and
nothing we can do will change their minds.

  #28  
Old September 18th 05, 07:21 PM
Hillary Israeli
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*On Sat, 17 Sep 2005 12:15:13 EDT, "Claire Petersky"
wrote:
*
*My daughter walks or rides her scooter or bike to her elementary school
*every day. Because the route goes on a footpath, it's only a quarter mile;
*the route by motor vehicle is four times longer. The biggest problem right
*now the kids walking is all the other parents who drive. She only has one
*street to cross, and of course there's crossing guards, but the parents
*still do not seem to respect the pedestrians in the vicinity.

My son's school drop off/pick up situation is going to make me crazy.

We do not live close enough to walk - it's about 8 miles away, over the
river and through the woods (literally! and we actually drive past his
grandmother's house as an added bonus ). So, ok, we drive. We're
required to make a left into the lot and a right out of the lot - this
means that we have to actually go around the school because the way we
approach, we'd have to make a right into the lot which is forbidden. So,
ultimately what happens is a huge line of cars forms waiting to get into
the lot... and the cars which are just driving down the road NOT wanting
to get into the school... what do they do? They reasonably enough do not
want to sit in traffic 2 city blocks worth for "no reason," so they
decide to just drive in the lane reserved for opposing traffic! This is a
two-lane road. It's also curvy. So when people start EXITING the lot, they
are confronted with the cars going the WRONG WAY. It's a huge problem,
IMO. I mean, I've only been doing it for a week, but several times last
week I feared for my life. Literally. And I had my babies in the car.... I
think the pedestrians have it easy, because the pedestrian access is via a
walking path slightly apart from the parking lot. You don't have to get
near any of this craziness if you walk! Lucky pedestrians.

I asked the head of the school if the school had asked for police support
and she indicated they had, but it was not forthcoming.

--
Hillary Israeli, VMD
Lafayette Hill/PA/USA/Earth
"Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it is
too dark to read." --Groucho Marx



  #29  
Old September 18th 05, 10:57 PM
enigma
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"Sushi Fish" wrote in
ups.com:

to be safe, you want to drive her to school. cars are not
the only threat. your child is still at elementary, too
little to walk by herself, shortcut tends to be in obscure
area.


oh, that's fear-mongering. i walked a mile to school in
Rochester NY, crossing at least 4 streets & using a bridge
over 590 starting at age 4. kids can be made aware of dangers
without being scared to death.
stranger abduction/molestation is *extremely* rare.
lee

--
war is peace
freedom is slavery
ignorance is strength
1984-George Orwell

  #30  
Old September 18th 05, 11:56 PM
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Caledonia wrote:

Near our school, the police are out in force every morning and every
afternoon (okay, we have a police force of 5 total, so there are about
2-3 officers out) ticketing anyone who goes above the speed limit of 30
(on surrounding roads) or 20 in the school zone. They manage to nab
about 12-15 cars a day for speeding within an 8 'block' area -- tidy
revenue for the town.

Caledonia


Yes, the police used to do this near my kid's school as well.
I think they got a pretty good "take," besides having a civilizing
effect on traffic.

Rupa

 




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