Placenta attachment causing bleeding (?) vs. Blighted Ovum... Questions (m/c ment.)

I'm just *confused*. I'm hoping someone can help me out a little.

I posted last week, scared I was having a m/c. (Thank, you, BTW to all of
you who replied) That doesn't seem to be the case according to my midwife.

Now, I'm still spotting brown (old blood) and wen't back to see my midwife
today. She did another HCG Quantative test for which I'll have the results
tomorrow and is sending me for another u/s on Monday. She gave me two
theories on what may be going on.

Theory 1: (Mind you I am NOT an auditory person, I'm a visual person so I
may not relay what she said with great accuracy, I'm hoping someone can
figure out what I'm talking about.) Is that there's been some sort of
bleeding between the placenta and where it attached for some reason or
another and that's what's causing my spotting. She said this is fairly
common and some women spot for days because of it, others have spotted for
up to 4 months. She said this condition will not affect the viability of the
fetus. Likely? Anyone heard of this? This is a new one on me...

Theory 2: I have a blighted ovum. I have heard of this, I know it is fairly
common. My u/s last monday showed only a gestational sac and a yolk sac but
I was determined to only be 4 to 5 weeks pregnant. My HCG levels went up
appropriately from Monday afternoon (9312) to Tuesday morning (13148).

I won't have the results from todays HCG until tomorrow afternoon. If it is
a blighted ovum how long will the HCG continue to rise? What should it be at
by now? My midwife will be unavailable until Monday, the lab tech is calling
with the results so I would like to have some idea on how to interpret them.

I won't know anything for certain until Monday's ultrasound when I should be
between 6 and 7 weeks pregnant. Will an ultrasound at this stage be accurate
enough to make a proper diagnosis?

Also, the midwife mentioned that they will offer me a D&C if it does turn
out to be a blighted ovum. Can anyone give me the risks and benefits of
having one? Is a blighted ovum guaranteed to come out on its own without
having one?

Anything else I need to know?

Thanks again.

Melody (driving myself crazy)

Melody wrote:

Theory 1: (Mind you I am NOT an auditory person, I'm a visual person so I
may not relay what she said with great accuracy, I'm hoping someone can
figure out what I'm talking about.) Is that there's been some sort of
bleeding between the placenta and where it attached for some reason or
another and that's what's causing my spotting. She said this is fairly
common and some women spot for days because of it, others have spotted for
up to 4 months. She said this condition will not affect the viability of the
fetus. Likely? Anyone heard of this? This is a new one on me...

Yes, I've heard of something like this. I think a fair number of women
have unexplained spotting. One thing you might want to check is your
progesterone level and go on supplements if its low.

Theory 2: I have a blighted ovum. I have heard of this, I know it is fairly
common. My u/s last monday showed only a gestational sac and a yolk sac but
I was determined to only be 4 to 5 weeks pregnant. My HCG levels went up
appropriately from Monday afternoon (9312) to Tuesday morning (13148).

Those are very good numbers, I think.


I won't have the results from todays HCG until tomorrow afternoon. If it is
a blighted ovum how long will the HCG continue to rise? What should it be at
by now? My midwife will be unavailable until Monday, the lab tech is calling
with the results so I would like to have some idea on how to interpret them.

My hCG levels were rising quite slowly, but rising. We had serial
ultrasounds, and confirmed a nonviable pregnancy at 8.5 weeks (I think).
At that point my levels had started to drop. We never saw a fetal pole
or the heartbeat.


I won't know anything for certain until Monday's ultrasound when I should be
between 6 and 7 weeks pregnant. Will an ultrasound at this stage be accurate
enough to make a proper diagnosis?

You should see some progress from your last ultrasound, probably a fetal
pole, maybe a heartbeat. Those would confirm a continuing pregnancy. We
continued to monitor our pregnancy until we were certain (by ultrasound
and by hCG) that it was not viable. We did choose to do a D&E, mostly
for my emotional health.


Also, the midwife mentioned that they will offer me a D&C if it does turn
out to be a blighted ovum. Can anyone give me the risks and benefits of
having one? Is a blighted ovum guaranteed to come out on its own without
having one?

You would likely miscarry naturally if you did nothing. I know one the
risks of a D&C is perforating the uterus but that this is rare. I know
there are other risks, but don't know them off hand. The benefit is that
your ordeal is over with quicker which may or may not
be a benefit. Miscarrying naturally is healing for some, and traumatic
for others. If you miscarry naturally and something is retained you may
end up with a D&C anyway. Its such a personal decision and hopefully
you wont need to make it. I would make sure that the evidence that the
pregnancy isn't viable really convinces you before you have the D&C if
you would go that way.

I'm sorry for the uncertainty, it really sucks. I wish you the best.

Mary

"Mary W." wrote in message
link.net...
Yes, I've heard of something like this. I think a fair number of women
have unexplained spotting. One thing you might want to check is your
progesterone level and go on supplements if its low.

What will that tell me? What should they be? Thank you.


My hCG levels were rising quite slowly, but rising. We had serial
ultrasounds, and confirmed a nonviable pregnancy at 8.5 weeks (I think).
At that point my levels had started to drop. We never saw a fetal pole
or the heartbeat.

Did you have a u/s at all before that? I'm so sorry for your loss :-(

I'm trying to determine if there comes a point where I'm "safe".


Thank you very much for all the advice and information.

Melody

Melody wrote:

"Mary W." wrote in message
link.net...
Yes, I've heard of something like this. I think a fair number of women
have unexplained spotting. One thing you might want to check is your
progesterone level and go on supplements if its low.

What will that tell me? What should they be? Thank you.

I think progesterone levels lower than 10 is worrisome (maybe
someone can chime in here). For my miscarriage, my level
was 5. For DD, when I had it checked early it was 20 (I think).
And I think low progesterone can cause spotting. Its just something
that, in hindsight, I wish I had done.

My hCG levels were rising quite slowly, but rising. We had serial
ultrasounds, and confirmed a nonviable pregnancy at 8.5 weeks (I think).
At that point my levels had started to drop. We never saw a fetal pole
or the heartbeat.

Did you have a u/s at all before that? I'm so sorry for your loss :-(

Thanks. We had multiple ultrasounds. Our first was early (6 weeks?)
for dating (I knew when I ovulated but my LMP date put me much
farther along - late ovulation, so they wanted to check). That ultrasound
dated the pregnancy at more like 5 weeks, so it was off with both my
LMP and my ovulation date. That's when they started checking HCG
and had me come back for a couple more ultrasounds. The sac got a little
bigger, but not as much as it should have and no fetal pole was ever seen.

I'm trying to determine if there comes a point where I'm "safe".

If you see a heartbeat on early ultrasound that is a *very* good
sign. Its not 100%, but it really improves your odds.

I'm sorry you are having this stress- it kind of takes alot of
the joy out of the pregnancy. So you know, with my daughter
we did do an early ultrasound (7w4d) and everything was
perfect (heart beat, embryo size). That eased my mind,
but I still had worries that I wouldn't have had, without the miscarriage.

My current pregnancy, I skipped all the hCG levels, and the
early ultrasound and just trusted that everything was OK, and
it has been (I'm 30 weeks). I've enjoyed this pregnancy alot
more.

Best of luck,

Mary

On Fri, 21 May 2004 12:54:03 -0400, Mary W. wrote:

What will that tell me? What should they be? Thank you.

I think progesterone levels lower than 10 is worrisome (maybe
someone can chime in here).

Yes, you're right. Below 5 is generally accepted to be a non-viable
pregnancy, between 5 and 10 is dubious, and above 10 is normal for first
trimester. Although it is not a given that all women with progesterone
below 5 will miscarry, and all women above 10 will have a healthy baby, a
combination of low progesterone with slow rising hCG is definitely not
a good sign.

In most cases, the low progesterone is a consequence and not a cause for
miscarriage. How I understood it too work: the fertilized egg will produce
hCG as soon as it burrows into the uterine lining, which signals the
corpus luteum to stay alive and produce progesterone. Initially the hCG
production will double every 48h, but this slows down after a few weeks.
The progesterone signals the uterus not to shed the endometrium so the
embryo can safely develop and grow. However, when the embryo dies, or the
egg isn't succesfull for another reason, the hCG production will slow down
and eventually drop. Then the corpus luteum dies as well, progesterone
will drop, and just like when you get your period, your uterus will shed
the lining and you will miscarry.

The only women where progesterone supplementing is of any use, is women
with a deficiency in their corpus luteum. In their case the hCG is
produced normally and will show normal doubling times, but the corpus
luteum doesn't respond with producing enough progesterone to maintain the
pregnancy and they have a high risk to miscarry. It is not always possible
to tell if a woman has this condition, therefore many doctors will give
supplements in case of low progesterone anyway.

HTH.

--
-- I
mommy to DS (July '02)
mommy to three tiny angels (28 Oct'03, 17 Feb'04 & 20 May'04)
guardian of DH (33)

"Melody" wrote in message
...


Theory 1: (Mind you I am NOT an auditory person, I'm a visual person so I
may not relay what she said with great accuracy, I'm hoping someone can
figure out what I'm talking about.) Is that there's been some sort of
bleeding between the placenta and where it attached for some reason or
another and that's what's causing my spotting. She said this is fairly
common and some women spot for days because of it, others have spotted for
up to 4 months. She said this condition will not affect the viability of
the
fetus. Likely? Anyone heard of this? This is a new one on me...

Yes, yes, yes! Very common. I had bleeding at about seven weeks with this
pregnancy. Bright red blood which scared me to death because I've miscarried
twice in the past year and a half. An ultrasound showed that my placenta was
forming low and the technician said that it was very likely a blood vessel
burst and that was the cause of the spotting. It ended fairly quickly, I had
no cramping at all and it turned to brown (old) blood after the initial
bleed. FWIW, the brown blood lasted for about a week.

Theory 2: I have a blighted ovum. I have heard of this, I know it is
fairly
common. My u/s last monday showed only a gestational sac and a yolk sac
but
I was determined to only be 4 to 5 weeks pregnant. My HCG levels went up
appropriately from Monday afternoon (9312) to Tuesday morning (13148).

Those are *fabulous* HCG numbers.

I won't have the results from todays HCG until tomorrow afternoon. If it
is
a blighted ovum how long will the HCG continue to rise? What should it be
at
by now? My midwife will be unavailable until Monday, the lab tech is
calling
with the results so I would like to have some idea on how to interpret
them.

I'd think that if it was bad news that *someone* would call to have you come
in. I doubt that they would just give you the numbers and say, "Have a nice
weekend".

I won't know anything for certain until Monday's ultrasound when I should
be
between 6 and 7 weeks pregnant. Will an ultrasound at this stage be
accurate
enough to make a proper diagnosis?

You should be far along enough to see a heartbeat and probably the placenta
starting to form through a transvaginal ultrasound. The tech should be able
to tell you where the placenta is forming.

Also, the midwife mentioned that they will offer me a D&C if it does turn
out to be a blighted ovum. Can anyone give me the risks and benefits of
having one? Is a blighted ovum guaranteed to come out on its own without
having one?

I had two miscarriages and ended up with a D&C with both. With the first, I
was too far along to feel comfortable letting it happen naturally (about 12
weeks) so I had a D&C. The second, I was about six weeks and decided to let
nature take it's course. This is just my experience, but the waiting was
pure HELL. I waited for over a month and finally some bleeding started, but
after over a week of bleeding an ultrasound showed that the sac was still
there. I hadn't passed any of it. I ended up with a D&C after all that
anyway. Very traumatic for me. I don't think it takes most women this long,
but it did for me and I was totally unprepared.

Choosing a D&C or miscarrying naturally is a highly personal decision that
only you can choose. I really hope that everything is fine, but if in the
unfortunate situation they aren't, feel free to post again about D&C vs.
natural miscarriage. You'll get a lot of support and information to help you
make your decision.

Let's hope we are discussing these options all for nothing. I know how
hard this time is for you. ((((Melody)))

--
JennP.

mom to Matthew 10/11/00
EDD #2 10/24/04
remove "no........spam" to reply

"JennP" wrote in message
news:MPTqc.26358$gr.2333756@attbi_s52...
Yes, yes, yes! Very common. I had bleeding at about seven weeks with this
pregnancy.

Wow, I had no idea this was so common. I never had any bright red blood (so
far at least) just brown.


Bright red blood which scared me to death because I've miscarried
twice in the past year and a half. An ultrasound showed that my placenta
was
forming low and the technician said that it was very likely a blood vessel
burst and that was the cause of the spotting. It ended fairly quickly, I
had
no cramping at all and it turned to brown (old) blood after the initial
bleed. FWIW, the brown blood lasted for about a week.


Mine seems to be tapering off. (I know this is prolly TMI) but I actually
had a BM without causing bleeding for the first time in over a week today
and I haven't spotted since yesterday morning... so I have some hope.


You should be far along enough to see a heartbeat and probably the
placenta
starting to form through a transvaginal ultrasound. The tech should be
able
to tell you where the placenta is forming.

I hope so...*crossing fingers*


Thanks for the replies and all the wonderful information. You guys have
saved my saity the past couple of days.

Melody

"Melody" wrote in message
...
I'm just *confused*. I'm hoping someone can help me Theory 1: (Mind you
I am NOT an auditory person, I'm a visual person so I
may not relay what she said with great accuracy, I'm hoping someone can
figure out what I'm talking about.) Is that there's been some sort of
bleeding between the placenta and where it attached for some reason or
another and that's what's causing my spotting. She said this is fairly
common and some women spot for days because of it, others have spotted for
up to 4 months. She said this condition will not affect the viability of
the
fetus. Likely? Anyone heard of this? This is a new one on me...


This sounds like a subchorionic hemorrhage, which I had in my last
pregnancy. Its basically a blood clot that bleeds itself out. I spotted
from about week 10 to week 16, and had a few instances of heavy
bleeding/cramping where I was convinced I was miscarrying. My midwife put
me on pelvic rest until my 18 week ultrasound showed that it was gone. I
now have a healthy 4 week old girl.

Good luck, I hope this turns out well for you.

Nancy

"Nancy P" wrote in message
...
This sounds like a subchorionic hemorrhage, which I had in my last
pregnancy. Its basically a blood clot that bleeds itself out. I spotted
from about week 10 to week 16, and had a few instances of heavy
bleeding/cramping where I was convinced I was miscarrying. My midwife put
me on pelvic rest until my 18 week ultrasound showed that it was gone. I
now have a healthy 4 week old girl.

Thanks Nancy, that gives me some hope. The corest term allowed me to look up
a lot more info too. This does sound like a real possibility. Thanks!

Melody

Melody wrote:
I'm just *confused*. I'm hoping someone can help me out a little.


Theory 1: (Mind you I am NOT an auditory person, I'm a visual person
so I may not relay what she said with great accuracy, I'm hoping
someone can figure out what I'm talking about.) Is that there's been
some sort of bleeding between the placenta and where it attached for
some reason or another and that's what's causing my spotting. She
said this is fairly common and some women spot for days because of
it, others have spotted for up to 4 months. She said this condition
will not affect the viability of the fetus. Likely? Anyone heard of
this? This is a new one on me...

When I was 8 ww pg I started bleeding. At first it was spotting like yours.
I went to the ER (Dr's orders and they said that our little bean was fine.
A week later I had serious bleeding. Back to the ER they found a big blood
clot just beside the placenta that was bigger than the embrio and
gestational sac! They gave me progesterone for a week and after 10 days or
so the bleeding stopped.

Hope that everything turns out fine for you, too.
I do understand the scare.

Pampering vibes to you

--
Love

Nicky

Proud mamma to Alexandra (03/22/2004)

Alexandra's birth announcement
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