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Example of LIES and the *gang* sticking together
http://groups.google.com/group/misc....0f3def4795324e
Jun 30 2005 You finally provided a definition, and I accepted it. There's no lie. I'll stop asking you for one now. -- --Rich http://groups.google.com/group/misc....c46f3bcb5c0d25 Aug 25 2005 There's no such thing as "*organized medicine*", Jan, until you define it. Where is that definition, Jan? -- --Rich http://groups.google.com/group/misc....b08b5bb2f35161 Aug 26 2005 So, is your definition of "*organized medicine*" "those who are influenced by the Rockefeller Foundation"? Will you stick to that? -- --Rich http://groups.google.com/group/misc....3641c15c2a5061 Aug 29 2005 You still have not proven a single lie on any of them. That is a REPEATED LIE. http://tinyurl.com/dv7rc Peters comments here are entirely factual. There is no lie. Once again, the only lie is your own. -- --Rich http://groups.google.com/group/misc....226cce852cb08f Aug 30 2005 First the LIAR. Peter Bowditch. Dr Death I was criticised recently for lack of balance in my choices of which forms and instances of medical fraud to feature here. The specific complaint was that I didn't have a page on this site about Dr Jayant Patel, late of Bundaberg Hospital in Queensland, Australia. My first response was that I don't have a page about every quack or charlatan in the world, not even all those whose web sites are listed here. My second response was that Dr Patel does not appear to have a web site himself, and nobody seems to have one supporting him. My third point was that Dr Patel was not practising quackery but was just a dangerously incompetent doctor. That wasn't good enough, and it was claimed that by not having something to say about him I was condoning his behaviour and I was exhibiting a double standard by criticising quacks but not members of something called "evil organised medicine". In fact, I was protecting him by not calling him a quack and it was all part of some form of cover-up. No lies in that paragraph. To people outside Australia (and those within who have been in a coma or otherwise disconnected from the world for the last few weeks) the name Dr Jayant Patel might mean nothing, but he was a doctor who managed to get a job at Bundaberg Hospital by lying about his qualifications and overseas experience. It now seems that he may have been directly responsible for the deaths of at least 87 patients. He may not have deliberately killed them, but his negligence and ignorance did. His hiring has revealed a huge hole in the recruitment practices of whoever it was that let him have a job, and the extent of the damage has shown that better methods of whistleblowing are required. Dr Patel has fled the country and nobody knows where he is. No lies in that paragraph. Quackery supporters are using Dr Patel as an example of the dangers of real medicine as compared to the absolute safety of alternatives. I have been challenged to name a single alternative practitioner who has killed 87 people. The facts are that real medicine has methods to deal with disasters like this, but alternative medicine hasn't even any useful system of adverse event reporting. There is a government enquiry under way, the recruitment and reporting problems are being identified and corrected, Dr Patel will be charged with criminal offences (manslaughter at least, possibly even murder), his extradition to Australia will be sought as soon as he is located, and he is looking forward to a long time behind bars. This was not a case of medical fraud, but one of a failure of management. It is a tragedy and a disgrace, but something is being done to stop it happening again. No lies in that paragraph. One delightful irony of this whole matter is that Dr Patel apparently said that it was not necessary to wash hands between patients because germs mean nothing. It is rather bizarre to see people holding these comments up as examples of the incorrect thinking of real doctors when those same people accept chiropractic, naturopathy, energy medicine, acupuncture, homeopathy and other magical medical paradigms in which pathogenic organisms play no part. But then, hypocrisy is never short on the ground when quacks start criticising medicine. No lies there either. ===== Now Rod, The HONEST Man. Rod is irrelevant. snip Jan, you keep posting this same thing as "proof" of a "lie" on Bowditch's site. Now get down to specifics and select out of the above JUST THE ONE SENTENCE THAT IS A LIE. That's all. If there is a lie there, you should be able to do that and tell us just what about the statement makes it a lie. Until you can, THERE IS NO LIE THERE, and Ratbags is NOT a "lying website". -- --Rich http://groups.google.com/group/misc....87393b831569ea Aug 31 2005 LadyLollipop" wrote in message news:EknRe.78667$084.39122@attbi_s22... So, is that the best you can do? Peter is a "blatant liar" and Ratbags is a "lying website" because Peter did not PROVE that certain accusations were made against him? That's way too thin. Peter's website is confrontational and controversial, and is bound to generate all sorts of responses, so why should we not believe that Peter got exactly the indictments he says he did. And why should he have to prove his statements about what happened to him? The bottom line is that you still have not exposed a single lie on Peter's website. Your accusation that it is a "lying website" is still the lie here. -- --Rich http://groups.google.com/group/misc....83fd4a1a508a79 Sept 1 2005 Actually, Jan, I have absolutely no recollection of you actually proving that Peter lied. I do recall that you have made this claim a thousand times, and have been asked for proof a thousand times, but, all you do is respond by saying that you already proved it. However, you never offer such proof. Since this is your standard operating procedure with regard to anyone who disagrees with you, or anyone who takes you to task for your abusive behavior and support of NetStalkers, why should anyone believe you? Again, you snip what you do not want to deal with. I posted the truth, and YOU CANNOT HANDLE THE TRUTH so you snip it. http://groups.google.com/group/misc....c47210364da330 Sept 1 2005 "Mark Probert" wrote. . snip lies from another proven liar, yawn So there you go again. Mark told no lie. You snipped his comment because you cannot handle the truth. Then you once again called him a "proven" liar. You provided no proof; you didn't even identify the lie. Again, the only lies are your own, and the only liar is YOU. -- --Rich Patel didn't wash hands between patients, inquiry told http://groups.google.com/group/misc....da07c98f128162 Post # 3 Hulda Clark Post # 19 Subject changed: Hulda Clark steals from the desperate Mark Probert http://groups.google.com/group/misc....571fa666d52381 http://groups.google.com/group/misc....56c5ff4f30cf8a Have you ever been caught lying No. LOL! This is another blatant lie. Do show us where Dr. Haley's fans said he has apologized! Do prove Mark S Probert disbarred attorney is NOT the Mark S. Probert that posts here on this newsgroup. Do show us Where Peter Moran was accused of LYING once for not spelling "syncrometer" correctly. Just WHERE was it claimed that you were condoning Dr. Patel's behavior????? Just WHERE did anyone say you were *protecting* him ot it was some kind of cover up????? Just WHERE has anyone one said there was absolute safety in alternative?? Just WHERE has anyone demanded evidence that anyone said or believed that liver flukes cause cancer? Just WHERE has anyone one *said* that liver flukers cause cancer on the newsgroup as of the date you you changed the wording? Just WHO is a strong supporter of cancer quack Hulda Clark? MANY OF THESE LIES ARE ON PETER'S WEBSITES!!!! "Peter Bowditch" wrote: "Jan Drew" wrote: "Peter Bowditch" wrote: "Jan Drew" wrote: "Peter Bowditch" wrote: "Jan Drew" wrote: "Peter Bowditch" wrote; "Max C." wrote: Mr. Moran, by chance are you familiar with the work of Dr. Otto Warburg? Max. It's Dr Moran, and why would he need to know about Otto Warburg, who won a Nobel Prize "for his discovery of the nature and mode of action of the respiratory enzyme"? Otto Warburg's It is Dr Otto Warburg and his research DID have to do with cancer despite what known and proven liar, Peter Bowditch has to say. http://www.stopcancer.com/ottolecture3.htm One must ask, then, why the word "cancer" appears ZERO times in Dr Warburg's 1931 Nobel acceptance speech. YOU may ask that... And you may answer if you like. There are however, MANY references to CANCER in the very subject relating to the Nobel Prize won by *DR* Warburg. There is ONE mention of cancer in the Presentation Speech by Professor E. Hammarsten. OOPPSEY. STILL talking out of both sides of your mouth, I see.... Now....just *WHERE* is DR Warburg's Nobel *acceptance* speech? You snipped it. NO, I did not snip it. That means I am entitled to say "**** off". In fact, you called it a "diversion". See below before you start on the "Liar" stuff. In FACT, I called a diversion EXACTLY this: There is, however, an oblique reference to the uselessness of laetrile in the treatment of cancer when he says "I will mention here two substances that can specifically and reversibly inhibit respiration in living substance: hydrocyanic acid (for historical reasons)and carbon monoxide (for other reasons)". Read the whole thing at http://nobelprize.org/medicine/laure...rg-lecture.pdf, unless you choose to think that the Nobel committee are part of the great organised medicine conspiracy. Now....just *WHERE* is DR Warburg's Nobel *acceptance* speech? The above is L E C T U R E, NOT an *acceptance* speech! If you think that one is "MANY" then I am not surprised that you believe that 1=2. I am NOT surprised to see you try to DECEIVE, as is your HABIT!! When caught, you....insult..... "The medical world expects great things from your experiments on cancer and other tumours, experiments which seem already to be sufficiently far advanced to be able to furnish an explanation for at least one cause of the destructive and unlimited growth of these tumours". Professor Hammarsten then went on to say what Dr Warburg was getting his ONLY Nobel Prize for. You might like to point out where the word "cancer" appears". "Your discovery about the nature and effect of the ferment of respiration, which the Caroline Institute is rewarding this year with Alfred Nobel's Prize for Physiology or Medicine ..." snip What Jan snipped was In part, your usual diversion about another subject.... Dr Warburg's Nobel lecture, in which he mentions cancer ZERO times. Why did you snip it Jan - I just told you. See - there's where you admit See - there's where I just told you why I snipped it...... I admitted nothing. that I posted Dr Warburg's speech OOPPPSEY. What happened to *acceptance* speech? STILL deceiving!!! STILL caught. Out comes the vulgarity...... but you snipped it. **** off squared. Grow up! is allowing people to read Dr Warburg's words "diversion"? are you frightened that people might notice that he didn't get the Nobel Prize for cancer research. Not even. People have the ability to make decision all by themselves. NOT based of your DECEITFULNESS. It would really be deceitful to claim that Dr Warburg got his ONLY Nobel Prize for his cancer research when the person presenting him with the gong made the point that it was awarded for something else. research had nothing to do with cancer, despite what alternuts have to say. And he only won the Nobel once, not twice as mythology would have it. *ONLY* once... Yes, Jan, ONLY once. Therefore the statement on the site you referenced above that he "was voted a second Nobel Prize in 1944 for his discovery of the active groups of the hydrogen transferring enzymes" is what is known as a LIE. No, no, no. Deceiving, Peter... *was voted*.... Was voted by whom? If he was voted why wasn't he presented? It is an unfortunate fact of life that if you don't get a Nobel Prize you don't get a Nobel Prize. According to the Nobel site, Dr Warburg won the prize in 1931. Once. Never again. Once. Not twice. Irrevelant. Known as the Bowditch...dance...when caught.... Please explain how once equals twice, Jan. The Nobel Prize people think that Dr Warburg only won once. I realise that the Karolinska Institutet is an integral part of "organised medicine", but surely they would be the people who would know. Care to retract your statement? *Yes, Jan, ONLY once. Therefore the statement on the site you referenced above that he "was voted a second Nobel Prize in 1944 for his discovery of the active groups of the hydrogen transferring enzymes" is what is known as a LIE.* Was voted in FACT.... was NOT a lie. I have removed you words and put them in the correct place. Why should I retract a statement that someone who won only one Nobel Prize only won the Nobel Prize once? That would be silly. That was NOT the statement...... Ready to retract, yet? *Yes, Jan, ONLY once. Therefore the statement on the site you referenced above that he "was voted a second Nobel Prize in 1944 for his discovery of the active groups of the hydrogen transferring enzymes" is what is known as a LIE.* Was voted in FACT.... was NOT a lie. Ready to retract, now? Oh, by the way, Ready to retract, yet? [snip, ye ole Bowditch diversion dance] In FACT, it shows, YOU are a DECEIVER. O what a tangled web we weave...when first we practice to deceive...... I agree it is deceptive to say that someone won two Nobel Prizes when it is so very easy to prove that he won only one. WHO said that? HELLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO WHO SAID THAT?!?!?! YOU get caught as the ONLY LIAR........ Except the people who say that 1+0=2, of course. WHO said that? HELLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO WHO SAID THAT?!?! By the way and speaking of liars, SEE ABOVE...... snip Peter Bowditch From: "Peter Bowditch" Subject: Peter Bowditch can NOT Back Up His Claims Date: Sunday, June 26, 2005 1:19 AM "LadyLollipop" wrote: Do show us where Dr. Haley's fans said he has apologized! Do prove Mark S Probert disbarred attorney is NOT the Mark S. Probert that posts here on this newsgroup. Do show us Where Peter Moran was accused of LYING once for not spelling "syncrometer" correctly. Jan Do **** off. -- Peter Bowditch http://groups.google.com/group/alt.s...b5f458996e5840 Peter Bowditch" wrote in message ... "LadyLollipop" wrote: "Jeff" wrote in message ink.net... "Ilena Rose" wrote in message ups.com... Never unrestricted medical license Quack Vac Flack J P UTZ proclaims: "The reality is that the question of whether or not vaccines cause autism has been settled." Only in Quackland ... How about showing evidence that vaccines cause autism? Jeff It HAS NOT been settled! Jeff didn't say I don't need YOU Mr LIAR to tell me What Jeff did or didn't ask or say. YOU have a whole list of LIES and claims that YOU have not backed up because YOU made them up. MANY of them are on your LYING websites. -- Peter Bowditch Like this list. Do show us where Dr. Haley's fans said he has apologized! Do prove Mark S Probert disbarred attorney is NOT the Mark S. Probert that posts here on this newsgroup. Do show us Where Peter Moran was accused of LYING once for not spelling "syncrometer" correctly. Do show us where you saw this : I see that Jan has changed her question from "who says ..." to "who believes ...". Just WHERE was it claimed that you were condoning Dr. Patel behavior????? Just WHERE did anyone say you were *protecting* him ot it was some kind of cover up????? Just WHERE has anyone one said there was absolute safety in alternative?? Just WHERE has anyone demanded evidence that anyone said or believed that liver flukes cause cancer? Just WHERE has anyone one *said* that liver flukes cause cancer on the newsgroup as of the date you changed the wording? Just WHO is a strong supporter of cancer quack Hulda Clark? Peter has NOT proved a SINGLE one. Peter Bowditch REPEATEDLY LIES!!!!! Many of these LIES is ON HIS WEBSITE!!!!! Jan http://groups.google.com/group/alt.s...214ee54be8beac snip things that are not evidence, even if mice are involved -- Peter Bowditch |
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Example of LIES and the *gang* sticking together
Oh, get a life, Jan. You know, some people would really like to be able to find SUPPORT when they're going through a difficult patch. But they can't find it on any of the groups to which you ECP, because of your garbage. Kitten |
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Example of LIES and the *gang* sticking together
"Caitriona Mac Fhiodhbhuidhe" wrote in message oups.com... Oh, get a life, Jan. You know, some people would really like to be able to find SUPPORT when they're going through a difficult patch. But they can't find it on any of the groups to which you ECP, because of your garbage. Kitten lol. Yes, I know you do not like your buddies and gang members exposed. Mark Probert. Rich Shewmaker. Peter Bowditch. Did you have anything to say about THEIR lies?? No, of course not you try to slam me. Typical for you, because you are a liar yourself. |
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Example of LIES and the *gang* sticking together
Jan Drew wrote: "Caitriona Mac Fhiodhbhuidhe" wrote in message oups.com... Oh, get a life, Jan. You know, some people would really like to be able to find SUPPORT when they're going through a difficult patch. But they can't find it on any of the groups to which you ECP, because of your garbage. Kitten lol. Yes, I know you do not like your buddies and gang members exposed. snipped No, of course not you try to slam me. Typical for you, because you are a liar yourself. Slam you, Jan? No, I'm just tired of seeing nothing but vitriol when I log onto the group, especially when I'm needing a bit of support with things going on in my life. Anything good and supportive is smothered under the garbage posted by you and your ilk. I'm not going to get into a discussion with you about who does or does not lie. You'll continue believing what you believe, no matter what anyone else has to say. But you know, it'd be nice if those of us who NEED SUPPORT for things going on in our lives could get it, rather than getting a dose of hatred from you and your buddies. Kitten |
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Some wee support (Was:Example of LIES and the *gang* sticking together)
snipped
Slam you, Jan? No, I'm just tired of seeing nothing but vitriol when I log onto the group, especially when I'm needing a bit of support with things going on in my life. I'm sorry you're going through a rough patch. I agree, it's wearisome to try to sort through the junk here to get to the jewels. Wish I had an answer for that. "Courage does not always roar. Sometimes courage is the quiet voice at the end of the day saying, "'I will try again tomorrow.'" --Mary Ann Radmacher hth, w |
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Example of LIES and the *gang* sticking together
"Caitriona Mac Fhiodhbhuidhe" wrote in message ups.com... Jan Drew wrote: "Caitriona Mac Fhiodhbhuidhe" wrote in message oups.com... Oh, get a life, Jan. You know, some people would really like to be able to find SUPPORT when they're going through a difficult patch. But they can't find it on any of the groups to which you ECP, because of your garbage. Kitten lol. Yes, I know you do not like your buddies and gang members exposed. snipped No, of course not you try to slam me. Typical for you, because you are a liar yourself. Slam you, Jan? No, I'm just tired of seeing nothing but vitriol when I log onto the group, especially when I'm needing a bit of support with things going on in my life. Anything good and supportive is smothered under the garbage posted by you and your ilk. I'm not going to get into a discussion with you about who does or does not lie. You'll continue believing what you believe, no matter what anyone else has to say. But you know, it'd be nice if those of us who NEED SUPPORT for things going on in our lives could get it, rather than getting a dose of hatred from you and your buddies. Kitten Can it Kitten, you can plainly see that they lied. They post here and you join in with their lies. You don't complain when they lie about me, in fact you join it. I have no ilk. They and you do. You just proved it by saying nothing about their lies. |
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Example of LIES and the *gang* sticking together
"Jan Drew" wrote:
KACHING!! $1 (mentioning *gang* (TING) in title) snip huge JanRant(tm) which shows Jan continually failing to provide evidence of lying I think I saw some implication in the snippage that I might have been lying at some time, so here's another two postage stamps for ACAHF. KACHING!! $1 -- Peter Bowditch aa #2243 The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles Australian Council Against Health Fraud http://www.acahf.org.au Australian Skeptics http://www.skeptics.com.au To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com |
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Example of LIES and the *gang* sticking together
"Jan Drew" wrote:
"Caitriona Mac Fhiodhbhuidhe" wrote in message oups.com... Oh, get a life, Jan. You know, some people would really like to be able to find SUPPORT when they're going through a difficult patch. But they can't find it on any of the groups to which you ECP, because of your garbage. Kitten lol. Yes, I know you do not like your buddies and gang members exposed. KACHING!! $1 - *gang* (TING) Mark Probert. Rich Shewmaker. Peter Bowditch. Did you have anything to say about THEIR lies?? KACHING!! $1 Keep it up Jan. ACAHF needs a new inkjet printer. No, of course not you try to slam me. Typical for you, because you are a liar yourself. Maybe next month I will give a donation every time Jan calls anyone a liar. Maybe not - I don't want to go broke. -- Peter Bowditch aa #2243 The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles Australian Council Against Health Fraud http://www.acahf.org.au Australian Skeptics http://www.skeptics.com.au To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com |
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Example of LIES and the *gang* sticking together
"Caitriona Mac Fhiodhbhuidhe" wrote:
Jan Drew wrote: "Caitriona Mac Fhiodhbhuidhe" wrote in message oups.com... Oh, get a life, Jan. You know, some people would really like to be able to find SUPPORT when they're going through a difficult patch. But they can't find it on any of the groups to which you ECP, because of your garbage. Kitten lol. Yes, I know you do not like your buddies and gang members exposed. snipped No, of course not you try to slam me. Typical for you, because you are a liar yourself. Slam you, Jan? No, I'm just tired of seeing nothing but vitriol when I log onto the group, especially when I'm needing a bit of support with things going on in my life. Anything good and supportive is smothered under the garbage posted by you and your ilk. I'm not going to get into a discussion with you about who does or does not lie. You'll continue believing what you believe, no matter what anyone else has to say. But you know, it'd be nice if those of us who NEED SUPPORT for things going on in our lives could get it, rather than getting a dose of hatred from you and your buddies. Kitten I hope you don't include me in the list of Jan's "buddies" - that would cause her to go apoplectic. I'm trying to educate her and change her obnoxious behaviour. My campaign is having some effect, because there are some offences which she hasn't committed since the start of November. I might be a little optimistic, but I would hope that one day we can all get on with what these groups are about and Jan can post sensible contributions and have rational discussions. Perhaps she should post in OCD groups, where constant repetition is the norm. I have a particular interest in her anti-psychiatry posts, which is why I have a KACHING!! donation going on this month for every time she posts something from Scientology or CCHR. As she has refrained from this so far in December I am pleased. She sailed rather close to the wind with an article about how the TGA in Australia is supposed to be doing something about Strattera. The article had a distinct stench of CCHR about it, but I haven't been able to prove the link (unlike the last time she jumped into the Australian ADHD swamp). -- Peter Bowditch aa #2243 The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles Australian Council Against Health Fraud http://www.acahf.org.au Australian Skeptics http://www.skeptics.com.au To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com |
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Example of LIES and the *gang* sticking together
Peter Bowditch expounded:
I hope you don't include me in the list of Jan's "buddies" - that would cause her to go apoplectic. I'm trying to educate her and change her obnoxious behaviour. My campaign is having some effect, because there are some offences which she hasn't committed since the start of November. Well, it would be nice if you taught her outside of ASAD, because her constant lunacy doesn't do anything to help the tenor around here. Just snip ASAD and go at it in all the other groups, if that's what you feel you must do. -- Ann e-mail address is not checked |
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