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Man shoots at noisy teenagers, killing one



 
 
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  #21  
Old December 2nd 03, 03:47 PM
Al Lewis
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Default Man shoots at noisy teenagers, killing one

On Tue, 02 Dec 2003 18:05:25 +1100, AlexT

Al Lewis wrote:

How do you know he didn't try that last week?

Just playing devil's advocate - I doubt he did.


Even if he had tried it, would that justify shooting at the car?


No, but he should have done what Richard Pryor did. He killed the car,
not the driver.
  #23  
Old December 2nd 03, 05:57 PM
Brent P
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Default Man shoots at noisy teenagers, killing one

In article , Ignoramus29143 wrote:

Anyway, all this talk about banning guns is moot as there is a
constitutional amendment protecting their ownership.


And it is becoming less and less effective like every other part of
the bill of rights. New laws are consistantly making for ways to
effectively alow the government work their way around the bill of rights
without actually repealling it.


  #24  
Old December 2nd 03, 06:03 PM
Cathy Weeks
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Default Man shoots at noisy teenagers, killing one

Banty wrote in message ...

The best you can argue is that this isn't murder one. This is a good-old
fashioned case of stupidly killing someone in anger. The man who shoots his
wife caught en-flagrante is still a murderer, the gang member who shoots another
banger because 'he was in my face' is still a murderer. Bernie Getz was a
murderer. There really aren't that many murders which are truly cold and
unprovoked. This is like blaming road rage on traffic.


OK. Point taken. BUT, I did fall into my own personal rut when it
comes to assuming he was provoked. I've had too many people turn the
volume *up* when I asked it to be turned down. But I also said, and
it's true, that we don't know all the details. He could just be some
idiot with anger issues who murdered someone in cold blood, or he
could be someone who had tried many times - using the appropriate
channels - to get the kids to quit drag racing on his street.

As memory serves, Bernard Goetz though those guys were going to mug
him. Likely the situation wasn't as dangerous as he might have
thought (the average mugging doesn't usually result in death), but he
thought he was protecting himself. Calling him a murderer seems a bit
unfair. I am NOT addressing the issue of him possibly being a racist
(don't know if he was or wasn't).

On the other two examples - agreed. Those people are still murderers.

We're responsible for our actions, including reactions - there's little
difference in practice between the two anyway. If it were a problem - he should
have taken it to the authorities.


And we don't know that he didn't. I doubt the police department would
be anxious to share that information.

And it's completely possible that, if you're
anxious to blame things on who has irritated whom, the man had irritated the
teens by previously registering trivial complaints and yelling at them for more
normal car activities. Which doesn't excuse the teens either, but I put
disturbing the peace and murder on whole different planes of evil. I'm
wondering if certain respondants here really find them comparable. Do you??


Of course not. But until the full results of the investigation are
released (if ever) we cannot really understand what happened, or
assign ANY justifiability or lack thereof.

Cathy Weeks
Mommy to Kivi Alexis 12/01
  #25  
Old December 2nd 03, 06:37 PM
Banty
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Default Man shoots at noisy teenagers, killing one

In article , Cathy Weeks
says...

Banty wrote in message
...

The best you can argue is that this isn't murder one. This is a good-old
fashioned case of stupidly killing someone in anger. The man who shoots his
wife caught en-flagrante is still a murderer, the gang member who shoots another
banger because 'he was in my face' is still a murderer. Bernie Getz was a
murderer. There really aren't that many murders which are truly cold and
unprovoked. This is like blaming road rage on traffic.


OK. Point taken. BUT, I did fall into my own personal rut when it
comes to assuming he was provoked. I've had too many people turn the
volume *up* when I asked it to be turned down.


Let's say you encountered a real asshole who really cranked it up. Everytime he
saw you. I understand the frustration about that, but do you see shooting
anywhere in that picture?

I'm certainly willing to grant that the situation up to the shooting could have
been very obnoxious. (But I'm not ready to assume it was - I've seen people go
off the deep end both ways about wanting their way exactly.) But deadly action
to solve it is in a different category of a question. That's rather clear-cut.

He coudl have done anything up to kicking his son out of the house if he was old
enough (after all - this wasn't random drag-racing - they were actually guests
of a household member!) to moving from what may have been a bad location for him
to live in. Even if all other channels were exhausted - completely unresponsive
police, unresponsive parents, unresponsive son.

You don't kill people over something like that.

Banty

  #26  
Old December 2nd 03, 09:22 PM
ColoradoSkiBum
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Default Man shoots at noisy teenagers, killing one

: That's what I said! Except that I wouldn't have put up with it for one
more
: night and waited until morning, I would have gone over to the friend's
: parents' house *right away*, after first videotaping the incident taking
: place in the street.
:
: How do you know he didn't try that last week?
:
: Just playing devil's advocate - I doubt he did.

I don't know--not like they would tell you that in a newspaper anyway.
--
ColoradoSkiBum

  #27  
Old December 2nd 03, 09:24 PM
ColoradoSkiBum
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Posts: n/a
Default Man shoots at noisy teenagers, killing one

: Another screwed up puppet of the NRA goes to jail .
:
: And the Supreme Court says UP YOURS to the NRA gun lobbyists!!!!
:
: Good news !!!!!!!

WTF are you talking about???? The Supreme Court has repeatedly *upheld* the
right to own guns.
--
ColoradoSkiBum

  #28  
Old December 2nd 03, 10:33 PM
Arif Khokar
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Default Man shoots at noisy teenagers, killing one

Brent P wrote:

In article , Ignoramus29143 wrote:


Anyway, all this talk about banning guns is moot as there is a
constitutional amendment protecting their ownership.


And it is becoming less and less effective like every other part of
the bill of rights. New laws are consistantly making for ways to
effectively alow the government work their way around the bill of rights
without actually repealling it.


That and the fact that the courts are not doing their part in declaring
such laws unconstitutional...

  #29  
Old December 3rd 03, 02:07 AM
DTJ
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Default Man shoots at noisy teenagers, killing one

On Tue, 02 Dec 2003 16:01:04 +1100, AlexT wrote:

who killed their son, and his once peaceful street is now the scene of a
murder investigation.


And is now a peaceful, quiet street once again...
  #30  
Old December 3rd 03, 02:19 AM
Jim Yanik
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Default Man shoots at noisy teenagers, killing one

Asmodeus wrote in
. 199.17:

"P. Tierney" wrote in news:TwOyb.383376
$Tr4.1120836@attbi_s03:

The gun lobby sure knows how to stoke the fear, and make a buck.
Sell guns to criminals. A lot of them. Then tell suburbia that the
guns are all out there and can't be brought back, so they had better
buy some to protect themselves against "evil people". Nice way to
make a profit


Cite your evidence for this drivel.



Especially the "sell guns to criminals" part.

--
Jim Yanik,NRA member
jyanik-at-kua.net
 




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