Ideas sought...

In article , Banty
wrote:

The teacher's suggestion is for me to play with him in the hallway, but (a)
I'm not sure that the manager would approve and (b) the hall has not one,
but *two* ungated stairwells (the school is above a shop). I'm a bit at a
loss.

But the teacher is suggesting it - presumably he or she knows more of what
the manager allows than you. At the least, if the manager complains to you,
you can tell him the teacher suggested it.

The teacher is very young and quite new, and perhaps not familiar with the
concept of Public Liability Insurance. My required presence in the classroom
may have more to do with that than anything else. I will ask the teacher to
check that this is acceptable.

snip quoted vent

But the four year old is a paying customer, and two 'wrongs' dont' make a
right.

That's why it's a vent. Life isn't fair. Nothing I can do about this
situation, especially now the teacher has spoken to *me* -- can you imagine
how bad it would sound to suggest the little boy go to the preschool class?!
But Blind Freddy can see it though, and for all I know the teacher has already
suggested it to the mother.

Really, this one isn't a difficult problem. The real problem is that it is
not exactly relaxing to do what's needed, and you can't watch the older one
take the lesson if you do what's needed, so you haven't been willing. But
you can't just chill and let the baby run around.

The real problem is that you haven't read the OP carefully. Where does it say
that my role is merely to watch DS1? That I haven't been actively trying to
keep DS2 out of the way? And that I'm just chilling and letting the baby run
around? Did you need coffee when you posted?

--
Chookie -- Sydney, Australia
(Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply)

"Parenthood is like the modern stone washing process for denim jeans. You may
start out crisp, neat and tough, but you end up pale, limp and wrinkled."
Kerry Cue

In article , Banty
wrote:

I missed the part about your participation being needed. Really? Is it? How
have you been doing that and having baby all this time anyway? Is this
possibly a requirement just to make sure they're not a babysitting service,
and having to deal with late pickups? What kind of participation do you
need to do?

Quite possibly these are the times that DS2 is distracting the teacher! We
join in some dances/ rhythm patterns, open books to the correct page, help
seat our children properly at their keyboards, admire, applaud and encourage.
We also provide the usual parent interpreting service -- explaining the child
to the teacher.

I think you're unecessarily closing off your options, though. If the teacher
suggests the hallway, you imagine a disapproving manager. You assert your
IL's will be imposed upon if they watch the younger, but so often from what
I've seen IRL this isn't really the case. At any rate, they should want to
help out with predicaments for their grandchildren's sake, no?

One would think so, but I hesitate to ask anyone to mind a baby for a period
that includes arsenic hour, particularly older people. He's still a very
booby boy. Let's say the ILs will be a way down the list.

Can hubby truly not watch the baby for awhile? Doesn't he at home?

Well, DH is usually at work at 4:15. However, your use of the word 'home' has
reminded me that most of the firm work from home on Wednesdays, and DH is able
to do this. Perhaps this will be simple to solve after all!

"Manager won't approve, imposing, not good with babies" - I recognize a
string of excusifying here. Bringing baby with you simply
is the most convenient option for you and you don't want to give it up.

Of course not. I was really hoping some one would come up with a suite of
toys that would keep DS2 happily and quietly occupied for 45 mins, but as his
favourite activities atm include pulling books off shelves and stuff out of
cupboards, that may be a lost cause. (Has anyone invented a portable kitchen
cupboard full of tupperware yet?!)

Chookie - this really is a problem for others. People may smile at you and
not want to anger you, but their teeth is on edge, believe me.

I would be more inclined to think so if I had not previously been in a class
with a busy toddler who was the younger sibling of a student. That is why I
was surprised when the teacher complained. But as several people have said,
it's her class.

--
Chookie -- Sydney, Australia
(Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply)

"Parenthood is like the modern stone washing process for denim jeans. You may
start out crisp, neat and tough, but you end up pale, limp and wrinkled."
Kerry Cue

In article . com,
"Irene" wrote:

I read the OP as Chookie's Dad, not her hubby. I'm assuming
Chookie's dh is at work during the class?

Yep. It's my Dad who's legally blind.

I do think Ericka and others had some good ideas further down the
thread. It's disappointing they don't have better facilities for
siblings during class.

Yes, it's a tight fit. They have a tiny waiting area with some toys and 4
seats, right at the top of a steep flight of stairs. I leave the stroller at
the foot of the stairs as there is no place I could leave it upstairs
withoutcausing a hazard to shipping. The space is all music rooms, and on
weekday afternoons they are in heavy use. I don't know how the people
downstairs (medical imaging) put up with the noise of feet dancing around a
Mexican Hat all day, let alone a constant stream of faulty renditions of Fur
Elise... How *do* music teachers cope?!

--
Chookie -- Sydney, Australia
(Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply)

"Parenthood is like the modern stone washing process for denim jeans. You may
start out crisp, neat and tough, but you end up pale, limp and wrinkled."
Kerry Cue

In article ,
"Donna Metler" wrote:

FWIW, most parent participation curricula I'm familiar with stop requiring
parent participation through all of class at age 3-4, and instead have a
"sharing time" at the end where the children show their parents what they've
done

No, not in this case. They are very into kinaesthetic learning so there's a
lot of dancing, singing, rhythm games, etc, with parents dancing with the
child or helping with the rhythm. Also, parents keep the kids focussed. 5yos
are not at their best after a day of school and a parent can cut the gigglies
short before the child gets completely silly. We do have little
'performances' from time to time, but they seem to be mid-lesson.

I like the physical activity of the class -- the last thing a 5yo can cope
with is 45 mins sitting at a keyboard in the late afternoon. This school's
style of teaching seems very much in tune with the developmental stage of the
children -- short activities and plenty of movement. I like the
listen-and-guess-the-note-sequence game too.

--
Chookie -- Sydney, Australia
(Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply)

"Parenthood is like the modern stone washing process for denim jeans. You may
start out crisp, neat and tough, but you end up pale, limp and wrinkled."
Kerry Cue

In article ,
wrote:

Can you enrol DS2 as a student in the music class? :-)

Not for another 6 months, and it would be a different class.

--
Chookie -- Sydney, Australia
(Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply)

"Parenthood is like the modern stone washing process for denim jeans. You may
start out crisp, neat and tough, but you end up pale, limp and wrinkled."
Kerry Cue

In article .com,
"Cheryl" wrote:

I don't know how she can say that parental participation is necessary
and then say that you can take #2 out into the hallway to play with
him. Either your presence is necessary all the time or you could be
nowhere near the place, there really isn't any middle ground there.

Yes, this is what concerned me about the suggestion, and why I'll suggest she
OK it with the boss first.

--
Chookie -- Sydney, Australia
(Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply)

"Parenthood is like the modern stone washing process for denim jeans. You may
start out crisp, neat and tough, but you end up pale, limp and wrinkled."
Kerry Cue

Here are all the suggestions so far. Thank you all for helping; I'll let you
know what pans out.

* Talk to the teacher about whether your participation is really
required and, if it is not, leave and take your younger child elsewhere
during the class

* Get DH to work from home on Wednesdays and be a bit less productive for
some of it.

* Bite the bullet and ask the grandparents if they'd be
willing to babysit.

* Look for a local drop-in daycare for the 1yo.

* invite one of the in-laws along, and have either them or you
look after the 1yo, while the other does the parent participation part.

* Hire a babysitter, either near your home for a
long stretch, or near the class for a short stretch.

* Bring along a "mother's helper" (=young babysitter?) to the class

* tag teaming with another parent in a similar predicament, or share a
babysitter.

* Bring along a playpen

* Switch to lessons where parental participation is
not required.

* Switch to lessons with a nursery.

* Pull your older son out of the class

--
Chookie -- Sydney, Australia
(Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply)

"Parenthood is like the modern stone washing process for denim jeans. You may
start out crisp, neat and tough, but you end up pale, limp and wrinkled."
Kerry Cue

In article , Chookie
says...

In article , Banty
wrote:

The teacher's suggestion is for me to play with him in the hallway, but (a)
I'm not sure that the manager would approve and (b) the hall has not one,
but *two* ungated stairwells (the school is above a shop). I'm a bit at a
loss.

But the teacher is suggesting it - presumably he or she knows more of what
the manager allows than you. At the least, if the manager complains to you,
you can tell him the teacher suggested it.

The teacher is very young and quite new, and perhaps not familiar with the
concept of Public Liability Insurance. My required presence in the classroom
may have more to do with that than anything else. I will ask the teacher to
check that this is acceptable.

Still, it's not _your_ problem. And have you seen their insurance policy or
limitations? Do you truly know what it is, or is this your guess. The teacher
you think isn't knowledgable because she's new, but you, as a partron, knows all
their restrictions?? C'mon. There's no reason for you to overrule her. If
you're right about the insurance thing, let the manager talk to her. It's
simply not your purview to be concerning yourself about it. You're closing off
one of your options.


snip quoted vent

But the four year old is a paying customer, and two 'wrongs' dont' make a
right.

That's why it's a vent. Life isn't fair. Nothing I can do about this
situation, especially now the teacher has spoken to *me* -- can you imagine
how bad it would sound to suggest the little boy go to the preschool class?!
But Blind Freddy can see it though, and for all I know the teacher has already
suggested it to the mother.

I don't even know if it's "unfair". The child is getting a lesson. To be
"fair", is the music school to reject all students with ADHD or simliar
problems, if they're to otherwise keep a non-distracting atmosphere??



Really, this one isn't a difficult problem. The real problem is that it is
not exactly relaxing to do what's needed, and you can't watch the older one
take the lesson if you do what's needed, so you haven't been willing. But
you can't just chill and let the baby run around.

The real problem is that you haven't read the OP carefully. Where does it say
that my role is merely to watch DS1? That I haven't been actively trying to
keep DS2 out of the way? And that I'm just chilling and letting the baby run
around? Did you need coffee when you posted?


OK, the first time I missed that they needed parent participation. I did
correct that - possibly you haven't read farther into the thread (where's your
tea - fix it now.) But, in this list of "where does it say I didn't...", I
don't see what parent participation IS needed. That's what I'm curious about.
And, if the baby is disruptive, whatever you're doing ain't working.

You simply need to use one of your other existing options, or try one of new
ones suggested in this thread. Yes, none of them will be as smashingly
convenient and free of charge as what you're presently doing. But that's only
because it's at cost to others at the music school.

Banty


--

Chookie wrote:

Of course not. I was really hoping some one would come up with a suite of
toys that would keep DS2 happily and quietly occupied for 45 mins, but as his
favourite activities atm include pulling books off shelves and stuff out of
cupboards, that may be a lost cause. (Has anyone invented a portable kitchen
cupboard full of tupperware yet?!)

I think the reason that you haven't heard this
suggestion is that most of us who've been there realize
that it's futile ;-) There are very rare toddlers who'll
sit quietly and play in this sort of situation, but not
enough of them that better toys seems like a reasonable
solution to propose!

Best wishes,
Ericka

In article , Ericka Kammerer
says...

Chookie wrote:

Of course not. I was really hoping some one would come up with a suite of
toys that would keep DS2 happily and quietly occupied for 45 mins, but as his
favourite activities atm include pulling books off shelves and stuff out of
cupboards, that may be a lost cause. (Has anyone invented a portable kitchen
cupboard full of tupperware yet?!)

I think the reason that you haven't heard this
suggestion is that most of us who've been there realize
that it's futile ;-) There are very rare toddlers who'll
sit quietly and play in this sort of situation, but not
enough of them that better toys seems like a reasonable
solution to propose!


I don't see the post you responded to, but, since we've all been parents of
toddlers, yes, you're right. Something might work *once*, but not time after
time.

But mostly, whatever would work would have to mean a *lot* of second to second
parental attention to the toddler, kinda like having a toddler with you on an
airline flight. And that doesn't accomodate a kinesthetic parent-participation
music class.

Banty


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