Child support - who needs it?

(Andre Lieven) wrote in message ...
My Own Doppelganger ) writes:
Well, it's like whatever is best for the kids.

Eh me God, it's, like, whatever's best for the kids 'n stuff.

Hey Buffy, it's best for the kids if I knock over a 7-11 and give the
loot to a kid's charity. Think they'd still put me in jail for it?

However, I do have a question... Why would a NCP NOT provide some
type of child support? I mean, aren't the kids theirs also?

Two sets of reasons.

1) Can't.
2) Won't.

The second is less common than the first. The first set could have
the following subsets.

a) In jail.

b) Poor.

c) Court order is based on "imputed" income, which is what some judge
rules that he _could_ make, if only he really really tried. Thus, the
order is out of proportion to his actual income, and the only possible
way to make the payments would be to live in a roach infested box and
ride a used Honda scooter back and forth to work. And even that might
not work. So then he winds up with arrearages, and those have
interest, and the debt quickly builds into a colossus that he can't
pay. It's kind of like credit card debt, only the child support
people aren't out for a profit. -Or are they?- Regardless, he
becomes another "deadbeat dad" statistic.

I'd say subset b is common, since the typical child support beggar is
an inner-city welfare queen with a habit of banging indigent men.
Then she stands aghast when they don't pay child support. Well duh.
What did she think would happen?

The second set has a variety of subsets. Sometimes the father didn't
even know she was pregnant until after the baby was born. He never
got word of the paternity hearing, and was thus declared the father en
absentia. One day, he gets a letter ordering him to pay thousands of
dollars, and he tells them all to f--- off.

Other times, the father flat out told the mohter, prior to birth, -I
don't want this child-. You either have an abortion, give the child
up for adoption, or drop it off at a fire station. I'll have nothing
to do with this. I won't pay child support. Of course she has the
child anyway, idiot that she is, then stands aghast when he won't pay
child support. Well duh. What did she think would happen?

Other times, a man paying child support _isn't the actual father of
the child_. Yet through legal and verbal contortions, the State
talks itself into shaking him down. Of course, he doesn't want to
pay.

I'm beginning to sound like Ron Popeil, but instead of saying "set it
and forget it," my refrain has become, "What did she think would
happen???"

Do women lack any kind of foresight whatsoever?

[...]

The *silence* from women is palpable. Nor do I mean the very few
women here on Usenet, but the *millions* of greedy women going
to kourts, demanding loot for the begging bowls *they unilaterally
chose to whelp*.

If sex is not the determinant time of parental choice for a
woman ( The existance of abortion, RU-486, legal adopting out,
and legal woman-only abandon laws shows that it *isn't* ),
then its SEXIST to claim that it must be, for *men, only*...

Andre

Not only is it sexist. It _should_ be embarassing for the women who
drive this engine, because they do so out of greed and a pathetic
inability to be responsible for their acts. Consider:

We have abortion on demand, because women shout from the rooftops for
it, and Godess forbid they should have to bear a child they conceive.

But the cackling about abortion on demand is all for nought, because
most will have the child and use it to live beyond their means anyway.

And all of the pitiful begging they do for OPM (other people's money)
comes just after they tell us how strong and independent they are, and
how we're supposed to hear them roar.

I'm listening, ladies. I can't hear it. Are you roaring yet?
Perhaps the cries of your indigent babies is drowning it out.

happilyhippy ) writes:
(Andre Lieven) wrote in message ...
happilyhippy ) writes:
(Andre Lieven) wrote in message ...
My Own Doppelganger ) writes:
Well, it's like whatever is best for the kids.

However, I do have a question... Why would a NCP NOT provide some
type of child support? I mean, aren't the kids theirs also?

So ? In the case of children either not of marriages, or the hundreds
of thousands of men being garnished from, who are *not* the bio-
fathers of the children they're being stolen from to pay some lying
woman, there was NO express prior agreement to become a parent
offered the guy.

Further, in all such cases, the *woman is the sole chooser* as to
whether or not there will BE a child.

" Her body, her choice... HER RESPONSIBILITY. "

What part of women being *as responsible for their own choices as
their choices are*, is unclear to you ?

On Tue, 24 Feb 2004 23:20:17 -0600, Anti-Sheila J
smcneillAToddpostDOTcom wrote:

If the court would award me custody of my two daughters (ages 8 and
5), I would be willing to waive child support AND make certain I
exceeded all visitation requirements for their mother. I would make
this deal without any hesitation or reservation, whatsoever.

I was wondering if anyone here feels the same.

The *silence* from women is palpable. Nor do I mean the very few
women here on Usenet, but the *millions* of greedy women going
to kourts, demanding loot for the begging bowls *they unilaterally
chose to whelp*.

If sex is not the determinant time of parental choice for a
woman ( The existance of abortion, RU-486, legal adopting out,
and legal woman-only abandon laws shows that it *isn't* ),
then its SEXIST to claim that it must be, for *men, only*...

Andre

I think

Bzt. ASSumes facts not in evidence.

Plus, thinks for showing that you *cannot* refute/debate the
*topic*, and can *only* throw feeble attempts at personalities.

Since you *don't know **** about me, or my life*, its clear
that you prefer to spout IGNORANCE. In which case, we can
safely understand that your " views " are nothing more than
*misandry*.

BTW, I have a *great* relationship going with a spectacular
woman, a woman who understands that men are men, and that
hating men is, well, *insane*.

you had better wrap yourself up in cotton wool and never go
near a woman again - or men either just to be on the safe side. I am
sure you do already, but make sure to account for every one of your
sperm cos those women are everywhere!!

Funny how you *can't* demand that *women be as responsible for
their EGGS*...

Thank you for *proving* that you want men to *be responsible
for women, who YOU VIEW as fundamentally IRRESPONSIBLE.

Why do you *hate women so much* ?

Andre
I was being sarcastic I am afraid.

Uh huh. After thirty years of women saying to men " Be rresponsible
for us both ", I'm afraid that the onus is on *you* to *speak
clearly, for once*.

I took you at your word. Now, you say that that was an error.

OK, from now on, I *won't* take you at your word. Happy ?

That, BTW, is called a... *consequence*.

As someone who raises 4 children alone now, including working full
time to support them , I think no one would blame me for having the
completely opposite view to yourself.

Sure, we will. Its called a *lack of human empathy*, on your part.

Thats a horrid character flaw.

I dont because there are good
men, and good women. If you choose to make sweeping generalizations

Non sequitur. *Statistical* facts are not " sweeping generalisations ".

and then get really hot under the collar about it then it is a real
waste of your energy.

Mine to " waste ", oh control freak.

I think you have answered your own question
about why women posters are scarce around you.

Ah, the OLD " you can't get any " FemiBorg ploy.

I just got off the phone after 8 hours speaking with she who
is the love of my life, toots. We have a great relationship, with
scads of total communication. We could write The Book on great
romance, great relationships, great sex, and great love, respect,
and consideration, *both* ways ( Unlike with *yourself*, who
is a one way only kinda " gal " )...

So, I think you've well proven why there aren't more man hating
bitches like yourself around me:

NONE of you can take the heat of the truth.

Tough. Deal with it, toots.

Oh, and thanks for showing that you *did mean* what you said.
About *men being made responsible for women's actions and choices*.

Hypocrite much ? Indeed.

Andre

--
" I'm a man... But, I can change... If I have to... I guess. "
The Man Prayer, Red Green.

happilyhippy ) writes:
(Andre Lieven) wrote in message ...
happilyhippy ) writes:
(Andre Lieven) wrote in message ...
My Own Doppelganger ) writes:
Well, it's like whatever is best for the kids.

However, I do have a question... Why would a NCP NOT provide some
type of child support? I mean, aren't the kids theirs also?

So ? In the case of children either not of marriages, or the hundreds
of thousands of men being garnished from, who are *not* the bio-
fathers of the children they're being stolen from to pay some lying
woman, there was NO express prior agreement to become a parent
offered the guy.

Further, in all such cases, the *woman is the sole chooser* as to
whether or not there will BE a child.

" Her body, her choice... HER RESPONSIBILITY. "

What part of women being *as responsible for their own choices as
their choices are*, is unclear to you ?

On Tue, 24 Feb 2004 23:20:17 -0600, Anti-Sheila J
smcneillAToddpostDOTcom wrote:

If the court would award me custody of my two daughters (ages 8 and
5), I would be willing to waive child support AND make certain I
exceeded all visitation requirements for their mother. I would make
this deal without any hesitation or reservation, whatsoever.

I was wondering if anyone here feels the same.

The *silence* from women is palpable. Nor do I mean the very few
women here on Usenet, but the *millions* of greedy women going
to kourts, demanding loot for the begging bowls *they unilaterally
chose to whelp*.

If sex is not the determinant time of parental choice for a
woman ( The existance of abortion, RU-486, legal adopting out,
and legal woman-only abandon laws shows that it *isn't* ),
then its SEXIST to claim that it must be, for *men, only*...

Andre

I think

Bzt. ASSumes facts not in evidence.

Plus, thinks for showing that you *cannot* refute/debate the
*topic*, and can *only* throw feeble attempts at personalities.

Since you *don't know **** about me, or my life*, its clear
that you prefer to spout IGNORANCE. In which case, we can
safely understand that your " views " are nothing more than
*misandry*.

BTW, I have a *great* relationship going with a spectacular
woman, a woman who understands that men are men, and that
hating men is, well, *insane*.

you had better wrap yourself up in cotton wool and never go
near a woman again - or men either just to be on the safe side. I am
sure you do already, but make sure to account for every one of your
sperm cos those women are everywhere!!

Funny how you *can't* demand that *women be as responsible for
their EGGS*...

Thank you for *proving* that you want men to *be responsible
for women, who YOU VIEW as fundamentally IRRESPONSIBLE.

Why do you *hate women so much* ?

Andre
I was being sarcastic I am afraid.

Uh huh. After thirty years of women saying to men " Be rresponsible
for us both ", I'm afraid that the onus is on *you* to *speak
clearly, for once*.

I took you at your word. Now, you say that that was an error.

OK, from now on, I *won't* take you at your word. Happy ?

That, BTW, is called a... *consequence*.

As someone who raises 4 children alone now, including working full
time to support them , I think no one would blame me for having the
completely opposite view to yourself.

Sure, we will. Its called a *lack of human empathy*, on your part.

Thats a horrid character flaw.

I dont because there are good
men, and good women. If you choose to make sweeping generalizations

Non sequitur. *Statistical* facts are not " sweeping generalisations ".

and then get really hot under the collar about it then it is a real
waste of your energy.

Mine to " waste ", oh control freak.

I think you have answered your own question
about why women posters are scarce around you.

Ah, the OLD " you can't get any " FemiBorg ploy.

I just got off the phone after 8 hours speaking with she who
is the love of my life, toots. We have a great relationship, with
scads of total communication. We could write The Book on great
romance, great relationships, great sex, and great love, respect,
and consideration, *both* ways ( Unlike with *yourself*, who
is a one way only kinda " gal " )...

So, I think you've well proven why there aren't more man hating
bitches like yourself around me:

NONE of you can take the heat of the truth.

Tough. Deal with it, toots.

Oh, and thanks for showing that you *did mean* what you said.
About *men being made responsible for women's actions and choices*.

Hypocrite much ? Indeed.

Andre

--
" I'm a man... But, I can change... If I have to... I guess. "
The Man Prayer, Red Green.

happilyhippy ) writes:
(Andre Lieven) wrote in message ...
happilyhippy ) writes:
(Andre Lieven) wrote in message ...
My Own Doppelganger ) writes:
Well, it's like whatever is best for the kids.

However, I do have a question... Why would a NCP NOT provide some
type of child support? I mean, aren't the kids theirs also?

So ? In the case of children either not of marriages, or the hundreds
of thousands of men being garnished from, who are *not* the bio-
fathers of the children they're being stolen from to pay some lying
woman, there was NO express prior agreement to become a parent
offered the guy.

Further, in all such cases, the *woman is the sole chooser* as to
whether or not there will BE a child.

" Her body, her choice... HER RESPONSIBILITY. "

What part of women being *as responsible for their own choices as
their choices are*, is unclear to you ?

On Tue, 24 Feb 2004 23:20:17 -0600, Anti-Sheila J
smcneillAToddpostDOTcom wrote:

If the court would award me custody of my two daughters (ages 8 and
5), I would be willing to waive child support AND make certain I
exceeded all visitation requirements for their mother. I would make
this deal without any hesitation or reservation, whatsoever.

I was wondering if anyone here feels the same.

The *silence* from women is palpable. Nor do I mean the very few
women here on Usenet, but the *millions* of greedy women going
to kourts, demanding loot for the begging bowls *they unilaterally
chose to whelp*.

If sex is not the determinant time of parental choice for a
woman ( The existance of abortion, RU-486, legal adopting out,
and legal woman-only abandon laws shows that it *isn't* ),
then its SEXIST to claim that it must be, for *men, only*...

Andre

I think

Bzt. ASSumes facts not in evidence.

Plus, thinks for showing that you *cannot* refute/debate the
*topic*, and can *only* throw feeble attempts at personalities.

Since you *don't know **** about me, or my life*, its clear
that you prefer to spout IGNORANCE. In which case, we can
safely understand that your " views " are nothing more than
*misandry*.

BTW, I have a *great* relationship going with a spectacular
woman, a woman who understands that men are men, and that
hating men is, well, *insane*.

you had better wrap yourself up in cotton wool and never go
near a woman again - or men either just to be on the safe side. I am
sure you do already, but make sure to account for every one of your
sperm cos those women are everywhere!!

Funny how you *can't* demand that *women be as responsible for
their EGGS*...

Thank you for *proving* that you want men to *be responsible
for women, who YOU VIEW as fundamentally IRRESPONSIBLE.

Why do you *hate women so much* ?

Andre
I was being sarcastic I am afraid.

Uh huh. After thirty years of women saying to men " Be rresponsible
for us both ", I'm afraid that the onus is on *you* to *speak
clearly, for once*.

I took you at your word. Now, you say that that was an error.

OK, from now on, I *won't* take you at your word. Happy ?

That, BTW, is called a... *consequence*.

As someone who raises 4 children alone now, including working full
time to support them , I think no one would blame me for having the
completely opposite view to yourself.

Sure, we will. Its called a *lack of human empathy*, on your part.

Thats a horrid character flaw.

I dont because there are good
men, and good women. If you choose to make sweeping generalizations

Non sequitur. *Statistical* facts are not " sweeping generalisations ".

and then get really hot under the collar about it then it is a real
waste of your energy.

Mine to " waste ", oh control freak.

I think you have answered your own question
about why women posters are scarce around you.

Ah, the OLD " you can't get any " FemiBorg ploy.

I just got off the phone after 8 hours speaking with she who
is the love of my life, toots. We have a great relationship, with
scads of total communication. We could write The Book on great
romance, great relationships, great sex, and great love, respect,
and consideration, *both* ways ( Unlike with *yourself*, who
is a one way only kinda " gal " )...

So, I think you've well proven why there aren't more man hating
bitches like yourself around me:

NONE of you can take the heat of the truth.

Tough. Deal with it, toots.

Oh, and thanks for showing that you *did mean* what you said.
About *men being made responsible for women's actions and choices*.

Hypocrite much ? Indeed.

Andre

--
" I'm a man... But, I can change... If I have to... I guess. "
The Man Prayer, Red Green.

I just got off the phone after 8 hours speaking with she who
is the love of my life, toots. We have a great relationship, with
scads of total communication. We could write The Book on great
romance, great relationships, great sex, and great love, respect,
and consideration, *both* ways ( Unlike with *yourself*, who
is a one way only kinda " gal " )...

Oh, and thanks for showing that you *did mean* what you said.
About *men being made responsible for women's actions and choices*.
Andre I never said that?? You just would be better off putting your
energy into your fantastic relationship instead of getting angry over
untruths.

I just got off the phone after 8 hours speaking with she who
is the love of my life, toots. We have a great relationship, with
scads of total communication. We could write The Book on great
romance, great relationships, great sex, and great love, respect,
and consideration, *both* ways ( Unlike with *yourself*, who
is a one way only kinda " gal " )...

Oh, and thanks for showing that you *did mean* what you said.
About *men being made responsible for women's actions and choices*.
Andre I never said that?? You just would be better off putting your
energy into your fantastic relationship instead of getting angry over
untruths.

I just got off the phone after 8 hours speaking with she who
is the love of my life, toots. We have a great relationship, with
scads of total communication. We could write The Book on great
romance, great relationships, great sex, and great love, respect,
and consideration, *both* ways ( Unlike with *yourself*, who
is a one way only kinda " gal " )...

Oh, and thanks for showing that you *did mean* what you said.
About *men being made responsible for women's actions and choices*.
Andre I never said that?? You just would be better off putting your
energy into your fantastic relationship instead of getting angry over
untruths.

"Rambler" iamrambler (at) yahoo dot com wrote in message ...
"Andre Lieven" wrote in message
...
Other relevent groups restored. Only fools want to *hide*.

No moron, people trim headers because they don't want to have to subject
others to all of the idiocy that you spew. Still clueless. I'm tiring of
this "debate."

Rambler

Interesting - I cannot seem to see a single point *debated* by you -
which is what Andre has been attempting to point out.
A few unsubstantiated fem-swipes maybe... but debates... might have
made interesting reading.

Its dictionary time for Barbie I think !!!

Spelt: D E B A T E

Dave M

"Rambler" iamrambler (at) yahoo dot com wrote in message ...
"Andre Lieven" wrote in message
...
Other relevent groups restored. Only fools want to *hide*.

No moron, people trim headers because they don't want to have to subject
others to all of the idiocy that you spew. Still clueless. I'm tiring of
this "debate."

Rambler

Interesting - I cannot seem to see a single point *debated* by you -
which is what Andre has been attempting to point out.
A few unsubstantiated fem-swipes maybe... but debates... might have
made interesting reading.

Its dictionary time for Barbie I think !!!

Spelt: D E B A T E

Dave M

"Rambler" iamrambler (at) yahoo dot com wrote in message ...
"Andre Lieven" wrote in message
...
Other relevent groups restored. Only fools want to *hide*.

No moron, people trim headers because they don't want to have to subject
others to all of the idiocy that you spew. Still clueless. I'm tiring of
this "debate."

Rambler

Interesting - I cannot seem to see a single point *debated* by you -
which is what Andre has been attempting to point out.
A few unsubstantiated fem-swipes maybe... but debates... might have
made interesting reading.

Its dictionary time for Barbie I think !!!

Spelt: D E B A T E

Dave M