Baby feeding issues at daycare

PK writes:

: Jess wrote:
: "PK" wrote in message
: ups.com...

:
: What kind of pump, and are you doing anything like tea?
:

: I have an Ameda PY. No teas or fenugreek as yet. But the Ped advised me
: to start them. I'll start this week, but I expect I won'ty see results
: until the following week.

You should start to see fenugreek results within 3 days.
(3 600 mg caps 3 x daily).

Good luck,
Larry

"PK" wrote and I snipped:

I have an Ameda PY. No teas or fenugreek as yet. But the Ped advised me
to start them. I'll start this week, but I expect I won'ty see results
until the following week.

Staying well-hydrated is very important, as well. I remember pumping
noticeably less ebm when I didn't keep my water bottle with me at work.

-Patty, mom of 1+2

wrote:
PK writes:

: Jess wrote:
: "PK" wrote in message
: ups.com...

:
: What kind of pump, and are you doing anything like tea?
:

: I have an Ameda PY. No teas or fenugreek as yet. But the Ped advised me
: to start them. I'll start this week, but I expect I won'ty see results
: until the following week.

You should start to see fenugreek results within 3 days.
(3 600 mg caps 3 x daily).

Good luck,
Larry

IME, you'll start to smell fenugreek results even earlier. (Sigh. BTDT
-- but it *did* help my output for the pump.)

Caledonia

If your baby has a problem with cow's milk protein, then try to avoid
going to ANY formula. Just eliminate cow's milk proteins in your OWN
diet.

A surprisingly large percentage (15%? 30%? I can't recall just now) of
babies with cow's milk protein allergy DO react to the broken down
proteins in formulas such as Alimentum. And about 30% react to soy! So
for these babies, breast isn't just better, it's WAY BEST.

that was what I was thinking though on a lower level, baby has survived so
far on breastmilk, even if not thrived, so there wouldn't seem much harm in
two more weeks before the perfect breastmilk is there. Also, with no
breastfeeds in a fortnight it would be amazing for a baby to come back to
the breast, so even if you were going with formula I'd have recommended 1-2
breastfeeds.

PK, about the formula, I was going to post it somewhere else, but I don't
really have the full info, basically I've heard it said that there are good
reasons to make sure you give just breastmilk until 3 months after solids
are started, all to do with allergies in the long term I think. Also, when
introducing formula, many people consider it like introducing another food,
which means you wouldn't introduce it until the point at which you would
introduce another form of dairy, which with your baby sounds like that
wouldn't be for a while. So whilst I think Nikki's advice is sensible for a
lot of babies and a lot of mums, it isn't for all, for me it wouldn't suit
my bloody mindedness, for you, it's your baby that is the issue.

Anne

That must have been stressful. But E has always been on the 5% for
weight. In fact when she was born, she was so little she was not even
on the chart. But she regained birth weight at 2 weeks, doubled birth
weight at 4 months, and has slowed her weight gain at 6 months (all
signs of growing babies). She is between the 75% and 95% for both
height and head circ. But she has always been at 5% for weight. She
just never *lost* weight before.

But she was a little prem IIRC, so they should plot her like that on the
chart, which means that she would be small for full term, but she would be
plottable before the 40 weeks line (our charts have 0 at an inch or so into
the page, with pregnancy weeks marked backwards from there, if the baby is
born before 37 weeks you are supposed to draw a new birth line) and should
be still plotted adjusted for a while longer.

I know that's not very relevant as losing weight whatever centile you are on
or however you plot it is not good, but I don't think at gone 6 months it's
as worrying as it would be when she was younger.

Anne

"PK" ) writes:
They warm it in a crock pot too, but I haven't checked the temperature.
This might be something worth looking into. Thanks for the tip. The
other thing the day care provider asked me to do was wear the bottle
nipple close to my body. We'll try both these things.

You could try tasting the bottle nipple and the sippy
cup. They might taste all plasticky and icky. Apparently
some bottle nipples taste horrible and are the reason some
babies reject the bottle (though I think there are other
reasons too).

Everyone has preferences, including some strong preferences
and some firmly based in instinct. There's no need to
label them "strong-willed" or "obstinate".

Here are some ideas that might possibly help.

You can thicken the EBM with cornstarch or gelatin or
something. (A few flax seeds can thicken a lot of water --
maybe it has to be cooked though). And send it
to daycare as a "solid" food. I wonder if they
would serve EBM popsicles or ice cream?

For pumping: to get more milk out with the pump,
here's a trick, though it has a danger of plugged
ducts due to going too long without nursing.
You nurse on only one breast all night. Then
in the morning, you nurse again on the same
breast, and at the same time as nursing you
pump on the very full breast. You finish up by
nursing on the breast you just pumped, because usually
baby is better at emptying it and you need to get
it well emptied to try to avoid plugged ducts.
The next night you can switch breasts.

The book Bestfeeding talks about how to feed a newborn
with a cup. I forget the details, but basically the
adult holds the cup and you don't tip or pour it but
have the fluid just come up to the edge of the cup, and
baby puts her mouth onto it and sucks. Of course, she's
older than that, so these instructions may not apply.

Maybe the holes in the bottle nipples are too big, and
she's getting too much EBM in her mouth at once and
that could be why she's spitting it out. Same with
the sippy cup.

I would apply the word "stubborn" to the daycare centre
that won't use spoons rather than to the baby. Just
my point of view.

Anne Rogers wrote:

PK, about the formula, I was going to post it somewhere else, but I don't
really have the full info, basically I've heard it said that there are good
reasons to make sure you give just breastmilk until 3 months after solids
are started, all to do with allergies in the long term I think. Also, when
introducing formula, many people consider it like introducing another food,
which means you wouldn't introduce it until the point at which you would
introduce another form of dairy, which with your baby sounds like that
wouldn't be for a while. So whilst I think Nikki's advice is sensible for a
lot of babies and a lot of mums, it isn't for all, for me it wouldn't suit
my bloody mindedness, for you, it's your baby that is the issue.

Anne

Sorry about the delay in replying - weekends at our place are like a
circus. Anyway, I didn't think of formula as introducing another solid,
but it makes sense. In any case she refused it (hated the smell and
taste probably).
I've started oatmeal and fenugreek. I don't know if its because of that
or not, but I could pump a little bit more over the weekend.

PK

Anne Rogers wrote:

But she was a little prem IIRC, so they should plot her like that on the
chart, which means that she would be small for full term, but she would be
plottable before the 40 weeks line (our charts have 0 at an inch or so into
the page, with pregnancy weeks marked backwards from there, if the baby is
born before 37 weeks you are supposed to draw a new birth line) and should
be still plotted adjusted for a while longer.


yes, she was not plottable even with the correction ! :-) her head
circumference was 50% though iirc, even without the correction.

I know that's not very relevant as losing weight whatever centile you are on
or however you plot it is not good, but I don't think at gone 6 months it's
as worrying as it would be when she was younger.

Anne

I know, thats why I'm not "freaking-out-I-have-to-see-the-doctor-NOW"
worried, but instead just enough to keep an eye on her output (which
has been adequate), and over the past week, she seems to have gained a
little too.

PK

Catherine Woodgold wrote:
Here are some ideas that might possibly help.

You can thicken the EBM with cornstarch or gelatin or
something. (A few flax seeds can thicken a lot of water --
maybe it has to be cooked though). And send it
to daycare as a "solid" food. I wonder if they
would serve EBM popsicles or ice cream?

All great suggestions, I'll ask, I don't see why they will refuse.

For pumping: to get more milk out with the pump,
here's a trick, though it has a danger of plugged
ducts due to going too long without nursing.
You nurse on only one breast all night. Then
in the morning, you nurse again on the same
breast, and at the same time as nursing you
pump on the very full breast. You finish up by
nursing on the breast you just pumped, because usually
baby is better at emptying it and you need to get
it well emptied to try to avoid plugged ducts.
The next night you can switch breasts.


Yes, I do this already. Before taking oatmeal and fenugreek, this was
about the only time I got a decent amount from pumping.

The book Bestfeeding talks about how to feed a newborn
with a cup. I forget the details, but basically the
adult holds the cup and you don't tip or pour it but
have the fluid just come up to the edge of the cup, and
baby puts her mouth onto it and sucks. Of course, she's
older than that, so these instructions may not apply.


I tried with an open top cup. And she's improving everyday. She's
learned to take the milk in her mouth, but she has not figured out how
to swallow it. If I could get her care provider to be consistent, she
would improve - lets see how that goes.


I would apply the word "stubborn" to the daycare centre
that won't use spoons rather than to the baby. Just
my point of view.

Thanks. I think they gave EBM with spoons in the past, but some child
almost choked that way, so now to avoid legal issues they refuse to do
it. I'll ask about the popsicles though, E loves cold foods, so maybe
she will take her milk that way.

Thanks,
PK