How to break 4 year old from shyness?

IMAFriend wrote:
I think maybe you misunderstood. Maybe a sing-along, with some hand
movements in the classroom. Daughter will sit, listen, probably will
not sing, or jump around, or do the hand movements. If so, will not
have much enthusiasm. (Can't think of an example song right now, maybe
the 5 frogs jumping off a log or something)

If the teacher is talking to a parent, or another teacher, or another
child, they cannot give 100% attention to my daughter. My daughter
acts as tho she has nothing else to do other than to stand next to the
teacher and wait for her attention. Would rather wait patiently for
some words, or just to follow the teacher around and do nothing, rather
than to go play on the slide, or sandbox, or the jumper, or whatever
else is out there, by herself or other kids.

DougB

Among other things, it sound like she just has an introverted
personality. She doesn't enjoy performance situations, and may enjoy
observing more than participating.

Does she show Separation Anxiety? If you go out for an evening and
leave her with someone else, does she handle it well?

I definitely like the idea of one-on-one playdates. Especially if you
and your wife can do it so that you start providing that nearness, and
back off slowly as she engages with other children.

It's important for you both to enjoy the _other_ child as well. I know
of parents that have a hard time with this.

Greg Zywicki

Here's another thing. Omega-3 essential fatty acids
may help. This essential nutrient is needed for
proper brain function -- in fact the brain is
largely made of it.

In a book about essential fatty acids, (some book
with Omega in the title, I forget) there was at least
one, I think three, adults with agoraphobia who tended
to be afraid to go outside their house, and with
essential fatty acid therapy (flax oil, I think)
they improved and became more normal.

"Jen" ) writes:
"Rebecca Jo" wrote in message
...
"Catherine Woodgold" wrote:

Jen wrote:
[snip]
I was extremely shy all my life. It isn't till I was 35ish that I
discovered I had social phobia.

"Social phobia" is just a fancy word for "shy".

That is not true. That is like saying depression is just a fancy word for
sad.

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/soc...595/DSECTION=2

I was just going to say the same thing. Social phobia is a phobia! It's a
serious fear of social situations. It's not about being a loner or a bit
nervous with strangers.

I don't mean to imply this child has it. I just mean it's a good idea to be
aware of it

Jen

"Phobia" is just the Greek word for "fear".

"Catherine Woodgold" wrote in message
...
"Jen" ) writes:
"Rebecca Jo" wrote in message
...
"Catherine Woodgold" wrote:

Jen wrote:
[snip]
I was extremely shy all my life. It isn't till I was 35ish that I
discovered I had social phobia.

"Social phobia" is just a fancy word for "shy".

That is not true. That is like saying depression is just a fancy word
for
sad.

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/soc...595/DSECTION=2

I was just going to say the same thing. Social phobia is a phobia! It's
a
serious fear of social situations. It's not about being a loner or a bit
nervous with strangers.

I don't mean to imply this child has it. I just mean it's a good idea to
be
aware of it

Jen

"Phobia" is just the Greek word for "fear".

Yeah. Like I said above. It's not about being a loner or a bit nervous with
strangers. It's a fear!!!

"Jen" wrote in message
...

"Catherine Woodgold" wrote in message
...
"Jen" ) writes:
"Rebecca Jo" wrote in message
...
"Catherine Woodgold" wrote:

Jen wrote:
[snip]
I was extremely shy all my life. It isn't till I was 35ish that I
discovered I had social phobia.

"Social phobia" is just a fancy word for "shy".

That is not true. That is like saying depression is just a fancy word
for
sad.

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/soc...595/DSECTION=2

I was just going to say the same thing. Social phobia is a phobia!
It's a
serious fear of social situations. It's not about being a loner or a
bit
nervous with strangers.

I don't mean to imply this child has it. I just mean it's a good idea
to be
aware of it

Jen

"Phobia" is just the Greek word for "fear".

Yeah. Like I said above. It's not about being a loner or a bit nervous
with strangers. It's a fear!!!


A phobia is a persistent irrational fear of an object or a situation that's
generally considered harmless.

Social anxiety disorder (SAD), also referred to clinically as social phobia,
is a psychiatric anxiety disorder involving overwhelming anxiety and
excessive self-consciousness in everyday social situations. People
experiencing social anxiety often have a persistent, intense, and chronic
fear of being watched and judged by others and being embarrassed or
humiliated by their own actions. Often the triggering social stimulus is a
perceived or actual scrutiny by others. Their fear may be so severe that it
significantly impairs their work, school, social life, and other activities.
While many people experiencing social anxiety recognize that their fear of
being around people may be excessive or unreasonable, they encounter
considerable difficulty overcoming it.

This differs from shyness, in that the person is functionally debilitated
and avoids such anxiety provoking situations by all means. At the same time,
a person with social anxiety may only feel the fear of the disorder during
certain situations. For example, an actor or singer may feel fine on stage,
but afraid of social situations in everyday life.

In humans, shyness is a feeling of insecurity and awkwardness.............

Jen

IMAFriend wrote:

I have a daughter, almost 4 years old. We put her in daycare,
partially to learn, but primarily to be more 'social'.

She usually will sit just by the teacher, she does not play with other
children. She usually either plays by herself, or sits and does
nothing.
[...]
I tried putting her into a very social and interactive environment,
that is daycare / preschool. At home there's interaction, and games.
So, can anyone make any suggestions or reasons or comments?

My first suggestion would be to figure out exactly what the problem is here.

For starters, I don't think you can assume – as everyone seems to be
doing – that the problem is that she's _afraid_ of interacting with
other children. She may simply not be interested. I know it's the
accepted social norm for people to want to spend time with other people,
but some people are loners by nature. Is your child actually bothered
by the presence of other children? Does she want to play with them and
not know how? Or is she quite happy the way she is? Most of the
suggestions that people have given seem to be based on the assumption
that she herself is having a problem with the way things are that needs
to be sorted out. If this is the case, then those suggestions would be
helpful – but if she's actually quite happy just standing and watching,
then I think most of these suggestions would have the potential of
making things worse, by making her feel as though there's some sort of
problem or that she's doing something wrong when she didn't initially
feel this way.

I was also a very solitary child by nature, and it wasn't so much
shyness as disinterest in others. My mother was very concerned about
this and spent a lot of time urging me to participate more, organising
playdates for me, etc. Of course, none of this actually made me one
whit more interested in socialising – would you become more interested
in something you didn't like as a result of being pushed to take part in
it? But it did mean that I learned to think of socialising as something
I had a duty to do, and to believe that there was something wrong with
me if I didn't want to spend time with people. This had some very
long-term adverse effects on how I managed relationships (both platonic
and romantic). I simply didn't understand that it was OK if I _didn't_
want to make friends with a particular person, or go to a particular
social event, or continue with a particular boyfriend. I ended up with
some pretty weird people because I had no idea how to distinguish
between what was actually necessary to be polite and what was above and
beyond the call of duty.

If your daughter is happy with the way things are, then I would not
recommend trying to push her into your image of what you think her
social life ought to be like. I would recommend figuring out what
social skills she _needs_ to know to handle herself with other people
(individuals or groups), and also some skills for making friends when
and if she actually does want to, and I would work on getting her to
develop these while still giving her the message that it's perfectly OK
if she isn't a social animal by nature. Being able to make conversation
with people on at least some occasions is a social obligation; making
friends isn't. If she doesn't want to do the latter, then I don't see
that it's a good idea to act as though she should.


All the best,

Sarah


--
http://www.goodenoughmummy.typepad.com

"That which can be destroyed by the truth, should be" - P. C. Hodgell

Sarah Vaughan ) writes:
If this is the case, then those suggestions would be
helpful – but if she's actually quite happy just standing and watching,
then I think most of these suggestions would have the potential of
making things worse, by making her feel as though there's some sort of
problem or that she's doing something wrong when she didn't initially
feel this way.

What? I don't remember seeing any suggestions that involved
giving the girl the impression that there is something
wrong with her.

For example, I suggested inviting another child into the
home regularly. I did not suggest telling this girl to
play with that child. I think the parents should play with
the guest.

By the way: earlier in the thread, someone asked the OP
whether he interacts with the other children at daycare.
He said something like, Yes, he says things like
(examples of talking about the daycare children in
the third person, something like "look, Sally is
playing with a ball" or something, that's not
an exact quote.) I would like to point out that there
is a big difference between talking to your own child
about another child, and actually having a conversation
with the other child. I suggest that the parents have
conversations with other children in the presence
of their daughter.

In article , Catherine Woodgold says...

Sarah Vaughan ) writes:
If this is the case, then those suggestions would be
helpful – but if she's actually quite happy just standing and watching,
then I think most of these suggestions would have the potential of
making things worse, by making her feel as though there's some sort of
problem or that she's doing something wrong when she didn't initially
feel this way.

What? I don't remember seeing any suggestions that involved
giving the girl the impression that there is something
wrong with her.

For example, I suggested inviting another child into the
home regularly. I did not suggest telling this girl to
play with that child. I think the parents should play with
the guest.


What?? Playdates are for the parents to play with the visiting child, while
their own child stays off and does something else?? What the heck is the point
of that? It doesn't make sense from *anyone's* viewpoint. Not the child, not
the parents, and especially not the visiting child and his/her parents. Kid
ain't props.

A lot of times, Catherine, your advice is either scattershot (this book, that
book, this vitamin that vitamin) or just plain whacked.

Banty

"Banty" wrote in message
...
In article , Catherine Woodgold says...

Sarah Vaughan ) writes:
If this is the case, then those suggestions would be
helpful – but if she's actually quite happy just standing and
watching,
then I think most of these suggestions would have the potential of
making things worse, by making her feel as though there's some
sort of
problem or that she's doing something wrong when she didn't
initially
feel this way.

What? I don't remember seeing any suggestions that involved
giving the girl the impression that there is something
wrong with her.

For example, I suggested inviting another child into the
home regularly. I did not suggest telling this girl to
play with that child. I think the parents should play with
the guest.


What?? Playdates are for the parents to play with the visiting
child, while
their own child stays off and does something else?? What the heck
is the point
of that? It doesn't make sense from *anyone's* viewpoint. Not the
child, not
the parents, and especially not the visiting child and his/her
parents. Kid
ain't props.

But in *this* case, the point of the playdate would be to get the OP's
child more used to other children. Trying to insist that the children
play together might backfire, but if the mom is playing with the other
child, her own child is more likely to join in. As a mom who has
worked *very* hard on her child's social skills, I can tell you how
valuable something like this can be.

A lot of times, Catherine, your advice is either scattershot (this
book, that
book, this vitamin that vitamin) or just plain whacked.

This just seems mean-spirited and unnecessary to me.

Bizby

"bizby40" ) writes:
But in *this* case, the point of the playdate would be to get the OP's
child more used to other children. Trying to insist that the children
play together might backfire, but if the mom is playing with the other
child, her own child is more likely to join in. As a mom who has
worked *very* hard on her child's social skills, I can tell you how
valuable something like this can be.

Yes, that's the idea. The parents can, for example,
volunteer to babysit another child for money or as a favour
to a parent who has something to do. They need not mention
to their own girl that they have other reasons.
After the child has been in
the home many times, the shy girl may
play comfortably with the child, as she does with her own
parents. Then it may be a smaller step for her to
get used to playing with other children, too (though
it may still be a big step).