What to do next

Here's part of an email I got from my SS's teacher this afternoon.

____________________________________
It has been pretty rough here with him and it seems I am his primary target.
He is telling the other kids that I am a 'bitch,' which is probably to be
expected, so I let that one go. We were talking about Veteran's day today
because we are having an assembly to honor local veterans. We were talking
about how, especially now, we need to appreciate our veterans. When I
mentioned that my dad was a Korean War veteran, [he] made a rude comment
about him being stupid enough to join the Army ( he was actually in the
Navy). He then starting talking about how he would kill people with some
kind of bomb and simulated shooting people. I sent him to time out for 2
minutes. When he came back, I told him that I was willing to give him a
chance every morning, but he had to work with me a little and try to stay in
class.

Everyone was sharing what they had done over the weekend, [he] did fine
through that. When I mentioned that I was at a friend's condo in
Silverthorne for a birthday party, he started in with how Dillon is a better
place to buy a condo, how I know nothing about the mountains, how everyone
in the class is a bad Coloradoan, and when I told him he had to stop, he
told me I am ignorant. I sent him to the office with a referral to process
it, then he is spending the rest of the day in my back room. He was told he
could receive after school detention or suspension. He replied that his dad
would only make him do the detention if he wasn't busy and he doesn't mind
suspension because he "gets" to go to work with you.

I think I am going to keep him in my room, but in the back, he seems to be
able to maintain in isolation, but can't get through 15 minutes in the room
with me and other kids.
_____________________________________

I'm at a loss as to how to even address this, or even *if* we should address
it. This sort of behavior has been going on for over 2 years now. No
amount of talking to him has put a dent in it.

The teacher--the same one that sent the email--told us last week that she
feels that school things should be left at school--IOW if he gets in trouble
at school, he shouldn't be punished for it at home. (FWIW we've been down
that road for a long time, that didn't change anything either.) So. Do we
talk to him about what he said/did at school? Ignore it? I sort of feel
like if I'm going to talk to him about it, then there has to be some sort of
consequence...we can't just say "that was a bad thing you did, do you
understand?" Because when we "talk to him" we get the non-responsive
"okaaaaaaaay" and "uh-huh" and "mm-hmm" back from him.

BTW, this is not the same teacher that he got suspended for assaulting; that
was one of the para-educators in the same classroom.
--
ColoradoSkiBum

ColoradoSkiBum wrote:

: BTW, this is not the same teacher that he got suspended for assaulting; that
: was one of the para-educators in the same classroom.

Short sentence: long term therapy. I don't see how your SS is ever going
to break this negative spiral unless he gets some solid psychological
intervention and the sooner the better. I'd suggest a male therapist just
in case he is triggered by women. Do you think he might be projecting
mother-anger on to this particular teacher?

Noreen

"Noreen Cooper" wrote in message
...
: ColoradoSkiBum wrote:
:
: : BTW, this is not the same teacher that he got suspended for assaulting;
that
: : was one of the para-educators in the same classroom.
:
: Short sentence: long term therapy. I don't see how your SS is ever going
: to break this negative spiral unless he gets some solid psychological
: intervention and the sooner the better. I'd suggest a male therapist just
: in case he is triggered by women. Do you think he might be projecting
: mother-anger on to this particular teacher?
:
: Noreen

I suppose it's possible, but he *likes* this teacher, and the para in that
classroom, both women. But he does seem to have an issue with especially
girls. Actually it's anybody he perceives as weaker; he goes right after
them and exploits their weaknesses, whatever they are.
--
ColoradoSkiBum

ColoradoSkiBum wrote:

: : intervention and the sooner the better. I'd suggest a male therapist just
: : in case he is triggered by women. Do you think he might be projecting
: : mother-anger on to this particular teacher?
: :
: : Noreen

: I suppose it's possible, but he *likes* this teacher, and the para in that
: classroom, both women. But he does seem to have an issue with especially
: girls. Actually it's anybody he perceives as weaker; he goes right after
: them and exploits their weaknesses, whatever they are.

Sounds like a mother projection show to me. Is this kid in therapy now, I
hope. He probably likes his mother, too, in some ways but the teacher is
getting far more anger directed at her than is explicable. That's when
projection plays a role. I'd ask your son if his teacher reminds him of
his mother in any way and see what he has to say. Perhaps if he can make
the connection and see that the anger he is blasting her way is really the
anger he wants to blast his mother with, he can ease back on his teacher.

The sadism, that's a whole 'nother story but it wouldn't surprise me if
he's been on the receiving end to perfect the craft.

Noreen

On 14 Nov 2003 01:24:38 GMT, Noreen Cooper
wrote:

ColoradoSkiBum wrote:

: BTW, this is not the same teacher that he got suspended for assaulting; that
: was one of the para-educators in the same classroom.

Short sentence: long term therapy. I don't see how your SS is ever going
to break this negative spiral unless he gets some solid psychological
intervention and the sooner the better. I'd suggest a male therapist just
in case he is triggered by women. Do you think he might be projecting
mother-anger on to this particular teacher?
I agree

He needs therapy. If Kaiser isn't able to provide it, please consider
cutting the budget in other places to fit this in. Look at
alternative sources, try bartering or cooping, but please find a way.
I have been there with a kid who needs therapy and Kaiser insurance.
It was a long haul but it had to be done. This is an obligation you
took over. Please find a way to do right by this chld.

Barb

Noreen

Barbara Bomberger wrote in message . ..
On 14 Nov 2003 01:24:38 GMT, Noreen Cooper
wrote:

ColoradoSkiBum wrote:

: BTW, this is not the same teacher that he got suspended for assaulting; that
: was one of the para-educators in the same classroom.

Short sentence: long term therapy. I don't see how your SS is ever going
to break this negative spiral unless he gets some solid psychological
intervention and the sooner the better. I'd suggest a male therapist just
in case he is triggered by women. Do you think he might be projecting
mother-anger on to this particular teacher?
I agree

He needs therapy. If Kaiser isn't able to provide it, please consider
cutting the budget in other places to fit this in. Look at
alternative sources, try bartering or cooping, but please find a way.
I have been there with a kid who needs therapy and Kaiser insurance.
It was a long haul but it had to be done. This is an obligation you
took over. Please find a way to do right by this chld.


I just want to comment that advising a person to take their child to
therapy is a very GOOD thing, but realistically, it can be close to
impossible for a parent to accomplish this. First, insurance is a
difficult stumbling block, but an even bigger issue is that there are
*very* few therapists (not psychiatrists, therapists) that deal in
adolescent psych and even fewer that have openings in their practices.
Where I live, the *average* wait to get into a practice is well over a
year. There is such a limited supply of doctors willing to take an
adolescent, and if you need insurance coverage, tough luck. Most do
not take it at all. It's a very serious problem, and it makes this
whole issue even more stressful in that a parent WANTS to help their
child, but are unable to because the medical community just isn't
their to support them.

Marjorie

Barb

Noreen

: I just want to comment that advising a person to take their child to
: therapy is a very GOOD thing, but realistically, it can be close to
: impossible for a parent to accomplish this. First, insurance is a
: difficult stumbling block, but an even bigger issue is that there are
: *very* few therapists (not psychiatrists, therapists) that deal in
: adolescent psych and even fewer that have openings in their practices.
: Where I live, the *average* wait to get into a practice is well over a
: year. There is such a limited supply of doctors willing to take an
: adolescent, and if you need insurance coverage, tough luck. Most do
: not take it at all. It's a very serious problem, and it makes this
: whole issue even more stressful in that a parent WANTS to help their
: child, but are unable to because the medical community just isn't
: their to support them.

Now follow that scenario out all the way. We make an appointment for him
with a therapist, say a month from now (if we're lucky). We pay the
therapist approximately $100 for this first visit. He goest to this
therapist, say, 5 more times? For a total of 6 visits, or $600. Then
we/he/the therapist decides that they aren't "clicking" or he won't open up
and talk, like his last therapist decided (after 11 visits--you do the
math). Now we're out $600 and have to start over with a *different*
therapist. We don't have that kind of cash lying around.

Fortunately he will be changing schools very soon. We finally have a
meeting set up for this coming Monday, a full-on IEP meeting with the person
from the district and people from the new school. There is a very strong
theraputic angle at the new school; it's not quite a mental health facility
(that would be one more step down), but it's pretty close. We're also going
to start over with Kaiser--even though their angle is more of a "family
counseling" idea, I think it might be a nice addition to what he'll be
getting every day at his new school.
--
ColoradoSkiBum

ColoradoSkiBum wrote:

: Now follow that scenario out all the way. We make an appointment for him
: with a therapist, say a month from now (if we're lucky). We pay the
: therapist approximately $100 for this first visit. He goest to this
: therapist, say, 5 more times? For a total of 6 visits, or $600. Then
: we/he/the therapist decides that they aren't "clicking" or he won't open up
: and talk, like his last therapist decided (after 11 visits--you do the
: math). Now we're out $600 and have to start over with a *different*
: therapist. We don't have that kind of cash lying around.

I've been following this thread with great interest but I'll need to
excuse myself from the conversation now. I still maintain the seriousness
of your SS's past will only be resolved with long term therapy. I wish
you the best in finding a solution to your challenges with him.

Noreen

On 16 Nov 2003 06:11:52 GMT, Noreen Cooper
wrote:

ColoradoSkiBum wrote:

: Now follow that scenario out all the way. We make an appointment for him
: with a therapist, say a month from now (if we're lucky). We pay the
: therapist approximately $100 for this first visit. He goest to this
: therapist, say, 5 more times? For a total of 6 visits, or $600. Then
: we/he/the therapist decides that they aren't "clicking" or he won't open up
: and talk, like his last therapist decided (after 11 visits--you do the
: math). Now we're out $600 and have to start over with a *different*
: therapist. We don't have that kind of cash lying around.

I've been following this thread with great interest but I'll need to
excuse myself from the conversation now. I still maintain the seriousness
of your SS's past will only be resolved with long term therapy. I wish
you the best in finding a solution to your challenges with him.

I tend to agree. I dont want this to turn into a flame, but you need
to decide how important this is to you. To me, it would be of the
most import, and of other costs had to be cut drastically I would (and
have) done so.How important is this to you. To me it was the most
important thing. It was a struggle, but it was something that has to
be done. With all due respect, you really seem to be into the excuse
part. there will not be easy, cheap or quick solutions here. You
will have to spend as much time and effort into the repair that the
damage took originally. Othewise you might as well throw him away.

I will be thinking of your son.

Barb
Noreen

Barbara Bomberger wrote:

On 16 Nov 2003 06:11:52 GMT, Noreen Cooper
wrote:

ColoradoSkiBum wrote:

: Now follow that scenario out all the way. We make an appointment for him
: with a therapist, say a month from now (if we're lucky). We pay the
: therapist approximately $100 for this first visit. He goest to this
: therapist, say, 5 more times? For a total of 6 visits, or $600. Then
: we/he/the therapist decides that they aren't "clicking" or he won't open up
: and talk, like his last therapist decided (after 11 visits--you do the
: math). Now we're out $600 and have to start over with a *different*
: therapist. We don't have that kind of cash lying around.

I've been following this thread with great interest but I'll need to
excuse myself from the conversation now. I still maintain the seriousness
of your SS's past will only be resolved with long term therapy. I wish
you the best in finding a solution to your challenges with him.

I tend to agree. I dont want this to turn into a flame, but you need
to decide how important this is to you. To me, it would be of the
most import, and of other costs had to be cut drastically I would (and
have) done so.How important is this to you. To me it was the most
important thing. It was a struggle, but it was something that has to
be done. With all due respect, you really seem to be into the excuse
part. there will not be easy, cheap or quick solutions here. You
will have to spend as much time and effort into the repair that the
damage took originally. Othewise you might as well throw him away.


No offense but I think the last sentence could have gone
unsaid/unwritten. I've also been following the thread and while therapy
seems like the best thing to me as well, I don't get the sense the SS is
a "throw-away" child to this family. This is a struggle and support is
needed, not throw away lines.

Jeanne

I will be thinking of your son.

Barb
Noreen