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Am I hurting my child by putting her in daycare at 22 months?



 
 
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  #61  
Old December 6th 07, 11:12 PM posted to misc.kids
enigma
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Posts: 447
Default Am I hurting my child by putting her in daycare at 22 months?

Beliavsky wrote in

oups.com:

I think children with educated and caring SAHM moms who
never go to day care or preschool can do just as well as
kids who attend them. I don't think I have asserted that
day care and preschool cause cognitive *deficiencies*, I am
just questioning that they have cognitive *benefits*,
especially lasting ones, for kids with good mothers at
home.


yeah, well, the NH ChildFind services disagree with you.
apparently they felt strongly enough that i should put my 3
year old into their DD preschool that they threatened me with
removing him from my home if i did not. the reason they gave?
he needed peer group involvement & i was "overly involved"
with him.
yeaaaaah.
i enrolled him in a private preschool. not a damn thing they
could do then.
lee who refused to let them label him either
  #62  
Old December 6th 07, 11:13 PM posted to misc.kids
enigma
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Posts: 447
Default Am I hurting my child by putting her in daycare at 22 months?

Nan wrote in
:

On Thu, 6 Dec 2007 16:07:18 +0000 (UTC), enigma
wrote:

not to mention that after a time unemployed people 'fall
off' the unemployment rolls. if you have been out of work
for long enough to run out of employment compensation (i
think it's 16 or 18 months, but it's been a while since i
got employment compensation), or if you have just given up
on finding a job because there aren't any you are qualified
for in your area, then you 'fall off' the unemployment roll
and are no longer counted in the % unemployed.
also, if you work for *one hour* during a quarter, you are
not counted as unemployed... so you can take those
wonderfully low unemployment figures with a huge grain of
salt.
technically i'm unemployed because i don't work and am
able
to (although one field i'm eligable to work in is retail &
i'm highly chemical sensitive to formaldyhide and the ink
on US currency, so i can't work in a mall or handle cash.
there's not much call for sys admins that don't do Winbloze
around here either), but i'm certainly not counted in that
4.7%, as i'm not particularly seeking employment & i don't
qualify for compensation anymore.


Neither am I counted. I'm not sure what the unemployment
rate for our particular county is, but I know it's not an
accurate accounting. Besides, Beliavsky is pointing out
only one factor that makes up an economy.... rising prices
on everything affect the economy as well.

and the sub-prime mortgage fiasco hasn't bubbled yet either.
things are going to get worse.
lee
  #63  
Old December 6th 07, 11:16 PM posted to misc.kids
Banty
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Posts: 2,278
Default Am I hurting my child by putting her in daycare at 22 months?

In article , enigma says...

Beliavsky wrote in

oups.com:

I think children with educated and caring SAHM moms who
never go to day care or preschool can do just as well as
kids who attend them. I don't think I have asserted that
day care and preschool cause cognitive *deficiencies*, I am
just questioning that they have cognitive *benefits*,
especially lasting ones, for kids with good mothers at
home.


yeah, well, the NH ChildFind services disagree with you.
apparently they felt strongly enough that i should put my 3
year old into their DD preschool that they threatened me with
removing him from my home if i did not. the reason they gave?
he needed peer group involvement & i was "overly involved"
with him.
yeaaaaah.
i enrolled him in a private preschool. not a damn thing they
could do then.
lee who refused to let them label him either


Whats this? Who are "ChildFind" and how did they get this power and mixed up in
your life??

Banty

  #64  
Old December 7th 07, 02:06 AM posted to misc.kids
Chookie
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Posts: 1,085
Default Am I hurting my child by putting her in daycare at 22 months?

In article
,
Beliavsky wrote:

Just as we have no way of knowing that YOUR judgmentalism and
devotion to the cult of *intelligence* won't irreparably harm YOUR
kids.


That's a cheap shot. The intelligence researchers I have cited do not
lead a "cult", and what I have said on the subject is representative
of "Mainstream Science on Intelligence"
http://www.udel.edu/educ/gottfredson...mainstream.pdf .


Actually, your views on giftedness are not quite mainstream. For example,
grade skipping is not The Solution for all gifted children (which is what you
have asserted here previously). It is a good solution (and a cost-effective
one) for many gifted children, but it is not the only way gifted children can
or should be catered for. My impression of your understanding of giftedness
is that it is sound, but not broad.

--
Chookie -- Sydney, Australia
(Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply)

http://chookiesbackyard.blogspot.com/
  #65  
Old December 7th 07, 02:19 AM posted to misc.kids
enigma
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 447
Default Am I hurting my child by putting her in daycare at 22 months?

Banty wrote in
:

Whats this? Who are "ChildFind" and how did they get this
power and mixed up in your life??


he didn't talk at age 2. no babble, nothing except an really
good ambulance siren imitation, so he was referred to Early
Intervention. he received physical therapy & later speech
therapy. he was unable to work the muscles in his tongue &
face to make sounds (i currently maintain speech therapy was
the stupidest parenting mistake i've made g)
anyway, when kids age out of EI at age 3, they refer you to
ChildFind or whatever your state calls the school district
developmental delay program. i didn't know this when i went
into EI. i figured he'd get a year of PT & then i'd find a
private PT if he needed to continue. one of the things the PT
suggested was putting him into a playgroup once/week so he
could play with other kids. seemed reasonable at the time
because there aren't other kids around.
well, that & the fact that Boo refused to play the intake
coordinators games made them decide to label him emotionally
immature (show me an emotionally mature 2year7 month old) &
overly attached to me.
he *tried* to talk to the intake coordinators & show them his
tractors and implements, but they wanted him to look at
pictures & point at things (when they asked him where the
window was in the picture, he pointed to the window he was
sitting next to, & when that was "wrong" he didn't want to
play that game).
so, they wanted him to go to developmentally delayed
preschool & i thought they were crazy.
lee still thinks they're crazy. hence the private school
  #66  
Old December 7th 07, 02:21 AM posted to misc.kids
Chookie
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,085
Default Am I hurting my child by putting her in daycare at 22 months?

In article
,
Lady Penelope Creighton-Ward wrote:

I was all excited to get a spot at our neighbourhood daycare centre
for my 22-month old, who has been at home until now, but a naysayer
relative has made me wonder if I'm hurting my daughter more than doing
her good by putting her in daycare at this age, in winter, no less.


amusement

The exact way I hurt DS1 by doing the same thing! He has a March birthday but
started day care the January before he turned two. He's now six and not
displaying any worrying signs that I can see. DS2 started day care at gasp
21 months.

I know my daughter will benefit tremendously from being around other
children in a structured educational setting. She will be in a group
of 9 children, who are looked after by 2 teachers and one part-time
assistant.


The only thing that concerns me is the "structured educational setting". THat
*should* mean a well-structured day with different kinds of play: not
worksheets, forming letters, or any of that sort of thing. Children learn by
playing, not by being forced to study early.

I work full-time from home, and have a 9-month old here as well. He
will stay with me until he gets a spot at the daycare at 12 months.

The relative (whose neck I would love to wring right now) insists a
child should be kept at home until age 3.

I am doing this because I need to keep my job. Until now I had help
from my mother, but she leaves in a few days, after having been with
us for six months. Already a huge luxury!

What I'd love is to hear some positive stories, and if there's any
scientific backing to my relative's claims.


Up to the relative to produce the evidence, and it had better be strong
evidence to make giving up your job a good option.

The stuff I've seen pretty much indicates that bad day care IS bad, but good
day care is at worst good fun for kids, and at best is very positive for kids
at risk.

--
Chookie -- Sydney, Australia
(Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply)

http://chookiesbackyard.blogspot.com/
  #67  
Old December 7th 07, 02:26 AM posted to misc.kids
Chookie
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,085
Default Am I hurting my child by putting her in daycare at 22 months?

In article ,
Ericka Kammerer wrote:

My concern is her (physical) health as she will inevitably go down
with something pretty soon. This was the crux of my relative's
argument - that a child under 3 is best left protected at home. Maybe
I should have said this more explicitly in my original post.


Oh, pbbbthb on the health issue. If the child were immune
compromised, that would be a problem, but otherwise, it's not the
end of the earth for kids to get sick. They're going to start building
up their immune systems sooner or later. Sure, she'll come home with
crud (and likely pass it on to you), but keeping her home will just
postpone that process until later.


Of course, you will need to have a plan in place for days when she is sick.
In our case, it's:

I stay home when DS2 is sick (he BFs)
DH works from home if DS1 is sick.

--
Chookie -- Sydney, Australia
(Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply)

http://chookiesbackyard.blogspot.com/
  #68  
Old December 7th 07, 03:05 AM posted to misc.kids
Chookie
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,085
Default Am I hurting my child by putting her in daycare at 22 months?

In article ,
Ericka Kammerer wrote:

The big challenge is that few people know how to evaluate
quality daycare or preschool programs, so many just sort of freeze
and don't ask a lot of questions or don't spend some real time in
the center to see for themselves how things are going. While I
think that it is difficult to *create* a good classroom, it's one
of those things that if you only have to *evaluate* it, it's not
all that difficult. You may not know precisely what you'd need to
do to be a great childcare provider, but you'll know a good situation
when you see it if you spend some time there and drop in unannounced
on occasion. I'm not sure why people feel so inhibited about asking
to see classrooms in action, but that's ultimately what you need to
do. It's possible for the childcare providers to try to put on a
show for you, but the kids don't lie. You can see from their
behavior how things are going.



Going by my one bad experience:

1. Go with your gut. If you get a bad vibe, cross it off your list.
2. Look around, so you get an idea of what happens at day cares.
3. Do not base your decision on the newness and shininess of the facilities.
4. Read the daily programme.
5. If the director is not trained in child care, leave immediately.
6. If the office is disorganised, leave immediately. I should have known it
was bad because the Xmas tree was stuck upside down in a box on the office
floor, the files were higgledy-piggledy, and the director handed money from
his own wallet to staff for a petty cash purchase -- without recording
anything!
7. One crying child does not mean the day care is bad. Avoid places where
the children don't display emotion/animation or where children appear
cowed/depressed. Look at how the staff handle the crying child, and look at
how the other children respond.
8. A children's vegetable garden is a good sign.
9. Low turnover of staff is a good sign.
10. A long waiting list is a good sign.
11. Lots of artwork on the walls -- in different media -- is a good sign.
12. Wooden equipment (shelves, toy stove, etc) is a good sign.
13. Frequent use of stencils (do you call them that? Photocopied material
for kids to colour in) is a bad sign.

The only thing I disagree with Ericka about is dropping in unannounced; I
think that's rude, and it can be very inconvenient for the carers. Certainly
you should not pop in between 11:30 and 2pm; that's lunch and nap time. Day
care centres will ask you to come at about 10:30am, as a rule, which is
usually when they are having a quieter, organised indoor activity after the
more vigorous activity earlier, but the children are not yet tired out and
cranky!

Bear in mind that in my context, we have strict State and Federal regulations
about such matters as floor space ratios, carer ratios, and so forth.

--
Chookie -- Sydney, Australia
(Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply)

http://chookiesbackyard.blogspot.com/
  #69  
Old December 7th 07, 03:14 AM posted to misc.kids
Chookie
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,085
Default Am I hurting my child by putting her in daycare at 22 months?

In article
,
Beliavsky wrote:

That standard should apply both to people who tell the OP to send to
her daughter to day care and to those who advise against it. But a
blanket statement "Your daughter will do just fine", made by someone
who knows neither the child or the day care center, raises no hackles,
except from me. My questioning such a blanket statement, without
telling what the OP what she should do, does upset people. There is a
double standard when it comes to discussing the merits of day care,
both in this group and the media in general.


DS1 has been a subject in a large longitudinal study of Australian children on
the merits (or lack of them) of day care, precisely because of the
biassed/inadequate nature of some earlier studies. Here is the project
website:

http://www.aces.mq.edu.au/childcarechoices/index.htm

--
Chookie -- Sydney, Australia
(Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply)

http://chookiesbackyard.blogspot.com/
  #70  
Old December 7th 07, 03:35 AM posted to misc.kids
Chookie
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,085
Default Am I hurting my child by putting her in daycare at 22 months?

In article
,
Beliavsky wrote:

I know my daughter will benefit tremendously from being around other
children in a structured educational setting. She will be in a group
of 9 children, who are looked after by 2 teachers and one part-time
assistant.


I disagree. My 2yo learns a lot from his parents, his baby-sitter, and
his 4yo brother, and I don't think he is missing much by not being
around other 2yo's.


But you don't *know*.

DS2 is getting quite a few things at day care that he doesn't get at home. He
plays with kids who don't necessarily speak English very well, and are of
various cultural backgrounds. Most are of a lower SES than our family -- we
live in a lower middle class area. He plays with materials I'd never be
bothered with at home and plays games he would not get here. You can't really
play Sandy Girl with only two children!

Day care, as I see it, is a substitute for playing with the kids in the street
-- which is what my parents got to do as children. It breaks down social
barriers and broadens the mind. I am quite competent to see to my child's
education myself, and to his morals, but I cannot provide the experience of
diversity (or of being in a large group of children). Most of my friends and
family are Anglophone, well-off and tertiary-educated. I'd hate it if he
thought that "everyone" lived like that -- and I've met plenty of people who
do!

--
Chookie -- Sydney, Australia
(Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply)

http://chookiesbackyard.blogspot.com/
 




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