Recognizing Good Dads

"Gini52" wrote in message
...
I wanted to start this thread because of the experiences of some posters
whose
dads or NCPs were/are not nurturers. My dad was of the same mindset and
now
aging with terminal illness, has a lot of regrets. Now, he tells us all
the time
that he loves us. He didn't do that when we were kids. His role was
discipline
and income (which was basically the same role my mother had--not much
nurturing
on either side there).
----------------------------
I think a lot of dads were expected by society to take on the role of
disciplinarian and breadwinner. A lot of men, having had little or no
experience nuturing a baby/child, and not being encouraged by society to do
so just had no idea how to. I'm sure there were many dads who were the
'Leave it to Beaver' and 'Father knows best' type but I'm sure there were
just as many who weren't. I don't think most had any bad intentions, they
simply accepted the script that moms are the ones that were supposed to be
doing all the touchy-feely stuff, hugging and saying I love you. Dads were
supposed to be the 'strong silent' type.
I have never thought of my dad as a bad dad. My mom never hid the fact that
my dads dad was a strong disciplinarian and never had any time for my dad.
I always felt a bit sorry for him. I was happy when his last wife was able
to get him to open up and he was finally able to accept, love and truly
enjoy his grandchildren and his kids.

I am glad that society has changed in that more dads seem to be being
encouraged to be loving nurturers to their kids. I too know many men who
are just that and I love it! Of course two people, especially when they
have divorced are going to have different ideas about how to parent.
*by the way, I loved how you put it-"I was an "eat
your dinner or you can't have dessert" type mom and my ex was a "don't eat
too
much or you won't have room for dessert" kinda dad"- that is so funny!
That's why it is the absolute best for kids to be raised by both parents. I
have many times wondered how different I would have turned out had I had a
'Father knows best' type of dad. Better, I think. But I don't resent my
dad for what he couldn't help.
I think 50/50 physical custody should be the standard because you're right
and I think many dads would step up to the plate and be 'good' dads if
society expected it and supported them in it.

~AZ~

Anyway, over the past few years I have seen a lot of dads
in very different roles.
My husband has been the primary caregiver of our two young sons since my
"accident" in 1998--Primary in the sense of about 60/40. After my divorce
from
my first husband, I lived in a 4 unit apt. building in which there were
two
custodial dads. These dads' NCP moms had no contact with and provided no
child
support to the CP dads. Both dads were very nurturing and did an excellent
job
with those kids each realizing that they had to compensate for detached
mothers.
One worked two jobs by necessity and relied heavily on neighbors to keep
an eye
on his kids. They were well-behaved so that wasn't a problem. Even though
he was
quite young he had *no* social life by choice.
My first husband was a nurturer in his own way. He loved his boys and
still
does. He didn't parent exactly the way I did but he had that right as the
boys
were just as much his as mine. I think sometimes mothers demand that
fathers
parent by a set of rules provided by her (as in Bob's perception of how
some
mothers drive dads away from parenting by being too critical). I was an
"eat
your dinner or you can't have dessert" type mom and my ex was a "don't eat
too
much or you won't have room for dessert" kinda dad. I had to do a lot of
tongue-biting. This is called balancing or compensating for each other's
parenting flaws. My flaw was over-protecting. His flaw was allowing them
to get
too close to the edge before pulling them back. Yet, it has been clear
that his
boys were the most important people in his life--they still are. We
adopted our
first son and I became pregnant soon after. Those boys are 18 months apart
and
now in their mid twenties are still inseparable. Anyway, our adopted son's
then
18 yr. old bio dad struggled terribly when the baby was born and the
mother
decided to place him in an adoptive home. We did not know the dad at the
time (I
did locate him when my son was about 13), but the caseworker told us of
his
torment of realizing adoption was the best thing to do for the child.
Although
their reunion has been something of a rollercoaster ride, his bio dad has
been
in frequent and continuing contact since. He was one very grateful dad
when we
located him after all those years. He never expected to see his child
again. My
son's bio dad took him to meet his bio mom during one visit (against my
wishes).
She seemed happy to see him and said she would keep in touch but he never
heard
from her again. That was my fear for him.
I have one more story to tell. I was recently in the outpatient waiting
room at
a children's hospital and there was a dad there with his terminally ill
son.
That dad spent his entire waiting time conversing with the waiting moms
about
his son's medicines and care. It was clear this dad was the primary
caregiver. I
do not know whether he was single but he sure was the main player in the
boy's
life and that little boy (a toddler) was very well cared for. So, while we
hear
about some loser and semi-loser dads around here, I wanted to recognize
that
dad's role has evolved significantly over the last decades and as a group,
they
are much more involved in their childrens' lives--at school functions and
meetings as well as sporting events and doctor's offices and they deserve
every
bit of credit for their role as nurturers to their children. Bad or
indifferent
dads are the exception as are bad moms and there is absolutely no reason
for
denying 50/50 physical custody with the exceptions recognized--I can't
help
wondering how many of those "bad dads" would be good dads if they had been
given
that right/responsibility from the start. Denying fathers the right to
raise
their children also denys their children the right to their father's
nurturing.

(PLEASE NOTE: I never bottom-sign my posts.
Check Headers to Verify the Authenticity of This Post)

"Gini52" wrote in message
...
I wanted to start this thread because of the experiences of some posters
whose
dads or NCPs were/are not nurturers. My dad was of the same mindset and
now
aging with terminal illness, has a lot of regrets. Now, he tells us all
the time
that he loves us. He didn't do that when we were kids. His role was
discipline
and income (which was basically the same role my mother had--not much
nurturing
on either side there).
----------------------------
I think a lot of dads were expected by society to take on the role of
disciplinarian and breadwinner. A lot of men, having had little or no
experience nuturing a baby/child, and not being encouraged by society to do
so just had no idea how to. I'm sure there were many dads who were the
'Leave it to Beaver' and 'Father knows best' type but I'm sure there were
just as many who weren't. I don't think most had any bad intentions, they
simply accepted the script that moms are the ones that were supposed to be
doing all the touchy-feely stuff, hugging and saying I love you. Dads were
supposed to be the 'strong silent' type.
I have never thought of my dad as a bad dad. My mom never hid the fact that
my dads dad was a strong disciplinarian and never had any time for my dad.
I always felt a bit sorry for him. I was happy when his last wife was able
to get him to open up and he was finally able to accept, love and truly
enjoy his grandchildren and his kids.

I am glad that society has changed in that more dads seem to be being
encouraged to be loving nurturers to their kids. I too know many men who
are just that and I love it! Of course two people, especially when they
have divorced are going to have different ideas about how to parent.
*by the way, I loved how you put it-"I was an "eat
your dinner or you can't have dessert" type mom and my ex was a "don't eat
too
much or you won't have room for dessert" kinda dad"- that is so funny!
That's why it is the absolute best for kids to be raised by both parents. I
have many times wondered how different I would have turned out had I had a
'Father knows best' type of dad. Better, I think. But I don't resent my
dad for what he couldn't help.
I think 50/50 physical custody should be the standard because you're right
and I think many dads would step up to the plate and be 'good' dads if
society expected it and supported them in it.

~AZ~

Anyway, over the past few years I have seen a lot of dads
in very different roles.
My husband has been the primary caregiver of our two young sons since my
"accident" in 1998--Primary in the sense of about 60/40. After my divorce
from
my first husband, I lived in a 4 unit apt. building in which there were
two
custodial dads. These dads' NCP moms had no contact with and provided no
child
support to the CP dads. Both dads were very nurturing and did an excellent
job
with those kids each realizing that they had to compensate for detached
mothers.
One worked two jobs by necessity and relied heavily on neighbors to keep
an eye
on his kids. They were well-behaved so that wasn't a problem. Even though
he was
quite young he had *no* social life by choice.
My first husband was a nurturer in his own way. He loved his boys and
still
does. He didn't parent exactly the way I did but he had that right as the
boys
were just as much his as mine. I think sometimes mothers demand that
fathers
parent by a set of rules provided by her (as in Bob's perception of how
some
mothers drive dads away from parenting by being too critical). I was an
"eat
your dinner or you can't have dessert" type mom and my ex was a "don't eat
too
much or you won't have room for dessert" kinda dad. I had to do a lot of
tongue-biting. This is called balancing or compensating for each other's
parenting flaws. My flaw was over-protecting. His flaw was allowing them
to get
too close to the edge before pulling them back. Yet, it has been clear
that his
boys were the most important people in his life--they still are. We
adopted our
first son and I became pregnant soon after. Those boys are 18 months apart
and
now in their mid twenties are still inseparable. Anyway, our adopted son's
then
18 yr. old bio dad struggled terribly when the baby was born and the
mother
decided to place him in an adoptive home. We did not know the dad at the
time (I
did locate him when my son was about 13), but the caseworker told us of
his
torment of realizing adoption was the best thing to do for the child.
Although
their reunion has been something of a rollercoaster ride, his bio dad has
been
in frequent and continuing contact since. He was one very grateful dad
when we
located him after all those years. He never expected to see his child
again. My
son's bio dad took him to meet his bio mom during one visit (against my
wishes).
She seemed happy to see him and said she would keep in touch but he never
heard
from her again. That was my fear for him.
I have one more story to tell. I was recently in the outpatient waiting
room at
a children's hospital and there was a dad there with his terminally ill
son.
That dad spent his entire waiting time conversing with the waiting moms
about
his son's medicines and care. It was clear this dad was the primary
caregiver. I
do not know whether he was single but he sure was the main player in the
boy's
life and that little boy (a toddler) was very well cared for. So, while we
hear
about some loser and semi-loser dads around here, I wanted to recognize
that
dad's role has evolved significantly over the last decades and as a group,
they
are much more involved in their childrens' lives--at school functions and
meetings as well as sporting events and doctor's offices and they deserve
every
bit of credit for their role as nurturers to their children. Bad or
indifferent
dads are the exception as are bad moms and there is absolutely no reason
for
denying 50/50 physical custody with the exceptions recognized--I can't
help
wondering how many of those "bad dads" would be good dads if they had been
given
that right/responsibility from the start. Denying fathers the right to
raise
their children also denys their children the right to their father's
nurturing.

(PLEASE NOTE: I never bottom-sign my posts.
Check Headers to Verify the Authenticity of This Post)

"Gini52" wrote in message
...
I wanted to start this thread because of the experiences of some posters
whose
dads or NCPs were/are not nurturers. My dad was of the same mindset and
now
aging with terminal illness, has a lot of regrets. Now, he tells us all
the time
that he loves us. He didn't do that when we were kids. His role was
discipline
and income (which was basically the same role my mother had--not much
nurturing
on either side there).
----------------------------
I think a lot of dads were expected by society to take on the role of
disciplinarian and breadwinner. A lot of men, having had little or no
experience nuturing a baby/child, and not being encouraged by society to do
so just had no idea how to. I'm sure there were many dads who were the
'Leave it to Beaver' and 'Father knows best' type but I'm sure there were
just as many who weren't. I don't think most had any bad intentions, they
simply accepted the script that moms are the ones that were supposed to be
doing all the touchy-feely stuff, hugging and saying I love you. Dads were
supposed to be the 'strong silent' type.
I have never thought of my dad as a bad dad. My mom never hid the fact that
my dads dad was a strong disciplinarian and never had any time for my dad.
I always felt a bit sorry for him. I was happy when his last wife was able
to get him to open up and he was finally able to accept, love and truly
enjoy his grandchildren and his kids.

I am glad that society has changed in that more dads seem to be being
encouraged to be loving nurturers to their kids. I too know many men who
are just that and I love it! Of course two people, especially when they
have divorced are going to have different ideas about how to parent.
*by the way, I loved how you put it-"I was an "eat
your dinner or you can't have dessert" type mom and my ex was a "don't eat
too
much or you won't have room for dessert" kinda dad"- that is so funny!
That's why it is the absolute best for kids to be raised by both parents. I
have many times wondered how different I would have turned out had I had a
'Father knows best' type of dad. Better, I think. But I don't resent my
dad for what he couldn't help.
I think 50/50 physical custody should be the standard because you're right
and I think many dads would step up to the plate and be 'good' dads if
society expected it and supported them in it.

~AZ~

Anyway, over the past few years I have seen a lot of dads
in very different roles.
My husband has been the primary caregiver of our two young sons since my
"accident" in 1998--Primary in the sense of about 60/40. After my divorce
from
my first husband, I lived in a 4 unit apt. building in which there were
two
custodial dads. These dads' NCP moms had no contact with and provided no
child
support to the CP dads. Both dads were very nurturing and did an excellent
job
with those kids each realizing that they had to compensate for detached
mothers.
One worked two jobs by necessity and relied heavily on neighbors to keep
an eye
on his kids. They were well-behaved so that wasn't a problem. Even though
he was
quite young he had *no* social life by choice.
My first husband was a nurturer in his own way. He loved his boys and
still
does. He didn't parent exactly the way I did but he had that right as the
boys
were just as much his as mine. I think sometimes mothers demand that
fathers
parent by a set of rules provided by her (as in Bob's perception of how
some
mothers drive dads away from parenting by being too critical). I was an
"eat
your dinner or you can't have dessert" type mom and my ex was a "don't eat
too
much or you won't have room for dessert" kinda dad. I had to do a lot of
tongue-biting. This is called balancing or compensating for each other's
parenting flaws. My flaw was over-protecting. His flaw was allowing them
to get
too close to the edge before pulling them back. Yet, it has been clear
that his
boys were the most important people in his life--they still are. We
adopted our
first son and I became pregnant soon after. Those boys are 18 months apart
and
now in their mid twenties are still inseparable. Anyway, our adopted son's
then
18 yr. old bio dad struggled terribly when the baby was born and the
mother
decided to place him in an adoptive home. We did not know the dad at the
time (I
did locate him when my son was about 13), but the caseworker told us of
his
torment of realizing adoption was the best thing to do for the child.
Although
their reunion has been something of a rollercoaster ride, his bio dad has
been
in frequent and continuing contact since. He was one very grateful dad
when we
located him after all those years. He never expected to see his child
again. My
son's bio dad took him to meet his bio mom during one visit (against my
wishes).
She seemed happy to see him and said she would keep in touch but he never
heard
from her again. That was my fear for him.
I have one more story to tell. I was recently in the outpatient waiting
room at
a children's hospital and there was a dad there with his terminally ill
son.
That dad spent his entire waiting time conversing with the waiting moms
about
his son's medicines and care. It was clear this dad was the primary
caregiver. I
do not know whether he was single but he sure was the main player in the
boy's
life and that little boy (a toddler) was very well cared for. So, while we
hear
about some loser and semi-loser dads around here, I wanted to recognize
that
dad's role has evolved significantly over the last decades and as a group,
they
are much more involved in their childrens' lives--at school functions and
meetings as well as sporting events and doctor's offices and they deserve
every
bit of credit for their role as nurturers to their children. Bad or
indifferent
dads are the exception as are bad moms and there is absolutely no reason
for
denying 50/50 physical custody with the exceptions recognized--I can't
help
wondering how many of those "bad dads" would be good dads if they had been
given
that right/responsibility from the start. Denying fathers the right to
raise
their children also denys their children the right to their father's
nurturing.

(PLEASE NOTE: I never bottom-sign my posts.
Check Headers to Verify the Authenticity of This Post)