FL jury acquits Dad in *felony spanking*

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Subject: FL jury acquits Dad in *felony spanking* Teen sides w Dad
From: "Life Coach Steve"
Date: 8/11/2003 12:36 PM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id:


"Brian" wrote in message
...


Life Coach Steve wrote:

"Brian" wrote in message
...
Ignore steve, its what most of us do.


Brian,

You might not like R. Steve, what he says or what he stands for...
but I am hoping you are attempting to argue that beating your child
with a belt is an acceptable way to raise a child, even one who sneaks
out
at night.

And I'm hoping that you are not saying that beating a child is acceptable.
I do, of course, differentiate between beating and spanking. Beating is
when mom
or dad comes home from work angry and takes it out on the kid. Spanking
is,
you've tried talking and other non-physical methods, and they have not
worked,
and you believe that the issue is important enough to spank.

No... a word was inadvertantly dropped... pre-coffee thinking... I am NOT
in favor
of beating a child with a belt.

Spanking may, with small children, and with more symbolism than force,
provide some
measure of correction. But hitting an adolescent pretty much never works.
It teaches
that when things in life are really difficult, they can get solved through
physical force.



While I don't necessarily believe the dad deserved the sentence they
were
initially discussing in the court case, to find him not guilty of
anything
seems to be sending the message that its just fine to smack our kids
around
when
the disobey us, and that our children need to fear us, not respect us.

I'm not familiar with the case, beyond what I've heard here.
But I dont think that they are saying what you claim. As I understand it,
all
the kid had when the spanking was done was a few welts and a clearer idea
of the
consequences of his/her actions.

And that when the chips were down, and dad needed to make a point... smack!

Had there been any injury beyond a few welts and a stinging but, I'd be
first in
line to lock the father up, and make sure his cell mate bubba knew why he
was
there.


Physical wounds are not the only ones here. The emotional elements may be
far more
scarring than the welts on the backside.


Forget about all of that relationship stuff... what a waste of time...
just
hit 'em
and that will work.

While DCFS, especially in the State of Florida (from all I have heard)
is a
mess,

Nightmare is more accurate.
(I lived in fla for several years, and know people who have had to deal
with
them)



I would not want their job for all the tea in China. But this is really
not
about them, it is about learning how to adequately parent children,
especially
teens.
Teens can be a real challenge to raise. They challenge authority
constantly,
attempt to grab freedom whereever they can, and will push every single
boundary we, as parents, establish for them. They are attempting to
become
adults. Our
job, as parents, is to help them to make better decisions, encourage
their
independent thought, all with the aim of growing up to be healthy,
happy,
competent adults.
Beating them into submitting to us only tells the child they are
incompetent
and
incapable of making their own decisions.

But a judiciously applied spanking is a good method of teaching those
teens
(usually when younger) that there are consequences to their actions.
That doesnt mean you as a parent cant overlook some of the normal teen
rebelliousness, of course you can. And definately try other methods first.


A parent using spanking on their adolescent child is simply saying, "I am
not to
be trusted, dear child, so don't come to me when you have problems, because
it'll be the belt for you." Spanking is almost always more for the spanker
than for
the spankee.

Am I saying that a 13 year-old should be sneaking out at night? Nope.
But
there has to be some sort of a solution short of hitting her with a belt
to
end
the nocturnal adventures.

Agree.
But how many of them had already been tried?


If its still happening, not all of them. If a 13 year-old is sneaking out
at night, she is
almost certainly sneaking away from something. What that is I have no
idea -- but
I would almost put money on it.



Anyway, Just my two cents.

Life Coach Steve
www.lifecoachsteve.com

PS, what exactly is a "life coach"
"Breath two three four, breath two three four...."?

Well, good question -- I work most of the time as a family therapist, and in
my part-time,
I work with people who are in the midst of making major decisions or major
moves, and
need some outside perspective of how to make those moves.


Anyway, Just my two cents.

Life Coach Steve
www.lifecoachsteve.com

FWD msg:

Subject: FL jury acquits Dad in *felony spanking* Teen sides w Dad
From: Brian
Date: 8/11/2003 11:41 AM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id:



Nan wrote:

On Mon, 11 Aug 2003 08:01:58 -0500, "Life Coach Steve"
wrote:


"R. Steve Walz" wrote in message
...
Fern5827 wrote:

Subject: FL jury acquits Dad in *felony* spanking. Kid agrees with Dad
From: (Fern5827)
Date: 8/8/2003 12:43 PM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id:

Teen daughter agrees that Dad was just in his punishment. States that
her
family was harmed far more by the intrusive legal system and DCF, than
her
father's aversive.
-----------------------
That's only because she's terrified that she has to go back to him,
you dumb****.

People like him need to be dragged to the curb and be shot through
the head, then be tossed in a hole and burned.
Steve


Wow, Steve...

We agree on something.

Though my guess is that part of the teenager's reasons for arguing for her
father is that,
to her, being beaten with a belt probably appears "normal", and so believes
it may be
the only way for her father to control her.

My guess is we are watching from the sidelines another child abuser in the
making.

Great.

Well, I'd have to agree that the daughter either fears her father, or
sees getting beaten as normal. But I'm guessing he's been beating her
all her life, for her to be accepting of it. That would make him an
abuser already, not one in the making.


Have you considered that maybe she has accepted that she had done wrong, and
that maybe the dad had tried othe ways first?
As I said in my response to Life coach Steve, I consider spanking to be a last
resort, after other methods of discipline have been tried, and that the
allowable force be limited to a few stinging welts that dont break the skin.


Nan

What is this post all about? No content and a web site saying nothing about
all those horrid DCF workers in Florida. Kind of a waste here, Fern. Do you
thing you could provide some content to your posts?

LaVonne

Fern5827 wrote:

Subject: FL jury acquits Dad in *felony* spanking
From: "bobb"
Date: 8/14/2003 11:07 AM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id:

This only proves that prosecutors have too much power... and mis-use
existing laws.

This case certainly should never have been brought to a court.

bobb

http://www.CPSWatch.com/fl/ Group and site in Florida for folks wrongfully
intruded upon by DCF.

Lavonne, I have done an analysis of your postings.

And I have coded them in Category 5--that is, responder hectors poster by
asking inane rhetorical questions.

I suggest you study interaction analysis and apply them to your missives.

Pathetic.

Lavonne repeats her same mistakes: When will she learn?

Subject: FL jury acquits Dad in *felony spanking*
From: LaVonne Carlson
Date: 8/18/2003 10:05 PM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id:

What is this post all about? No content and a web site saying nothing about
all those horrid DCF workers in Florida. Kind of a waste here, Fern. Do you
thing you could provide some content to your posts?

LaVonne

Fern5827 wrote:

Subject: FL jury acquits Dad in *felony* spanking
From: "bobb"
Date: 8/14/2003 11:07 AM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id:

This only proves that prosecutors have too much power... and mis-use
existing laws.

This case certainly should never have been brought to a court.

bobb

http://www.CPSWatch.com/fl/ Group and site in Florida for folks
wrongfully
intruded upon by DCF.




BTW, Felony spanking is the most *on target* post to this NG in months. Far
more than the *terrorism* posts.