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#21
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"Time Wasting Rules" - from Real Simple Magazine - NOT GOOD!
For me ff was simpler because bf was:
1) Sit down 2) Plop out breast(s)? 3) switch breast 4) switch breast 5) switch breast etc. alot for hours on end. Both my babies wanted to constantly for hours on end be on the nipple because of supply issues. I gave up on bf with my first and persevered with the help of domperidone with my second. while ff was: 1) pour water in bottle 2) put formula in bottle 3) shake 4) feed baby for max 15 min Which required no refrigeration, microwave, pitcher, or measuring cups. It did require a store :-) I think it is my supply issues and inability to move while bf because of large breasts which make it hard for my dd to keep her latch that make me think bf is hard. What I think it comes down to is YMMV. For someone who has a baby that nurses every 2 hours for 10 minutes and can walk around during that, and sleeps fine on their side at night and doesn't get mastitis or have a bad latch, or a baby with a small mouth, bf the easier. For people who don't worry about sterilizing bottles, give kids room temp formula made with powder on the spot with a fast flow nipple, formula feeding is a breeze. It is just different for different people in different circumstances. KC dragonlady wrote in message news:mehouck- OK -- but how was that simpler than: 1) Sit down 2) Plop out breast(s)? Which requires no refrigeration, microwave, store, pitcher, or measuring cups? (Again, I really am NOT trying to be difficult; I've heard people say that bottles were simpler than breasts. Since my first was bottle/formula fed after a few months, and my twins breastfed, I have the comparison, and considered breast SO much simpler -- I'm just trying to understand why, for some folks, the bottle is simpler.) (And, yes, I understand that for many people bottle feeding is necessary/desirable for reasons that have nothing to do with simplicity.) meh |
#22
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"Time Wasting Rules" - from Real Simple Magazine - NOT GOOD!
In article ,
blacksalt wrote: dragonlady wrote: Well, heck, if they're going to include pumping for women who have to go back to work, or who for some other reason are unable to nurse comfortably, it IS more time consuming! It is? I used a double pumper and could whip out my 7-9 oz. in 8 minutes flat. However, to keep baby interested in me, daddy brought baby in to my work2-3 times a day. *That* was time consuming. Getting up half an hour early to feed him first thing, that was tiring. The pumping, which I did for the weeks I worked overnight, was the easy part. I'm glad I did it, but without a homeDaddy, it would have been durn tough. As for the article, what do you expect from a magazine that uses such an ungrammatical phrase for a title. blacksalt Good point. For me, it wasn't the expressing while I was at work that bothered me; I could do that pretty fast, too. It was expressing while watching my baby cry because she was hungry but refusing to nurse, THEN giving her a bottle -- somewhere along the line, it just stopped making sense! meh -- Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care |
#23
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"Time Wasting Rules" - from Real Simple Magazine - NOT GOOD!
On Sat, 12 Jul 2003 01:46:33 -0400, "Kara H"
wrote: I have to say that this is a load of sh*t and I can't believe that anyone would even think of calling breastfeeding a "time waster". No kidding. IMHO, it saves time! No bottle prep time, you can feed the child ANYWHERE and not have to wait for a place to warm the formula, etc. I'm glad that they included the last statement. But I think that if they absolutely had to use this, they could have AT LEAST worded it in a different way to make BF'ing mothers not feel like what they are doing is unimportant. I think "some of the bonding" is an understatement as BF is a *huge* bonding oportunity. I breastfed both children. I think it not only saved time, but it was so much easier than preparing bottles and carrying all kinds of paraphanelia with me when I went out. I could, put a couple of diapers and some wipes in my purse and head off - no looking for stuff, no preparing bottles, just pack up baby and off I went. Now, there are more ready mixed formulas today, but the expense of that is the trade off and you still have to go get the bottles out of the fridge, warm them up and be careful about throwing out formula after feedings which is wasteful. I do think mom's and dad's can bond with babies when they feed bottles, though. I don't think we have to be so insistent that someone who bottle feeds is a bad mom or won't bond. Still, breastfeeding is best for both baby and mom, imo. I don't know where this physician is coming from at all. -Kara (who hasn't even BF a child yet but is still a little peeved by this!) -- Dorothy There is no sound, no cry in all the world that can be heard unless someone listens .. Outer Limits |
#24
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"Time Wasting Rules" - from Real Simple Magazine - NOT GOOD!
OK -- but how was that simpler than:
1) Sit down 2) Plop out breast(s)? For SOME ppl it is that easy, but not everyone. This is what BFing entails for me. Rent a hospital grade pump. See a multitude of lactation consultants and a myriad of LLL meetings also multiple discussions w/ LLL leaders (even speaking w/ LLL leaders that have experience w/ my BFing issues out of state and the country) Store pumped milk Fill a finger tube feeder. Feed w/ finger tube. Clean and sterilize all equipment. Buy extra tubing. Buy storage bags. Buy nursing shields (several types to find what DD can handle) Then ... after using the finger feeder it was off to buy a Supplemental Nursing System. Then train DD to use the SNS. (didn't work) Clean all the parts, and sterilize. Then after that didn't work very well, buy nipples and bottles and bags (I use playtex bottles w/ the bags because the other 10 or so kinds of bottles and nipples that we tried didn't work.) and fill w/ breast milk. More pumping. More pumping. And more pumping. I am sure I missed quite a few steps along explaining our BFing journey ... But I'm sure you get the idea. We are on opposite ends of the spectrum ... for you it has been extremely easy, for me it has been extraordinarily difficult. Most people are somewhere in-between and who is anyone else to make a judgment on the feeding choice that a mother makes for her own child, self, and family. A few days ago I was feeding DD at a restaurant. (DD gets formula as well as breast milk at this time) A woman asked me "is that formula or breast milk?" I said formula, she gave me a dirty look, shook her head, and turned her back to me. Bitch. IF she only had any idea. ~Kat Planet Claire has pink air All the trees are red No one ever dies there No one has a head |
#25
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"Time Wasting Rules" - from Real Simple Magazine - NOT GOOD!
dragonlady wrote: In article , Barbara Bomberger wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2003 23:30:47 GMT, dragonlady wrote: Aside from everything else that's wrong with this, I can't, personally, imagine that bottle feeding is LESS time consuming that breast feeding -- assuming you aren't "propping" your baby, which is a bad idea anyway. I know I visited households with twins the same age as mine who were being bottle fed, and the amount of time devoted to mixing formula, cleaning bottles, buying stuff, and, in one case, keeping the two formulas seperate -- it just looked like a real time consuming effort compared to plopping a breast (or two) out. Well first of all, I didnt clean bottles. I used the replaceable bags and had enough nipples to lst a long time. Secondly (and this is a benefit, having done both), my younger children could be held and fed by their dad, by me, by their ten year old sister ..you get the drift. I got much more sleep as a formula feeding parent, and much more free time. This is not a statement about the value of one kind of feeding over the other, just a statement on my experience with the "time" factor. Barb I can definately see how formula and bottles would be a time saver and simpler for the mother in a household with more adults (or older kids) than babies; I know how much I enjoyed feeding my younger brother and sister -- and if mom had nursed, I would not have had that particular pleasure. I guess I was just thinking in terms of "person hours" -- the total time spent -- not just "mother hours". meh Yes. It's just like hiring a cleaning service makes life simpler for me. Of course somebody else is putting in the time cleaning - but the important factor is that it ain't always me. Clisby |
#26
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"Time Wasting Rules" - from Real Simple Magazine - NOT GOOD!
Nan wrote: On Sat, 12 Jul 2003 16:56:31 -0500, toto wrote: I breastfed both children. I think it not only saved time, but it was so much easier than preparing bottles and carrying all kinds of paraphanelia with me when I went out. I've never understood the "all kinds of paraphanelia" comment, either. I bf'd as well as bottlefed, and didn't find I had to tote all kinds of anything when I went out. 2 bottles in my bag, and that was it. Well, other than all the stuff *all* moms seem to need to tote.... diapers, wipes, etc in a diaper bag. I don't get it either. I don't what people imagine you have to carry around with you. I always kept a couple of clean bottles and a couple of small cans of ready-to-feed formula in my backpack (I don't carry a purse or a diaper bag - everything I need goes in the backpack.) That was it for "all kinds of paraphernalia." Clisby |
#27
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"Time Wasting Rules" - from Real Simple Magazine - NOT GOOD!
In article ,
Clisby Williams wrote: Banty wrote: In article , says... For me ff was simpler because bf was: 1) Sit down 2) Plop out breast(s)? 3) switch breast 4) switch breast 5) switch breast etc. alot for hours on end. Both my babies wanted to constantly for hours on end be on the nipple because of supply issues. I gave up on bf with my first and persevered with the help of domperidone with my second. while ff was: 1) pour water in bottle 2) put formula in bottle 3) shake 4) feed baby for max 15 min Which required no refrigeration, microwave, pitcher, or measuring cups. It did require a store :-) Yep. I did both, and I think the perception varies on what the mother does and considers relaxing. Also the milk supply and let down. If it's feet up watching TV or sitting outside taking in the air and scenery and yammering on the phone to friends that mom loves, sitting and switching breasts is just the ticket. If more active pursuits are what's satisfying and relaxing to mom, sitting and switching breasts for 1/2 hour or so can be really reaaally sloooooow. And what's hard is what *else* has to be done with the time left over after siiiiittting and leetting dooown and relllaaaaxxxing for a loooooong time. (And no - don't say "oh -doncha know you can let the housework go" - I got REAL TIRED OF the clutter and feeling allergic to boot in a dirty, cat-hair filled house.) I did nurse, but my experience of it was more like that latter. My temprament isn't one to sit day in day out and look at baby and TV and trees and grass hours and yammer with whoever's hanging out hours in hours out day in day out. And I'm too heavy breasted to set up, hold baby in one arm, hold a paperback in the other. Banty Yep. And some of us don't get the side benefit of that supposed flow of relaxing hormones during nursing. I've nursed my son for 17 months, and the only hormonal side effects I've felt have been unpleasant (uterine contractions, and letdown.) Even once the bad part was past, I've seldom nursed him without thinking, "OK, honey, aren't you about through now?" Clisby OK -- this makes sense. I'm the sort who'd rather sit in a corner somewhere -- and managed to learn to nurse the twins while reading the newspaper. Personally, I *liked* the feeling of letting down -- though i could have passed on the uterine contractions! I've always understood that for some people, nursing is a PIA: they may have lactation problems, or a baby with a severe cleft pallatte or other medical issues, or a baby who just can't seem to latch on, or baby with neo-natal problems that meant they couldn't nurse for the first few weeks or months, or they adopted, or they had to return to work, or for some reason it made sense for someone else to be feeding the baby, or . .. . However, I guess I didn't understand that, for some people the sitting down to nurse -- the time just sitting -- felt more like a chore, or at least not pleasurable; since I'll use damned near ANY excuse to sit for a while -- nursing (almost) never felt like a chore. (And I did enjoy being able to tell other people, "Can you do the dishes? -- I have to nurse the babies.") Thanks for taking the time to put into words something I didn't really "get" before. meh -- Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care |
#28
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"Time Wasting Rules" - from Real Simple Magazine - NOT GOOD!
Stephanie and Tim wrote: "dragonlady" wrote in message ... In article , "The Ranger" wrote: dragonlady asked in message ... [snip] but I can't figure out how formula and bottles could be simpler than breastfeeding, [..] Can you explain how it was simpler? In our case it was as simple as: 1) Purchase multiple cases of concentrated liquid formula insert myriad of choices from Toys-R-Us (either at a B&M or on-line); store in pantry until needed. On our trip through TX, we were able to purchase pre-measured, fully-mixed liquid formula where we swapped their lid for our bottle nipples. 2) Get two cans from storage. Pop tops with can opener. 3) Pour both into pitcher; measure out appropriate amount of water. Stir. 4) P(remeasure)our into all available bottles. Cap. Refrigerate. During feeding the steps we 1) Grab two at a time from 'fridge, pop into microwave, nuke for 30 seconds, shake, test. 2) Pop on nipple cap and pop into infants' mouths. I remember feeding taking a maximum of 15 minutes for each child. (Spawn was a little more difficult because she was a lazy feeder and tended to try to nap.) The Ranger OK -- but how was that simpler than: 1) Sit down 2) Plop out breast(s)? Which requires no refrigeration, microwave, store, pitcher, or measuring cups? (Again, I really am NOT trying to be difficult; I've heard people say that bottles were simpler than breasts. Since my first was bottle/formula fed after a few months, and my twins breastfed, I have the comparison, and considered breast SO much simpler -- I'm just trying to understand why, for some folks, the bottle is simpler.) (And, yes, I understand that for many people bottle feeding is necessary/desirable for reasons that have nothing to do with simplicity.) meh -- Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care I thought Clisby's answer was pretty descriptive. Pumping is a drag. There is nothing simple about it. Dad was home all day; she wasn't. And the ability to share feeding can simplify things. Simple is in the eye of the beholder if you ask me. Each family's organizational style is different. Some people acheive efficiency by job sharing, some by stripping steps. S And just to be clear - I'm not advocating formula feeding. I wish I had perservered with breastfeeding my first child, and I'm glad I stuck with it for the 2nd. But there's no question in my mind that formula feeding was *simpler*. It wasn't better - but it was easier. Clisby |
#29
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"Time Wasting Rules" - from Real Simple Magazine - NOT GOOD!
"dragonlady" wrote in message ... For me, it wasn't the expressing while I was at work that bothered me; I could do that pretty fast, too. It was expressing while watching my baby cry because she was hungry but refusing to nurse, THEN giving her a bottle -- somewhere along the line, it just stopped making sense! The way I could get a decent amount expressed was to pump one side while nursing the other. Husband brought DS to work to nurse during my lunch break. It was very helpful and I really enjoyed the break from the office to see them. I think, though, that the nursing would have been harder on me if I had returned to work before the twelve week growth spurt because I simply would not have been able to keep up, at least I think not. This subject is clearly a YMMV area, though, and what worked for me may well be the bane of someone else's existence. -Aula --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.497 / Virus Database: 296 - Release Date: 7/4/03 |
#30
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"Time Wasting Rules" - from Real Simple Magazine - NOT GOOD!
In article ,
"just me" wrote: "dragonlady" wrote in message ... For me, it wasn't the expressing while I was at work that bothered me; I could do that pretty fast, too. It was expressing while watching my baby cry because she was hungry but refusing to nurse, THEN giving her a bottle -- somewhere along the line, it just stopped making sense! The way I could get a decent amount expressed was to pump one side while nursing the other. Husband brought DS to work to nurse during my lunch break. It was very helpful and I really enjoyed the break from the office to see them. I think, though, that the nursing would have been harder on me if I had returned to work before the twelve week growth spurt because I simply would not have been able to keep up, at least I think not. This subject is clearly a YMMV area, though, and what worked for me may well be the bane of someone else's existence. I'd have been glad to keep on expressing milk (I don't say "pump" because I found hand expressing easier and faster) -- but she wouldn't nurse at all. She preferred the bottle, and would just cry and turn away when offered the breast. So at some point (around 5 or 6 months, I think) I just quit and switched to full time formula, just cutting down the amount I expressed each day until there was none left. It seemed simpler than expressing *and* always using a bottle, and I figured I'd given her the early months of breast milk. I have a great deal of admiration for those women who have to express milk and still use bottles who continue for more than a few months! I know how important it is, especially for premies, it just is very frustrating to do! I suppose I could have tried to make her nurse by letting her get extremely hungry -- but that never sounded like a Good Idea. (And with the other two, they would never take to a bottle; again, I suppose I could have forced the issue, but since I didn't have anyplace to go where I wasn't taking them with me anyway, it didn't seem worth the effort.) meh -- Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care |
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