The Embry study: What it actually said.

What was that, Kane? No more lies about the Embry study? No more
claiming that this study can only be gotten from Dr. Embry himself?
No more claiming that this study doesn't involve punishment? No
more claiming that the spanked kids have the highest street entry
rates? ;-)

AFfromDreamLand

On Sun, 26 Feb 2006, 0:- wrote:

Doan refuses to debate the content.

--
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what
to have for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb
contesting the vote." - Benjamin Franklin

Another LIE from Kane!

AFfromDreamLand

On Mon, 27 Feb 2006, 0:- wrote:

Doan refuses to debate the content.

--
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what
to have for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb
contesting the vote." - Benjamin Franklin

On Mon, 27 Feb 2006 09:48:54 -0800, Doan wrote:

No more claiming that the spanked kids have the highest street entry
rates? ;-)

While that may not be what the study was about, Dr. Embry did write
this in a letter to Children Magazine (summer 1987 issue):

"Actual observation of parents and children shows that SPANKING
(emphasis added), scolding, reprimanding and nagging INCREASES the
rate of street entries by children. Children use going into the street
as a near-perfect way to gain parents' attention."


--
Dorothy

There is no sound, no cry in all the world
that can be heard unless someone listens ..

The Outer Limits

toto wrote:
On Mon, 27 Feb 2006 09:48:54 -0800, Doan wrote:


No more claiming that the spanked kids have the highest street entry
rates? ;-)

No, I will continue to makes such claims. I have not said what the
source was. You are lying again.


While that may not be what the study was about, Dr. Embry did write
this in a letter to Children Magazine (summer 1987 issue):

"Actual observation of parents and children shows that SPANKING
(emphasis added), scolding, reprimanding and nagging INCREASES the
rate of street entries by children. Children use going into the street
as a near-perfect way to gain parents' attention."

One has to ask during what "observation" this finding was noted.

His study and it's citations show that indeed they do.

And that the parent has the choice about how to use the child's desire
for parental involvement, to teach or to batter.

To support and train the small child, or to in fact up the odds of a
fatal traffic encounter by using methods proven to increase the street
entry rates.

--
Dorothy

Kane


There is no sound, no cry in all the world
that can be heard unless someone listens ..

The Outer Limits


--
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what
to have for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb
contesting the vote." - Benjamin Franklin

On Mon, 27 Feb 2006, toto wrote:

On Mon, 27 Feb 2006 09:48:54 -0800, Doan wrote:

No more claiming that the spanked kids have the highest street entry
rates? ;-)

While that may not be what the study was about, Dr. Embry did write
this in a letter to Children Magazine (summer 1987 issue):

Dr. Embry is entitled to his opinion! But, please, don't try to pass
off opinion as FACT!

Doan

Doan wrote:
On Mon, 27 Feb 2006, 0:- wrote:

toto wrote:
On Mon, 27 Feb 2006 09:48:54 -0800, Doan wrote:


No more claiming that the spanked kids have the highest street entry
rates? ;-)

No, I will continue to makes such claims. I have not said what the
source was. You are lying again.

You are the LIAR here! It's not in the Embry Study!

And that is YOUR LIE because I have not said the source was the Embry
study. Not the one we are discussing, or any other source.

You are still avoiding what IS in the study. And that it IS an
alternative discipline to spanking, the very thing you demanded of us
to support our claims.

Yet, when it arrives, you refuse to actually debate it.

Instead diddling with WHAT it is, by lying and misleading, instead of
what's in it.

Scared little cowardly trembling monkeyboy in the cold wind of reality.


R R R R R R

Doan

And right now, instead of dealing with what toto posted, you once again
try to move away from it...because you cannot refute it.

"STUPID!" is the term you use, is it not? Well, stupid, live with us
all seeing how dishonorable you are.

You can't defend spanking by argument so all you have left is chaos and
disruption..that when I've pointed it out, all you have replied is
"LOL!"

You take advantage of people's naive, but decent, assumption you
couldn't be here to do harm or deliberately behave dishonorably.

But you and I know the truth, and so too do some others. And more all
the time.

Keep posting this drivel and avoiding real debate. It helps any that
might have given you any credibility to rethink their generousity.

0:-

Doan wrote:
On Mon, 27 Feb 2006, toto wrote:


On Mon, 27 Feb 2006 09:48:54 -0800, Doan wrote:


No more claiming that the spanked kids have the highest street entry
rates? ;-)

While that may not be what the study was about, Dr. Embry did write
this in a letter to Children Magazine (summer 1987 issue):


Dr. Embry is entitled to his opinion! But, please, don't try to pass
off opinion as FACT!

You snipped the quote of Embry. Why?

Could it be because of the words "Actual observation of parents and
children shows."

That's not an opinion, doan't. That's the comment of a seasoned and
respected researcher related to his and other's findings by observation.

Of course he could be giving his opinion of his observeation, but then
that's what ALL researchers are doing when they comment.

You cannot refute what he said.

His study that we are (well, those of us OTHER THAN YOU that are)
looking at shows us that these methods that did NOT include spanking
showed remarkable improvements in the rate children avoided the street.
Only 10% of the baseline entries after the Safe Play program was
introduced and put into effect.

You can't handle that. There's nothing to say to it. His methods and
statistical products are solid. I myself can only find a few minor
questions of clarity I'd like to ask him, but the findings look good.

And on my desk is replication of his experiment, that I may share one
day. 0:-, but he has stated it's been replicated, and I can think of NO
reason to accuse him of lying.

You have accused him of lying by insinuation and inuendo though. Care to
make it official?

Doan

We will not debate the actual report after he ran head on into his own
ignorance of the meaning of the data. Too bad, doan't.

0:-




--
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what
to have for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb
contesting the vote." - Benjamin Franklin

On Mon, 27 Feb 2006, 0:- wrote:

Doan wrote:
On Mon, 27 Feb 2006, toto wrote:


On Mon, 27 Feb 2006 09:48:54 -0800, Doan wrote:


No more claiming that the spanked kids have the highest street entry
rates? ;-)

While that may not be what the study was about, Dr. Embry did write
this in a letter to Children Magazine (summer 1987 issue):


Dr. Embry is entitled to his opinion! But, please, don't try to pass
off opinion as FACT!

You snipped the quote of Embry. Why?

Could it be because of the words "Actual observation of parents and
children shows."

That's not an opinion, doan't. That's the comment of a seasoned and
respected researcher related to his and other's findings by observation.

That's not what in the study!

Of course he could be giving his opinion of his observeation, but then
that's what ALL researchers are doing when they comment.

You cannot refute what he said.

You don't need to refute an OPINION, STUPID! ;-)

Doan

Doan wrote:
On 27 Feb 2006, 0:- wrote:


Doan wrote:

On Mon, 27 Feb 2006, 0:- wrote:


toto wrote:

On Mon, 27 Feb 2006 09:48:54 -0800, Doan wrote:



No more claiming that the spanked kids have the highest street entry
rates? ;-)

No, I will continue to makes such claims. I have not said what the
source was. You are lying again.


You are the LIAR here! It's not in the Embry Study!

And that is YOUR LIE because I have not said the source was the Embry
study. Not the one we are discussing, or any other source.


Since we are discussing the Embry study, if it's not in the Embry study
it is A LIE!

No it isn't. I can discuss other things. You certainly change the
subject often enough during a "debate." ... 0:-

So then is every aside you try a lie? Get back to us on that.

You are still avoiding what IS in the study. And that it IS an
alternative discipline to spanking, the very thing you demanded of us
to support our claims.


Actualy, the conclusion was about reprimands, STUPID!

No, it's about the contents of the Safe Play program. Reprimands were
reduced by virtue of exposure to it. One of the changes being sought by
the intent of it, along with reduction in street entries.

I do hope you aren't so stupid as to try and claim the Embry experiment
was a program to reduce "reprimands."

If so, please prove it.

Yet, when it arrives, you refuse to actually debate it.

Instead diddling with WHAT it is, by lying and misleading, instead of
what's in it.


Hahaha! Since the conclusion of this study has little to do with
spanking, the LIAR IS YOU!

It is the product you demanded. An alternative to spanking. You are just
harassing now, as a way to avoid the inevitable. That Embry showed a
profoundly successful way to teach children to not enter the street as
often that did NOT include spanking.

Feel free to produce that spanking street entry reduction study, any time.


Scared little cowardly trembling monkeyboy in the cold wind of reality.


Oops! Resorting to adhoms again. How sad!

Always with the invitation to actually debate.

You were demanding I provide debate on something that showed
alternatives to spanking.

Is the Embry study not an alternative in street entry reduction methods
to the more common tool your compulsive spanking friends insist on using?

How many times do you wish to have this repeated? As many as it takes to
avoid actually having to admit the truth, and avoid people seeing how
ignorant you are about experimental research in social science?

AFfromdreadmland.


Coward.

0:-



--
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what
to have for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb
contesting the vote." - Benjamin Franklin