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For many foster children, hard life begins as adults
test
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A three-parter again folks..don't know why the newreader won't take
longer posts, but there yah go.......be prepared for some rich entertainment though. Part One of Three................ Through a fluke, Broward County receives more funding than it should for out of home care. Yet the Grand Jury in that County found that foster care continued to be a major problem, despite the increase in funding. To which, Kane replies: But, but, but....Doug, not a few months ago you claimed foster care was going down....did you not. And that the "problem" was being resolved, did you not? Hi, Kane, The size of the foster care population is one thing. Funding is another. I said that through a fluke Broward County is receiving more funding than it should for foster care. And, no, I did not say that the problems of abuse and foster care bounce were being resolved. Nor did I you said "bounce." Look at my statement above..not "bounce" in it. We have had this conversation before, only a few months ago, and you claimed foster care numbers were dropping...foster placement numbers being "the problem." And here we are, with MORE money, and the problem still in place. Any chance the problem is still money related? Like they have an abuse problem in Florida, and Broward specifically that requires more CPS services? 0:- Well, I think that Florida taxpayers would need to know that a 340% increase did not solve the problem. You already know my opinion. I have consistently maintained that money will not solve the problem. You want to claim the money is exacerbating the problem, stop using a correlation, (unprovable connection), and try some causal proofs. Got any? The problem is being driven by the increase...get that, INCREASE, in the numbers of substantiated cases the BSO is conducting. It's the county that went up, as I recall, while the others stayed level, despite your prediction abuse substantiations would fall by using "trained investigtors," r r r, which of course they did not have, and had to hire out of CPS and off the street. District 10 is now receiving $25,361,756 for out-of-home care, according to DCF figures, which is a 340% increase over the 1998 allocation. This calculates to approximately $6,000 per child in out-of-home care (foster care, shelters, relative placements, and group homes), according to DCF's Administration. " Despite the 340% increase in funding for out of home care, or most likely BECAUSE of it, DCF continues to employ caseworkers who are failing to meet regularly with their wards or comply with other regulations. This is were they go wacky. They think that foster care workers and caseworkers are the same, so they are using Caseworker when someone pointed out to the them FOSTER CARE WORKERS who do NOT do client case work, aren't doing "casework as required." R R R ...and you fell for it too...watch me prove it again, that there is a division of labor. This one got totally mucked up here. The Grand Jury notes that DCF, previously noted for its lack of accountablity, remains unwilling to supervise the work of its caseworkers. You seem to have missed that investigations...by BSO increased. That's hardly the work of DCF, now is it. The LE investigators do the removals, Doug. By their findings. No, no, no. Read the paragraphs again, Kane. The 340% increase was for out of home care, not investigations. Out of home care. Out of home care. There is nothing in the paragraph about increases in funding for out of home care that says anything about any increase in investigations. No, no, no, Douggie. The most simple logic, and recalling a fact or two, tells us that because ONE program got increased it does not follow that others didn't, and the fact? Historically? Easy. You know we discussed the fact that all the four counties showed they had higer costs per investigation by LEO. Do you think there was no money allocated to pay those higher costs? 0:- Give me some more of your logic. I could con'em at the craps table with that and walk away rich. LOL!! Yes, Douggie. LOL all you wish, and know how very hollow it appears after I point out your lapses in logic and fact. Unless they are in arrears, they have to pay salaries for those investigations. Think the sheriff's office waited to get paid? Or are you so ignorant that you do know, "caseworker" that services performed by one agency for another are billed the client agency? Even the AG's office bills for services. Not only is it a required accounting practice, it IS THE LAW in most states. Otherwise track is lost of the funding streams..and that is, as they say, naughty. "Unfortunately, foster workers, who are now referred to as Family Services Counselors, are often the lowest-paid, least-experienced DCF professional employees," the Grand Jury reports. "The demands on these workers can be tremendous. Although this Grand Jury has met several excellent foster workers, we have also seen the havoc a poor or lazy foster worker can create. Examples we have seen of the latter type of foster worker a a foster worker who failed to notify the foster parent of the foster child's potentially violent tendencies, knowing at the time younger foster children were in the home, and a foster worker who failed to perform a proper home study prior to the placement of children in a home where a known sexual offender lived." Well, I noticed this very paragraph, and something odd that brought the credibility of the grand jury into question. In the next sentence, that you left off, they start talking about this foster workers errors, but in fact the issues quoted were NOT foster at all, but worker...regular worker issues of failure. Very confusing. But then you like that because you can post out of context and play. No confusion, Kane. You have created a false duality that seems to bother you. The Grand Jury, the Independent research organization, nor I suffer by trying to base anything on your false duality. I would suggest you learn something about CPS field practice. No, I've created no false duality. They have missed the boat, and then you pushed into the water with YOUR igorance. If one reads through carefully and knows and understands government and specifically CPS organization and operations they know that foster families answer to TWO kinds of personnel from CPS. The child's worker, which can change in the wink of an eye, as children come and go, from many different workers, and their own "worker." A foster care worker, certifier in some states, various names around the country. Just how would a client caseworker keep track of all the foster families they place children with..they don't place all the children on their out of home caseload with ONE foster family. They can have 20 or 30 or more children on their caseloads. They certainly can make life interesting for a foster family, but any complaints or problems goes back through two supervisors to the FOSTER FAMILY WORKER, who does everything from accepting the first application, to doing the home study, which includes crimcheck handling, medical exam forms, handling references responses, financial statement review, local non-crim bg check inhouse and out, home inspection..then on to 90 day inhome checks and interviews with the foster kids and foster parents (the kids worker, a seperate entity does the 30 day or is supposed to), annual recertifications...a highly complex bit with review of foster parent training for the year, another home and grounds inspection, collecting water sample results in rural well areas, ...deary me it goes on and on. And how is this complex changing of the guard handled....different workers..in fact one for every child is possible, with a foster home? Which caseworker does the foster parent answer to, and when the foster parents needs something that isn't specific to a child, who do they go to? I'll tell yah. The foster home 'certifier' they are called around here. One each has about 50 foster families on their load...and it's not a "caseload" but simply a work load. And that's all they do, all the live long day, is ride herd on foster families. You, sir are an ignorant twit that puts up a wonderful front, but that's all it is. Want some citations...again? We went through similar before on division of labor in CPS worker units I've got a few, but a real careful reading shows how confused this GJ was...they are NOT experts in child welfare operations, nor should they be. That's not the purpose of a GJ, or the people that serve on them. Because of Florida's ongoing reform of privatization of foster care services, foster homes have increased and caseloads have gone down. A child in foster home does not lower caseloads, Doug. Anyone with a lick of knowledge would know, had they followed this over the past year or so, that the state had a great many open cases that were NOT being dealt with. Those cases are not close, but the remainder still require as much or more attention than they were getting before. Of course a child in foster care does not lower caseloads. Gee, we concur. Obviously we are making headway. 0:- That speaks nothing about the fact that foster care caseloads have dropped in Broward County, Florida. Considerably. Well, we have to consider if that's a real drop, or the closing of phantoms. Given the stories in the recent past about all those cases that were not closed, that now are, it follows, if one actually KNOWS CPS operations and field practice, that of course many of those were foster placements that in fact had no kid in the placement. They had gone home, as you know in many cases, and the file was not closed. If it wasn't closed, then the fact of foster place in the real word was skewed by recording a child as present when they were absent. These are the little things that give you away, phony. Oh. And the recent embarrassing exposure of malfeasance by these same contractors? Yep. They are being held accountable. DCF employees were not held accountable for their malfeasance. Oh dear, here we go AGAIN with the insane, turned on its head logic. You rabid anti Government types are full of this ****. Someone is not accountable, but they are fired, they are demoted, they are disciplined, and their malfeasance noted...yet somehow, "they are not accountable." What would "accountable" consist of in your book, Doug, a firing squad? Some here seem about that rabid. I don't approve of privatizing foster care. It's the point where children are at most risk in the system, naturally...because there is no way to have 24/7 oversight. Putting another layer between the worker and this child is NOT good. And it's very costly...as the state is learning. Well, the article you cited speaks about the increase of funding that went to pay for the privatizing of foster care. Yeeeees. You say the money led to improvement and cited the article. Was the number of kids in foster care not reduced? 0:- Maybe I misread you? So, it appears you believe that privatization has led to improvement. No, that does not logically follow. "Privatization" is a general term. So is "improvement." This is ONE such case, not all privatization. Some privatization...as I've said in the past, is NOT working out..and in fact in Florida we have examples of it. The scandals? You know, the ones you folks feel you must post 48 times in a row for fear someone might not notice and not be embarassed for being an "apologist." LOL. It appears that going private is a good investment. It depends on many factors. One of which will only tell in time. That would be the safety of the children. You haven't noticed the number of children that die or are injured in privatized foster care? I have. And it's written about here. Is your lodged to firmly and your ears and eyes blocked? The quality review study found that caseplans were terrible. Yes, and they, if memory serves, confused that with "foster care horrors." It's not related to foster care at all. Your duality. You don't understand the "Quality Review Study" is a two parter. One by a private firm, and this GJ report. They are in fact, in the GJ, confusing foster family workers with caseworkers, because, as I've seen many times before, the public, hell even the foster parents sometimes, confuse the two. I've seen foster parents calling the child's caseworker over their own recert paperwork being held up somewhere. That's the newbie foster parents. And the client caseworker directs them to please call their "certifier" the FOSTER PARENT WORKER for that business. DCF caseworkers did not involve parents, children and other family members to contribute to setting goals for the plans. (This is such a basic social work best practice, that it is unlikely safety plans constructed without parent input have ANY effectiveness whatsoever). Yep, and in states with money, Doug, they ARE involving more. Oh, so it takes more MONEY for caseworkers to follow the basics of their job and involve clients in setting goals for safety/treatment plans? No, it takes more TIME. Each case likely costs on average about the same, but the time is the same for each as well, and if one has more of them, eventually one runs out of time. Your logic would have them having no case load cap at all, and being held accountable for quality of work output. Brilliant, just brilliant..."caaaasssseeeewwwwooooorrrrkkkkkeeeeer rrr" R R R R R ....phony. At some point we know that quality of planning, setting, execution, and plain old work, is going to top out and begin to suffer...it's not malfesance or malpractice, it's mal funding....not enough money for enough workers to hold caseloads to the standards set by national review. Roughly 12 to 15 caseloads max for certain types of specialties (you still don't think there are many of those, do you Doug? R R R ) An investigator, for instance, can have a lot of cases, because they flow through their hands rather quickly. An ongoing worker, that is doing the execution and supervision of the elements of the caseplan...like those family unity meetings, etc. and appearing in court, etc. and running shotgun on emergencies, etc. can't handle as many. An adoption worker can handle more, usually, if they are doing only adoptoins, as was the case..and may be slipping now. Foster parent workers, my "certifiers" can and do handle up to 50 with enough experience, but often in the foster units it's divided up...new applicants through certification by one or two workers in the unit that do nothing else in busy urban practices, and ongoing certifiers that have to do the day to day year in year out drudge work with the foster families. In that case, it's reversed. The new applicants foster workers can only handle a few at a time, because the amount of work is so intense. I listed some items earlier. They usually have no more than 20 or so at a time, and many of those washout...bad crimchecks, bad financial statements, bad health reports, etc. Or just get terrified during the training when they start to glim on what the truth is about child abuse and what it does to children and what they will do to each other, the foster parents, and themselves as a result. I hope you are remembering some of this, because I'm considering a test smile because you seem to forget the education I've give you in the past and keep insisting I don't know casework field practice, Silly Boy. "The Quality Service Review also criticized many case plans as "cookie cutter" and "one size fits all", citing numerous instances where everyone was assigned the same or similar tasks regardless of the relevance of such assignments," said the Grand Jury. "It is very apparent to this Grand Jury that too many case plans have been prepared without regard to the foster child or the child's biological family's needs or concerns. Even more apparent is the fact that no supervisor was conducting meaningful reviews of these case plans." Sounds pretty bad to me. I notice you are cherry picking like mad, though. It is very bad. And the malpractice is going on in Broward County now. No it isn't. I Checked the hits I got were mostly all about medical malpractice suits in Broward, and I'm still trying to find an actual suit. Are are you just judging before the trial? Laying YOUR standards on, when you don't even know case practice standards, and barely understand policy? their biological families. The study questioned whether the group of professionals providing services to a particular foster child possessed the necessary collective technical skills, knowledge of the family, and access to resources to organize effective services for families with complex needs. Sounds like required spews. It's a very open ended kind of statement. One almost anyone could make about almost anyone else. I don't see the meat in the statement. It said the study "questioned." Not the study doubted, or found that it was not happening as it should. It was a question. Phrased to appear as though they found something that proved services weren't happening. It sounds like a very harsh criticism to me. Of course...to YOU. It was a question. This is NOT a panel of experts. They can't help but be a bit hesitant. They didn't even get it that their national foster care expert was nonplussed at their question why a foster care worker was not doing client casework duties. And you to are confused about that. YOu keep putting the spotlight on yourself. I guess if you learn enough from me it will be easier to con the young innocent Kane of the future that shows up here wonder what the hell you are selling and why. I might die next week. But there will always be someone like me Doug. And yah can't fool all of the people all of time, only some some of the time. Like your two dupes, boober and greegor, the two second bananas. They should, of course, as the grand jury, question a great many things. I'm glad they do. Me, too. .....end part one of three........... |
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Pop wrote: It's amazing you would think yhou could even hold a convo with any of these closed minds here unless yours is equally as closed. As I said, this one wasn't being asked if I was on his dance card. Others? Weeeeellll sometimes. 0:- Do you REALLY think anyone has any real interest in this group anymore? Yep. If one is patient and the asses are sufficiently exposed now and them some hopeful lurker pops out, Pop. And they can always watch the action, of which there would have to be some to watch, and private post to whoever they think would be most helpful. My concern is less for making earth shattering changes to the system and more for some of us being here for parents who come a lookin'. There's that kind of successful talent here the ****ants try to coverup...because they are such losers and he is a consistent winner. Many times over. If the "newsgroup" can't survive this then let it go away by its own weight. Prophecies of doom aren't really anything but more loser talk. I just drop by now and then to see who's doing what and it's always the same - never anything OT. If you think it's not OT then you aren't reading enough, or with sufficient comprehension. There is litte going on that isn't ON TOPIC these days. A dis**** sock or troll or two isn't anything to give credence to. Most groups gottem, even the "informational" one's you claim you are on your way to. If ever anyone with half a brain steps in here and decides to throw out the garbage, I'll gtive them a hand cleaning up, but until then it's not worth it. I believe on my last dental x-ray certain angles showed that in fact I have a complete brain, while back some years ago when I had a swollen passageway for the nerve from the ear it was noticed that I have an unusually large brain in certain portions. Now on to some more informational groups. Naw. That's either the whine of a loser, or the BS of a troll. -- Let someone else do it Yes, we will. I'm retired! Sure, you are. Tah. |
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Hi Kane,
You're sort of an enigma, aren't you? I found your post both good and not so good, but it was all reasonable. Suspecting myself of also being a rational human being, I decided to respond in kind (I hope). This used to be an excellent group, a few years back, and I DO notice there are a few good posts here and there; it just bugs me that the present makeup of the group over the last few months must keep a substantial number of people away, especially newbies. I know there are some very good forums, and I do frequent them, but all in all, I prefer newgroups for manageability and efficiency - thus, my interest in this one. There aren't many foster parent ng's out there. Yes, I am a foster parent; we do ages 12 and up, which turns out naturally to be mostly 14-16 year olds. We also look for all the Emergency/Respite care we can get, just because they provide variety, education, and more rounded experience. More comments inline. If you use search, look for "=== "; it's a programmable keyboard: wrote in message oups.com... .... Do you REALLY think anyone has any real interest in this group anymore? Yep. If one is patient and the asses are sufficiently exposed now and them some hopeful lurker pops out, Pop. === I'm glad to hear that, really. Such a comment's enough to make me stop by more often, just to see how things are; maybe even add a comment or two here and there if I feel qualified. And they can always watch the action, of which there would have to be some to watch, and private post to whoever they think would be most helpful. === What do you mean by private post? I don't think this group provides such a function? Or do you simply mean to address them directly and go off-group if it's appropriate. Personally, I don't approve of going off-group in most cases since it deprives the rest of the group of seeing possibly very important answers or things they hadn't thought of. My concern is less for making earth shattering changes to the system and more for some of us being here for parents who come a lookin'. There's that kind of successful talent here the ****ants try to coverup...because they are such losers and he is a consistent winner. Many times over. === You must be some sort of an oldtimer here, eh? I like your attitude and that's interesting enough to bring me back more often. I'm always open to new resources and if this is one, I'll increase my interest to see if I've been wrong in my assessment. Actually, your post is exactly the sort of thing I was hoping would happen: Someone in touch with reality and the goals of the group's purpose. If the "newsgroup" can't survive this then let it go away by its own weight. Prophecies of doom aren't really anything but more loser talk. === Agreed, but, groups such as this one are importnat, IMO, because there aren't many of them. I recall when I was first getting into FPing and looking for data. I could google millions of hits, but 99% of them were no good or were extremist or otherwise unusable. I just drop by now and then to see who's doing what and it's always the same - never anything OT. === I mis-spoke or something there; that makes no sense. If you think it's not OT then you aren't reading enough, or with sufficient comprehension. There is litte going on that isn't ON TOPIC these days. A dis**** sock or troll or two isn't anything to give credence to. Most groups gottem, even the "informational" one's you claim you are on your way to. === Well, I sure don't see much that's ON topic, but then I do admit that since I'm not here often, I see the whole gaggle of lots of posts all at once. Other than learning who might be a "real" poster, it's pretty hard to tell who's who unless it's a WexWimpy, who seems to use this for his own news blog. I've looked at several of those posts and there's nothing in them that isn't pulled from some news event or release somewhere. I may have had the Wex... thing in mind when I said those things, not sure now. Yeah, I know it'd be easy enough to killfile, but I don't believe in killfiles because they mask problems one should be aware of. IMO, at least. If ever anyone with half a brain steps in here and decides to throw out the garbage, I'll gtive them a hand cleaning up, but until then it's not worth it. I believe on my last dental x-ray certain angles showed that in fact I have a complete brain, while back some years ago when I had a swollen passageway for the nerve from the ear it was noticed that I have an unusually large brain in certain portions. === LOL! Does that mean you have -other- large organs, too? Now on to some more informational groups. Naw. That's either the whine of a loser, or the BS of a troll. === You really should think more before you pull out the troll weapon. I WILL respond to flames in kind, if it interests me at all, but I will never initiate anything of the sort. If that's how you feel, then so be it; your opinions aren't very important to me, which is as it should be, and vice-versa. FYI, where I went, though it's none of your business, appears from the logs to have been: spamcop.net, alt.msdos., als.dos.batch, home repair, and alt.social-security.disability. Oh, and alt.home.pc.security. If you consider those to be BS, then I feel sorry for you and have nothing else to say. Even if I was going to alt.****.**** (made up, not real I don't think), it'd still be possible for it to be informative, not BS. Like porno, it's in the eye/mind of the beholder. I have a total of about twenty groups I frequent, and about 8 that I actively participate in w/r to giving helpful answers. Mostly I lurk, looking for things I didn't know, and if I see a post that's been ignored, probably because no one has a good response, I'll try to at least give that OP a lead to where he might get more leads. -- Let someone else do it Yes, we will. === Yes, I bet you will, too. Don't be a stepping stone; stick up for yourslef and your beliefs. It's looking like you decided to turn counter-troll here toward the end, eh? Enigma comes to mind, esp when I consider some of the other posts of yours that I have read. I'm retired! Sure, you are. Tah. === Yes, I am, arsehole. It's NOYB, but I'm "retired" for health reasons, on disability, and I'd give my left arm to be able to go back to work. I'm 59 and housebound; so the internet's a part of my new life's goals to give back to the world some of the good it's given to me. I won't go further into that because I'm not looking for sympathy; hate that. But I AM looking for decent people who want to help others and who accept others into the effort. It's no skin off my arse whether you care or not, or what any of your opinions are; I don't kn ow you from Adam, but I do thank you for the chance to spend a few minutes doing something interesting. Perhaps some other decent people will also read this and come out of lurking for a comment or two, and show the true culture of this newsgroup, not just the slums part of the community. Regards, Pop |
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Pop wrote: Hi Kane, You're sort of an enigma, aren't you? Not if you read enough of my posts. I have depth. I'm not one dimensional. I can hate the mistakes CPS makes, foster parents make, judges make. I can also point out why they are likely too without an assumption they are a pack of evil jacklegs and assorted other insinuations some folks use here. Now and then there truly are bad people that get into positions of power. The assumptions promoted in this and other ngs related to this one, say CPS, repeately try to portray all parties that do excellent work, dedicated, running sometimes at top speed until they drop, as painted with the same brush of evil. They have even promoted the idea that it's morally right to kill them if they cross you. That would, very likely, as I respond to these many things, make me appear enigmatic I suppose. I found your post both good and not so good, We have something in common. 0:- but it was all reasonable. I suspect at times I'm not. At least not to some that lie and have serious emotional shortcomings they need or think they need support for. Suspecting myself of also being a rational human being, I decided to respond in kind (I hope). This used to be an excellent group, a few years back, and I DO notice there are a few good posts here and there; it just bugs me that the present makeup of the group over the last few months must keep a substantial number of people away, especially newbies. Actually you are correct, when it comes to asfp. Wex sticks to his news updates. A few wackos come and babble about health issues. There is almost no postings I can see that look at systems issues, and offer anything. It would be enriched if foster parents came here more, but they get viciously attacked, which is quite and insult, considering the work they do as volunteers. Everything from being more prone to abuse and kill than bio families, a flat out lie, and or being in it for the money, a giant joke. I know there are some very good forums, and I do frequent them, but all in all, I prefer newgroups for manageability and efficiency - thus, my interest in this one. There aren't many foster parent ng's out there. No, there aren't. Mostly folks have to go to webpage provided forums, I've been told. Have this unmoderated forum invites all kinds of vicious thugs, who work hard to both maintain their ignorance, and foist lies about fostering, while harrassing any foster's or the curious that come here for information and exchanges of their experience. Yes, I am a foster parent; we do ages 12 and up, which turns out naturally to be mostly 14-16 year olds. We also look for all the Emergency/Respite care we can get, just because they provide variety, education, and more rounded experience. I respectfully bow. My mother fostered for a time, as did my sister much longer. I have what might be called an extended family by proxie, very large. I'm "uncle" to many that are not blood related to me. More comments inline. If you use search, look for "=== "; it's a programmable keyboard: It's quite a challenge, isn't it. I worked with 11 to 16 year olds, boys, for some years in mental health treatment. You, of course, are more likely to have seen much more serious problems. The treatment centers screen OUT the more difficult....and you KNOW where they get housed. 0:- That's why I bow, most respectfully. See yah in comments below. wrote in message oups.com... ... Do you REALLY think anyone has any real interest in this group anymore? Yep. If one is patient and the asses are sufficiently exposed now and them some hopeful lurker pops out, Pop. === I'm glad to hear that, really. Such a comment's enough to make me stop by more often, just to see how things are; maybe even add a comment or two here and there if I feel qualified. And they can always watch the action, of which there would have to be some to watch, and private post to whoever they think would be most helpful. === What do you mean by private post? I don't think this group provides such a function? Or do you simply mean to address them directly and go off-group if it's appropriate. Personally, I don't approve of going off-group in most cases since it deprives the rest of the group of seeing possibly very important answers or things they hadn't thought of. I agree, but sometimes they might wish to discuss an issue they don't need a lot of braying jackasses attacking them for. You know, like discussing the realities of the foster subsidy. The jackasses immediatly ignore the real costs of caring for other's children and bray that you are doing it for that new SUV you are driving...forgetting that 5 or 6 kids take up rather a lot of room and foster kids need a great deal of hauling. My concern is less for making earth shattering changes to the system and more for some of us being here for parents who come a lookin'. There's that kind of successful talent here the ****ants try to coverup...because they are such losers and he is a consistent winner. Many times over. === You must be some sort of an oldtimer here, eh? I think I'm coming up on three years. I like your attitude You may feel lonesome at times in this ng then. R R R R R and that's interesting enough to bring me back more often. I'm always open to new resources and if this is one, I'll increase my interest to see if I've been wrong in my assessment. Actually, your post is exactly the sort of thing I was hoping would happen: Someone in touch with reality and the goals of the group's purpose. Well, I've been lonesome here for a long time. Stick around. I spent a great many years interfacing with the CPS establishment in various capacities. They have a love-hate relationship with me. But I hear occasionally they appreciated my directness and the fact that I was so often right about the kids. I did a confrontation for a friend in 1976, three years as an advisory committee member on human services matters to a county board of commissioners, a year of that as chair, about a year of workstudy with a tandem practicum at CPS in 80-81, watched the development of child protection, and made a pest of myself as a mental health worker with children lobbying the state for better care both in CPS and our custody. In about 1990 I was asked to help the grandparent of one of my charges...actually another kid in the neighboring unit for girls, who was struggling with the abusive parents, and CPS, for custody of the child. The rest is history...about a thousand such relatives in similar perdicaments until about a year or so ago when I eased up. I tend to know the system well, and especially the foster and adopt portions. Often I knew policy in the surrounding states better than a lot of caseworkers. If the "newsgroup" can't survive this then let it go away by its own weight. Prophecies of doom aren't really anything but more loser talk. === Agreed, but, groups such as this one are importnat, IMO, because there aren't many of them. I recall when I was first getting into FPing and looking for data. I could google millions of hits, but 99% of them were no good or were extremist or otherwise unusable. This is not any middle ground. It is the playground of the fringies with serious emotional problems mostly. Ever work with parents of the boys you care for? O:- Multiply by say five and you have some of the nutso babblings here. Even the ones that are educated and can appear rational. It you and others such as you would stick it out and not let yourselves be overcome by these twits this could become a valuable resource as it once was. I just drop by now and then to see who's doing what and it's always the same - never anything OT. === I mis-spoke or something there; that makes no sense. Never mind. It's less than important. I was probably being a smartass, as I tend to occasionally when I get tired of slapping these fools awake. Waste of time actually, as the brain deadness hasn't a thing to do with being sleepy. If you think it's not OT then you aren't reading enough, or with sufficient comprehension. There is litte going on that isn't ON TOPIC these days. A dis**** sock or troll or two isn't anything to give credence to. Most groups gottem, even the "informational" one's you claim you are on your way to. === Well, I sure don't see much that's ON topic, but then I do admit that since I'm not here often, I see the whole gaggle of lots of posts all at once. Other than learning who might be a "real" poster, it's pretty hard to tell who's who unless it's a WexWimpy, who seems to use this for his own news blog. Wex has a unique story. He was peripheral to the Rilya lost child debacle in Florida. She's still not found but the ones allegedly responsible are finally going to come to trial. Wex thought he had the child in question in his care...the missing child. I suspect he had good reason to think that, but being a decent sort, cannot post the circumstances here...and there's a confidentiality block on of course. He pressed the issue..DCFS..pressed back and pulled his cert. He has not let that deter him in his support of children and their safety. He posts material more balanced in bias than any other poster in this and another related group. Some of it is food for thought...rather a lot, in fact. And get's forwarded around. I don't know why he has the time, but good for him. I've badgered him at times, but more for drawing attention to him so people will take a moment to look at what he posts. I've looked at several of those posts and there's nothing in them that isn't pulled from some news event or release somewhere. I may have had the Wex... thing in mind when I said those things, not sure now. Wex is a bridge from the way it was, to the way it is now, with the potential to once more become a valuable resource. While the rest of us sort out the mess of the braying crazies here, he just keeps plugging along putting up the news...news that might be worth referring to one day, that drops off the media sources website after a week or so. Yeah, I know it'd be easy enough to killfile, but I don't believe in killfiles because they mask problems one should be aware of. IMO, at least. If you Usenet-google read, you see everything. I make it a point to google read from time to time. If ever anyone with half a brain steps in here and decides to throw out the garbage, I'll gtive them a hand cleaning up, but until then it's not worth it. I believe on my last dental x-ray certain angles showed that in fact I have a complete brain, while back some years ago when I had a swollen passageway for the nerve from the ear it was noticed that I have an unusually large brain in certain portions. === LOL! Does that mean you have -other- large organs, too? My hands? Now on to some more informational groups. Naw. That's either the whine of a loser, or the BS of a troll. === You really should think more before you pull out the troll weapon. I WILL respond to flames in kind, if it interests me at all, but I will never initiate anything of the sort. If that's how you feel, then so be it; your opinions aren't very important to me, which is as it should be, and vice-versa. Bait. And you got the message, apparently. Isn't the air a tad clearer now? Considering what comes here a little checkup never hurts. Usually those that can and do contribute can stand a little jab to see if a Troll grunt ensues. You aren't a troll, obviously. FYI, where I went, though it's none of your business, appears from the logs to have been: spamcop.net, alt.msdos., als.dos.batch, home repair, and alt.social-security.disability. Oh, and alt.home.pc.security. If you consider those to be BS, then I feel sorry for you and have nothing else to say. No. A test poke. Nothing more. I've no malice. Even if I was going to alt.****.**** (made up, not real I don't think), it'd still be possible for it to be informative, not BS. Like porno, it's in the eye/mind of the beholder. I have a total of about twenty groups I frequent, and about 8 that I actively participate in w/r to giving helpful answers. I could never keep up with that many, but I have one that I contribute a lot too that occupies me mostly. alt.support.child-protective-services. Drop by. If you think THIS is a sinkhole have a gander there. Mostly I lurk, looking for things I didn't know, and if I see a post that's been ignored, probably because no one has a good response, I'll try to at least give that OP a lead to where he might get more leads. -- Let someone else do it Yes, we will. === Yes, I bet you will, too. Don't be a stepping stone; stick up for yourslef and your beliefs. It's looking like you decided to turn counter-troll here toward the end, eh? Enigma comes to mind, esp when I consider some of the other posts of yours that I have read. 1. One that is puzzling, ambiguous, or inexplicable. 2. A perplexing speech or text; a riddle. Hmm....and I thought I was being very clear. 0:- I'm retired! Sure, you are. Tah. === Yes, I am, arsehole. Troll bait, sorry. Nice troll bait back at me though. It's NOYB, but I'm "retired" for health reasons, on disability, and I'd give my left arm to be able to go back to work. I'm 59 and housebound; so the internet's a part of my new life's goals to give back to the world some of the good it's given to me. Pooh. Sorry you are dinged out. Well, you can foster, so I wouldn't count you out by any means. I won't go further into that because I'm not looking for sympathy; hate that. But I AM looking for decent people who want to help others and who accept others into the effort. This may not be the place, but hey, a little housecleaning, dusting out the corners, a few chess moves I know that tend to can the fools, and who knows? It's no skin off my arse whether you care or not, or what any of your opinions are; I don't kn ow you from Adam, but I do thank you for the chance to spend a few minutes doing something interesting. You are entirely welcome. Perhaps some other decent people will also read this and come out of lurking for a comment or two, and show the true culture of this newsgroup, not just the slums part of the community. Never can tell. My, I'm naive enough to think it's possible. Others might refer to it as hopeful. Regards, Best Pop Kane |
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Pop wrote: Hi Kane, You're sort of an enigma, aren't you? Not if you read enough of my posts. I have depth. I'm not one dimensional. I can hate the mistakes CPS makes, foster parents make, judges make. I can also point out why they are likely too without an assumption they are a pack of evil jacklegs and assorted other insinuations some folks use here. Now and then there truly are bad people that get into positions of power. The assumptions promoted in this and other ngs related to this one, say CPS, repeately try to portray all parties that do excellent work, dedicated, running sometimes at top speed until they drop, as painted with the same brush of evil. They have even promoted the idea that it's morally right to kill them if they cross you. That would, very likely, as I respond to these many things, make me appear enigmatic I suppose. I found your post both good and not so good, We have something in common. 0:- but it was all reasonable. I suspect at times I'm not. At least not to some that lie and have serious emotional shortcomings they need or think they need support for. Suspecting myself of also being a rational human being, I decided to respond in kind (I hope). This used to be an excellent group, a few years back, and I DO notice there are a few good posts here and there; it just bugs me that the present makeup of the group over the last few months must keep a substantial number of people away, especially newbies. Actually you are correct, when it comes to asfp. Wex sticks to his news updates. A few wackos come and babble about health issues. There is almost no postings I can see that look at systems issues, and offer anything. It would be enriched if foster parents came here more, but they get viciously attacked, which is quite and insult, considering the work they do as volunteers. Everything from being more prone to abuse and kill than bio families, a flat out lie, and or being in it for the money, a giant joke. I know there are some very good forums, and I do frequent them, but all in all, I prefer newgroups for manageability and efficiency - thus, my interest in this one. There aren't many foster parent ng's out there. No, there aren't. Mostly folks have to go to webpage provided forums, I've been told. Have this unmoderated forum invites all kinds of vicious thugs, who work hard to both maintain their ignorance, and foist lies about fostering, while harrassing any foster's or the curious that come here for information and exchanges of their experience. Yes, I am a foster parent; we do ages 12 and up, which turns out naturally to be mostly 14-16 year olds. We also look for all the Emergency/Respite care we can get, just because they provide variety, education, and more rounded experience. I respectfully bow. My mother fostered for a time, as did my sister much longer. I have what might be called an extended family by proxie, very large. I'm "uncle" to many that are not blood related to me. More comments inline. If you use search, look for "=== "; it's a programmable keyboard: It's quite a challenge, isn't it. I worked with 11 to 16 year olds, boys, for some years in mental health treatment. You, of course, are more likely to have seen much more serious problems. The treatment centers screen OUT the more difficult....and you KNOW where they get housed. 0:- That's why I bow, most respectfully. See yah in comments below. wrote in message oups.com... ... Do you REALLY think anyone has any real interest in this group anymore? Yep. If one is patient and the asses are sufficiently exposed now and them some hopeful lurker pops out, Pop. === I'm glad to hear that, really. Such a comment's enough to make me stop by more often, just to see how things are; maybe even add a comment or two here and there if I feel qualified. And they can always watch the action, of which there would have to be some to watch, and private post to whoever they think would be most helpful. === What do you mean by private post? I don't think this group provides such a function? Or do you simply mean to address them directly and go off-group if it's appropriate. Personally, I don't approve of going off-group in most cases since it deprives the rest of the group of seeing possibly very important answers or things they hadn't thought of. I agree, but sometimes they might wish to discuss an issue they don't need a lot of braying jackasses attacking them for. You know, like discussing the realities of the foster subsidy. The jackasses immediatly ignore the real costs of caring for other's children and bray that you are doing it for that new SUV you are driving...forgetting that 5 or 6 kids take up rather a lot of room and foster kids need a great deal of hauling. My concern is less for making earth shattering changes to the system and more for some of us being here for parents who come a lookin'. There's that kind of successful talent here the ****ants try to coverup...because they are such losers and he is a consistent winner. Many times over. === You must be some sort of an oldtimer here, eh? I think I'm coming up on three years. I like your attitude You may feel lonesome at times in this ng then. R R R R R and that's interesting enough to bring me back more often. I'm always open to new resources and if this is one, I'll increase my interest to see if I've been wrong in my assessment. Actually, your post is exactly the sort of thing I was hoping would happen: Someone in touch with reality and the goals of the group's purpose. Well, I've been lonesome here for a long time. Stick around. I spent a great many years interfacing with the CPS establishment in various capacities. They have a love-hate relationship with me. But I hear occasionally they appreciated my directness and the fact that I was so often right about the kids. I did a confrontation for a friend in 1976, three years as an advisory committee member on human services matters to a county board of commissioners, a year of that as chair, about a year of workstudy with a tandem practicum at CPS in 80-81, watched the development of child protection, and made a pest of myself as a mental health worker with children lobbying the state for better care both in CPS and our custody. In about 1990 I was asked to help the grandparent of one of my charges...actually another kid in the neighboring unit for girls, who was struggling with the abusive parents, and CPS, for custody of the child. The rest is history...about a thousand such relatives in similar perdicaments until about a year or so ago when I eased up. I tend to know the system well, and especially the foster and adopt portions. Often I knew policy in the surrounding states better than a lot of caseworkers. If the "newsgroup" can't survive this then let it go away by its own weight. Prophecies of doom aren't really anything but more loser talk. === Agreed, but, groups such as this one are importnat, IMO, because there aren't many of them. I recall when I was first getting into FPing and looking for data. I could google millions of hits, but 99% of them were no good or were extremist or otherwise unusable. This is not any middle ground. It is the playground of the fringies with serious emotional problems mostly. Ever work with parents of the boys you care for? O:- Multiply by say five and you have some of the nutso babblings here. Even the ones that are educated and can appear rational. It you and others such as you would stick it out and not let yourselves be overcome by these twits this could become a valuable resource as it once was. I just drop by now and then to see who's doing what and it's always the same - never anything OT. === I mis-spoke or something there; that makes no sense. Never mind. It's less than important. I was probably being a smartass, as I tend to occasionally when I get tired of slapping these fools awake. Waste of time actually, as the brain deadness hasn't a thing to do with being sleepy. If you think it's not OT then you aren't reading enough, or with sufficient comprehension. There is litte going on that isn't ON TOPIC these days. A dis**** sock or troll or two isn't anything to give credence to. Most groups gottem, even the "informational" one's you claim you are on your way to. === Well, I sure don't see much that's ON topic, but then I do admit that since I'm not here often, I see the whole gaggle of lots of posts all at once. Other than learning who might be a "real" poster, it's pretty hard to tell who's who unless it's a WexWimpy, who seems to use this for his own news blog. Wex has a unique story. He was peripheral to the Rilya lost child debacle in Florida. She's still not found but the ones allegedly responsible are finally going to come to trial. Wex thought he had the child in question in his care...the missing child. I suspect he had good reason to think that, but being a decent sort, cannot post the circumstances here...and there's a confidentiality block on of course. He pressed the issue..DCFS..pressed back and pulled his cert. He has not let that deter him in his support of children and their safety. He posts material more balanced in bias than any other poster in this and another related group. Some of it is food for thought...rather a lot, in fact. And get's forwarded around. I don't know why he has the time, but good for him. I've badgered him at times, but more for drawing attention to him so people will take a moment to look at what he posts. I've looked at several of those posts and there's nothing in them that isn't pulled from some news event or release somewhere. I may have had the Wex... thing in mind when I said those things, not sure now. Wex is a bridge from the way it was, to the way it is now, with the potential to once more become a valuable resource. While the rest of us sort out the mess of the braying crazies here, he just keeps plugging along putting up the news...news that might be worth referring to one day, that drops off the media sources website after a week or so. Yeah, I know it'd be easy enough to killfile, but I don't believe in killfiles because they mask problems one should be aware of. IMO, at least. If you Usenet-google read, you see everything. I make it a point to google read from time to time. If ever anyone with half a brain steps in here and decides to throw out the garbage, I'll gtive them a hand cleaning up, but until then it's not worth it. I believe on my last dental x-ray certain angles showed that in fact I have a complete brain, while back some years ago when I had a swollen passageway for the nerve from the ear it was noticed that I have an unusually large brain in certain portions. === LOL! Does that mean you have -other- large organs, too? My hands? Now on to some more informational groups. Naw. That's either the whine of a loser, or the BS of a troll. === You really should think more before you pull out the troll weapon. I WILL respond to flames in kind, if it interests me at all, but I will never initiate anything of the sort. If that's how you feel, then so be it; your opinions aren't very important to me, which is as it should be, and vice-versa. Bait. And you got the message, apparently. Isn't the air a tad clearer now? Considering what comes here a little checkup never hurts. Usually those that can and do contribute can stand a little jab to see if a Troll grunt ensues. You aren't a troll, obviously. FYI, where I went, though it's none of your business, appears from the logs to have been: spamcop.net, alt.msdos., als.dos.batch, home repair, and alt.social-security.disability. Oh, and alt.home.pc.security. If you consider those to be BS, then I feel sorry for you and have nothing else to say. No. A test poke. Nothing more. I've no malice. Even if I was going to alt.****.**** (made up, not real I don't think), it'd still be possible for it to be informative, not BS. Like porno, it's in the eye/mind of the beholder. I have a total of about twenty groups I frequent, and about 8 that I actively participate in w/r to giving helpful answers. I could never keep up with that many, but I have one that I contribute a lot too that occupies me mostly. alt.support.child-protective-services. Drop by. If you think THIS is a sinkhole have a gander there. Mostly I lurk, looking for things I didn't know, and if I see a post that's been ignored, probably because no one has a good response, I'll try to at least give that OP a lead to where he might get more leads. -- Let someone else do it Yes, we will. === Yes, I bet you will, too. Don't be a stepping stone; stick up for yourslef and your beliefs. It's looking like you decided to turn counter-troll here toward the end, eh? Enigma comes to mind, esp when I consider some of the other posts of yours that I have read. 1. One that is puzzling, ambiguous, or inexplicable. 2. A perplexing speech or text; a riddle. Hmm....and I thought I was being very clear. 0:- I'm retired! Sure, you are. Tah. === Yes, I am, arsehole. Troll bait, sorry. Nice troll bait back at me though. It's NOYB, but I'm "retired" for health reasons, on disability, and I'd give my left arm to be able to go back to work. I'm 59 and housebound; so the internet's a part of my new life's goals to give back to the world some of the good it's given to me. Pooh. Sorry you are dinged out. Well, you can foster, so I wouldn't count you out by any means. I won't go further into that because I'm not looking for sympathy; hate that. But I AM looking for decent people who want to help others and who accept others into the effort. This may not be the place, but hey, a little housecleaning, dusting out the corners, a few chess moves I know that tend to can the fools, and who knows? It's no skin off my arse whether you care or not, or what any of your opinions are; I don't kn ow you from Adam, but I do thank you for the chance to spend a few minutes doing something interesting. You are entirely welcome. Perhaps some other decent people will also read this and come out of lurking for a comment or two, and show the true culture of this newsgroup, not just the slums part of the community. Never can tell. Myself, I'm naive enough to think it's possible. Others might refer to me as hopeful. As time passes the former disability looks more likely than the latter quality of character. Makes me feel foolish sometimes to continue to hope...but there you have it. I've won before. 0:- Regards, Best Pop Kane |
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