My DS Almost 4 Too Rambunctious in Nursey School

I have an interesting dilemma. My DS, soon to be 4, is the largest in
his class, very bright, gregarious and demonstrative. Described by
his teachers as 'taking up the room' with his personality and has a
father who wrestles, plays physically with him, his neighborhood
friends, jump on one another in a pile....well, just got a phone call
from the nursery school director that he did this type of play in
school and we need to bring him home. Now, at lunch bunch he plays
with the older kids where he is the same size and this isn't an issue
so I don't think my son discerns size or 'who wants to play' and who
doesn't. I don't disagree with the director for taking him to her
office and asking us to take him home and not be rewarded with 'lunch
bunch' or his after school program (which we will get credit for.)
However, any suggestions on how to starthelping him identify when,
where and with whom he can be his rambunctious self and 'larger than
life' self so he doesn't head towards being labeled and alienated or
worse, supressed? Also, the appropriate 'punishment.' I have some
ideas but would like the collective wisdom of this very intelligent
group.

Hi --

If your son isn't actually trying to hurt anyone, but is just trying to
play, then you need to start teaching him the rules about when he can
rough house and when he can't. He can't, for example, if the other
child says "no" or "stop". No means no, no matter what. (This is a
good rule to start learning early ...)

You need to talk with his teachers about how they deal with the
situation, and how you can support them at home. They should be keeping
a close watch on his play (and the other kids too, for that matter) and
stop the rough play before it begins. This kind of play WILL prevent
him from having friends! Some kids like it, but many do not.

Sending him home strikes me as silly. However, if his teachers can't
handle it -- perhaps there are not enough teachers available to
supervise the kids closely enough -- then sending him home might be
necessary. (Not desirable, but necessary.)

I'd also look into a more developmentally appropriate nursery school.
This one might not prove to be a good fit.

One of my sons was also very physical in nursery school. He alienated
some kids, but become close chums with others. His teachers DID
supervise him closely, and often had to remind him to play more gently,
or have him spend a minute or three sitting quietly on the bench to calm
down. (Not calm down from anger, but re-focus his play to something
more socially acceptable.) They certainly never sent him home!

Thinking about it some more, I think your son may need some explicit
instructions (by you and DH) regarding social cues. He needs to learn
what other kids enjoy and what they don't so that he can stop the
activities that the don't enjoy. You may think him young for this kind
of instruction, but kids who get on socially tend to do better overall
than kids who don't. There's no downside to starting early, so long as
you do it well.

I hope these thoughts help,
--Beth Kevles
-THE-COM-HERE
http://web.mit.edu/kevles/www/nomilk.html -- a page for the milk-allergic
Disclaimer: Nothing in this message should be construed as medical
advice. Please consult with your own medical practicioner.

NOTE: No email is read at my MIT address. Use the GMAIL one if you would
like me to reply.

On Fri, 02 Nov 2007 09:19:25 -0700, wrote:

However, any suggestions on how to starthelping him identify when,
where and with whom he can be his rambunctious self and 'larger than
life' self so he doesn't head towards being labeled and alienated or
worse, supressed? Also, the appropriate 'punishment.' I have some
ideas but would like the collective wisdom of this very intelligent
group.

Schools usually have a rule against roughhousing. It doesn't matter what
size anyone is. Just tell him no roughhousing at school.

I wouldn't punish him just yet. Make sure he knows the rules. The school
can deal with him there. If it continues to be a problem, then you'll need
to take action.

On Nov 2, 12:19 pm, wrote:
I have an interesting dilemma. My DS, soon to be 4, is the largest in
his class, very bright, gregarious and demonstrative. Described by
his teachers as 'taking up the room' with his personality and has a
father who wrestles, plays physically with him, his neighborhood
friends, jump on one another in a pile....well, just got a phone call
from the nursery school director that he did this type of play in
school and we need to bring him home. Now, at lunch bunch he plays
with the older kids where he is the same size and this isn't an issue
so I don't think my son discerns size or 'who wants to play' and who
doesn't. I don't disagree with the director for taking him to her
office and asking us to take him home and not be rewarded with 'lunch
bunch' or his after school program (which we will get credit for.)
However, any suggestions on how to starthelping him identify when,
where and with whom he can be his rambunctious self and 'larger than
life' self so he doesn't head towards being labeled and alienated or
worse, supressed? Also, the appropriate 'punishment.' I have some
ideas but would like the collective wisdom of this very intelligent
group.

I'm not surprised that your son is doing this; it's an extremely
common form of play amongst young boys (& probably girls). In fact,
while I agree with the school that this is not an appropriate form of
play at school, I'm rather surprised that they insisted upon sending
him home given that this is likely to occur frequently amongst the
kids.

I wouldn't punish your son for his behavior; I don't think he knew it
was wrong. (In any case, my guess is that having to go to the
director's office, missing lunch bunch, missing after school, and
having to have mom pick him up is a pretty steep punishment in his
eyes.) Instead, talk to him about *where* and *when* he can play this
way, and about adjusting his level of play when he is with less
rambunctious kids. It's a hard lesson to learn, so I wouldn't expect
him to master it immediately. You might want to practice using
stuffed animals or Playmobil figures. They can have fun roughhousing,
then walk them a little ways and say *now we stop because we're at
school*

I'd also talk to the school about exactly what happened, why the
school took this action, and how rough play is usually handled or re-
directed. If the school has a zero-tolerance of rough play policy, it
may not be the right place for your son.

Barbara

wrote in message
oups.com...
I have an interesting dilemma. My DS, soon to be 4, is the largest in
his class, very bright, gregarious and demonstrative. Described by
his teachers as 'taking up the room' with his personality and has a
father who wrestles, plays physically with him, his neighborhood
friends, jump on one another in a pile....well, just got a phone call
from the nursery school director that he did this type of play in
school and we need to bring him home. Now, at lunch bunch he plays
with the older kids where he is the same size and this isn't an issue
so I don't think my son discerns size or 'who wants to play' and who
doesn't. I don't disagree with the director for taking him to her
office and asking us to take him home and not be rewarded with 'lunch
bunch' or his after school program (which we will get credit for.)
However, any suggestions on how to starthelping him identify when,
where and with whom he can be his rambunctious self and 'larger than
life' self so he doesn't head towards being labeled and alienated or
worse, supressed? Also, the appropriate 'punishment.' I have some
ideas but would like the collective wisdom of this very intelligent
group.

I'm a teacher, and not a mom, but my approach would be to work with him
toward no rough housing at school. Even if it is permitted occasionally
with the older kids on the playground, he is eventually going to have to
stop.

However, first thing would be to teach him what "rough housing is." I used
to teach 3rd grade and we were still working on that concept there. Some
kids would like other kids so much that they wanted to show affection by
running and jumping on top of them in a big hug. Kids got hurt that way,
can't be permitted.

Wrestling, boxing, grabbing, pushing are good subdivisions to say "no" to.
Hugging, bearhugging, touching without permission in general can wait until
later, imo.

Does the school allow tag games and if so, what kind? I'd think the school
does not allow any sort of contact sport at that age, but maybe tag is okay.
If he can learn to initiate a particular game that's rowdy and involves
chasing, but learn not to go overboard, that would be good.

Linda G.
Teacher, 6th grade




--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

In article .com,
wrote:

I have an interesting dilemma. My DS, soon to be 4, is the largest in
his class, very bright, gregarious and demonstrative. Described by
his teachers as 'taking up the room' with his personality and has a
father who wrestles, plays physically with him, his neighborhood
friends, jump on one another in a pile....well, just got a phone call
from the nursery school director that he did this type of play in
school and we need to bring him home. Now, at lunch bunch he plays
with the older kids where he is the same size and this isn't an issue
so I don't think my son discerns size or 'who wants to play' and who
doesn't. I don't disagree with the director for taking him to her
office and asking us to take him home and not be rewarded with 'lunch
bunch' or his after school program (which we will get credit for.)
However, any suggestions on how to starthelping him identify when,
where and with whom he can be his rambunctious self and 'larger than
life' self so he doesn't head towards being labeled and alienated or
worse, supressed? Also, the appropriate 'punishment.' I have some
ideas but would like the collective wisdom of this very intelligent
group.

I think I'd be asking some very serious questions about exactly what happened.
I think this is WAAAAAYYY OTT for a single offence by a 4yo -- was he
continuing to jump on people despite being told to stop? Did he hurt someone
or break something? Was there a failure in supervision?

Little boys in particular need vigorous exercise alternated with quiet
activities. Too many quiet activities and you get fidgety, silly boys who
will take any opportunity to let off steam, such as running and climbing
indoors and throwing toys. Your DS is presumably towards the more energetic
end of the spectrum in the first place, so he needs a centre with plenty of
dance, good outdoor space and play equipment, and active games like Catch,
Duck Duck Goose etc. A centre that focusses on quiet crafts will not fulfil
his need for large-muscle exercise.

Lastly, only one type of punishment is appropriate for little kids, and that
is *immediate* punishment. Forget anything else; he won't understand, and I
cannot see that he needs punishment. He needs correction -- that is, to be
reminded of the right thing to do rather than jumped on when he gets it wrong.

--
Chookie -- Sydney, Australia
(Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply)

http://chookiesbackyard.blogspot.com/

Chookie wrote:
In article .com,
wrote:

I have an interesting dilemma. My DS, soon to be 4, is the largest in
his class, very bright, gregarious and demonstrative. Described by
his teachers as 'taking up the room' with his personality and has a
father who wrestles, plays physically with him, his neighborhood
friends, jump on one another in a pile....well, just got a phone call
from the nursery school director that he did this type of play in
school and we need to bring him home. Now, at lunch bunch he plays
with the older kids where he is the same size and this isn't an issue
so I don't think my son discerns size or 'who wants to play' and who
doesn't. I don't disagree with the director for taking him to her
office and asking us to take him home and not be rewarded with 'lunch
bunch' or his after school program (which we will get credit for.)
However, any suggestions on how to starthelping him identify when,
where and with whom he can be his rambunctious self and 'larger than
life' self so he doesn't head towards being labeled and alienated or
worse, supressed? Also, the appropriate 'punishment.' I have some
ideas but would like the collective wisdom of this very intelligent
group.

I think I'd be asking some very serious questions about exactly what happened.
I think this is WAAAAAYYY OTT for a single offence by a 4yo -- was he
continuing to jump on people despite being told to stop? Did he hurt someone
or break something? Was there a failure in supervision?

Little boys in particular need vigorous exercise alternated with quiet
activities. Too many quiet activities and you get fidgety, silly boys who
will take any opportunity to let off steam, such as running and climbing
indoors and throwing toys. Your DS is presumably towards the more energetic
end of the spectrum in the first place, so he needs a centre with plenty of
dance, good outdoor space and play equipment, and active games like Catch,
Duck Duck Goose etc. A centre that focusses on quiet crafts will not fulfil
his need for large-muscle exercise.

Lastly, only one type of punishment is appropriate for little kids, and that
is *immediate* punishment. Forget anything else; he won't understand, and I
cannot see that he needs punishment. He needs correction -- that is, to be
reminded of the right thing to do rather than jumped on when he gets it wrong.

I agree with you. It's definitely the case that the
preschool could likely be handling this better. However, one
has to really look at the big picture to tease out what's really
going on. Is this a school that has inappropriate expectations
(i.e., not developmentally appropriate)? Or is it a school where
the teachers haven't had enough training in early childhood
education to know how they ought to be working with him on
this issue? Or are they understaffed so that they can't
stay on top of him well enough to manage the situation? Or
did this boy upset another child whose parents are making a
big stink and the preschool is caving to them (this is particularly
lethal PR-wise when combined with not enough staff to assure the
parents that their child will be adequately safeguarded).
If you can figure out what the situation is, you will
have a better shot at working with the school to address this
problem. There's probably *something* that made them feel
they needed to take this action, even if it probably wasn't
the best course of action.
I also agree with the other posters that if you have
a child who is used to roughhousing, you have to do some serious
work to put some boundaries around that behavior. The teachers
need to be working on it in class, but probably also need some
support at home. If Dad is doing a lot of the roughhousing,
then it would be an excellent idea for Dad to take on some of the
work of defining some boundaries. Even Dad can suggest that
there are times and places where it's ok to roughhouse with
him, and other times and places where it isn't. No need to
make it all about "some kids are delicate wimps and others
are strong and robust and you can only roughhouse with the
strong kids." I'd go for teaching times and places and
"no means no." Also teach acceptable alternatives for getting
that energy out (and talk with his teacher about what will
work at school and whether the whole class is getting enough
of it).

Best wishes,
Ericka