Kinda stupid, but still...

xkatx . wrote in message
news:ZZP%b.635827$ts4.625636@pd7tw3no...

"lm" wrote in message ...
On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 17:09:43 GMT, "xkatx" wrote:


"Joelle" wrote in message ...
What do you think?
If something came up that you didn't agree with that, really, would
not
hurt
your child, but it was still something you were totally and 100%
against,
what would you do?


Well if you are totally and 100% against supporting something, I
guess
you
have
to stand up for your principles.

With a circus, I am as a whole. But in all reality, I am not
supporting
it
in any way - it's my aunt.

Hmmm, he's your son. Just because you're not spending the money
doesn't mean you're not supporting it. By allowing your son to go,
you're condoning it.

It's really hard to put up with this aunt. She has always been like my
mom
away from my mom, but there's been a few issues we've come across where we
don't agree with things, and even though this is my son, I seem to end up
losing the battle against her. She never once has said anything like she
will stop talking to me if I don't agree with something, but there's
little
things like I don't want him having much sugar, meaning candy, chocolates,
pop and so on, but something like jam on toast in the morning is fine, or
just every day things with sugar are fine, but chocolates and candies and
cookies to no end is just a small thing I don't like. I bring that up,
and
she will say something like, "well, when he's at my house, he can have
treats" so that kind of backs me into a corner. I'm not about to say,
"fine, then we'll never, ever come over again" because that is my aunt,
she
loves him and he loves her to death, well, it just kind of puts me in a
bad
position. That's kind of a really stupid example, but it's just a small
example. She would never do a thing to hurt him, but it's things that I
try
to enforce every day that get broken, and I just don't like it that much
but, again, in the long run, I lose the battle.


How often is your son with the Auntie? If its occasionally, don't sweat the
sweets. If its a daily thing, then you need to be firm. It can be hard, I
deal with issues with my mom all the time. Sometimes its a no-win.

T

"Kim" wrote in message ...

"xkatx" wrote in message

*snipped*

I'm kind of lost because this is not something that has ever been an
issue.
It's never been that the circus has come to town and I had said yes or
no
before. I can't seem to find any info on this circus about animal abuse
or
cruelty, and I shouldn't put my own fear of evil clowns into my son,
just
as
a whole, I personally hate the circus.


Bingo... I'm afraid of the dentist... Doesn't mean I'm going to stop the
kids from going... I'm also afraid of spiders, snakes and all sorts of
things that I have had nightmares about... I don't stop my kids from
picking
up snakes or climbing ladders or removing the spider from the shower while
I
cower in the corner screaming like a banchee...

If the circus has a good rep for being clean and treating thier critters
right I really don't think you should stop him from going because you are
afraid of clowns... That's just not fair to him or the auntie... They both
might find it a very entertaining trip...

Ah yes, I can relate. But, with the circus, it's not JUST the creepy and
demon-like clowns. It's a bit of everything, and I actually DID try and do
a bit of searching the other night on the circus. I couldn't come up with
anything, but I still don't think that animals should be exploited. Unless,
of course, they're monkeys, but only because I hate monkeys.

and my thoughts on:

"but chocolates and candies and
cookies to no end is just a small thing I don't like. I bring that up,
and
she will say something like, "well, when he's at my house, he can have
treats" so that kind of backs me into a corner. I'm not about to say,
"fine, then we'll never, ever come over again"

Very simple... I would never tell them that you'd never come back I'd very
simply state "well when the dental bills start piling up we'll know where
to
send them" in a very no nonsense voice AND make sure that auntie knows the
line "I'm sure that when so and so becomes over excited and I have to
raise
my voice or give him a time out becuase you gave him too many sweets while
he visited I'm positive I'll let him know that it was the aunties sweet
giving that caused him grief"

You know, I never thought of it like that. That's a really, really good
idea!

That is exactly what I did with my mom and guess what? My kids were very
closely monitored after that time... Treats are good and ok some of the
time
but not ok ALL of the time... and Aunties love to spoil them and that's
fantastic too but have auntie do it in a different way with lots and
lots
snuggles... Always the preffered choice

I know those two lines may seem extreme... BUT as a single parent with
little or know breaks available the last thing you want are caveties and
overly active sugar induced energized munchkins... Auntie needs to
apprecieate that aspect as well... Also doen't help if she is undermining
your authoritie with the tyke... Things like that aren't much help... You
might want to sit down with her and just chat about the facts of single
parenting

JMHO,
K


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(Reply to xkatx[at]shaw[dot]ca, and change the obvious, asshat.)

"Tiffany" wrote in message ...
snip 'cause it's getting long

You mention a fear of clowns..... is that the reason you don't like
circus?

No, not entirely. It's a bit of everything, but some may fear a giant lion
getting ready to pounce on them, I fear the clowns.
I also don't believe in exploiting those animals, and agree with you for
that.
I find more amusement in something like RealTV or something that we, as
humans, do that is just plain stupid, rather than what animals do.
I also don't like all the cruelty that rolls on in with the circus, but I
looked and looked, and had to admit that this circus seems to have a fairly
good rep.

sorry if you did post your reason elsewhere. I haven't really given
opinion
because I think the reason you are against the circus would change the
outcome. If its your fears, why would you prevent him from going? If its
the
cruelty issue, you could let him go then explain to him why you don't
agree
with circus. Let him now before he goes, so he can really SEE your reason.

Well, I really don't think he cares much for my reasons. He's 3, and
really, I don't think at 3 they can actually understand such thoughts as
this, and no, he's no super-human, super-smart, super-special toddler that
can do advanced physics in a matter of moments. Explaining much more than,
"What happened?" in a movie we've watched 100 times is kind of pointless, I
think. He wouldn't even be able to sit and concentrate long enough for me
to begin to start to explain my thoughts, and I think he'd care more about
making faces or silly noises at me than actually sitting and listening to
something like an entire lecture. lol

I don't go to circus or animal shows as I don't believe animals were put
on
this earth for our sick entertainment. Most animals are abused in one form
or another, why else would they do things they don't normally do? But one
day my daughter was with her father and he took her to a circus. Amazing,
he
was a vegetarian too. I am amazed as I never thought he would do that. She
did like it then, but now, after going to some other places, seeing other
animals in wild, she probably wouldn't go. I made that her choice.

Yes, he seems to like the wild as well. He loves going out of town to the
lake or just away and since, I guess, I'm a lot like my dad, I tend to keep
my eyes off the road and in the ditch or sky to point out every hawk, moose
or fox I see. He likes that, and we slow down to see deer running along a
field. I doubt he can really see a difference yet, but maybe one day he
will, or maybe he won't.

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(Reply to xkatx[at]shaw[dot]ca, and change the obvious, asshat.)

T

"Tiffany" wrote in message
...

xkatx . wrote in message
news:ZZP%b.635827$ts4.625636@pd7tw3no...

"lm" wrote in message ...
On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 17:09:43 GMT, "xkatx" wrote:


"Joelle" wrote in message ...
What do you think?
If something came up that you didn't agree with that, really,
would
not
hurt
your child, but it was still something you were totally and 100%
against,
what would you do?


Well if you are totally and 100% against supporting something, I
guess
you
have
to stand up for your principles.

With a circus, I am as a whole. But in all reality, I am not
supporting
it
in any way - it's my aunt.

Hmmm, he's your son. Just because you're not spending the money
doesn't mean you're not supporting it. By allowing your son to go,
you're condoning it.

It's really hard to put up with this aunt. She has always been like my
mom
away from my mom, but there's been a few issues we've come across where
we
don't agree with things, and even though this is my son, I seem to end
up
losing the battle against her. She never once has said anything like
she
will stop talking to me if I don't agree with something, but there's
little
things like I don't want him having much sugar, meaning candy,
chocolates,
pop and so on, but something like jam on toast in the morning is fine,
or
just every day things with sugar are fine, but chocolates and candies
and
cookies to no end is just a small thing I don't like. I bring that up,
and
she will say something like, "well, when he's at my house, he can have
treats" so that kind of backs me into a corner. I'm not about to say,
"fine, then we'll never, ever come over again" because that is my aunt,
she
loves him and he loves her to death, well, it just kind of puts me in a
bad
position. That's kind of a really stupid example, but it's just a small
example. She would never do a thing to hurt him, but it's things that I
try
to enforce every day that get broken, and I just don't like it that much
but, again, in the long run, I lose the battle.


How often is your son with the Auntie? If its occasionally, don't sweat
the
sweets. If its a daily thing, then you need to be firm. It can be hard, I
deal with issues with my mom all the time. Sometimes its a no-win.

Quite often... She works a few blocks from where we live, so we often go
visit her at work when she's not that busy and we aren't that busy either.
She lives way on the other side of the city, but we still visit her at home,
usually around once a week. She often babysits if I go to a movie at the
mall, so I'd say they're together fairly often, but not every single day.

T

I don't go to circus or animal shows as I don't believe animals were put
on
this earth for our sick entertainment. Most animals are abused in one form
or another, why else would they do things they don't normally do?


Well actually, many of the tricks elephants at reputable circuses do, are
actions they do in the wild. And elephants in the wild spend their time
working and looking for food, and traveling....so although an elephant is
better off in the wild, between a zoo, where they just stand around all day,
and a circus, where they work, an elephant in a reputable circus is better off.

Of course lions don't normally jump through hoops of fire, but really animals
that are put to work are usually happier than animals with nothing to do.

Kind of true for people to...

Joelle
The world is a book and those who do not travel read only one page - St
Augustine
Joelle

On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 17:16:31 GMT, "xkatx" . wrote:

[snipped so xkatx's quote is entirely out of context]

I still don't think that animals should be exploited. Unless,
of course, they're monkeys, but only because I hate monkeys.

LOL! That cracked me up! I'm not big on cats, myself, but they won't
do tricks anyway.

lm

'Kate wrote in message ...
On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 17:16:31 GMT, "xkatx" .

"Kim" wrote in message ...

Ah yes, I can relate. But, with the circus, it's not JUST the creepy and
demon-like clowns. It's a bit of everything, and I actually DID try and
do
a bit of searching the other night on the circus. I couldn't come up
with
anything, but I still don't think that animals should be exploited.
Unless,
of course, they're monkeys, but only because I hate monkeys.

Could it be that the clown fear led to seeking causes to avoid the
circus (like the determination of unethical treatment of animals) so
that avoiding the circus becomes less about clowns and seems more
plausable?

I don't really know. Could be, but I don't know for sure. I've never
really liked either, so you could be right.

What happens if the little one returns and LOVES the clowns? What if
that's all he can talk about? What if he wants to be one for Halloween?

Well, if that happens, I can, at least, ship him off to work with the
circus. He'll get all the clowns he could ever imagine. Haha Hopefully
next weekend is far enough away from Halloween that he'll want to be
something else


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(Reply to xkatx[at]shaw[dot]ca, and change the obvious, asshat.)

'Kate

"lm" wrote in message ...
On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 17:16:31 GMT, "xkatx" wrote:

[snipped so xkatx's quote is entirely out of context]

I still don't think that animals should be exploited. Unless,
of course, they're monkeys, but only because I hate monkeys.

LOL! That cracked me up! I'm not big on cats, myself, but they won't
do tricks anyway.

lm

THAT'S why it's all about monkeys.

Stand up for yourself - I agree about the circus (if it includes animals) but
really the principle here is that he is your child and you a right to decide
where he goes and what he sees.

I do not agree that the circus is not harmful to him tho - he will be
entertained and excited at the spectacle of animals (esp the lions and tigers
etc) who lead a miserable life, and will 'educated' that this is acceptable,
and that (by allowing him to go) you approve.

I cannot figure out why you didn't simply point out to the woman that you would
be happy for her to take him to a movie or some other form of entertainment,
but would allow him to go to the circus because...

David

xkatx wrote:

What do you think?

I'm kind of having some problems here; My auntie called me last night and
asked if she could take the B to the circus next weekend. ....

What do you think?
If something came up that you didn't agree with that, really, would not hurt
your child, but it was still something you were totally and 100% against,
what would you do?

Hi xkatx

There is an important issue in the paragraph below - in my view it is not
acceptable that your aunt has stated that SHE will decide what your son eats
when he is at her home.

If you agree with this in principle, then what about when he is older - does
that mean when he is at someone elses home and THEY think it is OK for him to
drink alcohol or smoke pot then that is OK with you?

Over the years I have many kids other than my own in my care (eg my kids
friends on sleepovers etc) and I have always believed that I should follow
their parents wishes about food, movies they watch, bedtimes etc etc.

Remember, you can give your aunt the opportunity to make a choice - she can
enjoy the company of your child and follow your rules, or she can miss out.

Easy peasy

David - who thinks you have to stick up for your principles, even tho sometimes
it is not so easy

xkatx wrote:

It's really hard to put up with this aunt. She has always been like my mom
away from my mom, but there's been a few issues we've come across where we
don't agree with things, and even though this is my son, I seem to end up
losing the battle against her. She never once has said anything like she
will stop talking to me if I don't agree with something, but there's little
things like I don't want him having much sugar, meaning candy, chocolates,
pop and so on, but something like jam on toast in the morning is fine, or
just every day things with sugar are fine, but chocolates and candies and
cookies to no end is just a small thing I don't like. I bring that up, and
she will say something like, "well, when he's at my house, he can have
treats" so that kind of backs me into a corner. I'm not about to say,
"fine, then we'll never, ever come over again" because that is my aunt, she
loves him and he loves her to death, well, it just kind of puts me in a bad
position. That's kind of a really stupid example, but it's just a small
example. She would never do a thing to hurt him, but it's things that I try
to enforce every day that get broken, and I just don't like it that much
but, again, in the long run, I lose the battle.