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OT religion and smacking



 
 
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  #21  
Old February 20th 04, 12:07 PM
Clisby
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Default OT religion and smacking



Clisby wrote:


Sue wrote:

Clisby wrote in message

There are states where public school officials can legally spank your
child without your permission.




Wow Clisby, I am amazed. I didn't think any states in the US could
spank so
I looked it up. Sure enough, 23 states are allowed to spank kids in
public
schools. ( It said it was mostly in the south in the "bible belt"
states. Geez, that's a shame.
--
Sue (mom to three girls)
I'm Just a Raggedy Ann in a Barbie Doll World...



Yeah, I remember looking up some of this stuff in relation to a thread
on one of the misc.kids newsgroups not too long ago. If we have the
same list, these states allow spanking:

Alabama
Arizona
Arkansas
Colorado
Florida
Georgia
Idaho
Indiana
Kansas
Kentucky
Louisiana
Mississippi
Missouri
New Mexico
North Carolina
Ohio
Oklahoma
Pennsylvania
South Carolina
Tennessee
Texas
Wyoming

Here in Georgia, a school district that wants to give officials the
option of spanking has to have a written policy on it. So it's possible
there are individual districts in Georgia that ban spanking - I know one
of the districts close to Atlanta was considering that recently. It's
also possible that some districts require parental permission, although
I'd be pretty surprised to hear it. (A child can be exempted from
spanking if the parent gets a doctor to sign a statement that it would
be detrimental to the child's mental or emotional stability.)

Clisby




One other note - according to this website:


http://www.corpun.com/faq.htm


Private schools aren't necessarily affected by state school spanking
bans - it lists Alaska, California, Illinois, Michigan, Nevada, New
York, Utah, and Washington as states where the bans don't apply to
private schools.

This website also said Pennsylvania abolished public school spankings in
2002, so maybe we're down to 21 states that allow it

Clisby

  #22  
Old February 20th 04, 03:51 PM
Nina
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Default OT religion and smacking


"teapot" wrote in message
m...
On the train yesterday I was talking to a woman who was keen to tell
me that children need to be disciplined from an early age. I did

all
the neutral 'oh really, well that's not how I want to do it but

thanks
anyway' stuff but then she told me that she had read about it in a
book her pastor had lent her. It said that you should smack but not
with the hand as that is for love, but with a paddle. She was

reading
it because it was the book that the christian school she wanted to
send her child to used as a guideline. She said that she wanted to
know that she had done the best she could for her child when

judgement
day came. I said that if I believed in a judgement day I would

expect
to go straight to hell, do not pass go, if I ever smacked my child,
especially with a paddle. She said she would pray for me.

It left me so upset, her poor child. She said the governbment are
trying to ban it, I said I wasnt surprised and asked how a school
could discipline children like that without breaking the law. She

said
it was ok as they parents had given consent.


It is allowed here as well.I am not pro-spanking, but I am not
vehemently anti-spanking either
I believe there are times when it is useful and justified. A great
many people believe that
if you spank a child you should use a paddle, or some object other
than the hand, so the
child doesn't associate the hand with pain.
I grew up in the Southern US, where corporal punishment is the norm.
Kids get spanked and
are expected to be spanked. In the schools, it was also allowed and
done with a paddle. I think in the state
where I grew up, it is still legal.
That being said, I am not for spanking very small kids, or very old
ones. There is a certain age range where
it can be effective and appropriate.
I am NOT for "beating" kids.


  #23  
Old February 20th 04, 03:56 PM
Nina
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Default OT religion and smacking


"New York Jen" wrote
In any case, if ANYONE lays a FINGER on my child, they are going to

have to
respond to one mad as hell momma with flying fists!

kinda contradictory, no? If corporal punishment isn't a valid form of
discipline or punishment, then it should also be wrong for you to
use force or violence in response to an offense against you or your
child.


  #24  
Old February 20th 04, 03:59 PM
MonifromMarrs
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Default OT religion and smacking

When I was a kid in school teachers were alowed to spank children and I was one
that got spanked on more than one occasion with wooden paddle and with the hand
of a teacher. I dont know if they still do it but I wouldnt doubt it. I live
in Texas. But then again I have never had good luck with teachers. Moni
  #25  
Old February 20th 04, 03:59 PM
Nina
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Default OT religion and smacking


"Sue" wrote in message
...
Clisby wrote in message
There are states where public school officials can legally spank

your
child without your permission.


Wow Clisby, I am amazed. I didn't think any states in the US could

spank so
I looked it up. Sure enough, 23 states are allowed to spank kids in

public
schools. ( It said it was mostly in the south in the "bible

belt"
states. Geez, that's a shame.
--
Sue (mom to three girls)
I'm Just a Raggedy Ann in a Barbie Doll World...


I once got in trouble in Jr high, some boys did too, same offense.
Because
they wouldn't paddle girls, the boys got a paddling and I got
suspended for 3
days. I was pretty upset,I'd have much rather had the paddling than 3
days
lost of school and the bad grades.
Basically you bent down, touched your ankles and were given 3 swift
NOT very hard paddles, then released. I really don't have a problem
with it,
of course I did grow up in Georgia.


  #26  
Old February 20th 04, 04:01 PM
Nina
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Posts: n/a
Default OT religion and smacking


"Clisby" wrote in message
...


Sue wrote:
Clisby wrote in message

There are states where public school officials can legally spank

your
child without your permission.



Wow Clisby, I am amazed. I didn't think any states in the US could

spank so
I looked it up. Sure enough, 23 states are allowed to spank kids

in public
schools. ( It said it was mostly in the south in the "bible

belt"
states. Geez, that's a shame.
--
Sue (mom to three girls)
I'm Just a Raggedy Ann in a Barbie Doll World...



Yeah, I remember looking up some of this stuff in relation to a

thread
on one of the misc.kids newsgroups not too long ago. If we have the
same list, these states allow spanking:

Colorado

Live here.
Florida

Lived here.
Georgia

Grew up here.

Louisiana

Grandma from here

Mississippi

Exhusband from here

Ohio

Born here


Pennsylvania

Lived here
South Carolina

Lived here


Texas

Grandma grew up here.
No wonder I amnot so anti-spanking as some of you.


  #27  
Old February 20th 04, 04:04 PM
Nina
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Posts: n/a
Default OT religion and smacking


"Shannon G" wrote in message
news:XtfZb.8253$lQ2.1854@okepread02...

"Clisby" wrote in message
...


Sue wrote:
Clisby wrote in message

There are states where public school officials can legally spank

your
child without your permission.


...


How old is this list? Here in AZ, a teacher was just either put on
administrative leave or terminated for physically reprimanding a

child for
speaking Spanish rather than the legislatively mandated English

during
class. IIRC, she slapped them on the arm.


Corporal punishment in the schools I am familiar with,isn't "spanking"
of children by teachers.
Is not like at home where you can just whack a kid. Usually it is done
by someone in administration
after the child is sent there from the classroom,offense evaluated and
punishment determined.
Then it is done with the spanker and an observer, usually a set number
of blows with a certain
object used expressly for that.
Teachers aren't allowed to willy-nilly just spank the kids, its done
along the lines of a suspension
or expulsion.


  #28  
Old February 20th 04, 04:05 PM
Nina
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Default OT religion and smacking


"Chotii" wrote in message
...

"Kari" wrote in message
...

New York Jen wrote:


I believe that here in the US, if you sign something agreeing

to let
the
school discipline your child, they are allowed to do so as

long as
they
don't leave any visible marks on the child. I may have just

fabricated
that
in my mind from watching too many television shows, but that's

what
sticks
in my mind.


There are states where public school officials can legally spank

your
child without your permission.


That's awful! I would be sooooo po'ed if someone touched my

child!!



In any case, if ANYONE lays a FINGER on my child, they are

going to
have
to
respond to one mad as hell momma with flying fists!


Better make sure you don't live in one of those states, then -

no point
in you ending up in jail as well as your child being spanked.


Well I'm totally with Jen, I'd be in jail too I guess. How insane

is that
law?! We are in the 21st century are we not??? Geez Louise.


When I was in middle school (6th grade, to be precise), I remember

kids
being sent to the principal to be swatted with a paddle. It doesn't

seem so
long ago, but of course it was 1979. That was a while ago. This was

in
Eastern Washington state.

I confess, we do swat. One swat, with a bare hand on a clothed

backside. I
haven't found that screaming in the child's face works any better

(and this
is what I have seen, and heard confessed, to be the alternative in a

great
many cases. And I don't see why it would *be* any "better" for

the child.
HOWEVER I would get all over anybody else who felt it was

appropriate to lay
hands on my children, and that includes (and maybe especially) the
grandparerents. I do *not* have a problem with an adult who

observes a
behavior problem either pointing it out to my child, or to me - and

I know a
lot of parents do - actually I would certainly HOPE that if another

adult
saw one of my children do something inappropriate, like shove

another child,
etc., that they would intervene and make sure the conflict was

resolved, or
make sure I knew about it so I could do so. (Of course, I find my

kids obey
complete strangers better than they do me, so they're less likely to

repeat
forbidden behavior around a stranger, or their grandparents, than

they are
around me.)

I have read a lot of books about discipline without the use of

corporal
punishment. I wish I could say they did anything for my family but

give me
sullen children who tuned out lectures, who smirked while they

repeated the
forbidden action, or who simply ignored us entirely, thus provoking

us into
the scream-at-the-child stage. Shrug. Again, I don't see how this is

an
improvement over a small pop on the backside, that gets somebody's
attention. Call my behavior inappropriate if you must. But do it

after you
walk a few miles in my shoes.

--angela

I'm with you. It works, isn't unduly traumatizing. My kids were more
upset by shots
or getting their ears cleaned than a quick swat on the butt.


  #29  
Old February 20th 04, 04:06 PM
Nina
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default OT religion and smacking


"Larry McMahan" wrote
For real discipline, I have found that time-outs or other revocation

of
privileges works quite well, and can get the point across quite

effectively,
thank you. I don't think corporal punishment is any more effective

for this
kind of thing, and can actually have negative unintended

consequences.


So much of this is child dependent. I was very antispaking till I had
kids
then realized, sometimes EVEN WHEN EVERYTHING ELSE IS DONE
RIGHT that its can be the only thing that WORKS. So as a last resort,
I will use it,


 




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