Homework over spring break (long)

In article ,
"bizby40" wrote:

My daughter (4th grade) likes to watch American Idol. Her favorite
is Anthony. Last week Anthony was in the bottom 3, though he
didn't get voted off. She *cried* about it. She said she couldn't
sleep. She wanted to know if she'd ever see him again. She was
completely distraught.

There are sexual scenes and situations that most adults don't
consider pornography that I still don't think would be appropriate
for my kids. There is also graphic violence that I don't think they
need to think about yet. But what I need to remember is how
much more sensitive children can be. How much more affected
by the things they are exposed to. I'd be much more wary of
something distressing than I would a homosexual reference. I'm
a bit worried about The Seeing Stone because there is a scene
where a pig is slaughtered. She hasn't gotten to that part yet,
but I'm a little worried that it will really upset her.

So I can't agree that any adult book is okay for kids.

Bizby

I think reading to yourself is entirely different, emotionally, from
watching it on a screen or even having someone else read it to you.

As I said in another post, I found that stuff that was unsuitable --
stuff I didn't REALLY understand or was emotionally unready for -- bored
me and I put it down.

I think when you are reading to yourself you can create a different kind
of distance between you and the material -- you can protect yourself --
in ways you cannot when you have less control.

I don't know any of my siblings who were upset by books, except the one
who started reading Stephen King when he was very young. He had a few
nightmares, and Mom made Dad get up with him, since SHE didn't read King
because she found him too intense, so Dad was the one bringing them into
the house. My brother got over his nightmares, and has read everything
by King.

As far as being upset by a pig being slaughtered -- heck, by the time I
was in 2nd grade I'd seen a pig get slaughtered, and helped slaughter
chickens. I'm reasonbly certain reading about it wouldn't have been
upsetting . . . but I do understand that city-reared kids have a
different sensibility about these things.
--
Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care

In article t,
Clisby wrote:

I don't know - I wouldn't stop my 3rd grader from reading "Gone with the
Wind" if she had the stamina for it. (I've never read Ender's Game, so I
don't know about that.) I think I was in the 4th grade when I
recognized the existence of homosexuality, all because I had read a book
that belonged to my parents. Unless a book's out-and-out porn, I don't
think I'd stop my child from reading it.

My son started reading Orson Scott Card (Ender's Game) by the time he
was 10 or so. It's pretty intense -- my Mom quit reading it because she
found it disturbing -- but both DH and I had read it and loved it. As
each new book in the series came out, the three of us would fight over
who got to read it first. (Since I read really fast, I usually won....)

What's interesting is that at 19 he is re-reading the series, and
understanding it on a whole new level. At 10, it was just kind of an
adventure book. At 19, he is clearer about the moral issues being
considered.
--
Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care

In article ,
"bizby40" wrote:


Ender is a child who is taken away from his parents because they had
more children than allowed by law. He is taken to a training center
with other children, where they are trained in war games.

Not quite -- his family was allowed to have a third, because the first
two were so promising. However, neither of them passed the tests to get
into the special training center. He was put in the center when he DID
pass the tests -- he wasn't removed as a punitive measure at all.
--
Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care

bizby40 wrote:



Ender is a child who is taken away from his parents because they had
more children than allowed by law.

Just to be pedantic, he wasn't taken because he was an illegal "Third", he was
taken because of his abilities. In the story, you find out that his parents were
encouraged to have a 3rd child, since their first 2 children were almost right.

Laura

bizby40 wrote:

Ender is a child who is taken away from his parents because they had
more children than allowed by law. He is taken to a training center
with other children, where they are trained in war games.

He's taken away, NOT because they had more children than allowed by
law, but because he's a child genius, and the hope is that he'll be the
one child that's talented enough to beat the aliens. In fact, because
their first two children were so promising (the parents are themselves
highly intelligent, as are the first two kids) they were given
permission to have a third, though he suffers some dislike because he's
a "third." The "rationing" of children is due to a world-wide shortage
of supplies due to the incredible world effort at beating the aliens.

Sorry... I just had to say something... my family is fanatic about the
Ender books, which are wonderful.

Cathy Weeks
Mommy to Kivi Alexis 12/01

dragonlady wrote:
In article ,
"bizby40" wrote:

My daughter (4th grade) likes to watch American Idol. Her favorite
is Anthony. Last week Anthony was in the bottom 3, though he
didn't get voted off. She *cried* about it. She said she couldn't
sleep. She wanted to know if she'd ever see him again. She was
completely distraught.

There are sexual scenes and situations that most adults don't
consider pornography that I still don't think would be appropriate
for my kids. There is also graphic violence that I don't think they
need to think about yet. But what I need to remember is how
much more sensitive children can be. How much more affected
by the things they are exposed to. I'd be much more wary of
something distressing than I would a homosexual reference. I'm
a bit worried about The Seeing Stone because there is a scene
where a pig is slaughtered. She hasn't gotten to that part yet,
but I'm a little worried that it will really upset her.

So I can't agree that any adult book is okay for kids.

Bizby

I think reading to yourself is entirely different, emotionally, from
watching it on a screen or even having someone else read it to you.

That's true. Because I know that I don't have a very thick emotional
skin for violence or suspense, or even humor especially if it makes
someone look foolish, I watch hardly any fictional stuff on TV, and
never go to the movies.

As I said in another post, I found that stuff that was unsuitable --
stuff I didn't REALLY understand or was emotionally unready for -- bored
me and I put it down.

I started reading Louis Carroll (someone gave me a complete set of his
works) when I was about 10, and it took me quite awhile to work my way
through it. But I didn't put it down. I kept trying. I don't ever
remember putting a book down because it bored me. So YMMV in that
respect.

I remember disliking a book that perhaps I was not ready for. I
detested Water Babies, and I'm not sure why. But I'm not ready to go
back and re-try it.

I think when you are reading to yourself you can create a different kind
of distance between you and the material -- you can protect yourself --
in ways you cannot when you have less control.

I'm not sure that is true for everyone.

I don't know any of my siblings who were upset by books, except the one
who started reading Stephen King when he was very young. He had a few
nightmares, and Mom made Dad get up with him, since SHE didn't read King
because she found him too intense, so Dad was the one bringing them into
the house. My brother got over his nightmares, and has read everything
by King.

I had nightmares after I read Gone with the Wind (at about 15 years
old) I still cry when I read some things. If I read science fiction
stories, some of them would also give me nightmares. If I read any
fiction at all now, it is only light romance novels, and even then I
sometimes read the end first. So I didn't get over it.

As far as being upset by a pig being slaughtered -- heck, by the time I
was in 2nd grade I'd seen a pig get slaughtered, and helped slaughter
chickens. I'm reasonbly certain reading about it wouldn't have been
upsetting . . . but I do understand that city-reared kids have a
different sensibility about these things.

I don't think that would have bothered me either, even though I had
not seen a pig be slaughtered.

grandma Rosalie

"Clisby" wrote in message
k.net...


Bruce Bridgman and Jeanne Yang wrote:
"Sue" wrote in message
...

"enigma" wrote in message

i see reading lists as one more way to make kids hate reading.
if you can't even pick your own books, how are you going to
find your own interests? and how do they pick the books for
those lists? i was reading Arthur C. Clark in 2nd garde. being
forced to read something like Junie B. would have bored me to
tears...

That's you. My kids love Junie B. And not to mention there are some books
that are just not appropriate for little kids even if they are reading at
a
higher level. However, for the record, we don't have a required reading
list
at our school, they just want them to read.
--
Sue (mom to three girls)




I always saw summer reading lists (for elementary school students) as
suggestions for the children to read over the summer. The lists DD's
school have are much too long for the children to read every book. Many
parents don't know what books are out there for children - I know I have
a tough time picking out appropriate books for DD. I have a good grasp
of picture books and young adult books but I'm less sure about young
reader (2-4 grades) books.

Like Sue mentioned, it's the appropriateness of subject and language as
well as reading ability. While a child *may* be able to read "Gone with
the Wind" or "Ender's Game" (to pick two random books) doesn't mean she
*should* read it.

Jeanne


I don't know - I wouldn't stop my 3rd grader from reading "Gone with the
Wind" if she had the stamina for it. (I've never read Ender's Game, so I
don't know about that.) I think I was in the 4th grade when I recognized
the existence of homosexuality, all because I had read a book that
belonged to my parents. Unless a book's out-and-out porn, I don't think
I'd stop my child from reading it.

Clisby


I never said I would stop my 3rd grader (if I had one) from reading the
above text. I was responding to the negative opinion of summer reading
lists saying that they are simply suggestions not demands in my school
district. From that point, I wouldn't necessarily suggest them for young
children (e.g., put them on a reading list or hand them to a 7 year old
child who wants something to read). From what I've seen, young children who
are able to read the words don't necessarily understand the meaning behind
the words, so they don't get the story.

There are many booksI wouldn't suggest to a 2nd or 3rd grader depending on
their emotional development as well as reading skills. Not that I think
their topics are deterimental (like porn) but because the children may not
grasp what the author is trying to convey - so, while I think Walter
Isaacson 's Benjamin Franklin biography is a great book, I don't think it's
an appropriate book for a 7 year old - has nothing to do with porn (or
whatever) - if the child is of average reading skills and comprehension, she
just wouldn't get much out of the book. I would pick a Franklin biography
that was simpler while not condescending.

Jeanne

Cathy Weeks wrote:
bizby40 wrote:


Ender is a child who is taken away from his parents because they had
more children than allowed by law. He is taken to a training center
with other children, where they are trained in war games.


He's taken away, NOT because they had more children than allowed by
law, but because he's a child genius, and the hope is that he'll be the
one child that's talented enough to beat the aliens. In fact, because
their first two children were so promising (the parents are themselves
highly intelligent, as are the first two kids) they were given
permission to have a third, though he suffers some dislike because he's
a "third." The "rationing" of children is due to a world-wide shortage
of supplies due to the incredible world effort at beating the aliens.

Sorry... I just had to say something... my family is fanatic about the
Ender books, which are wonderful.

Cathy Weeks
Mommy to Kivi Alexis 12/01


Since somebody earlier in the thread mentioned these as possibly not
appropriate for young children - do you agree? Purely based on the
synopses posted here, they sound fine for children.

Clisby

Clisby wrote:

Since somebody earlier in the thread mentioned these as possibly not
appropriate for young children - do you agree? Purely based on the
synopses posted here, they sound fine for children.

I think Ender's Game is fine for most kids, even relatively young ones.
My daugter wouldn't sit still for it (she's 3). I'd say it'd be fine
for any kid over about 7 or so. There *are* a couple of scenes of
violence, but taken in context of the whole book, it's not bad.

The other books in the first Ender Series are much more adult books, so
I'm not sure a younger kid would care for them. They have much more
adult themes, and may not be appropriate.

However, like any book where there's a question - read the book first.
Ender's Game is a wonderful book that I just couldn't put down. I read
it in one sitting, and finished at like 4:00am or something like that.

Cathy Weeks
Mommy to Kivi Alexis 12/01

I find it interesting that, if I had to guess, that most of you would not
let children watch certain things on TV because of the content. But, from
what I am reading here, content in a book is okay. Why is that? Is it
because when you see something it's real to a child, but if he reads it and
doesn't know what the meaning is, that they just gloss over it?

There are a lot of books out there that my kids *could* read, but because of
the content and where they are at tempermentally, I haven't let them read
it. My friend didn't want her 2nd grader reading Sounder because the dog was
killed. Her daughter's temperment was such that she would be really upset
over that. But, she *could* read it. I don't know, I guess I am of the
opinion to wait until they can understand the meaning of a book to read it
and not just because they can.

--
Sue (mom to three girls)