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"Bad Girl!!!"



 
 
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  #1  
Old August 13th 03, 09:06 PM
Laurie
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Posts: n/a
Default "Bad Girl!!!"

Jessica has a new habit of saying "bad girl" all the time as a joke. She
has never heard those words from myself or from my husband; I have a major
problem with that particular phrase. It turns out that the other little girl
at Jessica's daycare says things like "bad girl" and "shut up" all the time.
She's only there with that girl about one day a week, but it's obviously
still an influence. Right now I"ve just been telling her that mommy doesn't
want to hear that and that Jessica is a very good girl. Are there any ways
of curbing this, or is it just a phase?

laurie
mommy to Jessica, 28 months!
and Christopher, 4 months!

*This email address is now valid*


  #2  
Old August 14th 03, 01:19 AM
toto
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Default "Bad Girl!!!"

On Wed, 13 Aug 2003 20:06:35 GMT, "Laurie"
wrote:

Jessica has a new habit of saying "bad girl" all the time as a joke. She
has never heard those words from myself or from my husband; I have a major
problem with that particular phrase. It turns out that the other little girl
at Jessica's daycare says things like "bad girl" and "shut up" all the time.
She's only there with that girl about one day a week, but it's obviously
still an influence. Right now I"ve just been telling her that mommy doesn't
want to hear that and that Jessica is a very good girl. Are there any ways
of curbing this, or is it just a phase?

It's probably a phase, but I would not say that Jessica is a good girl
either. In it's own way that is damaging also. When you praise her
praise the specific action she takes. A general *you are a good
girl* when she knows sometimes she is not can be very unhelpful
to your communicating with her later on.

Even though you think you are helping by saying you don't want to
hear that, you aren't. You are still paying attention to the
behavior, so she will probably continue it. Ignore the words entirely
and they will be more likely to drop out as she sees she gets no
reaction to them.

Do teach respect. Ask her how she feels when someone calls her
a "bad girl." Explain that these words hurt people's feelings, that
it makes no difference if other kids are using the same language, and
that name-calling simply isn't allowed. Your toddler is still working
on learning empathy and probably won't remember to think of others,
but she still needs to know that her actions have an affect on them.

But teach this at a time when she is not using the language so you
are not paying attention to what she said at the time.


laurie
mommy to Jessica, 28 months!
and Christopher, 4 months!

*This email address is now valid*


--
Dorothy

There is no sound, no cry in all the world
that can be heard unless someone listens ..
Outer Limits
  #3  
Old August 14th 03, 03:09 AM
Rosalie B.
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Default "Bad Girl!!!"

x-no-archive:yes "Laurie" wrote:

Jessica has a new habit of saying "bad girl" all the time as a joke. She
has never heard those words from myself or from my husband; I have a major
problem with that particular phrase. It turns out that the other little girl
at Jessica's daycare says things like "bad girl" and "shut up" all the time.
She's only there with that girl about one day a week, but it's obviously
still an influence. Right now I"ve just been telling her that mommy doesn't
want to hear that and that Jessica is a very good girl. Are there any ways
of curbing this, or is it just a phase?


It's kind of the same thing as you get sometimes where a child will
use bad language because of the reaction it gets from the parents.
The fact that she thinks it is a joke means that the meaning of the
words is less important than the reaction. As you said you have a
problem with it.

Other than completely ignoring it, I know of no solution for you at
this age assuming she's about 3? If she were older and using
inappropriate language you might be able to explain to her why you
don't want her to say that. Or you could give her a time out for
saying it perhaps.

But myself - I'd ignore it.


grandma Rosalie
  #4  
Old August 14th 03, 04:27 PM
Sue
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Posts: n/a
Default "Bad Girl!!!"

If she is getting any kind of reaction from you, she is going to continue
it. I agree with Dorothy and not even use good girl either, but rather her
behavior is good or bad depending on the situation. Also kids are going to
pick up a lot of stuff everywhere and there is no way to try and shelter
them from it. Most of it we either need to ignore if it isn't too terrible
or just say that we don't use those kinds of words or we don't behave that
way.
--
Sue
mom to three girls

Laurie wrote in message
. ..
Jessica has a new habit of saying "bad girl" all the time as a joke. She
has never heard those words from myself or from my husband; I have a major
problem with that particular phrase. It turns out that the other little

girl
at Jessica's daycare says things like "bad girl" and "shut up" all the

time.
She's only there with that girl about one day a week, but it's obviously
still an influence. Right now I"ve just been telling her that mommy

doesn't
want to hear that and that Jessica is a very good girl. Are there any ways
of curbing this, or is it just a phase?

laurie
mommy to Jessica, 28 months!
and Christopher, 4 months!

*This email address is now valid*




  #5  
Old August 15th 03, 03:02 PM
Stephanie
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default "Bad Girl!!!"

toto wrote in message . ..
On Wed, 13 Aug 2003 20:06:35 GMT, "Laurie"
wrote:

Jessica has a new habit of saying "bad girl" all the time as a joke. She
has never heard those words from myself or from my husband; I have a major
problem with that particular phrase. It turns out that the other little girl
at Jessica's daycare says things like "bad girl" and "shut up" all the time.
She's only there with that girl about one day a week, but it's obviously
still an influence. Right now I"ve just been telling her that mommy doesn't
want to hear that and that Jessica is a very good girl. Are there any ways
of curbing this, or is it just a phase?

It's probably a phase, but I would not say that Jessica is a good girl
either. In it's own way that is damaging also. When you praise her
praise the specific action she takes. A general *you are a good
girl* when she knows sometimes she is not can be very unhelpful
to your communicating with her later on.




I do not fully agree with this. I agree that, in the normal course of
events, you should praise the good behavior. I think that tells the
child precisely WHAT is so praiseworthy. But I do not like the advice
to avoid telling the child that she is a good girl. This is partly
because I believe we are ALL good girls and boys from birth unless
someone does us harm, and that the making of mistakes does not change
that. So it is a slight difference in view. I think that just as
calling a child a bad boy can be a self-fullfilling profesy, so to can
reminding them that, at their nature, they are a good boy, and that
the making of mistakes is a normal part of the human experience.

Even though you think you are helping by saying you don't want to
hear that, you aren't. You are still paying attention to the
behavior, so she will probably continue it. Ignore the words entirely
and they will be more likely to drop out as she sees she gets no
reaction to them.


Do teach respect. Ask her how she feels when someone calls her
a "bad girl." Explain that these words hurt people's feelings, that
it makes no difference if other kids are using the same language, and
that name-calling simply isn't allowed. Your toddler is still working
on learning empathy and probably won't remember to think of others,
but she still needs to know that her actions have an affect on them.

But teach this at a time when she is not using the language so you
are not paying attention to what she said at the time.


laurie
mommy to Jessica, 28 months!
and Christopher, 4 months!

*This email address is now valid*

  #6  
Old August 15th 03, 04:21 PM
dragonlady
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default "Bad Girl!!!"

In article ,
Chookie wrote:

In article ,
"Sue" wrote:

Most of it we either need to ignore if it isn't too terrible
or just say that we don't use those kinds of words or we don't behave that
way.


I agree, and am putting it into practice -- DS has brought home "Oh my God"
from daycare -- he said it three times yesterday, and I'm gritting my teeth.
I really, really hate it -- I'd prefer him to say s***!


The only problem can be that sometimes the response they get from other
people is so dramatic that the fact that their parents aren't responding
is moot. When DD#1 came home from preschool with some new words, I
finally had to ask her to apologize to the neighbor boy and told her
that some words were so upsetting for other people to hear that if she
was going to keep using those words she'd have to stay in her bedroom so
that no one had to hear them. (Though it was really hard not to laugh
as this sweet little 4 yo looked up shyly and apologized for "calling
you a F***** A******")

meh
--
Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care

  #7  
Old August 15th 03, 11:49 PM
toto
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default "Bad Girl!!!"

On 15 Aug 2003 07:02:38 -0700, (Stephanie) wrote:

A general *you are a good
girl* when she knows sometimes she is not can be very unhelpful
to your communicating with her later on.




I do not fully agree with this. I agree that, in the normal course of
events, you should praise the good behavior. I think that tells the
child precisely WHAT is so praiseworthy. But I do not like the advice
to avoid telling the child that she is a good girl. This is partly
because I believe we are ALL good girls and boys from birth unless
someone does us harm, and that the making of mistakes does not
change that.


While I do agree that for the most part people are *good* by
nature, the problem is that the generic implies that you always
have to live up to the label. This can cause real problems when
you do make a mistake, I think.

It's better to praise the behavior and let the child make his or her
own judgement of how good s/he is.

So it is a slight difference in view. I think that just as
calling a child a bad boy can be a self-fullfilling profesy, so to can
reminding them that, at their nature, they are a good boy, and that
the making of mistakes is a normal part of the human experience.


I agree here too that making mistakes is a normal part of the
human experience. But the attractiveness of *being bad* is
there too sometimes as a rebellion or just as a testing of the
limits. No one is all good or all bad. And the point is to let
the child make that determination. Mostly if you praise the
action, the child then sees what was good about it and can
evaluate himself or herself as good for performing it without
any adult telling about it.



--
Dorothy

There is no sound, no cry in all the world
that can be heard unless someone listens ..
Outer Limits
  #8  
Old August 16th 03, 02:12 AM
R. Steve Walz
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default "Bad Girl!!!"

dragonlady wrote:

In article ,
Chookie wrote:

In article ,
"Sue" wrote:

Most of it we either need to ignore if it isn't too terrible
or just say that we don't use those kinds of words or we don't behave that
way.


I agree, and am putting it into practice -- DS has brought home "Oh my God"
from daycare -- he said it three times yesterday, and I'm gritting my teeth.
I really, really hate it -- I'd prefer him to say s***!


The only problem can be that sometimes the response they get from other
people is so dramatic that the fact that their parents aren't responding
is moot. When DD#1 came home from preschool with some new words, I
finally had to ask her to apologize to the neighbor boy and told her
that some words were so upsetting for other people to hear that if she
was going to keep using those words she'd have to stay in her bedroom so
that no one had to hear them. (Though it was really hard not to laugh
as this sweet little 4 yo looked up shyly and apologized for "calling
you a F***** A******")

---------------
Anyone who makes a 4 y/o apologize for saying ANYTHING should be
beaten!!


meh
--
Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care

-----------
Read your own ****ing sig quote, you ****ing asshole!
Steve
  #10  
Old August 16th 03, 02:37 AM
dragonlady
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default "Bad Girl!!!"

In article ,
"R. Steve Walz" wrote:

dragonlady wrote:

In article ,
Chookie wrote:

In article ,
"Sue" wrote:

Most of it we either need to ignore if it isn't too terrible
or just say that we don't use those kinds of words or we don't behave
that
way.

I agree, and am putting it into practice -- DS has brought home "Oh my
God"
from daycare -- he said it three times yesterday, and I'm gritting my
teeth.
I really, really hate it -- I'd prefer him to say s***!


The only problem can be that sometimes the response they get from other
people is so dramatic that the fact that their parents aren't responding
is moot. When DD#1 came home from preschool with some new words, I
finally had to ask her to apologize to the neighbor boy and told her
that some words were so upsetting for other people to hear that if she
was going to keep using those words she'd have to stay in her bedroom so
that no one had to hear them. (Though it was really hard not to laugh
as this sweet little 4 yo looked up shyly and apologized for "calling
you a F***** A******")

---------------
Anyone who makes a 4 y/o apologize for saying ANYTHING should be
beaten!!



You really ought to read a little more carefully before you fly off the
handle -- though I know how much you enjoy gonig over the top in your
criticism of nearly everyone. I suppose I should be glad to give you an
opportunity to yell at me.

I didn't actually MAKE her apologize; I asked her to apologize, and
told her that if she didn't, the boy in question (a 10 year old whose
company she really enjoyed) probably wouldn't want to play with her any
more, since he didn't like being called names and had been so upset by
this one that he'd felt compelled to come and tell me he didn't want to
play with her if she was going to keep doing that. (He was a very sweet
kid, and not prone to tattleing -- he was visibly upset by hearing
language that I know was NEVER used in his house.)

I've never forced my kids to apologize -- a forced apology is pretty
meaningless. However, I've let them know how their actions have made
other people feel, and that NOT apologizing would have certain
consequences -- in this case, not being able to play with a kid she
liked, not because *I* wouldn't allow it, but because *he* wouldn't.

Once she realized that she really had made him feel bad, and that the
language was really over the top for most people, she was genuinely
sorry.

Interestingly, as she has moved through her teens and into her twenties
(she'll be 21 soon!) she's always been very careful about her language
around adults or young children or anyone she knows might find it
offensive. She's perfectly willing to use scattological terms -- I've
heard her with her friends! -- but I've also heard her explaining to
younger teens that they should clean up their casual use of swearing
around people who find it offensive (mostly us unreasonable adults . .
..); her general position seems to be that language should only be used
to offend someone on purpose -- not because you're too lazy to clean it
up.

meh
--
Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care

 




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