A Parenting & kids forum. ParentingBanter.com

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » ParentingBanter.com forum » misc.kids » Breastfeeding
Site Map Home Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

"Time Wasting Rules" - from Real Simple Magazine - NOT GOOD!



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #21  
Old July 12th 03, 11:57 PM
dragonlady
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default "Time Wasting Rules" - from Real Simple Magazine - NOT GOOD!

In article ,
Clisby Williams wrote:

Banty wrote:

In article ,
says...


For me ff was simpler because bf was:
1) Sit down
2) Plop out breast(s)?
3) switch breast
4) switch breast
5) switch breast
etc. alot for hours on end. Both my babies wanted to constantly for
hours on end be on the nipple because of supply issues. I gave up on
bf with my first and persevered with the help of domperidone with my
second.

while ff was:

1) pour water in bottle
2) put formula in bottle
3) shake
4) feed baby for max 15 min

Which required no refrigeration, microwave, pitcher, or measuring
cups. It did require a store :-)



Yep.

I did both, and I think the perception varies on what the mother does and
considers relaxing. Also the milk supply and let down.

If it's feet up watching TV or sitting outside taking in the air and scenery
and
yammering on the phone to friends that mom loves, sitting and switching
breasts
is just the ticket.

If more active pursuits are what's satisfying and relaxing to mom, sitting
and
switching breasts for 1/2 hour or so can be really reaaally sloooooow. And
what's hard is what *else* has to be done with the time left over after
siiiiittting and leetting dooown and relllaaaaxxxing for a loooooong time.
(And
no - don't say "oh -doncha know you can let the housework go" - I got REAL
TIRED
OF the clutter and feeling allergic to boot in a dirty, cat-hair filled
house.)

I did nurse, but my experience of it was more like that latter. My
temprament
isn't one to sit day in day out and look at baby and TV and trees and grass
hours and yammer with whoever's hanging out hours in hours out day in day
out.
And I'm too heavy breasted to set up, hold baby in one arm, hold a paperback
in
the other.

Banty




Yep. And some of us don't get the side benefit of that supposed flow of
relaxing hormones during
nursing. I've nursed my son for 17 months, and the only hormonal side
effects I've felt have
been unpleasant (uterine contractions, and letdown.) Even once the
bad part was past, I've
seldom nursed him without thinking, "OK, honey, aren't you about through
now?"

Clisby


OK -- this makes sense. I'm the sort who'd rather sit in a corner
somewhere -- and managed to learn to nurse the twins while reading the
newspaper. Personally, I *liked* the feeling of letting down -- though
i could have passed on the uterine contractions!

I've always understood that for some people, nursing is a PIA: they may
have lactation problems, or a baby with a severe cleft pallatte or other
medical issues, or a baby who just can't seem to latch on, or baby with
neo-natal problems that meant they couldn't nurse for the first few
weeks or months, or they adopted, or they had to return to work, or for
some reason it made sense for someone else to be feeding the baby, or .
.. .

However, I guess I didn't understand that, for some people the sitting
down to nurse -- the time just sitting -- felt more like a chore, or at
least not pleasurable; since I'll use damned near ANY excuse to sit for
a while -- nursing (almost) never felt like a chore. (And I did enjoy
being able to tell other people, "Can you do the dishes? -- I have to
nurse the babies.")

Thanks for taking the time to put into words something I didn't really
"get" before.

meh
--
Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care

  #22  
Old July 13th 03, 01:33 AM
Clisby Williams
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default "Time Wasting Rules" - from Real Simple Magazine - NOT GOOD!



Stephanie and Tim wrote:

"dragonlady" wrote in message
...


In article ,
"The Ranger" wrote:



dragonlady asked in message
...
[snip]


but I can't figure out how formula and bottles could be
simpler than breastfeeding, [..]
Can you explain how it was simpler?


In our case it was as simple as:
1) Purchase multiple cases of concentrated liquid formula insert myriad


of


choices from Toys-R-Us (either at a B&M or on-line); store in pantry


until


needed. On our trip through TX, we were able to purchase pre-measured,
fully-mixed liquid formula where we swapped their lid for our bottle
nipples.
2) Get two cans from storage. Pop tops with can opener.
3) Pour both into pitcher; measure out appropriate amount of water.


Stir.


4) P(remeasure)our into all available bottles. Cap. Refrigerate.

During feeding the steps we
1) Grab two at a time from 'fridge, pop into microwave, nuke for 30


seconds,


shake, test.
2) Pop on nipple cap and pop into infants' mouths.

I remember feeding taking a maximum of 15 minutes for each child. (Spawn


was


a little more difficult because she was a lazy feeder and tended to try


to


nap.)

The Ranger




OK -- but how was that simpler than:

1) Sit down
2) Plop out breast(s)?

Which requires no refrigeration, microwave, store, pitcher, or measuring
cups?

(Again, I really am NOT trying to be difficult; I've heard people say
that bottles were simpler than breasts. Since my first was
bottle/formula fed after a few months, and my twins breastfed, I have
the comparison, and considered breast SO much simpler -- I'm just trying
to understand why, for some folks, the bottle is simpler.)

(And, yes, I understand that for many people bottle feeding is
necessary/desirable for reasons that have nothing to do with simplicity.)

meh
--
Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care




I thought Clisby's answer was pretty descriptive. Pumping is a drag. There
is nothing simple about it. Dad was home all day; she wasn't. And the
ability to share feeding can simplify things. Simple is in the eye of the
beholder if you ask me. Each family's organizational style is different.
Some people acheive efficiency by job sharing, some by stripping steps.

S





And just to be clear - I'm not advocating formula feeding. I wish I
had perservered
with breastfeeding my first child, and I'm glad I stuck with it for the
2nd. But there's
no question in my mind that formula feeding was *simpler*. It wasn't
better -
but it was easier.

Clisby

  #23  
Old July 13th 03, 03:10 AM
Banty
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default "Time Wasting Rules" - from Real Simple Magazine - NOT GOOD!

In article ,
dragonlady says...



I always figure that, if it isn't exploring rivers and swimming in seas,
there's
LOTS of quiet relaxing stuff *I* like to do in my nice air-conditioned house
:-)

Banty


Hmmm -- I think I'd like you, but I suspect we'd drive each other
bat-**** crazy if we ever tried to vacation together. It isn't that I
don't enjoy swimming or zooming around -- I just really enjoy just
sitting, too.


Oh, I like relaxing and reading, playing piano, and I like fiber arts, too. And
of course some talking and visiting. It's the - - just - always - SITTING - -
that gets to me. And how a lot of activities for a lot of people is about -
just finding somewhere *else* to - - sit.

A few weeks ago I spent two days with my brother and his
partner. My brother kept asking me what I wanted to do; I didn't want
to DO anything -- I just hadn't seen them for a very long time, and had
the chance to spend some time with them. I think he's more like you,
and I think just "hanging out" with me wasn't fun for him! (His partner
was OK with it; in fact, he may have enjoyed the chance to just hang
out and not "do" anything!)


I like a balance. Last visit to my father, I had to slow him down as to what we
all were to do. And it's *his* health that's failing. (That's unusual,
actually, almost as if he was trying to make up for something.)

It's just that sitting, per se, and yammering, per se, isn't enough for long.

Perhaps you can understand my frustration in a conversation like this:

Friends: Sooo, what are you doing Sunday?
Me: I finally have time to get back to that quilt I've been putting off!
Friends: Oh - since you're not reaally doing anything, how about going boating
with us on Sunday!

Rrrrrr....I'm supposed to want to sit and sip and visit - for hoouurs - on a
boat, and that's supposed to be soooo speshul 'cause it's on a BOAT, instead of
the relaxing and absorbing thing at home I *really* want to do!

Cheers,
Banty

  #24  
Old July 13th 03, 03:40 AM
Clisby Williams
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default "Time Wasting Rules" - from Real Simple Magazine - NOT GOOD!



Banty wrote:

In article ,
dragonlady says...


In article ,
Banty wrote:





Yep - that's the extrovert-introvert split. Extroverts all want introverts
like
me to toss aside the books, the hobbies, and the simple solitary pleasures,
defer these things to our dotages, "come out of (our) shells", and spend
whatever moments we can With Other People. Drives Banty batty. :-)



However, I would also be seriously annoyed at having my quilting
described as "not really doing anything"!


Hear hear!

Aren't we supposed to be talking about BF'ing??

Banty



Well, if you insist . . .



I shoulda put a smiley :-)



I wonder if this isn't part of the breastfeeding split?



I think maternal temprament is part of it. I don't think it necessarily splits
along introvert-extrovert lines. I can easily envision a sanguine introvert
loving the quiet time with baby(s). It's probably more on an activity
characteristic. Although not necessarily physical activity. Part of *my*
experience of bf'ing as a long sitting-chore was that I had no hands free to
pursue any mental activity. If I were a B-cup, I might have liked it better.



For me -- someone who needs to be around other people to get rejuvinated
-- breastfeeding was something that made ME feel good. I enjoyed it,
and was sad when my oldest gave it up so early. I never understood why
folks who COULD breastfeed without serious problems would prefer to
bottle feed.



WEll, IMO this isn't a deciding factor - after all, getting through Cub Scout
nights was also sometimes something of a chore! One stretches one's boundaries
of tolerance to parent.



If, on the other hand, for folks like you it feels more like a chore --
bottles WOULD be simpler, since it tends to be faster and since other
people can do it, too. (Regardless of a person's reason, I would be
hard pressed to criticize anyone's choice when it comes to this, or most
other parenting issues!)

I'm about to take the Myers-Briggs for the first time (I've actively
avoided it) and am reasonably certain that I'll turn up an "E"; I
wonder if anyone has ever looked at this particular aspect of
personality type and parenting styles? I wonder if E's, for example,
are more likely to breast feed, or use attachment parenting?




I test INTJ. It absolutely fits.

Banty




I test INTJ also.

Clisby

  #25  
Old July 13th 03, 03:48 AM
Clisby Williams
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default "Time Wasting Rules" - from Real Simple Magazine - NOT GOOD!



Donna Metler wrote:




We're actually a little bit concerned about that for our children, when we
have them-how do you raise children who have adequate social interaction
when you don't really interact socially much?




That's a good question. I've thought about it, because we don't
socialize much, either.
We don't dislike socializing - it's just that we like peace and quiet
more. (When I was
first dating my husband, one of things I liked so much about him was that
he didn't feel compelled to yammer at me the whole time we were
together.) I think
when you have children, you just have to make the effort to invite their
playmates over,
or invite their friends along to a movie, or get them involved in
activities where they'll be
around other children. Those things don't necessarily come naturally
to parents .

Clisby

  #26  
Old July 13th 03, 04:56 AM
Clisby Williams
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default "Time Wasting Rules" - from Real Simple Magazine - NOT GOOD!



just me wrote:

"Clisby Williams" wrote in message
...


I test INTJ. It absolutely fits.

Banty





I test INTJ also.





That's three of us. Scary. I wonder how many other idealistic hermits we
have around here?

-Aula




Not only that - I like knitting and needlepoint, although I haven't done
either in awhile.

Clisby




  #27  
Old July 13th 03, 05:53 AM
Banty
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default "Time Wasting Rules" - from Real Simple Magazine - NOT GOOD!

In article ,
dragonlady says...

In article ,
Banty wrote:



I like a balance. Last visit to my father, I had to slow him down as to what
we
all were to do. And it's *his* health that's failing. (That's unusual,
actually, almost as if he was trying to make up for something.)

It's just that sitting, per se, and yammering, per se, isn't enough for
long.

Perhaps you can understand my frustration in a conversation like this:

Friends: Sooo, what are you doing Sunday?
Me: I finally have time to get back to that quilt I've been putting off!
Friends: Oh - since you're not reaally doing anything, how about going
boating
with us on Sunday!

Rrrrrr....I'm supposed to want to sit and sip and visit - for hoouurs - on a
boat, and that's supposed to be soooo speshul 'cause it's on a BOAT, instead
of
the relaxing and absorbing thing at home I *really* want to do!

Cheers,
Banty


See, I'd scrap the quilt and go on the boat -- not because it's on a
boat, but because it's hanging out with people I like (you did say
they're friends?) instead of being home engaged in a solo activity.

I wonder how much of this is really has to do with personality types? I
get recharged, rejuvinated, by just being with other people -- and, the
way my life is right now, I don't have nearly enough of that.


Yep - that's the extrovert-introvert split. Extroverts all want introverts like
me to toss aside the books, the hobbies, and the simple solitary pleasures,
defer these things to our dotages, "come out of (our) shells", and spend
whatever moments we can With Other People. Drives Banty batty. :-)


However, I would also be seriously annoyed at having my quilting
described as "not really doing anything"!


Hear hear!

Aren't we supposed to be talking about BF'ing??

Banty

  #28  
Old July 13th 03, 07:22 AM
dragonlady
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default "Time Wasting Rules" - from Real Simple Magazine - NOT GOOD!

In article ,
Banty wrote:

In article ,
dragonlady says...

In article ,
Banty wrote:



I like a balance. Last visit to my father, I had to slow him down as to
what
we
all were to do. And it's *his* health that's failing. (That's unusual,
actually, almost as if he was trying to make up for something.)

It's just that sitting, per se, and yammering, per se, isn't enough for
long.

Perhaps you can understand my frustration in a conversation like this:

Friends: Sooo, what are you doing Sunday?
Me: I finally have time to get back to that quilt I've been putting off!
Friends: Oh - since you're not reaally doing anything, how about going
boating
with us on Sunday!

Rrrrrr....I'm supposed to want to sit and sip and visit - for hoouurs - on
a
boat, and that's supposed to be soooo speshul 'cause it's on a BOAT,
instead
of
the relaxing and absorbing thing at home I *really* want to do!

Cheers,
Banty


See, I'd scrap the quilt and go on the boat -- not because it's on a
boat, but because it's hanging out with people I like (you did say
they're friends?) instead of being home engaged in a solo activity.

I wonder how much of this is really has to do with personality types? I
get recharged, rejuvinated, by just being with other people -- and, the
way my life is right now, I don't have nearly enough of that.


Yep - that's the extrovert-introvert split. Extroverts all want introverts
like
me to toss aside the books, the hobbies, and the simple solitary pleasures,
defer these things to our dotages, "come out of (our) shells", and spend
whatever moments we can With Other People. Drives Banty batty. :-)


However, I would also be seriously annoyed at having my quilting
described as "not really doing anything"!


Hear hear!

Aren't we supposed to be talking about BF'ing??

Banty


Well, if you insist . . .

I wonder if this isn't part of the breastfeeding split?

For me -- someone who needs to be around other people to get rejuvinated
-- breastfeeding was something that made ME feel good. I enjoyed it,
and was sad when my oldest gave it up so early. I never understood why
folks who COULD breastfeed without serious problems would prefer to
bottle feed.

If, on the other hand, for folks like you it feels more like a chore --
bottles WOULD be simpler, since it tends to be faster and since other
people can do it, too. (Regardless of a person's reason, I would be
hard pressed to criticize anyone's choice when it comes to this, or most
other parenting issues!)

I'm about to take the Myers-Briggs for the first time (I've actively
avoided it) and am reasonably certain that I'll turn up an "E"; I
wonder if anyone has ever looked at this particular aspect of
personality type and parenting styles? I wonder if E's, for example,
are more likely to breast feed, or use attachment parenting?

meh
--
Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care

  #29  
Old July 13th 03, 08:56 AM
Jenn
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default "Time Wasting Rules" - from Real Simple Magazine - NOT GOOD!

In article , Clisby Williams
writes


In my experience of reading these newsgroups, people who talk about the
inconvenience
of formula feeding typically are grossly exaggerating the amount of time
and bother it takes.


But that works both ways - I honestly think the truth of the matter is
that whatever you do routinely ends up being well practised and not
seeming to be too much bother. I pumped exclusively for months, and by
the end of the time I was pleased that I could get up, feed DS a bottle,
express and change his bum in 15 mins, now if I'm still awake 10 mins
after starting to feed ds#2 it feels like a long time - I guess it's all
subjective

Here's the kind of thing I read:

1. You have to sterilize bottles. (No, you don't.)

I know in the states it's not always done, but here the 'official'
advice is still to sterilise up to about 6 months, even if you don't
have to sterilise you still have to wash them. Not everyone has a
dishwasher.

2. You have to get up in the middle of the night and fix a bottle.
(Only if your definition
of "fixing a bottle" is: reach in the refrigerator, pull out a
bottle, stick it in the baby's
mouth. If you have a picky baby, maybe you microwave it for 10
seconds first.)


Still have to prep the bottle before going to bed, get up to fetch it,
and that's more than if you're co-sleeping, not so much more though if
baby is in another room.

3. If you go out with the baby, you have to wait until you find
somewhere to warm up
the bottle. (No, you don't.)


True, but you do have to plan how many bottles, and carry them with you.

4. You have to go to the trouble of buying the formula. (Oh, give me
a break.)


Trouble, no, expense? Yes.
5. You might run out of formula. (Never happened. How much
trouble is it to remember
to buy the only food your baby eats?)


Depends how disorganised you are - we occasionally run out of nappies
even though it should be obvious when we're getting low on them.
--
Jenn
UK
  #30  
Old July 13th 03, 08:57 AM
Jenn
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default "Time Wasting Rules" - from Real Simple Magazine - NOT GOOD!

In article , The Ranger
writes
E wrote in message
.. .
[snip]
also, expressed bm can be "stored" at room temp. for
quite a few hours before "going bad" whereas mixed
formula can't be...


I am always surprised at how strongly resilient my daughter-units are at my
attempts to do what I think is best or right. Each test often shows they
will survive into adulthood despite my (and many other well-meaning adults)
book-based, doctor-supported, new-age intentions. Go figure.

The Ranger


Meaning what, in the context of this discussion?
--
Jenn
UK
 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
| Most families *at risk* w CPS' assessment tools broad, vague Kane General 13 February 20th 04 07:02 PM
At 3:22 am mom & son nancy Pregnancy 1 December 20th 03 07:57 PM
| | Kids should work... Kane General 13 December 10th 03 03:30 AM
Kids should work. LaVonne Carlson General 22 December 7th 03 05:27 AM
"Time Wasting Rules" - from Real Simple Magazine - NOT GOOD! Corinne General 138 July 25th 03 09:31 PM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 08:45 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 ParentingBanter.com.
The comments are property of their posters.