BTDT moms: is it as hard the second time around?

"Nikki" wrote in message
...

Oh in my case it was definitely easier. Here are the reasons. Some are
pure luck ;-)

b) I didn't have *any* anxiety while nursing the second baby. With #1 I
was
obsessive about counting minutes, keeping track of sides, counting
diapers,
etc. This made a surprisingly big difference. That was experience.
With
#2 my milk came in quicker, baby was alert and nursed better (no
jaundice).
That was lucky.

Oh, good. I was super-obsessive the first time around, too. I don't
anticipate that being so much of an issue this time around, if only because
I now know that babies aren't as fragile as I thought when Sarah arrived.

big one. I had zero routine before I had #1 and getting into a routine
was a bit painful. I already had a routine (and some people would laugh
at
that statement because it still isn't very strict) with #2 so there wasn't
that adjustment.

e) I never let #1 cry. In the beginning with #2 I had a very hard time
adjusting to the fact that sometimes one of them would be crying
(including
the baby) and they would just have to wait. It wasn't until #2 became a
little older (4-5mos) and was obviously such an expressive, happy, and
joyful baby that I let go of that anxiety. That was the only negative of
the first few months. It was unnecessary

Thanks, Nikki. I've saved your post in my "funfile" to reread when the baby
arrives.

Donna

Donna wrote:
So following Carol Ann's story over the last six weeks has had me
reliving the early days with my daughter; the shellshock, the
exhaustion, the inability to stop her crying at times, the six
weeks sitting on the couch nursing, the 30 second showers, the
mess.... I'm remembering all the stuff I'd just forgotten (or
blocked out grin). I'm beginning to get seriously nervous about
going through it again, but this time with the responsibility of
looking after a toddler as well. I had nothing left the first time
around -I can't conceive of how I'm going to handle two.

Is it easier the second time around? My mom swears that it is -
not that it's any easier to get in a shower, or get them to sleep
through the night, but that not having that constant shell-shocked
"now what do I do" feeling, makes a world of difference. (But
really, what else are they going to tell me? "Oh no, honey, the
first 10 weeks are *just* as horrible, and this time around, you'll
also have to keep your elder child entertained, too!" Not likely.
smile)

So - what is the real answer? I can take it.

Well, I guess I think it is a little of both. For me, the second baby was
easier in some ways and harder in others. I guess maybe I'll split it up
into ways it was easier and then ways it was harder.

It was easier because:

1) I knew more what to expect. I didn't get nearly as sleep-deprived in the
early days with my second as I did with my first because I knew it was okay
to go back to sleep while she was nursing (and I brought her into bed with
us for the first couple of weeks, something I didn't do with the first). I
was just generally more relaxed about everything because it wasn't all
"brand new" to me.

2) My first, while not colicky, was a baby who needed/wanted a LOT of
entertaining/input and just did NOT need the amount of sleep you'd expect of
a newborn. Part of the reason I was exhausted with him was because he just
didn't sleep enough for me to sleep enough. When I brought my daughter home,
I was shocked to discover that she actually SLEPT a LOT. It was a revelation
to me. Like you, I'd been terrified of the newborn+toddler stage because my
expectations for newborn behavior had been set by my first, and it became
clear to me afterwards that he wasn't really very typical.

3) The thing that every mother of a newborn needs is a toddler to entertain
the baby. I'm serious. My daughter thought her older brother was fascinating
and could be entertained nearly endlessly by watching him almost from birth.
Had I known, I swear I would have rented a toddler when her older brother
was tiny.

4) I wasn't as LONELY the second time around, largely because I had a 2yo
for company. I admit it--I was *really* lonely the first time and it was a
hard adjustment for to go from being in a busy office full of stimulating
adult conversation and activity to being home with a tiny,
eating-crying-pooping machine who wanted entertainment I didn't have the
foggiest idea how to provide. I eventually learned, of course (and went back
to work, too), but it was *so* much better the second time because Julian,
while hardly a scintillating conversationalist, was a lot more of a "talker
guy" (to use an expression I invented when *I* was 2yo) than a newborn ever
could be.

Ways it was harder:

1) Like Sophie mentioned, I think the hardest thing for me in the early
stages of parenting two was realizing that I couldn't meet both of their
needs simultaneously all the time, that someone was going to have to wait
sometimes, and that nobody was going to die of waiting. When you only have
one, you get accustomed to anticipating their needs and preventing them from
getting upset by that anticipation and, to some extent, you have to give
that up when you have the second.

2) Keeping the toddler entertained can be a bit of a problem. I found going
out--to the zoo, the park, etc.--almost daily was the one way to be sure the
2yo was happy and the baby didn't care where she was as long as I was there
and she could eat when she was hungry.

3) I tandem-nursed, so I got "touched out" and felt a bit overwhelmed fairly
often, especially in the first few months. I remember many times, I would
nurse them together and they'd both fall asleep and then, there I'd be,
alone in the house and stuck under two sleeping babies needing to pee. Mind
you, I'm not sorry I tandemmed--I think it helped reduce the sibling
rivalry/jealousy immensely (and my toddler didn't feel "left out" when I
nursed the baby), and I certainly saw the difference when I had my third and
*didn't* tandem--but it did have its downsides.

4) Nikki's right on target when she says you have to make a point to
intervene physically with the toddler when you want them to stop doing
something, even if it means interruping a feeding. The toddler has to know
that you still mean business and *will* stop them if they are doing
something that's not permitted. I had a bit of a problem with this in that
Julian was smart enough to wait until I'd just sat down to feed the baby or
she'd just fallen asleep to do something he knew wasn't allowed. He was
trying to figure out whether I really meant what I said or whether it was
just words. I wasn't quick enough to intervene much of the time and ended up
with more problems with this sort of behavior down the road as a result.

I guess the main thing I'll say is that, however hard you think it's going
to be, you'll get through it and it probably won't be as bad as *thinking*
about it is.
--
Be well, Barbara
Mom to Sin (Vernon, 2), Misery (Aurora, 4), and the Rising Son (Julian, 6)

Aurora (in the bathroom with her dad)--"It looks like an elephant, Daddy."
Me (later)--"You should feel flattered."

All opinions expressed in this post are well-reasoned and insightful.
Needless to say, they are not those of my Internet Service Provider, its
other subscribers or lackeys. Anyone who says otherwise is itchin' for a
fight. -- with apologies to Michael Feldman

Donna wrote:


Is it easier the second time around?


For me it has been *much* easier (I have a barely 4 year old and a 7
week old) the second time around, by leaps and bounds. I think a lot of
it is knowing more what to expect. I had a pretty high needs first baby
and that combined with nerves made it tough for me. This second baby
has been easier in some ways, still had a few really fussy weeks, but
all in all I expected it to be hard, I expected to be totally and
completely exhausted, etc...so that when it was I wasn't blindsided and
caught off guard.

The labor and delivery and recovery was much easier for me too. I found
going from none to 1 child was a hard transition, but 1-2 has been a
total breeze. Of course my 4 year old is really independent and not the
same as having a 2 year old and a newborn, that probably helps for my
personality and the overall dynamic.

cara

Circe wrote:

Ericka Kammerer wrote:

It's when they're nearing that toddler
stage and they're perpetual motion machines hell bent on
killing themselves that I find things difficult ;-)


LOL, I adore (adore, Adore, ADORE) toddlers and particularly 2yo's because
they are just cute beyond words, but I have already told my husband that my
biggest fear in even considering another child is that another 2yo like
Vernon will kill me. I am not kidding. I don't think my heart could take the
stress! My husband keeps saying, in response, that both Julian and Aurora
were easy 2yo's, at least in this regard and therefore, the odds of another
easy one are in our favor. He obviously does not believe in karma!

I actually didn't have trouble so much at 2yo. They
are little daredevils, but I guess I'm okay with that. The
trouble for me is the stage where they're pulling up but
not yet walking securely and they've into *everything*.
You either have to live in a padded cell for several months
or be on top of them constantly ;-)

Best wishes,
Ericka

Circe wrote:
LOL, I adore (adore, Adore, ADORE) toddlers and particularly 2yo's because
they are just cute beyond words, but I have already told my husband that my
biggest fear in even considering another child is that another 2yo like
Vernon will kill me. I am not kidding. I don't think my heart could take the
stress! My husband keeps saying, in response, that both Julian and Aurora
were easy 2yo's, at least in this regard and therefore, the odds of another
easy one are in our favor. He obviously does not believe in karma!

What is Vernon doing that is so stressful for you? My third child is
so much more "harder" than my first two were at that age (19 months) I
am so surprised by the end of the day that there wasn't an ER trip for
her!! She's never had an accident causing more than a bruise and a
scraped knee, but I sure don't know how.
Marie

Ericka Kammerer wrote:
Circe wrote:
Ericka Kammerer wrote:

It's when they're nearing that toddler
stage and they're perpetual motion machines hell bent on
killing themselves that I find things difficult ;-)

LOL, I adore (adore, Adore, ADORE) toddlers and particularly 2yo's
because they are just cute beyond words, but I have already told
my husband that my biggest fear in even considering another child
is that another 2yo like Vernon will kill me. I am not kidding. I
don't think my heart could take the stress! My husband keeps
saying, in response, that both Julian and Aurora were easy 2yo's,
at least in this regard and therefore, the odds of another easy
one are in our favor. He obviously does not believe in karma!

I actually didn't have trouble so much at 2yo. They
are little daredevils, but I guess I'm okay with that. The
trouble for me is the stage where they're pulling up but
not yet walking securely and they've into *everything*.
You either have to live in a padded cell for several months
or be on top of them constantly ;-)

I actually never had much trouble in the early stages of mobility--I guess I
was always able to baby-proof and gate to the point where I didn't worry
that much. I haven't had a coffee table or end tables since Julian was an
infant, so that's one whole level of worry completely eliminated g!

Vernon just has us shaking our heads because he is *very* active, *very*
physically capable, and *very* determined to do anything and everything that
older brother and sister do. When Julian was this age, he was a bit less
advanced physically, but you also knew he wouldn't try to do anything he
didn't *know* he could do, so you weren't terrified that he was going to
crack his head open or throw himself headlong down the steps, because it
just wasn't something he would do. And Aurora had only been walking for a
few months at this age and really *couldn't* get into all that much trouble.
But Vernon--ay yi yi!--he will try anything and everything and is almost
undeterable. Let's just say it makes life interesting!

Now, overall he's a very good-natured, delightful child and I wouldn't
change a hair on his head (well, aside from cutting it short, which I
finally did last week), but he *does* run us a bit ragged. But maybe that's
just because I'm old g (she says as she considers that her 40th birthday
is a mere 4 weeks hence).
--
Be well, Barbara
Mom to Sin (Vernon, 2), Misery (Aurora, 4), and the Rising Son (Julian, 6)

Aurora (in the bathroom with her dad)--"It looks like an elephant, Daddy."
Me (later)--"You should feel flattered."

All opinions expressed in this post are well-reasoned and insightful.
Needless to say, they are not those of my Internet Service Provider, its
other subscribers or lackeys. Anyone who says otherwise is itchin' for a
fight. -- with apologies to Michael Feldman

Marie wrote:
What is Vernon doing that is so stressful for you? My third child is
so much more "harder" than my first two were at that age (19
months) I am so surprised by the end of the day that there wasn't
an ER trip for her!! She's never had an accident causing more than
a bruise and a scraped knee, but I sure don't know how.

See my response to Ericka--he's just more balls-out and
hell-bent-for-anything than the older two were. Like you, I'm surprised he's
never had a trip to the ER. As an example of stuff that happens to him that
has not happened to either of my other kids, he has taken at least two
head-first tumbles off of beds--I mean, literally, HEAD-first. And both
times, he's done it while I was watching him--one second, he was sitting on
the bed doing nothing worse than bouncing on his bum and the next he was
standing up and diving off the bed!
--
Be well, Barbara
Mom to Sin (Vernon, 2), Misery (Aurora, 4), and the Rising Son (Julian, 6)

Aurora (in the bathroom with her dad)--"It looks like an elephant, Daddy."
Me (later)--"You should feel flattered."

All opinions expressed in this post are well-reasoned and insightful.
Needless to say, they are not those of my Internet Service Provider, its
other subscribers or lackeys. Anyone who says otherwise is itchin' for a
fight. -- with apologies to Michael Feldman

See my response to Ericka--he's just more balls-out and
hell-bent-for-anything than the older two were. Like you, I'm surprised
he's
never had a trip to the ER. As an example of stuff that happens to him
that
has not happened to either of my other kids, he has taken at least two
head-first tumbles off of beds--I mean, literally, HEAD-first. And both
times, he's done it while I was watching him--one second, he was sitting
on
the bed doing nothing worse than bouncing on his bum and the next he was
standing up and diving off the bed!
--
Be well, Barbara
Mom to Sin (Vernon, 2), Misery (Aurora, 4), and the Rising Son (Julian, 6)

Aurora (in the bathroom with her dad)--"It looks like an elephant, Daddy."
Me (later)--"You should feel flattered."


Vernon and Lewis sound a lot alike. I think it's a 3rd child thing.

"Donna" wrote in message ...

Is it easier the second time around?

It mostly has been easier this time. But, my first experience was
pretty awful. I had a miserable week in the hospital on Mag Sulfate
for perterm labor and then delivered my son at 34 weeks. Then he was
in the hospital an hour away for two weeks. I had a very hard time
adjusting to motherhood and especially the sleep deprivation. I also
had a major case of first time mother nerves too. And Aaron was a
very fussy high maintenance baby., and we discovered some
developmental problems at age 6 months. It took me a solid year to
even beging to THINK about having another; I was a wreck. By the time
he was 2 I knew I wanted one though.

So this time it has been easier. Madeline is an average baby as far as
temperment goes. The birth experience with her was also great, and I
spent months just euphoric over that. I think that is what kept me
going till she was sleeping through the night. It was still difficult
being up all night with a newborn and then getting up with my 3 y.o.
But, my delight over the birth of my baby girl is truly what got me
by. And, this time there was no new mom nervousness, and I did know
that she would eventually sleep through the night. And she did, a full
month before her brother did thank goodness. Also, dh was much better
about helping me this time. And another thing is that my son goes to
preschool 3 mornings per week.

The main thing I struggle with now is Maddie's daytime sleep. They
never nap at the same time. But as long as I sleep at night I will
make it. I still shower every day. I do it before they wake up. If
they do wake, my 3 yo won't come out of his room until I get him, and
Maddie will just play in her crib.

I think the 2nd one is easier because you already know what you are
doing, and know that you will survive whatever "stage" is happening at
the moment!

Amanda, mom to Aaron 10/00 and
Madeline 11/3/03

Sophie wrote:
See my response to Ericka--he's just more balls-out and
hell-bent-for-anything than the older two were. Like you, I'm
surprised he's never had a trip to the ER. As an example of stuff
that happens to him that has not happened to either of my other
kids, he has taken at least two head-first tumbles off of beds--I
mean, literally, HEAD-first. And both times, he's done it while I
was watching him--one second, he was sitting on the bed doing
nothing worse than bouncing on his bum and the next he was
standing up and diving off the bed!

Vernon and Lewis sound a lot alike. I think it's a 3rd child thing.

So you mean Ericka is going to get it with Genevieve in about a year?
(That'd be my bet g!)
--
Be well, Barbara
Mom to Sin (Vernon, 2), Misery (Aurora, 4), and the Rising Son (Julian, 6)

Aurora (in the bathroom with her dad)--"It looks like an elephant, Daddy."
Me (later)--"You should feel flattered."

All opinions expressed in this post are well-reasoned and insightful.
Needless to say, they are not those of my Internet Service Provider, its
other subscribers or lackeys. Anyone who says otherwise is itchin' for a
fight. -- with apologies to Michael Feldman