"Alcohol and pregnancy" clarification needed...

Alice wrote:
Thank you all for your valuable comments and information, I really
feel relaxed now. I'm sorry If i "sounded" a bit "neurotic", this is
because I was really worried.

I know. I've been there too, remember? And my doctor said I'm fine.
I trust my doctor, but you probably don't because you've never met him
or me. In that case, you should talk to your doctor. Hopefully you
trust him or her.

My dog bit me (and had to be put to sleep, as he had been aggressive
before, and it was getting more frequent) before I knew I was pregnant.
I took Tramadol for the pain (which is a schedule C) and an
antibiotic. Check out what I found:

"Pregnancy, Teratogenic Effects: Pregnancy Category C Tramadol has been
shown to be embryotoxic and fetotoxic in mice,(120 mg/kg or 360
mg/m2),rats (=B325 mg/kg or 150 mg/m2) and rabbits (=B375 mg/kg or 900
mg/m2) at maternally toxic dosages, but was not teratogenic at these
dose levels. These dosages on a mg/m2 basis are 1.4, =B30.6,and =B33.6
times the maximum daily human dosage (246 mg/m2) for mouse, rat and
rabbit, respectively. No drug-related teratogenic effects were observed
in progeny of mice (up to 140 mg/kg or 420 mg/m2),rats (up to 80 mg/kg
or 480 mg/m2) or rabbits (up to 300 mg/kg or 3600 mg/m2) treated with
tramadol by various routes. Embryo and fetal toxicity consisted
primarily of decreased fetal weights, skeletal ossification and
increased supernumerary ribs at maternally toxic dose levels. Transient
delays in developmental or behavioral parameters were also seen in pups
from rat dams allowed to deliver. Embryo and fetal lethality were
reported only in one rabbit study at 300 mg/kg (3600 mg/m2), a dose
that would cause extreme maternal toxicity in the rabbit. The dosages
listed for mouse, rat and rabbit are 1.7,1.9 and 14.6 times the maximum
daily human dosage (246 mg/m2),respectively."

(from http://www.rxlist.com/cgi/generic/tramadol_wcp.htm)

By my calculations, I was in my 5th week of pregnancy (from my LMP) or
21 - 30 days gestation when I took it. I took it four times (the pain
wasn't really all that bad from the bite) and I took a crapload of
Advil (also a pregnancy no-no).

My doctor, whom I trust, also said that this was probably fine. I
could spend the next 6 months worrying about it and freaking out and
feeling guilty, or I could just move on, do the best I can right now,
and deal with problems if they happen. I chose to move on. It sounds
like you have, too, and I'm glad.

Remember that millions of women have done far, far worse than a few
drinks and a schedule C or two, and have had perfectly healthy babies.
And millions of women have done far, far better, and have had problems.
But beating yourself up won't change the outcome either way.

I hope you can relax and enjoy the rest of your pregnancy. I
especially enjoyed the achey back last night, and the cramp in my right
side that was bad enough to wake me up at about 5:30 am. Ugh...

Amy

wrote:
I took a crapload of Advil (also a pregnancy no-no).

For the record, I believe ibuprofen is only *really* a no-no in the
third trimester (it is associated with a particular heart defect,
IIRC); in the first and second trimester, avoidance is recommended but
not essential.
--
Be well, Barbara

Circe wrote:
wrote:
I took a crapload of Advil (also a pregnancy no-no).

For the record, I believe ibuprofen is only *really* a no-no in the
third trimester (it is associated with a particular heart defect,
IIRC); in the first and second trimester, avoidance is recommended
but
not essential.

Oh good! I've been feeling pretty bad about that one (even though it
was the stupid dog's fault). Next time we decide to do this pregnancy
thing, I'm just going to pretend I'm already pregnant from the time we
decide to start "trying" until the baby's weaned... That way I can
avoid all of this guilt.

It seems to me that if the tramadol were inclined to do damage, we'd
have known about it by now, as in, I wouldn't still be pregnant, so I
think we dodged that bullet, too. I'm trying to take my own advice,
and I can forget for entire moments that I did anything stupid at all
during this pregnancy...

Amy

Libby Macdonald wrote:
On Sun, 13 Feb 2005 10:56:39 -0800, wrote:
I think God (or nature, if you prefer) protects us from harming our
babies
before we know about them. Sure, there are babies born with FAS,
but
their mothers usually drink much more heavily than you or I did. I
think
I read that 3 drinks a day every day raises your chance of FAS by
30%. (I
would call a person who has 3 drinks per day, every day an
alcoholic,
personally. YMMV). So, even someone who was drinking enough to
get me
drunk (I'm a cheap date) every day still has a 70% chance of having
a
non-FAS baby. And I only drank on 6 or 8 occasions over a 30 day
period -
the average is *far* less than one drink a day... Yours is, too.

delurking
Sorry if this seems a bit nit-picky, but raising your chance of FAS
by 30%
does not raise your chance of FAS TO 30%. If, say, your chance of FAS
was
1 in 100 (and I have no idea what the figures actually are - I'm sure
they're no way near that high) raising your chance by 30% would raise
your
chance of FAS to 1.3 in 100 not 30 in 100. Does that make sense? If
having
a couple of glasses of wine with dinner each night raised your chance
of
FAS to 30% close to a third of Europe would be effected

Good point. I suck at statistics. Thanks for clarifying that. I
can't remember where the original statistic came from, or whether it
was by 30% or to 30%. So, basically, I have no idea what I'm talking
about...

I wholeheartedly support the "don't worry" idea. I had a drinking
episode
early in pregnancy (I will spare you the reason why). My doctor was
very
dismissive of my concerns and said, "alcoholics often have low birth
weight babies, but I don't think you have anything to worry about."
While
I regret such a rotten start to a beautiful adventure, I now have a
perfect
little boy.

I think this is the most important point.

Thanks again for the clarity check...
Amy

wrote in message
ups.com...

Remember that millions of women have done far, far worse than a few
drinks and a schedule C or two, and have had perfectly healthy babies.
And millions of women have done far, far better, and have had problems.
But beating yourself up won't change the outcome either way.

This is so important for any woman to remember and really repeat to herself
over and over again. At this point, worrying won't change the outcome, so
you might as well do your best to enjoy every day that you wake up and are
still pregnant. All we can control is what we can control, and the rest is
out of our hands.
--

Jamie -- Someone who did everything right and still lost 9 babies...
Earth Angels:
Taylor Marlys, 1/3/03 -- Little Miss Manners, who says, "No skank you" and
"Tank you very much, momma."
Addison Grace, 9/30/04 -- The Prodigy, who can now roll over, and pull
herself to standing while holding onto someone's fingers!

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