128 students suspended at Ind. school

Jeff wrote:
"Banty" wrote in message
...
In article , nimue
says...

Tori M wrote:
I found it to be distracting to be in classes with kids wearing
CoEd Naked shirts (until the school figured them out lol) This
was also the "start" of the baggy jeans to your ankles pants..
kids yanking them up all the time. I dont want to see anyones
undies. I dont see what the big deal is of wearing Jeans that fit
and then going home and changing and expressing themselves on
their own time. Some people might be suprised at how nice it is
to walk without your pants falling off all the time.

I think it is absolutely ridiculous to suspend kids who violate the
dress code. Hello? The kids need to go to class to learn. We
should not punish
kids by taking away their opportunity and responsibility to learn.
That is
utterly counter-productive. Give the kids detention if you must,
just don't take them out of class for violating a dress code. They
need to know
that going to class and getting an education takes priority over
nearly everything.

OK - so you object to the punishment and not the rule?

I agree that suspension is a pretty unimaginative way to deal with
it.

to me: unimaginative = clear-cut. If you don't were the right dress,
you don't come to school.

So, how
about in-house detention, and in black slacks and white shirts as
required wear.
IF the parents can't support that (and run out and get the clothes),
then their
true value on education would be apparent. It would make the point,
and the
clothes would add the embarassment factor that would make the point
to the kids
in question.

Would you go along with that?

Banty

The kids were essentially sent home on the first day of school
because they either were not wearing appropriate attire or were using
cell phones. The student dress code is available on the internet and
presumable, students and parents were able to get a copy of it if
they didn't have it from the previous year. Clothing stores in the
area sell the apporpiate clothing that is consistant with the dress
code (no logos except school logos) in the appropriate color. I am
sure not only did the high school students get the message that only
appropriate clothing is to be worn, but the kids at the other two
high schools in the district and the lower grades got the message,
too.

If the policy is uniformly enforced, then it becomes a non-issue.

The kids have plenty of ways to express themselves with wearing
jewlry and othe ways. Hats and other colors are often allowed in
schools to decrease the visibility of gang symbols.

IMHO, the school did a good job.

IMO, any educator who deprives a child of time in class is an idiot. Why
couldn't she give the kids detention?

http://hammond.k12.in.us/StudentParentGuide.pdf

Jeff


--

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5222154.stm

--
nimue

"As an unwavering Republican, I have quite naturally burned more books
than I have read." Betty Bowers

English is our friend. We don't have to fight it.
Oprah

Jen wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...


No pajamas.

That's really funny. Doesn't everyone have the dream of going to
school naked or with their pyjamas on? LOL

Lots of our girls wear pajama pants to school. They like them because of
the cute patterns, cartoons and the like, that are featured on so many
pajama pants.

Jen

--
nimue

"As an unwavering Republican, I have quite naturally burned more books
than I have read." Betty Bowers

English is our friend. We don't have to fight it.
Oprah

nimue wrote:
toypup wrote:
"nimue" wrote in message
...
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060827/..._st/dress_code
Clearly they are NOT -- they are for teaching kids the appropriate
way to dress -- as teenagers!! In high school!! How does wearing
baggy pants affect a child's education? Why must we always be
controlling, controlling,
controlling these kids? This sends the message that we care more
about what
you look like than if you learn, that appearance is more important
than education. I don't give a **** what my students are wearing as
long as they
are in class!!!!

I hope you don't talk like that in class.

What a pointless, ridiculous thing to say. Of course I don't.

Let them have their little teenage nonsense. Let them
know they can BE THEMSELVES and still learn, still enjoy learning!
You know
what? You want to teach kids what is appropriate in a professional
environment? Pick ONE DAY of the week to be Professional Dress Day.

Why just one day? Why not everyday? School is everyday, not just
one day.

Teenagers want to be able to express themselves through their
clothing. I have no problem with that. I don't want to squash their
individuality. I don't want to control every aspect of their lives.
I just want them IN CLASS. Let them have their high school fun; the
real world will come along soon enough.

That's hilarious - "individuality?" The only thing most teenagers are
expressing in their dress is which style of fashion victim they want to
emulate!

Tai

wrote:
Jen wrote:
"nimue" wrote in message
...
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060827/..._st/dress_code

128 students suspended at Ind. school
Classrooms were a little less crowded at Morton High School on the
first day
of classes: 128 students were sent home for wearing the wrong
clothes.


Why not a proper uniform, with a range of things to cover lots of
tastes and individuality, but not turning it into a fashion show.

Because with a uniform that parents have to go out and buy their kids
an entire new wardrobe just for school? (And if the 'range' is broad
enough to cover a wide enough range, it's no longer a uniform, but a
dress code.)


In my experience a school uniform is actually the less expensive option. The
quality is usually good, the clothes are practical and wash well, items can
be handed down to siblings and there's a lot to be said for the no-fuss
no-thought aspects.

Tai

nimue wrote:

Clearly they are NOT -- they are for teaching kids the appropriate way to
dress -- as teenagers!! In high school!! How does wearing baggy pants
affect a child's education? Why must we always be controlling, controlling,
controlling these kids? This sends the message that we care more about what
you look like than if you learn, that appearance is more important than
education. I don't give a **** what my students are wearing as long as they
are in class!!!! Let them have their little teenage nonsense. Let them
know they can BE THEMSELVES and still learn, still enjoy learning!

ITA. I will refuse to send DS to a school that has a dress code, other
than for safety reasons. This kind of crap is petty and ridiculous,
and it squelches individual expression and creativity.
-L.

"nimue" wrote in message
...
skirts and shorts have to be longer than the tips of the fingers held
at the sides;

This is the one that always ticks me off. By definition, junior high and
high school kids are teens, they are still growing. My girls had arms and
legs that grew first. Their fingers touched their knees. Some kids arms and
legs grow last, they can wear incredibly short skirts. Now these kids are
already too body conscious and they come up with rules that point out how
different they are. That hits me as really stupid. If you want skirts and
shorts two inches above the knee, go with that. If you want shorts that end
halfway between the hip bone and knee, go with that. But the finger tip
rule never worked.

nimue wrote:
wrote:
Jeff wrote:
"Banty" wrote in message

Depends on the dress code. But even if they code requires black
shoes, they can choose the brand and style, to suit their needs.
Same things with ties and shirts. And not all dress codes are
strick. Apparently, the dress code that the OP referenced just
required that certain areas of the body be covered and nothing
offensive be on the clothing. And, that teens keep their cell phones
off (that's not part of the dress, however - but there were problems
with this, as well).


Right. The dress code sounds very similar to the one at our local
schools. Which includes: no offensive/drug related slogans on shirts;

Fine, but what is offensive? Is a "Question Authority" t-shirt offensive?
What about one with an anarchy symbol?

I recall an incident when a kid got sent home for wearing a Pepsi shirt
-- the school was having a photo to celebrate a contract signed with
Coca-Cola -- or maybe it was vice versa. Kid did it on purpose, too --
to spark an incident. Huge uproar ensued.

You may well get a stupid principal here or there who objects to
Question Authority or an anarchy symbol. But I'd think most would
prefer to pick their battles, and save their energy for the stuff that
causes discomfort among entire groups of people. Confederate flag,
crude sexual humor that demeans women, obscenities -- that kind of
stuff is out there, and it makes the shirts you describe look
positively quaint.

skirts and shorts have to be longer than the tips of the fingers held
at the sides; girls can wear sleeveless shirts if the straps are
(IIRC) at least two fingers wide and the shirt is cut high enough
under the arms to cover the bra; boys have to have sleeves. (Not
sure why the discrepancy.). No bare midriffs or backs (shirts have to
be long enough to tuck in),

Oh, good lord. That is ridiculous. I, like many women, never wear shirts
you have to tuck in.

Code doesn't say that the girls HAVE to tuck them in, only that they be
long enough to do so.

My guess is that that requirement helps prevent the rear-view cleavage
issue raised when the wearer of low-rise pants (sometimes very
low-rise) sits down and her top rides up.

No hats or
bandanas or heavy coats.

Uh, what if it's cold?

Sweaters?

Even in Wisconsin during 20-below weather, this is rarely an issue. If
the boiler's not working, they'll make an exception.

Look, there are some good ideas here, but when you try to enforce this, you
will find that members of the school staff interpret these rules
differently. I guess my main point is I don't want anyone missing class
because her shirt is low cut.

See, I think there's an issue of distraction that comes into play here,
too. Low-cut tops are going to make plenty of co-workers uneasy in the
workplace and quite possibly hinder her career. Kids need to learn that
people dress in different ways based not just on individual expression
or fitting in with peers, but also in how they want to be perceived.

I think it does a kid no favor to pretend that a low-cut top, designed
to accentuate her sexual attractiveness, is a neutral choice.

And maybe missing one class period helps drive home that larger
understanding in a way that all the philosophizing and lecturing
doesn't.

Lori G.
Milwaukee, WI

In article , nimue says...


What do you think about kid not being allowed to have cell phones in school
at all? That is a big issue in NYC right now. Mayor Bloomberg wantst to
enforce the ban on cell phones in school. I think that is ridiculous. Some
of the kids have commutes of an hour or more on the subway. Some live in
bad neighborhoods. I think kids should be allowed to have cell phones in
school. They shouldn't use them, of course, but they shouldbe allowed to
have them.

In our school district, the policy is that cell phones aren't to be seen during
school hours on school property, including lunch. If they're out for any
reason, it's assumed that it's for use and the cell is confiscated. If they're
kept away and brought out in order to call a parent or anyone after school,
that's different.

It's a good, enforceable policy that works for all.

We just visited our high school for parent orientation, and we couldn't get a
signal inside the building anyway. Yaay.

Banty


--

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5222154.stm

In article , nimue says...


The problem with the dress code is that kids in perfectly respectable
outfits are sent home. In fact, it's usually the girls who are sent home,
at least in my school. I have argued with deans that tell me that a young
girl in a tank top and a jean skirt that stops just above the knee should be
sent home because she is violating dress code. I tell them it's hot; we
have no air conditioning, and this kid is going to miss her first period
English exam. It makes me sick.

And whose problem is that? She can't stock up on a few light cotton short
sleeve tops for school? The dress code is distributed to all students, right?
(In our district, the parents have to sign it so there are no plaintive excuses
about unseen policies).

Banty


--

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5222154.stm

"nimue" wrote in message
...
Jeff wrote:
"Banty" wrote in message
...
In article , nimue
says...

Tori M wrote:
I found it to be distracting to be in classes with kids wearing
CoEd Naked shirts (until the school figured them out lol) This
was also the "start" of the baggy jeans to your ankles pants..
kids yanking them up all the time. I dont want to see anyones
undies. I dont see what the big deal is of wearing Jeans that fit
and then going home and changing and expressing themselves on
their own time. Some people might be suprised at how nice it is
to walk without your pants falling off all the time.

I think it is absolutely ridiculous to suspend kids who violate the
dress code. Hello? The kids need to go to class to learn. We
should not punish
kids by taking away their opportunity and responsibility to learn.
That is
utterly counter-productive. Give the kids detention if you must,
just don't take them out of class for violating a dress code. They
need to know
that going to class and getting an education takes priority over
nearly everything.

OK - so you object to the punishment and not the rule?

I agree that suspension is a pretty unimaginative way to deal with
it.

to me: unimaginative = clear-cut. If you don't were the right dress,
you don't come to school.

So, how
about in-house detention, and in black slacks and white shirts as
required wear.
IF the parents can't support that (and run out and get the clothes),
then their
true value on education would be apparent. It would make the point,
and the
clothes would add the embarassment factor that would make the point
to the kids
in question.

Would you go along with that?

Banty

The kids were essentially sent home on the first day of school
because they either were not wearing appropriate attire or were using
cell phones. The student dress code is available on the internet and
presumable, students and parents were able to get a copy of it if
they didn't have it from the previous year. Clothing stores in the
area sell the apporpiate clothing that is consistant with the dress
code (no logos except school logos) in the appropriate color. I am
sure not only did the high school students get the message that only
appropriate clothing is to be worn, but the kids at the other two
high schools in the district and the lower grades got the message,
too.

If the policy is uniformly enforced, then it becomes a non-issue.

The kids have plenty of ways to express themselves with wearing
jewlry and othe ways. Hats and other colors are often allowed in
schools to decrease the visibility of gang symbols.

IMHO, the school did a good job.

IMO, any educator who deprives a child of time in class is an idiot. Why
couldn't she give the kids detention?


You would think just a warning, for the first day, would be enough.

Jen