Character of a growing girl (middle school question)

Kevin Karplus wrote:

It depends a lot what you mean by "prestigious" and "decent".

There is a very nice article in a recent issue of Academe by Renny
Christopher
http://www.aaup.org/publications/Aca...a/03jachri.htm
claiming that working-class kids are getting short-changed in their
university education because of lower quality education in the
California State (CSU) schools contrasted to the University of
California (UC) system (she has taught in both). I think that for most
people, the CSU system is considered "decent" and UC is "prestigious".

The UC school system is roughly at the same level as University of
Washington, Seattle---I'm not familiar enough with the Washington
colleges to know what the equivalents are of the CSU system.

Thanks for the link and the information. I'd guess that UW and WSU are top-tier
schools, while WWU, EWU, and CWU are not. On the other hand, my sister went to
WWU and was happy with it...though when she went to grad school, she went to
UW. At that time, though, she was living and working locally.

If your standards are higher (that almost any research university is
"decent" and Stanford or UC Berkeley is prestigious), the question
becomes quite a different one.

Thanks for your thoughts on this. No matter what, my daughter won't be going to
an Ivy League school unless she gets some sort of amazing scholarship. It does
occur to me, though, that if she went to UW and was willing to live at home,
the overall cost would be much less.

I hope not to have to face this problem with my son---we've been
saving for college for him since he was born, and hope to be able to
afford to send him to whatever schools or colleges best fit his needs
and abilities.

We've been saving for college, but not with the thought in mind of sending The
Kid to private school or anything other than an in-state public university.

For elementary school so far we have stuck with public schools (taking
full advantage of a strong bilingual program to get him intensive
education in Spanish). When the bilingual program ends after 3rd
grade, we may move him to a private school for a few years, since the
GATE program is practically non-existent in the public schools here.
For middle school and high school, we will probably try to get him
into a local charter school that has very high academic standards.
Unfortunately, there is a lottery to get into the charter school (only
room for 50 students per year), so luck may affect our choices.

The charter school sounds great. I hope that works out for you.

Thanks for your well-thought-out response. You have me thinking...which is
always a good thing.

beeswing

"Robyn Kozierok" wrote in message
...

I think our private school is completely different from the one(s) you
are
considering, and is indeed a pretty "alternative" model for a school,
but
I like talking about it, so I'll take your opening anyhow.

Thanks for letting me hear about your school. It sounds great.

beeswing

2 situations I've heard of myself:

1) My SIL's niece, who ended up with low self-esteem issues when she was in a
big, fairly weathly suburban public school...she transferred to a small private
school (actually, in the same wealthy suburb, but with enrollment from other
towns) and she really came out of her shell.

2) My cousin's stepdaughter, who went to a Private Catholic Junior High, and
felt like she was taunted mercilessly about her weight, etc... She transferred
to a larg Public High School and developed a huge crowd of friends and was
incredibly happy.

So I guess you need to know both the school and the child. Some private schools
are very "nurturing," and some allow much more cliqueishness and abuse than a
public school would ever tolerate.
Some kids need to be a small fish in a big pond to reach their potential; some
need a small pond to feel safe enough to grow.

beeswing wrote:

Jeanne wrote:

I'm not sure I would use early graduation as an indicator of successful,
but I'm not a fan of pushing students through school as fast as
possible.

They don't graduate early, neccessarily (I don't know that they do or don't,
really, but that wasn't what we were being told). What I mean is that all of
this year's graduating class is working two or more years above "grade level."
The only caveat I see is that the kids are required to be at grade level or
above to get into the school, so I don't know if it's chicken or egg.

Oh. I see. I'm beginning to think private schools have to say the kids
are two years above grade level - my daughter's school says the same
thing. Again, I'm not sure this is good.

In first grade, she's learning multiplication along with addition -
holding off subtraction until later. So yeah, in some ways, she's two
years ahead.

By the way, what did you decide to do for graduate school? Spend the extra
money for a number one school, or go to what you called a "second-tier school"?

Option Number 3.

The one of the top schools (for City Planning), UC Berkeley, was the one
I thought I would attend if I got in. One of my old professors would be
my adviser if I went there. Then, I got in. Unfortunately, they could
only guarantee one semester worth of aid and the cost of living was very
high.

I also got into U. of FL in Gainesville, definitely second-tier but I
would be queen. Lots of money, lots of resources and my old adviser
from a previous degree program was department chair. This was scary
because even though I would have lots of support, again, the program
wasn't a great fit.

Unexpectedly I heard that I was accepted into UNC-Chapel Hill with a one
year assistantship (which turned into essentially a fellowship) working
with a very well respected faculty member. Low cost of living, as well
as one of the top schools. So, I ended up at UNC.

Before I heard from UNC, I was strongly leaning toward Florida. I
wasn't thrilled with the program at Berkeley and I pretty much knew it
wasn't right for me.

Do you think the choice you made has made a difference, either positive or
negative?


Of course my choice made a difference. Suffice it to say, I'm happy
where I am now in my life so it's pretty moot whether the difference is
positive or negative. I never once said to myself (even when I knew I
wasn't going to finish), "gee, I wish I went to..." so I guess I made
the right choice.

I think you just need to make the decision you feel is best for your
child and you.

Jeanne

Scott wrote:
LFortier wrote:


I spent years saying how glad I was I didn't have to relive the teen
years until it finally dawned on me that a parent relives them through
children.


Yes. But I think it's important to recognize that your
daughter or son may or may not react to things the same
way you did. So you may relive them, but you're reliving
something that is different from what your child is
living.

Scott DD 10 and DS 7.8


Oh, yes, and that's something I must constantly remind
myself with the older child. We're very alike
tempermentally in many ways, but I have to remind myself
that she's not a carbon copy.

Lesley

"Beeswing" wrote in message
...

Here's why I asked the question I asked. Although the school we are
considering is much better academically than our public, urban middle
school, I really *am* concerned about "character" -- self-image,
self-confidence, personal integrity, and the ability to steer clear of
peer pressure (i.e., that my daughter be strong enough to own choices on
sex, drugs, and so forth). The school we're considering is much
different from the environment of our public middle school. It is an
all-girls school whose mission is to train "future world leaders" -- in
whatever way those future leaders might choose to run with it. Some of
the parents and a few of the girls spoke at the school's open house. The
parents were enthusiastic about how their daughters had grown and
changed; they also talked about how engaged the kids were in the school
and in education. The girls were poised, confident, well-spoken, and
very positive about the school.

Ah, Seattle Girls School? We were looking at it too. I have two friends with
daughters there. I too had a pretty wretched time in junior high, so I am
very concerned about my daughter's experience next year. She's a 5th Grader
in the Bellevue public school system, and we're exploring middle schools
options ourselves. There's lots of considerations -- she has some
neurological quirks that make it harder for her to adapt socially and would
make it more likely she will end up on the bottom of the middle school
social heap. She's a bright kid, and is complaining now about how dull her
current academic situation is at her existing elementary school, where she
is in a gifted pull-out program.

We spent some time at school conferences last week talking to our daughter's
classroom teacher and her teacher for her pull-out gifted program. Both of
them strongly encouraged our daughter to try to test into the district's
full-day gifted program. I can see the benefits of being in this program --
if you are among other "smart" kids, you are less likely to be tortured (as
I was) for doing well in the classroom. Social markers like having just the
right clothes are probably less important. The school that hosts the
full-day program also is the magnet school for the district for drama,
another one of my daughter's interests, and she could participate in the
general school's drama program as an elective. So we are going to cross our
fingers on this, and hope she tests in to the full-day gifted program.

Our district also has an international school, in which kids go through the
international baccalaureate program as it is set up in Europe. This program
is very popular, and you get in by lottery. We could also see if my daughter
could get into this program as well.

When we looked at private schools, well, here on the Eastside, there's only
one secular middle school -- Overlake -- and it costs over $17K a year. In
general, we're concerned about the costs of private school -- even SGS, one
of the cheaper ones, is at 9K and climbing every year. Further, if we go to
Seattle to try to find more options, nearly everyone in the household has
some concerns about the time sink of commuting in to the city for middle
school.

I guess we ended up feeling much more positive about our public school
options compared to private after looking into it in depth and talking with
the teachers -- much more so than before. Maybe that should be your next
step. Are you in the Seattle school system or outside of it?

--
Warm Regards,

Claire Petersky

Home of the meditative cyclist:
http://home.earthlink.net/~cpetersky/Welcome.htm

Books just wanna be FREE! See what I mean at:
http://bookcrossing.com/friend/Cpetersky

wrote:

Ah, Seattle Girls School? We were looking at it too. I have two friends with
daughters there.

I'd love to hear about their experiences by email, if you have time. (Heck,
maybe we should all get together sometime! Real life, what a concept.)

Helen

"Claire Petersky" wrote in message
news:Orgvb.200127$275.745324@attbi_s53...

I guess we ended up feeling much more positive about our public school
options compared to private after looking into it in depth and talking
with
the teachers -- much more so than before. Maybe that should be your
next
step.

It sounds like we have similar concerns as far as how the middle school
goes, including the gifted issue. I tried to emailed you a nicer,
longer, more detailed response, but it bounced (hmm, no such thing as
"mouse-potato.com"?). I was wondering if it might bounce, but hoping it
wouldn't. If you can send me a working email address, I'd really like to
resend it.

The upshot of it is that I've checked into the public school choices
we're given, and they aren't the best. Maybe my daughter could go out of
the area (but within the district). I don't *think* she can, but I
haven't confirmed it. (Transportation would be a problem, though.) The
quality of her middle school choices also depend on whether she can test
into the upper tier gifted program.

Thanks so much for your response. You touched on a lot of the same
things I've been thinking about.

beeswing

"H Schinske" wrote in message
...
wrote:

Ah, Seattle Girls School? We were looking at it too. I have two
friends with
daughters there.

I'd love to hear about their experiences by email, if you have time.
(Heck,
maybe we should all get together sometime! Real life, what a concept.)

I'd like to hear about their experiences as well.

I'd love to talk with you all IRL, too. I've met Claire briefly; and my
husband has met Helen briefly, but I haven't met Helen at all (: . It
would be great to be able to simply sit down and chat with both of you
together.

beeswing

"H Schinske" wrote in message
...
wrote:

Ah, Seattle Girls School? We were looking at it too. I have two friends
with
daughters there.

I'd love to hear about their experiences by email, if you have time.
(Heck,
maybe we should all get together sometime! Real life, what a concept.)

I'm having a tea party on Saturday, you're welcome to come!


--
Warm Regards,

Claire Petersky

Home of the meditative cyclist:
http://home.earthlink.net/~cpetersky/Welcome.htm

Books just wanna be FREE! See what I mean at:
http://bookcrossing.com/friend/Cpetersky