Is this racist?

"just me" wrote in message
m...
"P. Tierney" wrote in message
et...

I would be shocked if the driver wasn't aware of that possibility,
even though it likely wasn't his intent. Intelligent people are aware
of
different usages of different words.

If the bumper sticker had referenced coons or blacks only the double
entendre might have been obvious.

True, but there would likely be some advantage to not being
very obvious.

Really, aren't some here just grasping at straws as regards this
particular bumper sticker?

By doing what? By considering the possibility that it's a
slur? No. By considering the different meaning of the words
and how others might use them? No. By thinking that it's
likely that the driver was racist in intent? Yes. By thinking
that such a phrase is clearly a slur and shouldn't be used? Yes.

But, no one is doing either of the latter two possibilities.
Were though, it would be a reach. But I don't think that there
is anything wrong with doing either of the first two things.



P. Tierney

x-no-archive:yes
Wendy Marsden wrote:

toto wrote:
Wonder what Wendy would have thought of the "I hunt English" bumper
sticker :-)

Reference to the US revolution? vbg

Nope, that wouldn't work. I taught the Revolutionary War last
summer. The colonists called themselves "English", too. For it to make
sense they would have to be saying, "I hunt Lobsterbacks" or something
like that. But there wasn't really any tradition of "hunting" the enemy,
anyway.

Well I assume that Dorothy was joking because she knows what the
bumper sticker would refer to. And initially I thought they meant fox
hunting in English tack. But I've never seen it exactly like that.
Maybe it's someone who lives in Montreal. Or even in France. Or
maybe it was a bumper sticker on an Amish buggy.

grandma Rosalie

dragonlady wrote:

In article ,
Clisby Williams wrote:



Wendy Marsden wrote:



I'm driving behind a white GMC Jimmy SUV and it has exactly one bumper
sticker on it that says, "I hunt black and tans". I'm looking at this
with my mouth open thinking they MUST be talking about dogs, they
can't really be talking about lynching, can they? I look closer to see if
there's a tiny "with" in there. Nope, but there's a silhouette which I
finally figure out (at a stop light when I can study it) is a dog barking
up a tree trunk.

I told my husband how scandalized I was by the poor taste of this bumper
sticker. He said that he didn't take it that way and he couldn't imagine
that the people who put that bumper sticker up thought that way. I said
that the double entendre was the whole POINT of putting up that bumper
sticker. He said I was off my rocker and way too cynical.

Opinions? Am I just nuts to think anyone would be that horrid? I *do*
tend to be cynical (and that's a trait my husband deplores.) I'm also
putting together a study unit on the Restoration of the American South
through to the Civil Rights movement, so racism is on my mind.

Wendy, see red




I don't think you're nuts to think people could be that horrid - but I
have to say, if
I saw it, dogs are the only thing that would come to mind.

Clisby




It might depend upon where you live, but I HAVE heard that sentence
construction for huntin WITH dogs: "I'm hunting the pointers this
weekend," would mean "I'm taking my pointers to go hunting; they hunt,
I shoot."

So it could be someone who hunts with that particular type of dog.

I'm with a group that will be printing up buttons for an upcoming
conference with "BMP" -- standing for "Best Motives Possible". We are
encouraged to assume that, whatever we see or hear, the person speaking
has the "best motives possible", and if we detect a racial, sexual,
ageist, or whatever slur, we should assume it was inadvertant or
unintended or the result of a need for education, rather than
symptomatic of a genuine desire to oppress. I'm TRYING to live my life
that way: assume the BEST motives, and only move to recognizing an
individual racist when there can be no other possible explanation.

meh



Now, if I see you sporting a BMP button, I'm going to assume you're a
computer geek.

Clisby

Wendy Marsden wrote in message ...
seyshell wrote:

are americans this ... thin skinned (right word??) about colour?

Well, if do you mean race relations are that tenuous in general, I'd say
no. But I sure don't care for the thought of "hunting" people for their
colour. And it actually happened here occasionally within the past
100 years. I tend to have a longer memory than most people.

Wendy

But the conclusion that that bumper sticker was racist was just
incredibly forced. When people take stuff like that and twist so very
hard so find racism, it does make them look silly. You should stop
trying excuse your silliness on the basis of your superior anti-racist
perspective and just take a little lesson from it. The existence of
the word "black" in a sentence or phrase does not racism make.

On Mon, 11 Aug 2003, Rosalie B. wrote:

x-no-archive:yes
Wendy Marsden wrote:

toto wrote:
Wonder what Wendy would have thought of the "I hunt English" bumper
sticker :-)

Reference to the US revolution? vbg

Nope, that wouldn't work. I taught the Revolutionary War last
summer. The colonists called themselves "English", too. For it to make
sense they would have to be saying, "I hunt Lobsterbacks" or something
like that. But there wasn't really any tradition of "hunting" the enemy,
anyway.

Well I assume that Dorothy was joking because she knows what the
bumper sticker would refer to. And initially I thought they meant fox
hunting in English tack. But I've never seen it exactly like that.
Maybe it's someone who lives in Montreal. Or even in France. Or
maybe it was a bumper sticker on an Amish buggy.


English coon hounds... It's a specific breed of dog that originated
in England. I think they're called Redticks by some people. I had
one as a puppy once. I was in high school. One morning early before
school he bit into an electric cord and electrocuted himself. I rushed
him to the vet and he recovered. A few months later my dad drove over
him with the truck. He was a sweety.

On Sun, 10 Aug 2003, P. Tierney wrote:


"just me" wrote in message
m...
"P. Tierney" wrote in message
et...

I would be shocked if the driver wasn't aware of that possibility,
even though it likely wasn't his intent. Intelligent people are aware
of
different usages of different words.

If the bumper sticker had referenced coons or blacks only the double
entendre might have been obvious.

True, but there would likely be some advantage to not being
very obvious.

Really, aren't some here just grasping at straws as regards this
particular bumper sticker?

By doing what? By considering the possibility that it's a
slur? No. By considering the different meaning of the words
and how others might use them? No. By thinking that it's
likely that the driver was racist in intent? Yes. By thinking
that such a phrase is clearly a slur and shouldn't be used? Yes.

But, no one is doing either of the latter two possibilities.
Were though, it would be a reach. But I don't think that there
is anything wrong with doing either of the first two things.

I didn't have to go looking for another meaning. DIdn't have to sit
and think about it and grasp at anything. It was right there. All
that and bumper stickers are *famous* for the double entendre.
"Coon hunters do it in the bushes" and that sort of thing....

"Nevermind" wrote in message
om...
Wendy Marsden wrote in message
...
seyshell wrote:

are americans this ... thin skinned (right word??) about colour?

Well, if do you mean race relations are that tenuous in general, I'd say
no. But I sure don't care for the thought of "hunting" people for their
colour. And it actually happened here occasionally within the past
100 years. I tend to have a longer memory than most people.

Wendy

But the conclusion that that bumper sticker was racist was just

I don't see where that conclusion was firmly reached by anyone.

incredibly forced. When people take stuff like that and twist so very
hard so find racism, it does make them look silly.

It's in the eye of the beholder. Me, I find those who dismiss ideas by
inventing the intent of the speaker (by calling it forced), slapping
irrelevant and meaningless labels on it (politically correct), and claiming
that their words make them "look" a certain way, as if everyone wears
the same shade of glasses as the critic, to be the silly ones.

A big world, lots of ways to look at things. Which is one of the
points of this thread, I think.



P.
Tierney

"Nevermind" wrote in message
om...
Wendy Marsden wrote in message
...
seyshell wrote:

are americans this ... thin skinned (right word??) about colour?

Well, if do you mean race relations are that tenuous in general, I'd say
no. But I sure don't care for the thought of "hunting" people for their
colour. And it actually happened here occasionally within the past
100 years. I tend to have a longer memory than most people.

Wendy

But the conclusion that that bumper sticker was racist was just

I don't see where that conclusion was firmly reached by anyone.

incredibly forced. When people take stuff like that and twist so very
hard so find racism, it does make them look silly.

How over the top. Perhaps we have different backgrounds. I didn't have
to twist a damned thing, didn't have to force anything. I'm familiar
with coon hunters and coon jokes. I grew up with both. There was no
stretch. And while I doubt the owner's intentions were racist, more than
just a few people will see the double meaning. I bet just about
anyone I grew up with would look at that and say, "Hmm, you could
take that more than one way."

Meanwhile, no one at all concluded the bumper sticker was definitely
racist or that the owner of the vehicle sporting the bumper sticker was a
racist. It was simply discussed that the bumper sticker *could*
be taken that way. And I have no doubt but that it is used that
way by some because it is *no* stretch to see both meanings for
many people who remember the times so vividly.

"Joni Rathbun" wrote in message
...
English coon hounds... It's a specific breed of dog that originated
in England. I think they're called Redticks by some people. I had
one as a puppy once. I was in high school. One morning early before
school he bit into an electric cord and electrocuted himself. I rushed
him to the vet and he recovered. A few months later my dad drove over
him with the truck. He was a sweety.

Those coonhounds have a way of getting themselves into trouble don't they! I
have a redbone and boy, oh boy do I have 9 years of stories. The latest
(just last month) involved a chunk of corncob and an intestine...
--
JennP.
mom to matthew 10/11/00
EDD 4/4/04

"Byron Canfield" wrote:

"There are 10 kinds of people in the world:
those who understand binary numbers and those who don't."

Quite OT, but I really enjoyed reading that sig. An original,
or is there a source? Thx.



P.
Tierney