Gut flora

"Peter Bowditch" wrote in message
...
"carole" wrote:

Note - silica, silicon, and sililic acid are interchangeable.

In which universe?


These are the various names that supplements go by - silica, silicon,
silicon dioxide and siliclic acid. They all address silica deficiencies.

Good article on the value of silica at
http://www.orgoneproducts.org/orgone_g5silica.php


--
carole
www.conspiracee.com
"Necessity is the plea of every infringement of human freedom. It is the
argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves." -William Pitt (1759-1806)

On 9/29/10 9:05 AM, carole wrote:
wrote in message
...
On 9/29/10 2:18 AM, carole wrote:
wrote in message
...
On 9/28/10 9:48 PM, carole wrote:




Silica, silicon, silicon dioxide, siliclic acid - any of these
ring
a bell?


Silica is also beneficial for bone growth and arterial
health,
amongst
other
things.

Silica is harmful and can cause inflamation if inside the
body. It
is
not
absorbed by the body.

Get a clue errol. Studies have shown that silica is a vital
nutrient, go
do
some homework in pubmed or one of your research books.

I did. It is a toxin. That's about it.

How about silicon dioxide?

Bottom line is that silicon is not a nutrient for humans. If I am
incorrect, show me *good* evidence.

WHO FOOD ADDITIVES SERIES NO. 5
http://www.inchem.org/documents/jecf...no/v05je04.htm

From that report: Very small amounts of silica are normally present in
all body tissues but there is no evidence that they play any
physiological
role.

Are you stupid, or maybe you just can't read?
Note - silica, silicon, and sililic acid are interchangeable.

http://www.inchem.org/documents/jecf...no/v05je04.htm


From this reference: "The available data on orally administered silica and
silicates, including flumed silicon dioxide, appear to substantiate the
biological inertness of these compounds."

Chicken

"Day-old deutectomized cockerels were kept in a trace element controlled
environment and fed a synthetic low silicon diet. The diet of the test
groups was supplemented with sodium metasilicate (Na2SiO3œ9H2O) at a
level
of 100 mg/kg. 114 chickens were in the control groups and 114 chickens in
the test groups. Growth rates and the appearance of the animals were
evaluated at two- to three- day intervals. The animals were killed at the
end of a 25- to 35- day period. Gross pathology and histological
examinations were carried out on the organs of each chick. Differences
between the chicks on the basal and silicon-supplemented diets were noted
after one to two weeks.

At the twenty-third day of the study the average weight for the low
silicon
group was 76 g compared to a weight of 116 g for the supplemented group
(p
0.02). The average daily weight gain for the control groups was 2.57 g
and
that of the test groups reached 3.85 g (p 0.01).

The animals on the basal diet were smaller and all their organs appeared
relatively atrophied as compared to the test chickens. The leg bones of
the
deficient birds were shorter, of smaller circumference and thinner
cortex.
The metatarsal bones were relatively flexible and the femur and tibia
fractured more easily under pressure than those of the supplemented
group.
Thus the effect of silicon on skeletal development indicates that it
plays
an important role in an early stage of bone formation (Carlisle, 1972)."

From a 40-year old study. Big deal.


So if this information has been known for 40 how do you explain the lag in
having it known to the medical establishment?

You're making the wrong assumption that the info has real value in human
health.

Jeff

On 9/29/10 9:11 AM, carole wrote:
"Peter wrote in message
...
wrote:

Note - silica, silicon, and sililic acid are interchangeable.

In which universe?


These are the various names that supplements go by - silica, silicon,
silicon dioxide and siliclic acid. They all address silica deficiencies.

Good article on the value of silica at
http://www.orgoneproducts.org/orgone_g5silica.php

It shows you how little the people selling you expensive supplements know.

And how little they care about, except for your money.

Jeff

"Bob Officer" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 17:37:50 +1000, in misc.health.alternative, Peter
Bowditch wrote:

"carole" wrote:

Note - silica, silicon, and sililic acid are interchangeable.

In which universe?

Well Carole Believes that it is true.

I need to find her post where she states "Silicon, Silica and Silicon
Dioxide and Silicates and Silicon are all the samethings."

Carole had no idea what Sililic Acid was until I mentioned it.

You've got no idea what it is because its spelled silicic -- not sililic.

--
carole
www.conspiracee.com
"Necessity is the plea of every infringement of human freedom. It is the
argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves." -William Pitt (1759-1806)

"Bob Officer" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 23:05:07 +1000, in misc.health.alternative,
"carole" wrote:


"dr_jeff" wrote in message
...
On 9/29/10 2:18 AM, carole wrote:
wrote in message
...
On 9/28/10 9:48 PM, carole wrote:




Silica, silicon, silicon dioxide, siliclic acid - any of these
ring
a bell?


Silica is also beneficial for bone growth and arterial
health,
amongst
other
things.

Silica is harmful and can cause inflamation if inside the
body. It
is
not
absorbed by the body.

Get a clue errol. Studies have shown that silica is a vital
nutrient, go
do
some homework in pubmed or one of your research books.

I did. It is a toxin. That's about it.

How about silicon dioxide?

Bottom line is that silicon is not a nutrient for humans. If I
am
incorrect, show me *good* evidence.

WHO FOOD ADDITIVES SERIES NO. 5
http://www.inchem.org/documents/jecf...no/v05je04.htm

From that report: Very small amounts of silica are normally present
in
all body tissues but there is no evidence that they play any
physiological
role.

Are you stupid, or maybe you just can't read?
Note - silica, silicon, and sililic acid are interchangeable.

http://www.inchem.org/documents/jecf...no/v05je04.htm


From this reference: "The available data on orally administered silica
and
silicates, including flumed silicon dioxide, appear to substantiate the
biological inertness of these compounds."

Chicken

"Day-old deutectomized cockerels were kept in a trace element
controlled
environment and fed a synthetic low silicon diet. The diet of the test
groups was supplemented with sodium metasilicate (Na2SiO3½9H2O) at a
level
of 100 mg/kg. 114 chickens were in the control groups and 114 chickens
in
the test groups. Growth rates and the appearance of the animals were
evaluated at two- to three- day intervals. The animals were killed at
the
end of a 25- to 35- day period. Gross pathology and histological
examinations were carried out on the organs of each chick. Differences
between the chicks on the basal and silicon-supplemented diets were
noted
after one to two weeks.

At the twenty-third day of the study the average weight for the low
silicon
group was 76 g compared to a weight of 116 g for the supplemented group
(p
0.02). The average daily weight gain for the control groups was 2.57 g
and
that of the test groups reached 3.85 g (p 0.01).

The animals on the basal diet were smaller and all their organs
appeared
relatively atrophied as compared to the test chickens. The leg bones of
the
deficient birds were shorter, of smaller circumference and thinner
cortex.
The metatarsal bones were relatively flexible and the femur and tibia
fractured more easily under pressure than those of the supplemented
group.
Thus the effect of silicon on skeletal development indicates that it
plays
an important role in an early stage of bone formation (Carlisle,
1972)."

From a 40-year old study. Big deal.


So if this information has been known for 40 how do you explain the lag in
having it known to the medical establishment?

Carole it was an artificial environment. They artificially deprived
the chickens of all silicon compounds normally available in the
natural diet.

The other Chickens were feed an enriched diet supplemented with
Additional Silicates.

The Test does not say what you think it says.

I suggest you re-read:
Cite Comment
"Day-old deutectomized cockerels were kept|Describes test subjects
in a trace element controlled environment |They were deprived of
|natural trace element
and fed a synthetic low silicon diet. |Note" the word synthetic
The diet of the test groups |Which of the two groups
|was target
was supplemented |Do you see that word
with sodium metasilicate (Na2SiO3½9H2O) |That is not silica or even
|silicon dioxide
at a level of 100 mg/kg. |that is about 10-15x the
|normal level found in
|natural diets
/cite |/comments

What the study doesn't say plainly is the artificial control
environment allowed them to deprive the "control group" of any foods
containing "Silica" or any other "trace minerals", and then "test
Group" was given suppliments at least 10 to 15 times the level of
Silica compounds (Sodium Silicate) found non-artifical non-enriched
diets.

In other words they created a false or artificial group as a control.
and then Created a second set of groups with outlandish Suppliments.

So you can understand a "dumbed down" version just for Carole. They
Starved one group and over fed the Second Group and then remarked
about the disparity between the two groups.

Not really much a study, is it Carole? Do See why you have to read
critically?

If I were you I would have start to doubt the validity of the so
called "Briggs-Myers Type Test" you claimed to have taken. It is
plain to just about everyone else but you, that you are not a master
mind or able to see any sort of a big picture.

The test showed that chickens deprived of silica developed abnormalities.
That's the bottom line.


http://www.naturalhealthtechniques.c...on/silicon.htm

What Silica Does:



Formation of collagen for bones and connective tissue

For healthy nails, skin, and hair

Calcium absorption in the early stages of bone formation

Needed to maintain flexible arteries

Counteracts the effects of aluminum on the body and is important in the
prevention of Alzheimer's disease

Prevention of osteoporosis

Stimulates the immune system

Inhibits the aging process in tissues

Helps guard against certain heart and circulatory diseases

Believed to help prevent falling hair




--
carole
www.conspiracee.com
"Necessity is the plea of every infringement of human freedom. It is the
argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves." -William Pitt (1759-1806)

On 10/1/10 6:18 AM, carole wrote:
"Bob wrote in message
...
On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 23:05:07 +1000, in misc.health.alternative,
wrote:


wrote in message
...
On 9/29/10 2:18 AM, carole wrote:
wrote in message
...
On 9/28/10 9:48 PM, carole wrote:




Silica, silicon, silicon dioxide, siliclic acid - any of these
ring
a bell?


Silica is also beneficial for bone growth and arterial
health,
amongst
other
things.

Silica is harmful and can cause inflamation if inside the
body. It
is
not
absorbed by the body.

Get a clue errol. Studies have shown that silica is a vital
nutrient, go
do
some homework in pubmed or one of your research books.

I did. It is a toxin. That's about it.

How about silicon dioxide?

Bottom line is that silicon is not a nutrient for humans. If I
am
incorrect, show me *good* evidence.

WHO FOOD ADDITIVES SERIES NO. 5
http://www.inchem.org/documents/jecf...no/v05je04.htm

From that report: Very small amounts of silica are normally present
in
all body tissues but there is no evidence that they play any
physiological
role.

Are you stupid, or maybe you just can't read?
Note - silica, silicon, and sililic acid are interchangeable.

http://www.inchem.org/documents/jecf...no/v05je04.htm


From this reference: "The available data on orally administered silica
and
silicates, including flumed silicon dioxide, appear to substantiate the
biological inertness of these compounds."

Chicken

"Day-old deutectomized cockerels were kept in a trace element
controlled
environment and fed a synthetic low silicon diet. The diet of the test
groups was supplemented with sodium metasilicate (Na2SiO3½9H2O) at a
level
of 100 mg/kg. 114 chickens were in the control groups and 114 chickens
in
the test groups. Growth rates and the appearance of the animals were
evaluated at two- to three- day intervals. The animals were killed at
the
end of a 25- to 35- day period. Gross pathology and histological
examinations were carried out on the organs of each chick. Differences
between the chicks on the basal and silicon-supplemented diets were
noted
after one to two weeks.

At the twenty-third day of the study the average weight for the low
silicon
group was 76 g compared to a weight of 116 g for the supplemented group
(p
0.02). The average daily weight gain for the control groups was 2.57 g
and
that of the test groups reached 3.85 g (p 0.01).

The animals on the basal diet were smaller and all their organs
appeared
relatively atrophied as compared to the test chickens. The leg bones of
the
deficient birds were shorter, of smaller circumference and thinner
cortex.
The metatarsal bones were relatively flexible and the femur and tibia
fractured more easily under pressure than those of the supplemented
group.
Thus the effect of silicon on skeletal development indicates that it
plays
an important role in an early stage of bone formation (Carlisle,
1972)."

From a 40-year old study. Big deal.


So if this information has been known for 40 how do you explain the lag in
having it known to the medical establishment?

Carole it was an artificial environment. They artificially deprived
the chickens of all silicon compounds normally available in the
natural diet.

The other Chickens were feed an enriched diet supplemented with
Additional Silicates.

The Test does not say what you think it says.

I suggest you re-read:
Cite Comment
"Day-old deutectomized cockerels were kept|Describes test subjects
in a trace element controlled environment |They were deprived of
|natural trace element
and fed a synthetic low silicon diet. |Note" the word synthetic
The diet of the test groups |Which of the two groups
|was target
was supplemented |Do you see that word
with sodium metasilicate (Na2SiO3½9H2O) |That is not silica or even
|silicon dioxide
at a level of 100 mg/kg. |that is about 10-15x the
|normal level found in
|natural diets
/cite |/comments

What the study doesn't say plainly is the artificial control
environment allowed them to deprive the "control group" of any foods
containing "Silica" or any other "trace minerals", and then "test
Group" was given suppliments at least 10 to 15 times the level of
Silica compounds (Sodium Silicate) found non-artifical non-enriched
diets.

In other words they created a false or artificial group as a control.
and then Created a second set of groups with outlandish Suppliments.

So you can understand a "dumbed down" version just for Carole. They
Starved one group and over fed the Second Group and then remarked
about the disparity between the two groups.

Not really much a study, is it Carole? Do See why you have to read
critically?

If I were you I would have start to doubt the validity of the so
called "Briggs-Myers Type Test" you claimed to have taken. It is
plain to just about everyone else but you, that you are not a master
mind or able to see any sort of a big picture.

The test showed that chickens deprived of silica developed abnormalities.
That's the bottom line.


http://www.naturalhealthtechniques.c...on/silicon.htm

What Silica Does:



Formation of collagen for bones and connective tissue

For healthy nails, skin, and hair

Calcium absorption in the early stages of bone formation

Needed to maintain flexible arteries

Counteracts the effects of aluminum on the body and is important in the
prevention of Alzheimer's disease

Prevention of osteoporosis

Stimulates the immune system

Inhibits the aging process in tissues

Helps guard against certain heart and circulatory diseases

Believed to help prevent falling hair

You got this from the side of the bottle or an ad, right? Do you really
believe ads?

Jeff

"dr_jeff" wrote in message
...
On 9/29/10 9:05 AM, carole wrote:




From this reference: "The available data on orally administered silica
and
silicates, including flumed silicon dioxide, appear to substantiate the
biological inertness of these compounds."

Chicken

"Day-old deutectomized cockerels were kept in a trace element
controlled
environment and fed a synthetic low silicon diet. The diet of the test
groups was supplemented with sodium metasilicate (Na2SiO3œ9H2O) at a
level
of 100 mg/kg. 114 chickens were in the control groups and 114 chickens
in
the test groups. Growth rates and the appearance of the animals were
evaluated at two- to three- day intervals. The animals were killed at
the
end of a 25- to 35- day period. Gross pathology and histological
examinations were carried out on the organs of each chick. Differences
between the chicks on the basal and silicon-supplemented diets were
noted
after one to two weeks.

At the twenty-third day of the study the average weight for the low
silicon
group was 76 g compared to a weight of 116 g for the supplemented group
(p
0.02). The average daily weight gain for the control groups was 2.57 g
and
that of the test groups reached 3.85 g (p 0.01).

The animals on the basal diet were smaller and all their organs
appeared
relatively atrophied as compared to the test chickens. The leg bones of
the
deficient birds were shorter, of smaller circumference and thinner
cortex.
The metatarsal bones were relatively flexible and the femur and tibia
fractured more easily under pressure than those of the supplemented
group.
Thus the effect of silicon on skeletal development indicates that it
plays
an important role in an early stage of bone formation (Carlisle,
1972)."

From a 40-year old study. Big deal.


So if this information has been known for 40 how do you explain the lag
in
having it known to the medical establishment?

You're making the wrong assumption that the info has real value in human
health.

I don't think so.
Silica, silicon dioxide, silicic acid are all established as necessary
nutrients by people who know nutrition.

http://www.orgoneproducts.org/orgone_g5silica.php

silicic acid
Silicon (silicic acid), which comes from the latin word silex meaning flint,
is ... A deficiency of silicic acid is associated with a number of health
problems. ...
www.silicol.com/acid_facts.html


--
carole
www.conspiracee.com
"Necessity is the plea of every infringement of human freedom. It is the
argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves." —William Pitt (1759-1806)

On 10/1/10 6:26 AM, carole wrote:
wrote in message
...
On 9/29/10 9:05 AM, carole wrote:




From this reference: "The available data on orally administered silica
and
silicates, including flumed silicon dioxide, appear to substantiate the
biological inertness of these compounds."

Chicken

"Day-old deutectomized cockerels were kept in a trace element
controlled
environment and fed a synthetic low silicon diet. The diet of the test
groups was supplemented with sodium metasilicate (Na2SiO3œ9H2O) at a
level
of 100 mg/kg. 114 chickens were in the control groups and 114 chickens
in
the test groups. Growth rates and the appearance of the animals were
evaluated at two- to three- day intervals. The animals were killed at
the
end of a 25- to 35- day period. Gross pathology and histological
examinations were carried out on the organs of each chick. Differences
between the chicks on the basal and silicon-supplemented diets were
noted
after one to two weeks.

At the twenty-third day of the study the average weight for the low
silicon
group was 76 g compared to a weight of 116 g for the supplemented group
(p
0.02). The average daily weight gain for the control groups was 2.57 g
and
that of the test groups reached 3.85 g (p 0.01).

The animals on the basal diet were smaller and all their organs
appeared
relatively atrophied as compared to the test chickens. The leg bones of
the
deficient birds were shorter, of smaller circumference and thinner
cortex.
The metatarsal bones were relatively flexible and the femur and tibia
fractured more easily under pressure than those of the supplemented
group.
Thus the effect of silicon on skeletal development indicates that it
plays
an important role in an early stage of bone formation (Carlisle,
1972)."

From a 40-year old study. Big deal.


So if this information has been known for 40 how do you explain the lag
in
having it known to the medical establishment?

You're making the wrong assumption that the info has real value in human
health.

I don't think so.
Silica, silicon dioxide, silicic acid are all established as necessary
nutrients by people who know nutrition.

http://www.orgoneproducts.org/orgone_g5silica.php

silicic acid
Silicon (silicic acid), which comes from the latin word silex meaning flint,
is ... A deficiency of silicic acid is associated with a number of health
problems. ...
www.silicol.com/acid_facts.html

Wrong, they have been established as necessary nutrients by those who
sell them. You keep saying that pharmacuetical companies are out to make
money. Do you think they are selling this out of the goodness of their
hearts?

If I am wrong, please provide the good peer-reviewed evidence that shows
that these silicon compounds are necessary for human health and that we
don't already get enough in our regular diets.

Jeff

"carole" wrote in
.com:

http://www.naturalhealthtechniques.c...on/silicon.htm

This site is trying to sell you something:
http://www.naturalhealthtechniques.c...pping_cart.htm

For rather obvious reasons, claims made by commercial sites are somewhat
suspect.

--
The trouble with the World is that the stupid are so confident
while the intelligent are full of doubt. -Bertrand Russell

"dr_jeff" wrote in message
...
On 9/28/10 9:48 PM, carole wrote:




WHO FOOD ADDITIVES SERIES NO. 5
http://www.inchem.org/documents/jecf...no/v05je04.htm

This reference says that silicon has no known physiological function.

The Importance of Silicon
http://www.ultimatesg.com/22mayjarrowsilicon.html
"Silicon is a trace mineral required for the formation of healthy
connective tissue, bone, skin, hair and nails. Silicon is essential for
collagen formation, healthy arteries and regulates calcium deposition in
bones.* BioSil's active silicon is an essential partner of calcium for
bones, glucosamine for joints

Absorption is Key. Dietary sources of silicon such as those found in
food, horsetail and colloidal gel (silica) products are very poorly
absorbed because of their insoluble, polymerized forms. For absorption
to occur, dietary silicon must be first converted to Orthosilicic Acid
(monomeric silicic acid), the bioavailable form found in BioSil™.

Why is BioSil™ Different? BioSil™ (Si[OH]4) is 20,000 times more soluble
than silica(SiO2 — found in horsetail and colloidal gels) and 2.5 times
more bioavailable than other forms of silicon!

The superiority of silicon as concentrated, choline-stabilized
orthosilicic acid from BioSil™ has been proven in a peer reviewed
scientific study comparing three different forms of
silicon. The results of the comparative, cross-over, double-blind
clinical trial demonstrated that the stabilized monomeric form of
silicon (stabilized orthosilicic acid – as found in BioSil™) is far
superior to colloidal silica and horsetail extract. In fact, of the
three experimental groups, only BioSil™ offered a bioavailable source of
silicon; the other forms of silicon (horsetail and colloidal gel) were
no better than placebo1.

Scientific References
1. Arch Dermatol Res. 2005 Oct;297(4):147-53. Epub 2005 Oct 26. Effect
of oral intake of choline-stabilized orthosilicic acid on skin, nails
and hair in women with photodamaged skin. Barel A et al.

2. Calcif Tissue Int. 2006 Apr;78(4):227-32. Epub 2006 Apr 13. Partial
prevention of long-term femoral bone loss in aged ovariectomized rats
supplemented with choline-stabilized orthosilicic acid. Calomme M et al."

This is from the sellers of silicon. The so-called scientific references
were for either two small groups or rats. The one with small groups found
a small decrease in the roughness of skin. So this is the best you can do.
How sad.

Jeff

Well this is an improvement.
Dr Jeff goes from the stand that silica isn't necesary, to now saying the
study is inadequate.

There are plenty of sources that say silica is an essential mineral.
Just because your dumbed-down education didn't teach you about nutrition no
need to get all testy and defensive.
If I was to rely on allopathic medicine I too wouldn't have learnt about the
importance of silica.

--
carole
www.conspiracee.com
"Necessity is the plea of every infringement of human freedom. It is the
argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves." —William Pitt (1759-1806)