New Mama With Questions

Anne

Oh, you poor thing, how undermining your doctor has been. He's 5 days
old if I'm counting correctly, which is the exact time you'd expect
him
to be at the max below birthweight and 10% less than birthweight is
absolutely fine. Most doctors use 10% as a threshold, but it's
debatable
whether it's really necessary as long as other signs of health are
reassuring. Weighing the next day is incredibly unreliable, most
people
weigh babies undressed and the weight can depend on when they weed and
pooed, he could by the scales have lost weight tomorrow, yet really
have gained.

Well, I went in today and he had gained an ounce and a half. In just over
24 hours. Plenty of wet and pooey nappies. Yet they still insisted he needed
to come in tomorrow since he was still at 9% weight loss. I don't think
we're going to go. It is the "mother/infant clinic" at the hospital, not
even his regular ped. It seems to be a standard procedure when they discharge
to have a weight check 2 days later and then "as needed" after that. It
seems ridiculous. Especially to have the same policy for bf vs. ff infants
at this point in their life.

Do not give any supplements of formula, they are entirely unnecessary
from the information you have given. You can check that he's doing ok
by monitoring hydration based on nappy output, which for a newborn
should be 6 wet nappies a day.

I didn't give him any of the formula. His nappies are good.

It's possible that a little boost might help him, which you can do
with your own breastmilk, you said you were engorged, so you should be
able to hand express into a cup, then give it to him by any method
other than a bottle, don't let a bottle anywhere near him until you
have fully established breastfeeding.

You don't mention any details about the birth - if you received IV
fluids for any length of time, the babies birth weight can be higher
than it really would have been and weight lost is simply loosing
fluids that were never even supposed to be there.

I did have IV fluids for about 6 hours before he was born. I didn't even
think of that aspect.

I really wouldn't go back for the weight check tomorrow, I'd watch to
see that he's hydrated, on the off chance he isn't supplement without
using a bottle with your own milk, but still don't go and get him
weighed. Continue to watch for hydration and only go get him weighed
when your curiosity gets the better of you!

Thanks for the advice. The doctors seem to be doing their best to stress
out this post-partum mama!!

--Jodi

Jodi B wrote:

Well, I went in today and he had gained an ounce and a half. In just
over 24 hours. Plenty of wet and pooey nappies. Yet they still
insisted he needed to come in tomorrow since he was still at 9% weight
loss. I don't think we're going to go. It is the "mother/infant
clinic" at the hospital, not even his regular ped. It seems to be a
standard procedure when they discharge to have a weight check 2 days
later and then "as needed" after that. It seems ridiculous. Especially
to have the same policy for bf vs. ff infants at this point in their life.

You are doing just fine and you are a well-informed
Mama. Trust your gut. I'm with you; I don't think
you need to go back in 2 days, especially if his
nappy counts are good.

-- Anita --

"Jodi B" wrote in message
t.net...
Anne

Oh, you poor thing, how undermining your doctor has been. He's 5 days
old if I'm counting correctly, which is the exact time you'd expect
him
to be at the max below birthweight and 10% less than birthweight is
absolutely fine. Most doctors use 10% as a threshold, but it's
debatable
whether it's really necessary as long as other signs of health are
reassuring. Weighing the next day is incredibly unreliable, most
people
weigh babies undressed and the weight can depend on when they weed and
pooed, he could by the scales have lost weight tomorrow, yet really
have gained.

Well, I went in today and he had gained an ounce and a half. In just over
24 hours. Plenty of wet and pooey nappies. Yet they still insisted he
needed
to come in tomorrow since he was still at 9% weight loss. I don't think
we're going to go. It is the "mother/infant clinic" at the hospital,


There's the problem!
The first health nurse I ever visited demoralised me so much. She suggested
that DD was not gaining enough on my breastmilk and I'd need to supplement.
Thank goodness I ignored her....
I think they get training on how to make new mothers feel inadequate,
(although you do find the rare wonderful ones who just fill you up with
confidence and have logical answers when you need them.)

I'd ignore the next weigh in ... especially if his nappy count is good and
they didn't suggest jaundice when you were there yesterday. I think
weighing too often can be misleading as weight naturally fluctuates
throughout the day.

Just make the best use of all his hunger cues (rooting reflex, sucking on
hands or lip, a little "eh eh eh" sound).
You are doing fine. Give yourself and your baby time to get used to
breastfeeding.

Amanda

On Sep 25, 11:24 pm, Jodi B wrote:
Hi All,

I just gave birth to my son on Sunday and I while I've lurked in this group
for a long time, I guess I'd like some encouragement now that I'm actually
in the thick of learning to bf a newborn.

My milk came in with a vengance today. We are still learning to nurse properly,
and while there are times that he feeds contendedly and well, they are definitely
not the norm. More often we have latch-on-latch-off-repeatedly type sessions
where he gets a few good sucks and then tires out or yells for awhile. Should
I be doing anything to get rid of the engorgement, or will things even out
on their own?

He was 8lb 9oz at birth and discharged from the hospital at 7lb 15oz. They
want him for a weigh-in on Thursday...hopefully we can get some good feeds
in between now and then, but should I expect that he will lose more weight
this week?

Thanks for any advice!

--Jodi

Hi Jodi,
I am a 22 year old mom of 2. Both breastfed. sounds like you are doin
a great job. From experience, my babies gained after the hospital. My
youngest is 4 months old and he weighed 6,4. He left the hospital at
5,14. By his 6 week checkup, he weighed almost 12. He dos the same
thing at times..on and off the breast. Sometimes, its only a burp
stopping him, other times it comes from the other side. Some older
women have told me that boys tend be a little lazier at times than
girls. AND NEEDIER! And they will never get enough mommy. So, hang in
there! And enjoy the bonding!
Desiree

On Sep 28, 1:44 pm, Jodi B wrote:

It seems to be a standard procedure when they discharge
to have a weight check 2 days later and then "as needed" after that. It
seems ridiculous. Especially to have the same policy for bf vs. ff infants
at this point in their life.

Well, for what it's worth it's a fairly new recommendation of the
American Academy of Pediatrics (not sure about other countries) that
all newborns have an exam at 3-5 days of life. While the increase in
breastfeeding rates is wonderful in almost every way, one of the very
few problems associated with it was a rise in severely dehydrated
newborns who'd been going for days on end with little effective food
or fluids. Sometimes the breastfeeding isn't working and the parents
don't realize that. Diaper counts are useful information but not
always that reliable. The other thing that we're supposed to check is
for jaundice. I think that properly executed the policy should
support breastfeeding because it will allow for earlier intervention
when things aren't going well. Unfortunately many pediatricians
aren't well trained at supporting breastfeeding and may not have easy
access to lactation consultants for their patients, so that's not how
it's always going to work.

Sounds like things have turned around for you now so that's good. I
know few doctors -- or lactation consultants, for that matter -- who
wouldn't recommend some form of supplementing with formula or EBM for
a baby that's 10% down from birthweight so I don't think they were
being terribly unreasonable. Unless it's really a huge burden on you
I would think a weight check in a day or two could help put your and
their minds at ease that things are now solidly on the right track,
but of course it's your choice.

Kate, ignorant foot soldier of the medical cartel (pediatrician)
and the Bug, 4 years old
and something brewing, 4/08

Akuvikate wrote:

Sounds like things have turned around for you now so that's good. I
know few doctors -- or lactation consultants, for that matter -- who
wouldn't recommend some form of supplementing with formula or EBM for
a baby that's 10% down from birthweight so I don't think they were
being terribly unreasonable.

I really thought it was unreasonable to send me, someone who is 5 days post-partum,
home with a bunch of formula, and very little instruction (basically, "feed
him this after you breastfeed"). If I didn't know what I know about breastfeeding,
supply and demand, etc, etc...it could have totally sabotaged my supply.
I would think, anyway? They didn't even say anything about the possibility
of supplementing with EBM.

Unless it's really a huge burden on you
I would think a weight check in a day or two could help put your and
their minds at ease that things are now solidly on the right track,
but of course it's your choice.

It's not a burden to get him weighed. The burden is that even after I got
him weighed yesterday, and he was gaining, they want me to come back *every
day* until he is at 5% loss from birth weight. That is their protocol.

Oh, and just a general reply to everyone's comments: he is not jaundiced
at all. He had good bili levels on discharge and he's very pink. The nurses
do make note of that when we go in.

We are getting better at feeding, although I do try to see what I can pump
when he's done if it seems like he didn't get "enough" time on both sides
(sometimes he's a little sleepy on the second side). Usually it's less than
20ml (and I know that I can pump ~2 oz from each side if he hasn't eaten
at all, so I think he's getting the good stuff out).

Thanks to everyone! I think I am at least turning an emotional corner on
this stuff now that I can get him to latch well (even if it takes awhile
for him to do it, I know he *will*).

--Jodi

"Akuvikate" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Sep 28, 1:44 pm, Jodi B wrote:

It seems to be a standard procedure when they discharge
to have a weight check 2 days later and then "as needed" after that. It
seems ridiculous. Especially to have the same policy for bf vs. ff
infants
at this point in their life.

Well, for what it's worth it's a fairly new recommendation of the
American Academy of Pediatrics (not sure about other countries) that
all newborns have an exam at 3-5 days of life. While the increase in
breastfeeding rates is wonderful in almost every way, one of the very
few problems associated with it was a rise in severely dehydrated
newborns who'd been going for days on end with little effective food
or fluids.

But at 3-5 days pp the mother's milk is generally just coming in so one
wouldn't imagine that the babies were getting a lot of "food" before that
time unless they were given formula.
Amanda

just to update everyone...what a difference a week makes! ds is doing great
on feedings, latching well and eating every 3-4 hours. he has, um, excellent
output.

we stopped going to the weigh ins, once it was clear he was gaining (maybe
not as fast as the nurses wanted to see, but he was healthy, peeing, pooping,
having alert times). once we made the decision to stop going, it took so
much pressure off of me and ds and we just got the hang of it! we have
his two week ped appt tomorrow, and i'm actually kind of excited now to go
and see how much he's gained.

thanks for the support and advice...i'll probably be around for awhile asking
more questions.

--jodi, nak (yay!)

"Jodi B" wrote in message
t.net...
just to update everyone...what a difference a week makes! ds is doing
great
on feedings, latching well and eating every 3-4 hours. he has, um,
excellent
output.

we stopped going to the weigh ins, once it was clear he was gaining (maybe
not as fast as the nurses wanted to see, but he was healthy, peeing,
pooping,
having alert times). once we made the decision to stop going, it took so
much pressure off of me and ds and we just got the hang of it! we have
his two week ped appt tomorrow, and i'm actually kind of excited now to go
and see how much he's gained.

thanks for the support and advice...i'll probably be around for awhile
asking
more questions.

--jodi, nak (yay!)


Hooray!
I'm pleased to hear that everything has sorted itslef out.
Now just in case your nurses etc are using outdated information for growth
rates .... here's a link to theWHOs software and charts using breastfed
infants as the "norm" http://www.who.int/nutrition/media_page/en/

Let us know how he goes
Amanda

On Oct 4, 11:49 am, Jodi B wrote:
just to update everyone...what a difference a week makes! ds is doing great
on feedings, latching well and eating every 3-4 hours. he has, um, excellent
output.

we stopped going to the weigh ins, once it was clear he was gaining (maybe
not as fast as the nurses wanted to see, but he was healthy, peeing, pooping,
having alert times). once we made the decision to stop going, it took so
much pressure off of me and ds and we just got the hang of it! we have
his two week ped appt tomorrow, and i'm actually kind of excited now to go
and see how much he's gained.

thanks for the support and advice...i'll probably be around for awhile asking
more questions.

--jodi, nak (yay!)

Glad to hear it's all settled down! Good luck with the pedi
appointment tomorrow.

Kate, ignorant foot soldier of the medical cartel
and the Bug, 4 years old
and something brewing, 4/08