Preparing sibling for birth process?

Chookie schrieb:
In article , NL wrote:
snip
Yes, but if you look further up in the thread it had been about single
parents in general, specifically about your mother leaving your father
to live with your grandmother....

Um, no -- look at my post again.

Can you give me the post ID I've kind of lost track in the sub threads I
think...

cu
nicole

On Apr 21, 12:36 am, agsf_57 wrote:
On Apr 20, 3:02 pm, Sarah Vaughan wrote:

wrote:
A married woman covered in a burka in
Afghanistan has more respect and value than an unwed single mother in
America.

While doing a bit of googling to find out what life is actually like for
women in Afghanistan these days, I came across
http://www.hrw.org/backgrounder/wrd/afghan-women-2k2.htm. Must say it
didn't leave me terribly impressed with the level of respect and value
these women are getting. Single motherhood isn't a path I'd want to go
down, but to me it sounds vastly preferable than the life that's
described for Afghanistan women.

The women punished are those who go out of the scope of their society.

OK, I get you – you're saying that these women get respect if they
remain within the strictly defined boundaries of their society. So,
as long as they don't work outside the home or travel freely, and
remain swathed in all-concealing clothes no matter how uncomfortable
or inappropriate for the weather this may be, they'll get respect from
their menfolk.

What you seem to be implying is that you think this is somehow a
worthwhile trade-off which ultimately leads to women's lives being
much better. Care to explain in exactly what way you feel this to be
the case?

However, from the American's point of view, she is oppressed.

Yes. Fromhttp://www.channel4.com/life/microsites/A/afghanistan/women.html, it
sounds as though – even though life for women has improved post-Taliban
– many women still have their lives severely restricted by the threat of
violence. Is that not something you see as oppressive?

Wanting to divorce your husband to become a doctor is not improvement.

Having the opportunity to become a doctor is improvement. Not having
to choose between your marriage and your chance at a career because
your husband wouldn't back you into that kind of corner would, of
course, be even more improvement.

Becoming a westernized country is not improvement.

Before we get into debating that point, may I point out that you
haven't actually answered my question? Regardless of whether or not
you see the situation for women in pre-Taliban Afghanistan as being
better or worse than that in a Western country, do you disagree with
the statement that these women are oppressed? If you do not see being
prevented from working or travelling freely as oppression, then can
you clarify what the word 'oppressed' means to you?


Sarah
--
http://www.goodenoughmummy.typepad.com

agsf_57 wrote in

ups.com:

On Apr 26, 12:44 pm, Zipadee
wrote:
agsf_57 wrote:
It's the same concept. Women want to marry rich men so
they can spend their days watching Oprah and go [sic]
shopping.
However, the majority of
girls grow up aspiring to marry a rich man and to stay
home and go to the mall everyday with their girlfriends.

Call it trolling if you want, but what I state is the
truth for the majority of women.

Because you state it, that makes it the truth for the
majority of women, eh? You've met them all? Perhaps it's a
large percentage of the women YOU HAVE MET which doesn't
say much for the kind of places you meet them or the kind
of people you hang out with.

No dear. It's a known cultural fact that women generally
want to marry the richest man that their looks can afford
and men want to marry/date the youngest and most hottest
girl that they can attract with their wealth.

bull. it might be "common knowledge", in an urban legend sort
of way, but when it comes down to actually choosing a mate
looks & wealth have very little to do with it for women.
*some* men never grow out of puberty & do go for the
"youngest, hottest chick"... usually leaving thier now older,
possibly less attractive wife & kids out in the cold..
don't be so condecending.

I never wanted to ?marry a rich man and stay home and go
to the mall everyday"

you do not fall into the majority.

the *majority* don't fall into your idea of what women want.
how much time does your little woman spend at the mall?

lee
--
Last night while sitting in my chair
I pinged a host that wasn't there
It wasn't there again today
The host resolved to NSA.

In article ,
agsf_57 says...

On Apr 26, 12:44 pm, Zipadee wrote:
agsf_57 wrote:
It's the same concept. Women want to marry rich men so they can spend
their days watching Oprah and go [sic] shopping.
However, the majority of
girls grow up aspiring to marry a rich man and to stay home and go to
the mall everyday with their girlfriends.

Call it trolling if you want, but what I state is the truth for the
majority of women.

Because you state it, that makes it the truth for the majority
of women, eh? You've met them all? Perhaps it's a large
percentage of the women YOU HAVE MET which doesn't
say much for the kind of places you meet them or the kind
of people you hang out with.

No dear. It's a known cultural fact that women generally want to marry
the richest man that their looks can afford and men want to marry/date
the youngest and most hottest girl that they can attract with their
wealth.

Sweeet-ums - that's another fact you're going to have to back up for us.

Banty

agsf_57 wrote:
On Apr 26, 12:44 pm, Zipadee wrote:
agsf_57 wrote:
It's the same concept. Women want to marry rich men so they can spend
their days watching Oprah and go [sic] shopping.
However, the majority of
girls grow up aspiring to marry a rich man and to stay home and go to
the mall everyday with their girlfriends.
Call it trolling if you want, but what I state is the truth for the
majority of women.
Because you state it, that makes it the truth for the majority
of women, eh? You've met them all? Perhaps it's a large
percentage of the women YOU HAVE MET which doesn't
say much for the kind of places you meet them or the kind
of people you hang out with.

No dear. It's a known cultural fact

I take it you don't have any actual evidence, then. ;-)


Sarah
--
http://www.goodenoughmummy.typepad.com

"That which can be destroyed by the truth, should be" - P. C. Hodgell

On Apr 27, 12:18 pm, Sarah Vaughan
wrote:
agsf_57 wrote:
On Apr 26, 12:44 pm, Zipadee wrote:
agsf_57 wrote:
It's the same concept. Women want to marry rich men so they can spend
their days watching Oprah and go [sic] shopping.
However, the majority of
girls grow up aspiring to marry a rich man and to stay home and go to
the mall everyday with their girlfriends.
Call it trolling if you want, but what I state is the truth for the
majority of women.
Because you state it, that makes it the truth for the majority
of women, eh? You've met them all? Perhaps it's a large
percentage of the women YOU HAVE MET which doesn't
say much for the kind of places you meet them or the kind
of people you hang out with.

No dear. It's a known cultural fact

I take it you don't have any actual evidence, then. ;-)

Sarah

Out of all people, I would you would have enough sense to agree.
However, for the socially inept:
http://www.somethingyoushouldknow.ne...ipt12_5_03.htm

http://www-personal.umich.edu/~kruger/dads-cads.html
"The sexual psychology of women also indicates that human sexuality
has been shaped by long-term sexual relationships. A number of studies
both in the United States and cross-culturally have shown that women
regularly report being attracted to men who are socially respected,
financially well-off, ambitious, industrious, dependable, emotionally
stable, and romantic, all qualities that indicate the ability and
willingness to sustain longterm, parentally investing relationships
with women (Buss 1994:32-34)."

Regards...

"A number of studies
both in the United States and cross-culturally have shown that women
regularly report being attracted to men who are socially respected,
financially well-off, ambitious, industrious, dependable, emotionally
stable, and romantic, all qualities that indicate the ability and
willingness to sustain longterm, parentally investing relationships
with women."

agsf, everyone knows this stuff. Post the other section of the
study... the one that is relevant to the argument, please. The part
about the TRUE motivation for finding a "socially respected,
financially well-off, ambitious, industrious, dependable, emotionally
stable, and romantic" partner. The Oprah and mall-hopping part. And
aren't you sharp... to see right through that 'women want longterm,
parentally investing relationships' smokescreen the coven cooked up.
Unfortunately, you are a threat to our way of life, and I ain't giving
up my daily shopping spree. I'm reporting you to our high witch, and
you will be dealt with. Expect a call from Oprah.

Regards

Fascinating ....

http://www.somethingyoushouldknow.ne...ipt12_5_03.htm

Well, this doesn't strike me as "evidence" of anything except an ability
to get people to listen to sound bites. But they're really interesting
sound bites! It's hard to tell whether they have any factual or
scientific basis, though, from such limited information and context.

http://www-personal.umich.edu/~kruger/dads-cads.html
"The sexual psychology of women also indicates that human sexuality
has been shaped by long-term sexual relationships. A number of studies
both in the United States and cross-culturally have shown that women
regularly report being attracted to men who are socially respected,
financially well-off, ambitious, industrious, dependable, emotionally
stable, and romantic, all qualities that indicate the ability and
willingness to sustain longterm, parentally investing relationships
with women (Buss 1994:32-34)."

I'm not sure how you jump from this study to thinking that women want to
stay home while the menfolk work. The abstract is kind of like a
Rorshach blot. What you interpret from it reflects on your own
assumptions and stereotypes than on any universal truths.

I'm trying to think of *any* women I've known who want or expect to be
fully supported by their husbands. Nope, none come to mind. Sorry.

--Beth Kevles
-THE-COM-HERE
http://web.mit.edu/kevles/www/nomilk.html -- a page for the milk-allergic
Disclaimer: Nothing in this message should be construed as medical
advice. Please consult with your own medical practicioner.

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