26-week appointment/birth plan stuff

Well, most of the 26-week appointment went fine. I'm not having
intestinal glitches anymore (for the moment). I survived my glucose
test without throwing up, though I won't know the results for a while
yet. I got a flu shot, which I'd wanted from the time I found out they
were safe during pregnancy -- there's so much stuff you can't take for
the flu that I didn't want to have to deal with it this winter. And I
got to talk about starting to exercise, which I could badly use --
chronic illness made me a couch potato from *years* before I ever got
pregnant, and I don't want to go into labor with no stamina.

The downside was that this doctor, who is the one of the trio I like
least, decided to go over my birth plan with me and try to talk me out
of most of it. :P When I pushed him to the wall on specific issues, he
didn't actually have a problem with any of it, he was just being
paternalistic and obnoxious, of the "You hired us to take care of you
and we're going to act in your best interests, so what do you need all
this stuff for?" I kept my cool, kept him to specifics, and argued him
down on everything except liquids during labor, which I conceded
because he had a medical reason for that and knew it and wasn't going
to budge. (IMO it's not a sufficient medical reason, but it's *a*
reason.) In particular, he wanted to keep to the hospital policy of
one person in the operating room if they have to do a C-section and I
was adamant that I wanted my husband and my doula there. I pointed out
that I have mental illnesses which are triggered by stress, pain and
lack of sleep, and absolutely need someone there whose job is to keep
me stable. If I can't bring two people I will bring my doula and leave
my husband waiting outside, because I *need* my doula there, but I
don't want to keep my husband from watching the birth of his first
child, so can they please consider overriding hospital custom in this
case? He finally conceded that since it was such a priority for me
he'd push the hospital on it, which is the best I think I can do for
the moment. I'm seeing the doctor I really like next visit and I'll
ask her to push too.

Not a bad visit, but left a bad taste in my mouth.

Naomi

Not a bad visit, but left a bad taste in my mouth.

Naomi

Honest question- why are so many women so cynical about doctors and hospitals?

On 25 Nov 2003 07:30:38 -0800, (Rupert) wrote:

Not a bad visit, but left a bad taste in my mouth.

Naomi

Honest question- why are so many women so cynical about doctors and hospitals?

In my case, it's because I've spent a great deal of time with doctors,
good, bad and okay, and I am not cynical about them as a whole but I
am very much aware that the really good doctors *want* informed
patients who take some responsibility for understanding and
participating in their own care. So, paradoxically, I trust far more
the ones who do not ask to be trusted blindly but explain things and
expect my understanding and input than I do the ones who pat my head
and say "just trust me, I know what's best." In a long lifetime of
experience with various different kids of doctors (chronic illness of
several varieties, two surgeries, one major auto accident,
infertility, and now pregnancy) I have found that the only ones to be
cynical about are those who demand faith. The ones who don't *want*
faith, but want active, informed patients collaborating with them, get
both my collaboration and my trust... and my profound respect and
gratitude.

Naomi

Hi Naomi

Good for you for sticking to what you want!!

I really don't see a logical reason for not having two people in the theatre
with you if you have to have a c-section - especially if one of them is
experienced with child birth.

All the best

Camille

Naomi Rivkis wrote:
On 25 Nov 2003 07:30:38 -0800, (Rupert) wrote:


Not a bad visit, but left a bad taste in my mouth.

Naomi

Honest question- why are so many women so cynical about doctors and hospitals?


In my case, it's because I've spent a great deal of time with doctors,
good, bad and okay, and I am not cynical about them as a whole but I
am very much aware that the really good doctors *want* informed
patients who take some responsibility for understanding and
participating in their own care.

I fully second that point of view. Doctors come in many varieties,
but they are not gods, should not be treated like them and should
not behave like them. When a patient is well informed, it can
improve treatments and prevent errors. The same is true for nurses.

--
-- I
mommy to DS (16m)
guardian of DH (32)
TTC #2
War doesn't decide who's right, only who's left

Naomi Rivkis wrote:
On 25 Nov 2003 07:30:38 -0800, (Rupert) wrote:


Not a bad visit, but left a bad taste in my mouth.

Naomi

Honest question- why are so many women so cynical about doctors and hospitals?


In my case, it's because I've spent a great deal of time with doctors,
good, bad and okay, and I am not cynical about them as a whole but I
am very much aware that the really good doctors *want* informed
patients who take some responsibility for understanding and
participating in their own care.

I fully second that point of view. Doctors come in many varieties,
but they are not gods, should not be treated like them and should
not behave like them. When a patient is well informed, it can
improve treatments and prevent errors.

However, from a female POV, my experience with male doctors is that
they often underestimate my ability to recognize problems when it
comes to my body. I don't go to a doctor unless I *know* something is
wrong, and would like to be taken serious. Some try, but some don't
and treat me like a complete idiot: 'the bloodwork is fine, so you
are fine' is a line I have heard too many times.

--
-- I
mommy to DS (16m)
guardian of DH (32)
TTC #2
War doesn't decide who's right, only who's left

Rupert wrote:


Honest question- why are so many women so cynical about doctors and hospitals?


Experience? For the most part, I don't think anyone
believes that doctors don't have their place or that all
doctors are bad. It's just that many have had direct or
indirect experiences with pregnancy and childbirth where
doctors were *not* supportive or did *not* follow evidence
based medicine. Add to that many who have had excellent
experiences going outside the medical model and it doesn't
take a PhD in statistics to figure out why some women are
skeptical of the need or advisability of going with the
medical model of care for a normal, healthy pregnancy.

Best wishes,
Ericka

On 25 Nov 2003 07:30:38 -0800, (Rupert) wrote:

Honest question- why are so many women so cynical about doctors and hospitals?

Because the crap they push on you that is NOT in the best interest of
you or your baby... it is in their best interest, whether it be for
legal reasons or just plain convenience. They try to play it off like
it is in your best interest, and if you know better, then you have a
fight on your hands.

Is it too much to ask for them to do what is best for you and your
baby? I don't think so.

--
Daye
Momma to Jayan
"Boy" EDD 11 Jan 2004
See Jayan: http://jayan.topcities.com/

I second Erika's response!

Jenn
-WAHM
-DS Feb'02
-DD Feb'97
-Jellybean due June 25/04~planning a homebirth

"Naomi Rivkis" wrote in message
...
The downside was that this doctor, who is the one of the
trio I like least, decided to go over my birth plan with me
and try to talk me out of most of it. :P

Not a bad visit, but left a bad taste in my mouth.

I know exactly what you mean. It's disturbing to have to argue with any
doctor, but particularly one who's involved in a pregnancy. Do you
think there's any possibility of finding caregivers whose normal
practices are more in line with what you want? I saw a practice of four
OBs during my first pregnancy, and the one I liked least, the only one
who argued with me about my birth plan, was of course the one who ended
up on call at the hospital when I gave birth. She wasn't very
supportive (directed the nurse to start preparations for an epidural,
when I hadn't even asked for one!), and handled my pushing phase
especially badly, IMO, making me stay in lithotomy position after I
clearly requested more than once to change position, and rushing things
when they didn't need to be, causing an unnecessarily large tear. I
felt that this doctor was on autopilot and did not care about my
individual wishes at all. For my second pregnancy I saw a midwife and
gave birth in a birth center, and it took me about half the pregnancy to
(mostly) get over my nervousness and fear of losing control. I was
still a little tense and wary, on some level, during my second labor
though. About two hours after he was born, it suddenly hit me that I
was *done*, it was all over, and no one had done anything to me that I
hadn't wanted. The relief and amazement I felt upon realizing that
shows that I was worried because of the loss of trust I experienced the
first time. Worry is not a good thing during labor. Don't settle for a
doctor that leaves a bad taste in your mouth, if you have any options at
all. If you don't have options, I don't mean to scare you. At least
your doctor was willing to negotiate, which my original doctor didn't
really do. When I said during a prenatal visit that I didn't want pain
medications, she just kept telling me over and over "you don't know what
your labor's going to be like". I should have left that practice then,
but I guess I was too timid, and just hoped I'd get one of the other
three.
--
Cheryl S.
Mom to Julie, 2 yr., 7 mo.
And Jaden, 2 months

Cleaning the house while your children are small is like
shoveling the sidewalk while it's still snowing.